What is your current supplement regimen and why you use them

[VelocideX]

What's the difference between a vitamin that is synthetic and natural? They both have the same chemical formula. Same molecule.

 

[mrsmitconh]

That's not strictly true .. any man made chemical has slight abberations to the original. Most often than not it's a "best fit" scenario where it's a closest match with the synthetic equivalent.
I'm no rocket scientists nor can I back this up with anything other than circumstantial evidence but that's most often the case in my experience. True many chemicals and processes can mimic the equivalent substance almost 100% but not always. So always be aware ;-)

 

[lifeisforliving]

That's not strictly true .. any man made chemical has slight abberations to the original. Most often than not it's a "best fit" scenario where it's a closest match with the synthetic equivalent.

If you are speaking of a named vitamin or supplement. If there is a synthetic available, it will be 100% the same.

I'm no rocket scientists nor can I back this up with anything other than circumstantial evidence but that's most often the case in my experience. True many chemicals and processes can mimic the equivalent substance almost 100% but not always. So always be aware ;-)

I think you may want to consider the more valid idea that our bodies are designed to pull nutrients out of regular plant and meat sources. There are combinations found in natural food that will help you absorb nutrients better. This "difference" can also be copied exactly by science if it is fully understood.

The idea is also used by synthetic vitamin regimens.. such as taking Vitamin D with Milk to help your body absorb both Calcium from the milk and Vit D. The synergy is better than taking either of them alone.

 

[Jamshyd]

My daily regimen:

Wake up:
50mg (100 when depressed) 5-HTP
500mg L-Phenylalanine (Just started with it, hoping it will help)
A multivitamin pill
About 0.1mg Atropine (to shorten life ).

Before Sleep:
50mg 5-HTP
3 - 9mg Melatonin sometimes (dose depends on frequency of use)
Magnesium/Calcium pill sometimes (too lazy to go look how much, I think its like 500mg/1g)

I take Melatonin semi-regularly, but almost always after a day of psychedelics use.

I take the Magnesium/Calcium on days I use drugs, especially Alcohol, Dissociatives or Opiates. If I know I'll be using any of these drugs on that day, I would take it in the morning as well.

 

[fizzacyst]

What's the difference between a vitamin that is synthetic and natural? They both have the same chemical formula. Same molecule.

Its possible that the synthetic route (or a particular synthetic route) produces different isomers than what occurs naturally. I don't know about anything in particular that this might affect, or particular instances where it might occur.. but it does happen sometimes when you are making other substances that occur naturally.

Its also possible that the product of synthesis could be better/worse than the natural form in this case, assuming it makes a difference in the first place. It would take long-term testing to know for sure about any man made vs. natural stuff.

 

[Roger&Me]

"MultiPro 32x" Multi-Vitamin
Extra E
Extra C
r-isomer Alpha Lipoic Acid
Udo's Choice Polyunsaturated Oil Blend
Whey Isolate
CytoSport's "Muscle Milk"
Digestive Enzymes
Fiber

I'm an athlete, and a weightlifter so most of my supplementation is to build muscle, but I also cover my bases and take plenty of vitamins and anti-oxidants for general health purposes.

I take a basic multi-vitamin, as well as extra C and E after my workout to neutralize free-radicals. I also take r-isomer Alpha Lipoic Acid for it's anti-oxidant effects as well as it's insulin mimmicking effects and it's ability to work through the glut-4 pathway.

The Udo' Oil is for the essential fatty acids. My diet is EXTREMELY high in EFAs. I use up two 12oz bottles of Udo's oil a week. My hair is shiny and lustrous like never before, my skin is perfect, I swear my IQ has gone up a few points, and I have very little muscle soreness and pain. Yurp, it's good stuff.

I take the whey isolate after my workout with 75grams of simple carbs from fructose and maltodextrin to facilitate recovery and muscle repair.

I take the Muscle Milk with two meals daily for extra protein and medium chain triglycerides.

