Alcoholism discussion thread v. 5.0

[Mariposa]

Yay hats! Herby, if I make it a month abstinent, then I might deserve one.

I've had a little bit of wine since my last post while on a date (not that impressive of one, I met him at trivia and he's a little eccentric - not even fling material) but that's been it. I am feeling better in general, the rebound anxiety is starting more than a bit though. It is just not worth it. Blah.

jspun, part of the reason I was put off from AA/NA was that the non-alky friend who went with me for moral support a few years back and I were both hit on relentlessly. I found it very difficult to talk about my unhealthy relationship with the bottle when guys were being as forward as these, most of them were long-term dry drunks my father's age who would looooove to show me the way to sobriety. I would date a sober guy if he had more clean time than I do. Not drinking didn't stop the recent ex from being an asshole or addicted to a whole slew of other stuff though.

I'll see how I continue to do. I have some major decisions to make about education/career stuff (I am considering a complete change).

Hope everyone's staying strong.

 

[eireann]

hi guys have a question im off heroin a year and im so annoyed,if i have 3 500ml cans of beer i suffer from a two day hang over,i cant imagine this would have anything to do with gear as it been a year since i went near it,do any of you find yourself in the same situation after you gave up your addiction,its driven me mad as im only 26 and i cant really have a good night out with my mates due to fear of a hang over! before i was on gear i could drink like 10 pints and the next day id feel it a bit but it wouldnt have me suffering for two days afterwards.....WTF like 3 cans and im getting all mighty hang overs its shame.

 

[polymath]

^ Maybe you should take vitamins before you start to drink, and avoid dehydration by drinking lots of water before going to sleep after drinking.

 

[eireann]

^ Maybe you should take vitamins before you start to drink, and avoid dehydration by drinking lots of water before going to sleep after drinking.

thanks polymath,i will try the vitamins.

 

[LaserHosen]

I bought some Valium off the internet to try and calm my shakes. I also bought some Librium (chlordiazepoxide) but they haven't arrived yet.
I felt I had to do this after going to the doctor and telling the doc I was desperate and needed help but she wouldn't prescribe me anything.

The Valium (diazepam blues, 10mg pills) arrived today and I was overjoyed that finally I could get out of this cycle of drinking vodka every day from the moment I woke up, the depression, the paranoia/anxiety about leaving the house. Anyone who's experienced alcohol addiction will know what I'm talking about.

The problem is that the Valium is making me drowsy and helping me sleep but it doesn't seem to be helping my shakes very well. I've only taken 3 pills so far and I went without vodka for maybe 9 hours this afternoon and slept. I took another valium an hour and a half ago and I've recently been really shaky, so I reluctantly decided to pour myself a vodka.

I'm going to try not mixing the booze with the benzo's as I realise it's dangerous and you can develop a cross-addiction but I'm a bit pissed off that the valium isn't sorting my shakes out as well as I'd hoped.

I'm just hoping that when the Librium arrives it will be better for my shakes and I can get properly dried out from this nasty booze habit.

Does anyone know the slight chemical differences between diazepam and chlordiazepoxide? Is the latter better at dealing with alcoholic tremors and shakes?

 

[areros18]

Wow!! Good for you n3ophy7e!!

 

[Vaya]

I bought some Valium off the internet to try and calm my shakes. I also bought some Librium (chlordiazepoxide) but they haven't arrived yet.
I felt I had to do this after going to the doctor and telling the doc I was desperate and needed help but she wouldn't prescribe me anything.

The Valium (diazepam blues, 10mg pills) arrived today and I was overjoyed that finally I could get out of this cycle of drinking vodka every day from the moment I woke up, the depression, the paranoia/anxiety about leaving the house. Anyone who's experienced alcohol addiction will know what I'm talking about.

The problem is that the Valium is making me drowsy and helping me sleep but it doesn't seem to be helping my shakes very well. I've only taken 3 pills so far and I went without vodka for maybe 9 hours this afternoon and slept. I took another valium an hour and a half ago and I've recently been really shaky, so I reluctantly decided to pour myself a vodka.

I'm going to try not mixing the booze with the benzo's as I realise it's dangerous and you can develop a cross-addiction but I'm a bit pissed off that the valium isn't sorting my shakes out as well as I'd hoped.

I'm just hoping that when the Librium arrives it will be better for my shakes and I can get properly dried out from this nasty booze habit.

Does anyone know the slight chemical differences between diazepam and chlordiazepoxide? Is the latter better at dealing with alcoholic tremors and shakes?

To answer your last question, Librium (chlordiazepoxide) possesses properties at the GABA A receptor subunit binding sites that more closely resemble activation of GABA B, the primary GABA subunit alcohol binds to. Diazepam binds more appropriately to alpha units a1-3 and a5, producing anticonvulsant (mild), anxiolytic (significant) and myorelaxant (significant) properties.

