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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

Swallowed fentanyl by accident!!!!

Apparently swallowing it doesn't work.gets destroyed by stomach acid or something
Nope. I'm afraid this is incorrect. There are many case reports of deaths caused by the ingestion of entire patches. In all cases (that I've read anyway and they are numerous I assure you @The Wizard of the Creek i.e. just in case you choose to lose it again): usually multiple patches have been swallowed, the deceased were using other drugs or medications (particularly in suicide cases), and the strength of the patches were always of the higher strength.
 
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@dalpat077 You know what, you're actually 100% right. It would have had to be a 12.5 microgram/hour patch for a total of ~2.55 mg of fentanyl. I ran the math at 12.5 mg (didn't even realize how incorrect that would be), and came up just shy of the LD50 for a 75 kg monkey (2.25 mg intravenous, non-tolerant fentanyl) of 2.08 mg available to arterial blood. It is almost certain the OP would be fine then, excellent catch.
 
Hello.
@dalpat077 You know what, you're actually 100% right. It would have had to be a 12.5 microgram/hour patch for a total of ~2.55 mg of fentanyl. I ran the math at 12.5 mg (didn't even realize how incorrect that would be), and came up just shy of the LD50 for a 75 kg monkey (2.25 mg intravenous, non-tolerant fentanyl) of 2.08 mg available to arterial blood. It is almost certain the OP would be fine then, excellent catch.
Well before I get "ripped another new one" by somebody who is obviously not having a good day (and should know me better anyway):

Let's just be clear that you cannot take the strength of a patch and multiply it by the 72 hours that it's meant to be worn as prescribed and assume that to be the amount of Fentanyl in the patch. In this case: by doing that you'd come up with only 0.9mg in total which is incorrect. The total amount of Fentanyl in the patch WILL and MUST be stated on the packaging. There is ALWAYS more TOTAL Fentanyl in a patch as there is ALWAYS residual Fentanyl after the patch has been worn for 72 hours.

There were some very seriously concerned forum members here on this thread so I figured I try put their minds at ease just a little by going through the "science" and before trying to trace the OP or call out the National Guard. Now if the OP had swallowed two 100ugh/hour patches: that would be a different story entirely of course. But that was not the case ACCORDING TO THE OP.
 
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Hello.

Well before I get "ripped another new one" by somebody who is obviously not having a good day (and should know me better anyway):

Let's just be clear that you cannot take the strength of a patch and multiply it by the 72 hours that it's meant to be worn as prescribed and assume that to be the amount of Fentanyl in the patch. In this case: by doing that you'd come up with only 0.9mg in total which is incorrect. The total amount of Fentanyl in the patch WILL and MUST be stated on the packaging (not necessarily on the patch itself in some instances which by the way is one very good reason to NOT buy patches on the street and take the dealer's word for the strength of the patch). There is ALWAYS more TOTAL Fentanyl in a patch as there is ALWAYS residual Fentanyl after the patch has been worn for 72 hours (throw your mind back to our other thread that we've got going where we were speaking about "first order kinetics").

There were some very seriously concerned forum members here on this thread so I figured I try put their minds at ease just a little by going through the "science" and before trying to trace the OP or call out the National Guard. Now if the OP had swallowed two 100ugh/hour patches: that would be a different story entirely of course. But that was not the case ACCORDING TO THE OP.

Rest assured nobody is calling any authorities. The only action that's been given any weight that I have seen is maybe emailing the OP to encourage them to let us know if they're ok. :)
 
There were some very seriously concerned forum members here on this thread so I figured I try put their minds at ease just a little by going through the "science"

Yeah, so pretty much the patch would have needed to contain 12.5mg of fentanyl, and 33% of that, 4.17mg would have had to theoretically been fully available to be absorbed, and then a mix of buccal and oral bioavailability (just assume the highest amount) to even get close to the LD50 for a non-tolerant 75kg monkey - and still would have been shy of it. Consider OP tolerance and my math was for a dose 500% greater than it really was - this is where you had the excellent catch by realizing OP meant 12microgram/hour patches - of 2.55 mg (I used a patch with a higher total available amount for my 2.55 mg number), I feel a lot more confident for the OP well being - minus any extenuating factors and only using the data provided.

