Stimulants VYVANSE MEGATHREAD ⬅ your Vyvanse thread has been merged here

[sutekidane]

On the topic of a ceiling dose, I'm not sure what dosages you have experience with, but when my prescribed dose was first increased to 70mg I took 140 mg at once, and I'm pretty sure all of it was effectively metabolized. When it started to kick in I had some pretty scary hypertensive symptoms, but they quickly subsided. I have ADD and a lot of experience with high-dose mixed amphetamines, even in combination with meth as well, but at least for me it seems that dextroamphetamine in particular has a very distinct comfort ceiling, beyond which the side effects far outweigh the benefits.

 

[Drownrat]

It seems this thread has been pushed back quite a bit, I would appreciate some insight on my questions so very much, thanks agian. http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showpost.php?p=9379395&postcount=360

 

[amapola]

I think you are misunderstanding how lisdexamfetamine is metabolized. It undergoes hydrolysis in the G.I. tract and it's metabolism is not hepatic until it is dextroamphetamine. That being said the answer to your questions are as follows.

Are there any CYP2D6 inducers widely available?

In the OD Directory as linked in my signature there is a thread called CYP-450 Interaction Chart.

How long does your enzyme efficiency return to normal after a dose of vyvanse, or how long after a dose would it take to get the full effect from the same amount again?

Incubation of lisdexamfetamine with human liver microsomes resulted in no concentration-dependent or mechanism-based inhibition of any of the isoenzymes under investigation: CYP1A2, CYP2A6, CYP2B6, CYP2C9, CYP2C19, CYP2D6, and CYP3A4.
...
Hydrolysis of lisdexamfetamine results in exposure to d-amphetamine; therefore, lisdexamfetamine could be predicted to ultimately have a similar potential for drug-drug interactions as amphetamine. In vitro results in this study, however, indicate that any interactions would likely be caused by amphetamine and its metabolites rather than the intact lisdexamfetamine prodrug.
http://dmd.aspetjournals.org/content/35/1/180.full

How much lisdexamphetamine can your enzymes process from a single dose before they are worn out to the point where adding more wouldn't be effective? (aka ceiling dose)

Animal model studies in mice and rats have shown that, at lisdexamfetamine doses within the therapeutic human equivalent dose (HED) range, lisdexamfetamine and d-amphetamine sulfate have similar oral bioavailability. However, as lisdexamfetamine doses are increased, the bioavailability of d-amphetamine from lisdexamfetamine declines relative to d-amphetamine sulfate. At an extreme HED of 800 mg, Cmax and the area under the drug concentration-time curve from time 0 to infinity (AUC∞) were reduced by approximately 80%.
J Clin Pharmacol March 2008 vol. 48 no. 3 293-302

 

[Drownrat]

Thank you amapola

 

[filet-o-fish]

I apologize if what I'm about to say has been repeated but I want to attempt to clarify and educate those who are interested in Vyvanse...

...especially those who may be curious about intravenous route of ingestion...

Lis-dexamphetamine (Vyvanse) is water-soluble (792 mg/mL). The reason it is considered a pro-drug is because the amino acid lysine is attached to the dex-amphetamine molecule (very similar to the adderall molecule). This causes the drug Vyvanse to be metabolized by the body at a more stable constant rate (preventing overdoses).
Although, the gastro-intestinal system contains enzymes (like proteases, trypsin) that breakdown this pro-drug to its most efficient form, enzymes are not solely needed to cleave the amino acid lysine. A moderately strong aqueous acid solution will work. Emphasis here is that it will work to an extent, nothing will work as well as your digestive system will. However, as a very general rule, anything water-soluble at room temperature will travel through your blood and to eventually to your liver where it, along with all blood, is filtered. Therefore...

Safest way:
-Let it dissolve in room temperature DI (de-ionized) water for 25-30 min. Distilled water is safe as well
-Filter at least 2x
-To the Moon!

More dangerous way:
-Let it dissolve in a mixture of a weak acid (lemon/grapefruit/orange juice, vinegar, ascorbic acid a.k.a. Vitamin C) + room temperature DI water in a 4:1 ratio for 15-20 min.
-Filter at least 2x
-Good Luck!