Chlordiazepoxide has antianxiety, sedative, appetite-stimulating and weak analgesic actions. The drug seems to block EEG arousal from stimulation in the brain stem reticular formation. The drug has been studied extensively in many species of animals and these studies are suggestive of action on the limbic system of the brain, which recent evidence indicates is involved in emotional responses. Hostile monkeys were made tame by oral drug doses which did not cause sedation. Chlordiazepoxide revealed a "taming" action with the elimination of fear and aggression. The taming effect of chlordiazepoxide was further demonstrated in rats made vicious by lesions in the septal area of the brain. The drug dosage which effectively blocked the vicious reaction was well below the dose which caused sedation in these animals.

DrugBank: Chlordiazepoxide

But to address your post:
Recently, I switched from 4mg Xanax/day to 20mg Valium/day in preparation to possibly begin tapering down soon. The problem is, I'm finding extreme and troubling solace in its effects as they relate to alcohol. It feels like replacement therapy, and I've become concerned that once I begin tapering down on the Valium (I've been on high doses of benzos for 11 years, so PAWS is inevitable in my mind), I may be triggered to drink.

Has this been your experience?

~ Vaya

EDIT: Just thought I'd report, 51 days of not drinking

 

[TouchN' Stuff Blvd]

Fuck, about a month ago I learned I have an very enlarged liver and the doctor told me I need to stop drinking completely before the damage becomes irreversible. For a couple of weeks I was able to use the fear that I was close to killing myself to stop, but the last few days I have been drinking again, not heavily but the pain in my side has already got a lot worse again. Smoking weed daily was enough satisfaction for me not to give in to the temptation to drink for awhile, but now I am out of money to buy weed, and I guess I am just not comfortable sober. It doesn't help that I recently moved back home to my parents place which is stocked 24 / 7 with beer and vodka that I have always been able to drink without paying for. Just the thought that I took a break so liver failure is probably not as immanent as it was is making it constantly extremely tempting to drink.

 

[Sepher]

The problem is that the Valium is making me drowsy and helping me sleep but it doesn't seem to be helping my shakes very well. I've only taken 3 pills so far and I went without vodka for maybe 9 hours this afternoon and slept. I took another valium an hour and a half ago and I've recently been really shaky, so I reluctantly decided to pour myself a vodka.

I'm going to try not mixing the booze with the benzo's as I realise it's dangerous and you can develop a cross-addiction but I'm a bit pissed off that the valium isn't sorting my shakes out as well as I'd hoped.

I'm just hoping that when the Librium arrives it will be better for my shakes and I can get properly dried out from this nasty booze habit.

How you doing Laser? You got the librium yet? How's things working with the benzos? Can't say I like the idea of you self-medicating with this stuff mate. Why wouldn't the doc prescribe for you? This your GP cos pretty sure they're required to hand you off to an addiction unit for detox these days to make sure you're properly supervised by an addiction specialist, don't think they can prescribe even if they wanted to but can't remember if you're under the addiction unit or not?

Fuck, about a month ago I learned I have an very enlarged liver and the doctor told me I need to stop drinking completely before the damage becomes irreversible. For a couple of weeks I was able to use the fear that I was close to killing myself to stop, but the last few days I have been drinking again, not heavily but the pain in my side has already got a lot worse again. Smoking weed daily was enough satisfaction for me not to give in to the temptation to drink for awhile, but now I am out of money to buy weed, and I guess I am just not comfortable sober. It doesn't help that I recently moved back home to my parents place which is stocked 24 / 7 with beer and vodka that I have always been able to drink without paying for. Just the thought that I took a break so liver failure is probably not as immanent as it was is making it constantly extremely tempting to drink.

Hey Touch. Don't think I've seen you in the thread before have I, so welcome aboard, if welcome's the right word? You know what I mean! Just been reading a couple of your other threads on this. An enlarged liver at your age with the length of time you've been drinking is very unusual isn't it? Docs any nearer deciding if this is entirely alcohol related or possibly another cause for it that the booze is aggravating?

Update: Day 87, still sober. I'm calling three months next Tuesday. I can't tell you how excited I am to be nearing it. I wonder what I'm gonna do once it's been and gone? Will I feel all deflated all of a sudden having hit so major a target for me? I guess the next step is a still bigger challenge: baby stepping it one day at a time to New Year!

How's everyone else doing? Jspun? You've gone quiet fella? You know I was kidding with that PM, right? I dunno, invite myself Stateside for a long stay over on my sobriety partner's sofa never to hear from the guy again! Pfffft! Hope you're ok mate. Did you make the three months yourself?

 

[TouchN' Stuff Blvd]

^Thanks for the welcome, its nice even if it isnt for the most positive thing.
Fucking doctors, no I have not learned anything new. After I got my test results I called my doctor and left a message every day for a week, until finally a nurse called me back and said I would need to make a "consultation" appointment if I wanted to ask the doctor any questions. The nurse I talked to was able to answer one question I had though: they did not include a STD test on the blood test. I guess I should have probed more when he said they would test for "everything," so I am thinking of getting an STD test done to see if it could be hepatitis. The current plan is just to test me again after I have not had alcohol for a few months to determine if thats the cause, but now that I have not been able to keep up the soberness that plan might be a little fucked. Maybe I need to find a new doctor. Thanks for taking the time to read my posts, however

 

[TouchN' Stuff Blvd]

Also Sepher, congrats on your own victory. I think its awesome you still stick around this thread to encourage others even though you already have some time between you and your drinking.