And last but not least, the digestive enzymes and fiber are so that I can keep my digestive system in check. I eat 8 meals a day totalling 5700 calories. Each meal with 10-14oz of meat, fish, or foul and a low GI carbohydrate. I take digestive enzymes with every meal, and I take fiber at a dosage of 20g per day.

 

[VelocideX]

Its possible that the synthetic route (or a particular synthetic route) produces different isomers than what occurs naturally. I don't know about anything in particular that this might affect, or particular instances where it might occur.. but it does happen sometimes when you are making other substances that occur naturally.

Its also possible that the product of synthesis could be better/worse than the natural form in this case, assuming it makes a difference in the first place. It would take long-term testing to know for sure about any man made vs. natural stuff.

I hadn't thought about the potential for non-selective stereoisomerism to be honest, but I don't think that a lot of the vitamins have it. The amino acids certainly do, and you can buy the correct form of it (e.g. acetyl-l-carnitine, as opposed to acetyl-r-carnitine).

A molecule is a molecule is a molecule. Vitamin c has the exact same structure, shape, molecular weight etc no matter how it has been made. Every vitamin C molecule in the universe has the same shape, structure, etc... If not, then it's not vitamin C. Molecular shapes are defined by quantum mechanics and are not open to "interpretation" or alteration based on whether the molecule is man-made or not. Man made molecules are no different from any other.

For people to say that vitamins produced "artificially" are different to vitamins produced naturally is simply incorrect. People who tout these theories usually have never studied chemistry, and are trying to push "alternative" theories about health. it's artficial products that are ruining our lives... (this is usally coupled with "buy my alternative natural health product instead!")

Put vitamin C out of a jar and vitamin C found naturally through every test and they will come out identically... A mass spectrometer is the fastest way to demonstrate this, despite its expense.

Mrsmitconh -- I'm sorry to be so blunt, but what you're saying is wrong and has no basis in science.

 

[frizzantik]

What's the difference between a vitamin that is synthetic and natural? They both have the same chemical formula. Same molecule.

theres no difference in the vitamin obivously, but sometimes other chemicals found in the foods help your body process the vitamins more efficiently. or a water soluable vitamin may cross a fatty barrier because it is connected to other bits, and then your body does what it needs to get hold of it because of the presence of some other checmicals in the food. sometimes certain food combos allow for even better absorption; for example iron is better absorbed in the presence of vitamin c, so having orange juice with your grain cereal improves absorption of the iron in the cereal

plus if you eat your vitamins with your food, you dont need to go and eat empty calories to fuel your body.

 

[mrsmitconh]

Mrsmitconh -- I'm sorry to be so blunt, but what you're saying is wrong and has no basis in science.

Then I bow to your superior knowledge and will inwardly digest the information ;-)

 

[crOOk]

Zinc and Echinacea
Immune system

Magnesium
Against Bruxism

L-Glutamin, Dextrose and Amino Acids
Workout

Wobenzym N
Against infections of the joints, tendons, ligaments

I also drink a lot of oils, like linen seed oil, sesame oil, olive oil, walnut oil etc.
It contains lots of Omega-3-Acids for vascular health and shit and other fine ass unsaturated acids and also a whole bunch of vitamine E which helps to get all the good vitamine A shit out of the green stuff we eat. Great stuff - Liquid gold!

crOOk

 

[SPUNK]

Morning: Multivitamin, Vitamin C, Vitamin E, Amino Acids

midday: protein shake or bar, creatine, l-glutamine

evening: protein, amino acids

 

[bipolair]

In regards to people who take lots of vitamin E / vitamin C:

vitamin C is actually a pro-oxidant at high doses. In addition it combines with iron in the gut to yield some nasty stuff (I saw a reference for this a while ago; I admit I'm not particularly knowledgable about it)

Studies find over and over that long-term intake of vitamin C/ E confers no life-extension benefits, and may actually reduce life expectancy.

Of how much vitamine C & E are we talking here?
And does it count for alpha-lipoic acid too, that pro-oxidant thing?