The second method is more dangerous because you must take into consideration the possible bacteria (acidophiles) within the acidic fruit juice or vinegar. Remember, aseptic technique (performing under sterile conditions) is key for intravenous use!

 

[dokomo]

I apologize if what I'm about to say has been repeated but I want to attempt to clarify and educate those who are interested in Vyvanse...

...especially those who may be curious about intravenous route of ingestion...

Lis-dexamphetamine (Vyvanse) is water-soluble (792 mg/mL). The reason it is considered a pro-drug is because the amino acid lysine is attached to the dex-amphetamine molecule (very similar to the adderall molecule). This causes the drug Vyvanse to be metabolized by the body at a more stable constant rate (preventing overdoses).
Although, the gastro-intestinal system contains enzymes (like proteases, trypsin) that breakdown this pro-drug to its most efficient form, enzymes are not solely needed to cleave the amino acid lysine. A moderately strong aqueous acid solution will work. Emphasis here is that it will work to an extent, nothing will work as well as your digestive system will. However, as a very general rule, anything water-soluble at room temperature will travel through your blood and to eventually to your liver where it, along with all blood, is filtered. Therefore...

Safest way:
-Let it dissolve in room temperature DI (de-ionized) water for 25-30 min. Distilled water is safe as well
-Filter at least 2x
-To the Moon!

More dangerous way:
-Let it dissolve in a mixture of a weak acid (lemon/grapefruit/orange juice, vinegar, ascorbic acid a.k.a. Vitamin C) + room temperature DI water in a 4:1 ratio for 15-20 min.
-Filter at least 2x
-Good Luck!

The second method is more dangerous because you must take into consideration the possible bacteria (acidophiles) within the acidic fruit juice or vinegar. Remember, aseptic technique (performing under sterile conditions) is key for intravenous use!

Neither of these methods are in any way safe (DI / distilled water are not sterile) and plain water will NOT break the peptide bonds, making the dextroamphetamine active. You'd be much better off using enzyme complexes externally, and even then the amount of processing one would have to do to make a solution that could be injected with any degree of safety would be enormous.

 

[Precious pain]

I am on a lymictal, Trazodone, Pristiq, and Topamax. I am Lymictal for Bipolar, Pristiq for Depression, Trazadone for the racing thoughts at nights causing me not to sleep, and Topamax help curb my appetite from boredom eating. I have wandering thoughts during the day, can't stay focused, when I have a conversation I forget what we are talking about, we I was saying, and to stay focused....that's a lost cause!! Cleaning my house... I can't stay in one room for more than 5 minutes cause I get distracted, and praying... I read a post earlier and I laughed because she said she said she says the same the thing over and over again. When I am writing, I write the same the same words twice! What is going on? I myself think I have ADD, I know i have OCD, is anyone on this combo of meds and on any ADD meds?

No need to quote yourself and repost Precious

 

[lovelycolorado]

I hate this stuff. I'm 6 months clean from oxy actually as of today! But the thing since being clean i can't keep my mind focused on anything so my therapist gave me this stuff because i wanted something non habit forming. So tried it a week ago with 20mg and it was great..got alot done and no sleep. the next day took same amount guess what happens...i freaked feel so weird and just sit in bed all day can't swallow dry mouth. tried it for three days same result. gross stuff. what gives?

 

[hydrochron]

^Tell your Dr. how it's making you feel and what happened. A dry mouth is a side effect of taking D-amp. Haven't you heard of meth mouth LOL. I would try drinking more fluid's or waiting until you see your Dr. again.

vyvanse is still addictive, you just cant really abuse it. And it sucks compared to straight up D-Amp. But hey cant make an orange out of a apple.

 

[sespress]

Catalytic effects of Stomach Acid??

Well the ant-acid which I always take with Amphet's as well is more of a comfort thing for me, I get terrible reflux when eating sizable mg amounts of dextro amphet. However looking at the bond I'm willing to bet that it will not be dependent on acidity of the stomach to happen, but the acid probably does catalyze it a little.