 

[Sepher]

Thanks for taking the time to read my posts, however

Hey, I'm a nosey fucker, what can I say! Whereabouts are you? Not familiar with Anecdotal Evidence, that somewhere Stateside? Can you not get the STD thing done at a drop-in clinic for free where you are? Sounds like you think hep's a possibility at least so yeah, just go get it done yourself ASAP, for your own peace of mind there.

Also Sepher, congrats on your own victory. I think its awesome you still stick around this thread to encourage others even though you already have some time between you and your drinking.

Thanks a bunch for the congrats but oh man, no, it's not at all like that. Really. Seems I'm winning at the moment at least but my sobriety hangs by a thread. I made two days short of three months last time out earlier in the year, fell off the wagon launching into a spectacular two month bender nearly cost me everything. Very nearly cost me my job, would have cost me the home I'd just moved into after splitting with the ex, could have easily cost me my life I think if that had happened. Could still happen quite easily at any moment though Antabuse has been a big help this time out keeping me on the straight and narrow path I'm on here. I'm not nearly so noble as to be entirely altruistic with my presence here by a long stretch, you know. I need the support myself, it's about the only real support I got mate. It's talking cure therapy kinda stuff for me. Without it I don't think I'd be where I am at the minute, at all. Having said that it's only right I try to give back some measure of what I've had here from others here. Karma man, karma!

EDIT: Just thought I'd report, 51 days of not drinking

It wouldn't be tempting fate too much to dangle the prospect of it being two months all too soon, would it Vaya? Nice one Vaya, really pleased for you. Congrats, keep going, yeah?

 

[ebola?]

To answer your last question, Librium (chlordiazepoxide) possesses properties at the GABA A receptor subunit binding sites that more closely resemble activation of GABA B, the primary GABA subunit alcohol binds to.

Actually, while alcohol isn't completely selective GABAnergically, it acts primarily as an allosteric modulator at the alpha subunit, with minor activity at the beta-subtype of receptor. Also, I'm not sure how a selective GABA A agonist could "closely resemble GABAB activation", as these are very different receptors, their single commonality being that they share an endogenous ligand (GABAA being a voltage-gated ion channel, GABAB activity involving g-coupled protein secondary messaging, having distinct anatomical distributions, involving different downstream signaling, etc.).

ebola

 

[Lawless666]

Hello fellow alcoholics/binge drinkers

Jumping right into the middle of this thread here, may be considered a little rude.....sorry.

I'll just introduce myself as a former alcoholic (I thought I was) - I had to give up drinking for 3 years to get a grip on myself, now I drink in moderation, rarely. I believe my brain re-wired itself and that SOME people can return to normal drinking after a period of abstinence.

 

[Sepher]

I fucking made it! I fucking made it! 3 months, official. Eat that fucker, I'm beating you. How like them apples!

*cries*

%)

 

[harlans]

it's been a long time since i posted here. after numerous and constant struggles i got into a dual diagnosis out-patient program. i've only slipped up once in the past 2 weeks. although, i'm the type of alcoholic that needs total abstinence. i was sober for 5 years and when i started trying to drink socially or whatever it was a rapid descent into the dark alcoholic pit. within that first week i was drinking every single day. three years later i'm trying to get a grip on myself again. i've moved across the country to a conservative and religious state (ugh!) and the aa here doesn't really jive with me which is very unfortunate. the aa here is way way too religiously oriented for me. oh, well, whatevs

 

[harlans]

I fucking made it! I fucking made it! 3 months, official. Eat that fucker, I'm beating you. How like them apples!

*cries*

%)

awesome :D

 

[Lawless666]

I fucking made it! I fucking made it! 3 months, official. Eat that fucker, I'm beating you. How like them apples!

*cries*

%)

Well done, the first 90 days are a killer. Keep doing whatever it is you're doing and remember to reward yourself!!!

 

[herbavore]

Sepher, my man, CONGRATULATIONS! Why aren't there little exploding fireworks emoticons on here? Anyway, if you look west, you'll see them going off for you. Yay! When I was knitting your hat, I was thinking about what a great metaphor knitting is for just stringing together little moments, that become hours that become days that become months and on and on--voilá! A hat from a ball of yarn. Or a life from a million little choices. All the little pieces, joined together make the whole. There is no other way there. So simple but so true.

 

[Sepher]

Thanks guys. :D

I've been smiling a secret smile to myself all day at work. In one sense three months isn't a big deal. Three years, that would be a big deal; three months, less so, but . . . It's proof positive that what I've been telling myself, that I have a better handle on this than last time out is objectively true, in fact, not just in imagination as the kinda thing we have to tell ourselves to get through today, because I got further than I did last time. Only by two days, sure, and there's a long ways to go yet, but those two days mean everything to me at the moment. Everything!!! Baby steps, little pieces, a life from a million choices NOT to drink today, one day at a time. ( Exactly Herb! )

Thanks again! ( through misty eyes, soft bugger! 8) )