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Help! Should my 17 year old daughter trip?

thegreenhand said:
I sometimes think that doing drugs forced me to grow up too fast. Having to confront mortality/god/all of my self hatred so young probably didn’t do me any favors.

I often times feel isolated from my peers. I struggle to relate to their experiences. My struggles have felt completely different than theirs (not that mine were more difficult, just different).

Maybe it would be easier if I didn’t do such powerful drugs at a young age. Maybe not idk. I’m still eternally grateful for everything I’ve learned from drugs.
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Generally, the situations that push us to use drugs so young are what force us to grow up. Not necessarily the drugs themselves. Or at least that's been my experience.
 
arrall said:
Generally, the situations that push us to use drugs so young are what force us to grow up. Not necessarily the drugs themselves. Or at least that's been my experience.
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Well said. I often think of it as drugs give us “higher highs but lower lows”

And sometimes I question if those higher highs are worth it is all
 
I just wanted to write that i am following your discussion about human brain development very closely here. Due to personal interest.

I have, for a long time now, been supporting the idea of completely legalizing all drugs. In order to minimize the harm caused by drugs as efficiently as possible

There are many details in this idea, but i thought i had them all covered. But they may need some fine tuning i see. I mean... in my scenario of all drugs being legal, there would be an age limit. And i have been thinking that the age limit should be 25 years. Now i am not sure about that anymore.

Some truly bright minds, right here on this forum. Always. Gotta love learning :) But i can't learn anything, unless i am personally interested in the subject i am trying to learn about. This time i am. I am personally interested about human brain development. I would also like to gain some understanding, about various ways i have damaged my brain, and their development, due to my alcoholism and substance abuse, before i was 25 but also after that.

Thanks people. U rock! :rockon:
 
i never had problems with psychedelics, some are really hard ones but they combine well with other stuff. i wouldnt do this when im younger than 25 yo now in retrospect. studying is better.
 
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FredF said:
Hi folks. Looking for some opinions here.

A little context-
I am a full time single dad, basically raised my daughter alone from the get-go, but have fully raised her alone from about the age of 8-9.

So, her mom not being stable enough for my daughter to even want to be around her and ask to be in my sole custody on her own and not having her mom around, combined with whatever bullshit negative influence I’ve had on her (plenty, believe me) combined with the regular stresses of being a teenager in 2022 has taken its toll.

Over the past 3 years, she’s been hospitalized for self harm, or worse. She don’t want to live alot of the time. School hasn’t happened in about 3 years either.

She’s on Prozac and Quetiapine, and admittedly, things are not as dire today as they were a year ago. But as you know, she’s desensitized to her emotions through the pharmaceuticals, those issues are all still there, plus, aside from not being a danger to herself, and not being so gloomy all day, every day, there isn’t really much improvement in advancing with life itself. School etc. Shes very far behind, she has no self confidence or belief in the incredible gifts she does indeed possess.

I mean, the first time I experienced psychedelics all those years ago, I said - everyone has to feel this, at least once in their lives.

My kid is 17 now, and I look at and use the psychs much differently now than I did when I myself was a kid.

Im contemplating macro dosing her. I know micro dosing is an approach…

Right now, sober, I’m critical of myself and there’s a feeling of what kind of father contemplates dosing his kid. But when I’m tripping, I’m so convinced that if the trip goes right, she could so benefit from a guided trip. I want to wake her up when I’m tripping. Show her without any shame everything that her dad is, and isn’t. Articulate to her how special she is. And I think she’d start buying in. I think about her a lot when I trip. Well, I always do, but you know what I mean.

Any thoughts or if anyone has experience with this would share it with me, it would be greatly appreciated.

Am a bad dad? Just a harmless hippy?
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Absolutely not. Tripping will just make her psychosis, suicide attempts, depression, and other mental illnesses worse.

Do not have her stop taking the meds either, not without her doctor knowing and approving. Quetiapine is for schizophrenia and for people who are bipolar/schizoaffective, and you cannot just suddenly stop taking meds like this.
 
Endopharm said:
Never do this. Get her into therapy.

Her brain is still developing, and if shes having issues now on meds, look at getting her off those.

Its horrible that drs prescribed these in the first place
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She is severely depressed and is bipolar/schizophrenic/schizoaffective.

Therapy can help but she needs to be on the meds as well as she is severely mentally ill.
 
FredF said:
Hi folks. Looking for some opinions here.

A little context-
I am a full time single dad, basically raised my daughter alone from the get-go, but have fully raised her alone from about the age of 8-9.

So, her mom not being stable enough for my daughter to even want to be around her and ask to be in my sole custody on her own and not having her mom around, combined with whatever bullshit negative influence I’ve had on her (plenty, believe me) combined with the regular stresses of being a teenager in 2022 has taken its toll.

Over the past 3 years, she’s been hospitalized for self harm, or worse. She don’t want to live alot of the time. School hasn’t happened in about 3 years either.