I'm slightly wondering now, though, if the patch had an absolute value of 12.5 mg for like a 50microgram/hour patch. Is that a possibility @dalpat077?
 
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Yeah, so pretty much the patch would have needed to contain 12.5mg of fentanyl, and 33% of that, 4.17mg would have had to theoretically been fully available to be absorbed, and then a mix of buccal and oral bioavailability (just assume the highest amount) to even get close to the LD50 for a non-tolerant 75kg monkey - and still would have been shy of it. Consider OP tolerance and my math was for a dose 500% greater than it really was - this is where you had the excellent catch by realizing OP meant 12microgram/hour patches - of 2.55 mg (I used a patch with a higher total available amount for my 2.55 mg number), I feel a lot more confident for the OP well being - minus any extenuating factors and only using the data provided.
The text that I've emboldened is key of course. Hence my choice of words in my original post of "NOT IMPOSSIBLE" but "HIGHLY UNLIKELY".

And, as it turns out, aside from saving 911 a little bit of bother, something else good came from this thread. The statement made below is dangerous (and by no means am I chastising you @draculic acid69 in any way or form for making it i.e. Fentanyl patches are just obviously not something on your radar is all).

Apparently swallowing it doesn't work.gets destroyed by stomach acid or something

But alright: it was by pure chance and pure luck that somebody made an incorrect statement and assumption and somebody else was able to correct it in detail before some newbie came across it and decided to swallow 5 x 100umg/hour patches just to see if the above was true or not!

Anyway. I suppose at this point in time it would be prudent for me to say that I do sincerely hope that the OP is doing well and responds to an email and/or to all concerned on this thread.
 
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I'm slightly wondering now, though, if the patch had an absolute value of 12.5 mg for like a 50microgram/hour patch. Is that a possibility @dalpat077?
I'm pretty sure it would be possible. The physical size of the patch would have to be changed though as well as the density of the drug in adhesive (not sure if the latter would be possible though but I don't really see why not). Contrary to popular belief: the release rate of Fentanyl from a Fentanyl patch is dependent on the physical size (area) of the patch NOT by the total amount of Fentanyl contained in the patch. That's one reason why a 12.5ug/hour patch is smaller in size physically than a 100ug/hour patch i.e. it's not ONLY because of the Fentanyl "load" as it were.

For clarity: most all of what I detail anywhere on these forums and on this topic is based on Durogesic DTrans DIA patches. So to be sure: I'm pretty sure that a little of what I post re: Fentanyl patches is not 100% correct for different manufacturers or for the older type gel reservoir patches. This is important to know. With the older type gel reservoir patches: the moment the reservoir ruptured the entire amount of Fentanyl would be immediately released and obviously this could result in an OD more readily I would imagine (but of course all other factors like bioavailability and individual traits and physical condition and tolerance etc. would still play a part).
 
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“If I may”? No you may not.

The OP is no longer here to speak for themselves. Let’s not assume anything about this poster. Don’t portend to speak for anyone else other than yourself or guess what the OP may or may not have swallowed?

Thank you.

—Wizard🧙‍♂️
@dalpat077 provided excellent information and he most definitely MAY contribute to this site. He went on what OP had in his post and after going over it myself he is most probably correct. There is little we can do anyway unless OP comes back to state how they are.

Do not be rude to someone giving actual thought out answers rather than you’re preferred call for good fucking vibes.
 
I asked for this thread to be closed days ago. Right now we are just guessing what the OP may or may not of have swallowed, may be it was 12.5 grams of fentanyl, dunno? This is why threads like these are really hard for me.

Unless the OP posts back, I‘m requesting that this thread be closed to further responses @F.U.B.A.R. This thread has run it’s course:

🧙‍♂️
Why do you care if the thread remains open? Anyway, @Xorkoth said to keep it open in case OP returns and can respond on it.

This thread being open isn’t harming you and it’s actually opened an interesting discussion On fentanyl patches that is informative.

if the thread is hard for you don’t fucking look at it and turn off notifications. Simple.
 
