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Conversion of 4-AcO- into 4-Ho Tryptamines

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I'm particularly interested in trying IV psilacetin for the reason that I would like to notice how quickly it kicks in and if the most immediate effects are different from the longer effects of an oral dose, or just in general how it effects me. I get the feeling this one would have some activity of its own before it was metabolized.
 
i would be happy to be a guinea pig.. just never seen pure psilocin

but with my experiences with 4-aco and mushrooms, i'm pretty sure i could tell the difference unless 4-ho-dmt is VERY different from mushrooms
 
sleepysaint said:
I'm particularly interested in trying IV psilacetin for the reason that I would like to notice how quickly it kicks in and if the most immediate effects are different from the longer effects of an oral dose, or just in general how it effects me. I get the feeling this one would have some activity of its own before it was metabolized.
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This has been done and reported about in the 4-AcO-DMT thread. I forget who exactly did it, but they reported DMT like effects with elaborate visions, etc. It seems IV is a worthwhile ROA with the AcO (I've yet to do it, but want to). It is reportedly powerfully and quickly active. The speed of the onset of the IV route is the strongest indication I know that the AcO is NOT a mere prodrug. That doesn't mean that it doesn't ALSO get converted to psilocin eventually (rate and degree probably varies by ROA), just that it's highly unlikely the AcO is inactive. Variations in enzyme concentrations are the best explanations I've thought of for the huge variations in onset time and duration between people via the oral route (stomach acid may also make the conversion, but do HCl stomach concentrations vary so dramatically between people that that variation alone can account for such vast differences?).
 
Hey, update on the 4-aco dmt and putting it in solution. I have had it in a solution with alcohol since august. I have been complaining about visuals with the substance in recent trips but I realized now it is because of my setting. :) Sitting in a room wont do much but when I went outside...

:O


But I love the mental effects a bit more. <3
 
.Felix. said:
Hey, update on the 4-aco dmt and putting it in solution. I have had it in a solution with alcohol since august. I have been complaining about visuals with the substance in recent trips but I realized now it is because of my setting. :) Sitting in a room wont do much but when I went outside...

:O


But I love the mental effects a bit more. <3
Click to expand...

My recent few trials with it are making me long for a good outdoor spot to go to next time. Honestly, my lack of places to trip should probably limit my intake a bit more... I definitely know what you mean though. For me, the intensity of the visuals on classical psychedelics is usually inversely proportional to how many times I've tripped in the location. It's another example of how psychedelics seem to self-limit, and I think a lot of this also plays into what people call respect towards the substances.
 
Here is my take on hydrolysis...Chemist Peter Webster (page 182 of Sacred Mushrooms of the Goddess):
In the first trial I heated 1 ergotamine tartrate tablet, containing 1mg of ergotamine with 200mg of hardwood ash in 20ml of vodka in a kitchen doble-boiler, and I found that after one hour the alcohol had boiled off. I continued to heat this mixture for an additional two hours at around 50degreeC, then neutralized the mixture with vitamin C, or ascorbic acid. Decanting the liquid from the residue of solids left by the wood ash, I then drank the result. A definite but weak psychoactive effect was noticed. Repeating the experiment with two and then three migraine tablets, the result was stronger and left no doub in my mind that the partial hydrolysis process we hpothesize does indeed happen to ergotamine. In my experiments here I used vodka as a solvent, since in a Gynergen tablet the ergotamine content exists as tiny crystals and an alcohol-water mixture would enhance the low solubilty of these ergotamine crystals. Neutralizing would make the brew more palatable and, in addition, augment the solubility of ergine/isoergine in body fluids since these alkaloids easily form salts with acids such as ascorbic, tartaric, or even hcl salts. These salts are far more soluble than the free base alkaloids.
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would this same procedure with 4-aco-dmt yield an ending solution with a 50% solution of psilocin? who knows....interesting theory.
 
Beenhead said:
its called a protocol :)

You also must ask what the Equilibrium constant for this equation is, because you will most certainly have unreacted compound int he mixture
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You will, if you use acid hydrolysis. Base hydrolysis is irreversible.
 
In case the experiment of using baking soda (ph = 8.2) in water doesn't work, you may want to try dropping a few TUMs or Rolaids into water and stirring the 4-aco-dmt with it, TUMs/rolaids have a ph of 10.0, the same as wood ash (wood ash is 90% calcium carbonate).

Let it spin for 1 hour if possible, then simply sip it slowly over the course of 1/2 to 1 hour, this may indeed result in an experience very different than 4-aco-dmt, and much very like psilocin indeed (4-HO-dmt)...as the 4-aco-dmt (acetyl-psilocin) is hydrolized into 4-ho-dmt (psilocin)...or maybe not, who knows.

After reading an entire 1000 pages of 4-aco-dmt experiences, I singled out 2 of the experiences where the 2 different people reported having taken 4-aco-dmt in a capsule weeks before (same dose)...then several weeks later decided to dissolve their 4-aco-dmt into a glass of water, and slowly drank this over 1 hours time, both people noticed a very distinct difference in their trips, both saying that the 4-aco-dmt dissolved into water then drunk slowly resulted in an experience very much like that of 4-ho-dmt (psilocin in mushrooms) as opposed to their normal 4-aco-dmt capsule swallowed trips.

They may be onto something here, partially or even completely hydrolyzing the 4-aco-dmt into 4-ho-dmt, or even perhaps giving their system ampule time to convert it with the slow drinking of it, enhancing the metabolism/conversion of it.

You don't have to use wood ash as Peter Webster did, just use TUM's instead, same exact PH as wood ash.

Another experiment can be done by heating the tums/water/mixture of 4-aco-dmt to speed up or completely convert the stuff perhaps...but then again the heat might destroy it, who knows.

In any case, I'm sure you might succeed in at least partial to whole conversion after doing enough experiments....or then again, maybe not, nobody knows yet.
 
I wish someone would do this and use TLC on it to check if there is a change from one compound to a mixture of two to a completed conversion.

Merged two threads and changed title a little.
 
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Nice bump. I would like to be able to turn my 4-AcO-DMT into 4-HO-DMT, personally... I had the pleasure of trying pure 4-HO-DMT a couple of times and I found it to be much preferable to 4-AcO-DMT
 
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