 

[crOOk]

@VelocideX
This ain't about "life expectancy", it's about life quality.

EDIT: @mrsmitconh
I wanted to say this in my last post, but I didn't want to hurt your feelings. Now I'm drunk and I reconsidered. I wanted to say:
Mrsmitconh, I reckon ye ain't no rocket scientist, are ye?

crOOk

 

[mrsmitconh]

EDIT: @mrsmitconh
I wanted to say this in my last post, but I didn't want to hurt your feelings. Now I'm drunk and I reconsidered. I wanted to say:
Mrsmitconh, I reckon ye ain't no rocket scientist, are ye?

crOOk

No worries ... I read your last post before you edited it ;-)
... and as I said I'm no Rocket Scientist so you repeating my words is hardly likely to cause offence! Have fun.

 

[crOOk]

Cool man! You're cool, I like you. Not in a gay way though.

EDIT: Hm, just realized you're a mrs. :D

crOOk

 

[VelocideX]

Of how much vitamine C & E are we talking here?
And does it count for alpha-lipoic acid too, that pro-oxidant thing?

Vitamin C becomes a pro-oxidant at around 5g+ per day, from memory.

Vitamin E doesn't become a pro-oxidant as far as I know, though long-term studies show that people who take large doses of vitamin E don't have any cardiovascular health, and in fact have slightly higher mortality rates. I'm not sure if the reason is known.

AFAIK alpha lipoic acid doesn't suffer from this problem.

It's funny... people don't realise that you DO need some oxidative stress in your system. Some parts of your immune system work by overwhelming invaders with free radicals. If you can't produce oxidative reactions, you can't live. Best demonstration of this is cyanide, which stops oxidative reactions inside the cell, killing you

 

[VelocideX]

@VelocideX
This ain't about "life expectancy", it's about life quality.

One would hope that an increased quality of life would correlate with increased life expectancy

 

[crOOk]

@VelocideX
What? How do those correlate? Well they do, but the higher one is, the lower the other is. What do you call that again? It's not antiproportional, but ...
Anyway, dude. You weren't serious, were you? I don't get it. Well, I'm drunk but still... Well, anyway, I'd hope not becasue that would mean I'd die pretty young.

crOOk

 

[Dave]

They are correlated actually. Someone who has clean drinkning water, access to lots of fresh food as well as mental and physical challenges would be said to have a higher quality of life than someone who didn't. Each of those things listed above will also extend one's lifespan.

Many nootropics and other supplements have some preliminary research backing up claims that they may help extend life expectancy. Do a PubMed/Medline search for "deprenyl" and see for yourself. Acetyl-l-carnitine is a really good one too.

I guess that I'll update my list while I'm replying:

5-HTP: helps take the edge off my depression

Vit E/ Alpha lipoic acid: antioxidants, helps with mental clarity as well as overall health

Udo's Choice: As Roger&Me said, this stuff rules. Great omega 3/6 fatty acid supplement

Acetyl-l-carnitine: started off as a nootropic, to improve focus and retention, ended up removing nealy all my anxiety and depression, makes me more sociable, improves my mood in general, increased energy, less hungry and I'm pretty sure that I'm losing some fat too. This stuff is amazing!

Psillium husk: fiber

I've also started taking melatonin to reset my sleep schedule when I need to (once a week at most), and I've started taking phosphatydlcholine in anticipation of starting on piracetam next week.

Oh, and the term you're thinking of is "inverse correlation"

 

[phishy2]

iron supplement and us men

it's hard to tell from the nics we all use, but i do hope that the men are
NOT taking iron supplements or multivits with iron. The trait to overstore iron, the hemochromatoisis gene is fairly common, several percent of the normal population and iron supplement can cause harm to those people. Men do not normally lose iron....thru menstruation and preganacy as woman do...and so require much less iron that woman. That explain womans vitamin having much more iron than men formulas. Men get enough iron from the regular diet. The same goes for post menopausal females, assuming they are not anemic to start with.