Right now we are just guessing what the OP may or may not of have swallowed, may be it was 12.5 grams of fentanyl, dunno? This is why threads like these are really hard for me.

The good news, is even if it was a total absolute amount of 12.5 mg, it is still likely the OP would be okay - the 5 years of tolerance makes it even more likely. Since there doesn't seem to be any patches with an actual amount of 12.5 mg, it's more likely, as @dalpat077 pointed out, it was a 12.5ug/hour patch with only 2-ish mg available.

With all that being said, if the thread is closed, we'll completely close the door on the OP ever updating us.

I do hope we hear from the OP and everything is fine.
 
I asked for this thread to be closed days ago. Right now we are just guessing what the OP may or may not of have swallowed, may be it was 12.5 grams of fentanyl, dunno? This is why threads like these are really hard for me.

Unless the OP posts back, I‘m requesting that this thread be closed to further responses @F.U.B.A.R. This thread has run it’s course:

🧙‍♂️
Actually. You make a good point actually. Something which I've brought up time and time again. And but one of the reasons (I think) that many people OD on these things. The OP did indeed use the abbreviation "mg". Only reason I responded the way I did is because I don't know of any patch that releases 12.5mg/hour (which needless to say would indeed be fatal even with extreme tolerance I reckon). So fair enough. I made the assumption that the OP was meaning ug (MICROgrams) as opposed to mg (MILLIgrams). The importance of this and as I've stated many times already: you'd be surprised at just how many people are not aware of this common mistake or misconception. There is in fact a post floating around here somewhere where somebody noted that they'd IV'd 10mg of Fentanyl and lived to tell the tale. I don't believe it (not if it was 100% pure Fentanyl that's for sure). Matter of fact: I have seen a post somewhere where somebody claimed something about IV'ing 100mg of CARFENTANIL (not here but somewhere else). With Fentanyl; these little details e.g. the difference between MICRO and MILLI can make a big difference (obviously) so people should be careful what they post when it comes to Fentanyl.

But your point is taken if the truth be told.
 
I think dalpat077 might be right. OP said he had the patch in his mouth for 2-3h prior to swallowing it, if it had been 12mg of fentanyl he would definitely have absorbed a pretty high dose even before eating it but he said he felt fine. It was probably a 12.5ug/h patch, many people mistake ug/h for milligrams.

But till OP shows up we can't know if he's fine or not, he did say that he had another patch on his skin (though he removed it), just hope he didn't take any more fent or any other sedative.
 
Only reason I responded the way I did is because I don't know of any patch that releases 12.5mg/hour

There would never be a 12.5mg/hour fentanyl patch, so you weren't wrong there. It would either be a 12.5ug/hour patch or a patch with an actual amount of 12.5mg - of which 50ug/hour seems to be the likely candidate.
 
You know what and as a matter of fact and just to reinforce what I'm saying in my previous post:

Take a look at what I consider to be one of the nicer Fentanyl harm reduction documents on the Internet (link below). And if you use Google to search for "injecting fentanyl" it's one of the first pages to come up.

Injecting Fentanyl - Minimising The Risks

Take a good look at the table on page 5. Then take a good look at the second footnote below the table i.e. "**Released hourly over 168 hours". See the problem? And that is a HARM REDUCTION DOCUMENT!

No Fentanyl patch will be releasing Fentanyl for 168 hours (that's 7 DAYS). I have never seen a prescription, or instruction, or package insert, or science, or medical paper that says anything other than a patch has to be replaced after 72 hours. And it is EXACTLY information like this that could very easily allow the uninformed to simply assume that a patch contains far less Fentanyl than it actually does (if they have seen this information and then decided to use 72 hours as the multiplier). See my point? Not only that. Those figures quoted are for Durogesic DTrans DIA patches (which is not mentioned). I happen to know that some of the Sandoz patches contain FAR more Fentanyl in total than do the Durogesic DTrans DIA patches. I'm talking serious differences here. Yet the strength of the patches is the same e.g. they'll both be labelled as 100ug/h patches and instructed to be worn for 72 hours. Off the cuff: the Sandoz 100ug/h patches contain just over 20mg of Fentanyl per patch. And the only way you have of knowing THAT is by making sure you look at the labeling on the patch's outside storage/delivery pouch/wrapper (which is a regulation i.e. for the total amount of Fentanyl to be printed on the said pouch/wrapper).