You could always try and see and write us a nice little comparison

Vyvanse needs not crushing, it comes in a powder form contained within a capsule. Antacids enhance amphetamine bioavailability so I always take them with any oral amphetamine. However, would antacids also reduce hydrolysis of Vyvanse into dextroamphetamine? If so, perhaps an antacid could be taken some time after Vyvanse ingestion to allow the lisdexamfetamine dimesylate to fully convert into the active amphetamine? Any suggestions, ideas? Either way, 50 mg Vyvanse feels very much like 30 mg of Adderall but actually smoother, so far at least. This is my first day on it, and 5 hours post ingestion, the effects are very pronounced and euphoric. It is definitely not useless, and certainly could be abused. It does not feel inferior to Adderall at all. I haven't tried pure dextroamphetamine, so I know not how it compares to that.

 

[sespress]

How so? if it breaks down to the real deal in the GI track you should be able to orally abuse it. It looks like it's a 2:1 on the drug after it's been metabolized so doubling the expected should do it.

I'm getting some tomorrow I'll post back about it.

^Tell your Dr. how it's making you feel and what happened. A dry mouth is a side effect of taking D-amp. Haven't you heard of meth mouth LOL. I would try drinking more fluid's or waiting until you see your Dr. again.

vyvanse is still addictive, you just cant really abuse it. And it sucks compared to straight up D-Amp. But hey cant make an orange out of a apple.

 

[mmj]

vyvanase

well i just got switched from ritalin to vyvanse.. i popped 5 30mg and disolved one in some orange juice and chugged it. this was about 2 hours ago. i still feel nothing. of course i was snorting 20mg rails of ritalin every few hours a few days before getting prescribed vyvanse.

ran out of ritalin one week prior to doc appt, no drugs to take, all out of kpins,hydrocodone, nothing.. i felt like shit.

now a week later after 5 of these fake speed pills my withdrawls from other drugs dont seem so bad. but there is really no high.

i'm 5'10
215 lbs
120-150mg of vyvanase at once and nothing.


i have been trying to get my doc to script me some focalin or adderall but she said it was too addictive but when i go back i'm telling her flat out i am not taking anything but focalin or adderal because this shit for me, vyvanase was 180$ for one month supply.

i preferred ritalin. fucking bitch, who is she to tell me somethings too addictive, i'm the one taking it, i'm the one thats the addict or not. give me what i fucking want you whore doctor.

 

[mmj]

well i did try pouring the powder out of the capsule into some freshly opened ginger ale with all the carbonation in it and it fizzed like crazy when i swirled it around. i just chugged it. i dont know if that could be a step in getting rid of the anti-abuse mechanisms or at least one of them? cause when i said fizz i mean like super fizzle violently.

i have no chemistry knowledge but i'm guessing theres a way to defeat this compound cocktail they put in for time release..
an easy way please cause i dont really feel like doing the whole drying on a pyrex dish i just want it not so weak . like i've taken probably 10 30mg pills in the last 3/4 hours and i can barely feel anything its like after 3 or 4 cups of coffee without the coffee jitters.

 

[The Chemist]

wash the powder with 91% rubbing alch, then stir in a glass, then evap that sloution in a pyrex....scrape and put that powder in your drinks. it works i did it for 7 months solid.

 

[mmj]

when you say "wash" the powder does that just mean mix it and stir it around, and how much rubbing alcohol?

 

[Toast to the Spirits]

What potentiated my vyvanse?

3 weeks ago I went on a reckless binge with Vyvanse. I ate approximately 600! mg. throughout a 24 hour period. I took nothing else that day except some beer. it seems that my tolerance should be through the roof.

6 days ago I did an unknown amount of 2ct2 (maybe 15-20 mg.) which is said to be a mild mao-a inhibitor, and from what I have read should have pretty much been out of my system after 4 days.

Last night I ate 60 mg. of Vyvanse 40 minutes after taking one Gaviscon (which contains the same ingredient in Tums). This is the first time I have attempted to potentiate the amphetamine effects by increasing alkalinity in my stomach. I had a very pleasurable 3 hour high that started about 1.5 hours after ingestion, with noticeable after effects lasting another 4-5 hours. This was probably one of the most euphoric experiences I've had with amphetamines (never done meth), interestingly because this dose was pretty low. At a certain point the effects reminded me of a medium dose of mdma without the touch enhancement and rolling eyes effects.