(By the way: I only noticed this today because of our little "spat" if the truth be told i.e. I've pointed more than a few to that very link).
 
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I asked for this thread to be closed days ago. Right now we are just guessing what the OP may or may not of have swallowed, maybe it was 12.5 grams of fentanyl, dunno? This is why threads like these are really hard for me.

Unless the OP posts back, I‘m requesting that this thread be closed to further responses @F.U.B.A.R. This thread has run it’s course:

🧙‍♂️

Hi Wizard, the general consensus of opinion is that we leave this thread open for the reason that Xorkoth stated above. Besides, it has fostered some useful discussion about fentanyl patches, so we cannot see any value in closing this thread for now...
 
Good morning.

First: let me apologize if my original post was upsetting to some and in particular to @The Wizard of the Creek. The wording of my original post could very have been construed as flippant (and as I noted: it was meant to be factual with a bit of humor included i.e. the point was not to prove that I know all there is to know about Fentanyl patches and more than anybody else I assure you). And @The Wizard of the Creek made a valid point as I've noted and he's acknowledged my response and reaction to his valid point made. So as far as I'm concerned: we're still good @The Wizard of the Creek. That is my hope anyway.

Second: I was really concerned for one or two that had posted here over the weekend (I only saw this thread yesterday morning) i.e. these members seemed worried about the OP to the point where I could actually picture them having sleepless nights over this. So I figured if I presented the "science" (only as I know it) it may serve to ease some of the concerns and worry. That's not to say I wasn't concerned about the OP or was making light of the dangers of Fentanyl. But one or two members were concerned and worried to a point that I'd not seen before on these forums (that's not to say it hasn't happened of course i.e. I've just never seen it before) and I've seen one or two posts where members have done a lot worse than the OP and have not received much more than a "well I hope you're alright" type of thing.

Third and lastly: of course I hope the OP is alright. If not: for sure I'm going to have a lot of egg on my face, I'll take the knock on the cheek, and lesson learned for next time (not to try and make light of something that could be serious). It is my guess and hope though that, given that the OP is not a abuser of these patches and that was obviously the first instance at attempting to use them in a way other than directed, the OP panicked, was fortunate enough to come across this site by whatever means to ask for advice, all turned out fine, and they just have no reason to return and continue posting. But in reality: if things didn't turn out quite as rosy as I'm assuming they did well then it's sad but true that it's nobody's fault here and it certainly wasn't for lack of trying on the part of the members here who went out of their way to help and gave some good advice (before I came along with my "scientific" approach). And let's be honest: the OP must have done some reading somewhere and was aware of the possible danger involved i.e. the "accident" was swallowing the third of the patch NOT that a third of a patch had been cut off and an attempt was made to get high using the patch sublingually or bucally (matter of fact: I could be totally wrong on all of this too i.e. as noted the swallowing of the patch may have been a first for the OP but that's not to say it's the first time the OP has tried to abuse a patch sublingually or bucally). Anyway and whatever the case: cutting off a third of a patch and putting it in your mouth really is not something that would even occur to someone who had not investigated possible methods of abuse of these patches. So nobody here is, or should feel, responsible at all for what may or may not have happened.

Anyway @Blaise2: everyone here is hoping that all is well with you. If you're receiving emails or notifications of these posts but feel that this thread has gotten a little bit out of hand or too much for you and you may not feel like getting involved: then no problem i.e. just login to the site and then logout again and all good (but of course as is obvious there's more than a few people who'd like to hear from you and hey: you've made some new "friends" and become a minor celebrity here as a result so maybe consider hanging around for a while) (and who knows: after using these patches for 5 years for sure you're going to need a helping hand or some caring advice as you go through withdrawal which, I'm afraid, is probably inevitable and the members here are just the type to provide such helping hand or some caring advice).
 
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