Does anyone know if the Vyvanse was potentiated solely by the Gaviscon, or could the 2ct2 I took 6 days ago have had an effect? Or was it simply a matter of not having done any amphetamines for 3 weeks? I just don't get it.

 

[mmj]

3 weeks ago I went on a reckless binge with Vyvanse. I ate approximately 600! mg. throughout a 24 hour period. I took nothing else that day except some beer. it seems that my tolerance should be through the roof.

6 days ago I did an unknown amount of 2ct2 (maybe 15-20 mg.) which is said to be a mild mao-a inhibitor, and from what I have read should have pretty much been out of my system after 4 days.

Last night I ate 60 mg. of Vyvanse 40 minutes after taking one Gaviscon (which contains the same ingredient in Tums). This is the first time I have attempted to potentiate the amphetamine effects by increasing alkalinity in my stomach. I had a very pleasurable 3 hour high that started about 1.5 hours after ingestion, with noticeable after effects lasting another 4-5 hours. This was probably one of the most euphoric experiences I've had with amphetamines (never done meth), interestingly because this dose was pretty low. At a certain point the effects reminded me of a medium dose of mdma without the touch enhancement and rolling eyes effects.

Does anyone know if the Vyvanse was potentiated solely by the Gaviscon, or could the 2ct2 I took 6 days ago have had an effect? Or was it simply a matter of not having done any amphetamines for 3 weeks? I just don't get it.

well consider youself lucky then cause i took some potentiators too and it just made it edgier and no euphoria to speak of and thats with taking about 25 at once. i was just up and unable to sleep, more annoying than anything else.

 

[Cloudburst]

Does anyone know if the Vyvanse was potentiated solely by the Gaviscon, or could the 2ct2 I took 6 days ago have had an effect? Or was it simply a matter of not having done any amphetamines for 3 weeks? I just don't get it.

I try to keep my stomach neutral in its PH levels when I dose lisdexamPhetamine (cute, Shire), because I don't want to take my chances with messing up my experience. However, given that the half-life of the prodrug molecule is an hour or less and that you had taken it 15 minutes prior to what is sure to be full conversion to the dextroamphetamine, it is a possibility you potentiated due to timing. Antacid-induced potentiation of oral non-prodrug amphetamines seems to have a consensus of ingestion around 15 minutes before dosing the amphetamine. That's my best guess.

I seriously doubt the 2C had any effect on your experience other than perhaps placebo at best.

Not doing any amphetamines for 3 weeks (which seems to me to indicate you use enough to build a significant tolerance) would undoubtedly, in my mind, be the culprit. Amphetamines are rather strange too, with intermittent dosing by a chronic user, there is even a chance of increased sensitivity (reverse tolerance) to explain the euphoria. How likely this is to happen, I do not know, but either way your tolerance would definitely have decreased significantly at that point. And I personally find Vyvanse to be quite euphoric at times (I'm not talking meth euphoria though), and prefer it to Adderall or any of the methylphenidates both recreationally and for its indications.

Magnesium seems to have very noticeably affected the effects on me. First time I dosed was supplemented with it and lasted 6-8 hours. I took a similar dose with the same amount of supplement two days later (now) and have been feeling full effects for 15 hours now. This makes me wonder about further about magnesium and what kind of variables are involved in getting this reaction, because I just can't help but feel these two factors are related.

Vyvanse is a substance I have learned to appreciate with over time. I would definitely consider it an acquired taste.

 

[motiv311]

I was just RX'd vyvanse finally... feels like cleaner smoother .. yet potent adderall XR

 

[Urgez]

i had my first appointment with the psych today, expecting to leave the office with IRs (which i have been self-medicating / abusing quite regularly the last few months). he wrote me out vyvanse which ive tried a few times.

frankly i was relieved. IRs can get out of hand, especially if you're looking to keep your tolerance down (they're too tempting to put up the nose!)