She’s on Prozac and Quetiapine, and admittedly, things are not as dire today as they were a year ago. But as you know, she’s desensitized to her emotions through the pharmaceuticals, those issues are all still there, plus, aside from not being a danger to herself, and not being so gloomy all day, every day, there isn’t really much improvement in advancing with life itself. School etc. Shes very far behind, she has no self confidence or belief in the incredible gifts she does indeed possess.

I mean, the first time I experienced psychedelics all those years ago, I said - everyone has to feel this, at least once in their lives.

My kid is 17 now, and I look at and use the psychs much differently now than I did when I myself was a kid.

Im contemplating macro dosing her. I know micro dosing is an approach…

Right now, sober, I’m critical of myself and there’s a feeling of what kind of father contemplates dosing his kid. But when I’m tripping, I’m so convinced that if the trip goes right, she could so benefit from a guided trip. I want to wake her up when I’m tripping. Show her without any shame everything that her dad is, and isn’t. Articulate to her how special she is. And I think she’d start buying in. I think about her a lot when I trip. Well, I always do, but you know what I mean.

Any thoughts or if anyone has experience with this would share it with me, it would be greatly appreciated.

Am a bad dad? Just a harmless hippy?
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IM SURE YOU KNOW THIS BUT YOU DONT HAVE TO TRIP TO TELL HER HOW GREAT AND APPRECIATED SHE IS AND THAT SHE IS LOVED MORE THEN SHE WILL EVER KNOW BY MOSTLY UNSEEN FORCES IN THE UNIVERSE. TELL HER EVERYDAY THAT YOU WILL ALWAYS BE THERE FOR HER NO MATTER WHAT AND MAYBE YOU CAN BOOST HER CONFIDENCE ENOUGH TO GET OFF ANTI DEPRESSANT AND THEN i WOULD TRY KETAMINE ITS PROVEN TO STOP SUICIDAL THOUGHT IN UNDER 20 MINUTES IN SUICIDAL PATIENTS IT IS VERY EFFECTIVE AND WITH VERY LITTLE TO NO SIDE EFFECTS AND IS NOT PHYSICALLY ADDICTING.
 
Hello, Everyone.

I’m the OP. Its been just over four months of contemplating since I opened this thread, and the contemplation was already ongoing for some time by the time I came here for advice.

For anyone who has followed along, or is catching up, firstly I’d like to sincerely thank everyone who opined, one way or the other.

The continuation of the story goes as such - this past Friday, my daughter, who will turn 18 in two months, and I consumed mushrooms together.

Now, things can still go sideways, but right now, we both believe its the best thing we could’ve done.

You have to understand, my daughter was/is stuck. For all intents and purposes, she hasn’t gone to school for years. Hasn’t left her room for years. Virtually only for hospital visits after self harm. Cutting herself. Badly. Eating fistfuls of pills and such.

A big issue was/is her inability to believe in herself, and I’m telling you, this kid can do anything she wants. A big part of the problem is that while I tried to tell her I believed this to be true, that she does have the ability to do anything, she really felt I only said I believed in her because, well, what else is a father going to say.

Right now, for the first time ever, or since she was so small she couldn’t know any better, she believes that she has the ability to do anything. Right now, for the first time in too long, she believes that I fully believe in her, and that im not just saying it.

I’ve already told her, this feeling of victory, this feeling she deserves to feel, may wane. Doubt may creep back in. And that’s normal. For all of us. But I also told her that from now on, that feeling of doubt won’t feel exactly the same. That it won’t feel eternal. And she believes it. Fully.

I know there is much work to be done, but the willingness to do the work, and the ability to see the end goal in reach is now there, within her.

I know how this sounds, I didn’t think I would be this guy, but in a few hours she got so much farther than years of antidepressants ever got close to taking her.

In this moment I am happy. Its been long for me too. To feel happy. And my happiness stems from being happy for her. And that I can feel happy for someone else so authentically, makes me happy for me.

In this moment I am happy. And grateful. Grateful to anyone who had an authentic well wish. It worked. And I wish you all well. And happiness. I wish you all happiness.
 
Can't advise you nothing about that really.My daughter is 18 and does not smoke,nor have any interest about any psychoactive substance and she knows enough about that stuff besides me.Oo one time inhale together nitrous.Rarely drink some whiskey.If the moment and place is right,you are right,she is right....why not?But also why yes?
 
FredF said:
Hello, Everyone.

I’m the OP. Its been just over four months of contemplating since I opened this thread, and the contemplation was already ongoing for some time by the time I came here for advice.

For anyone who has followed along, or is catching up, firstly I’d like to sincerely thank everyone who opined, one way or the other.

The continuation of the story goes as such - this past Friday, my daughter, who will turn 18 in two months, and I consumed mushrooms together.

Now, things can still go sideways, but right now, we both believe its the best thing we could’ve done.

You have to understand, my daughter was/is stuck. For all intents and purposes, she hasn’t gone to school for years. Hasn’t left her room for years. Virtually only for hospital visits after self harm. Cutting herself. Badly. Eating fistfuls of pills and such.

A big issue was/is her inability to believe in herself, and I’m telling you, this kid can do anything she wants. A big part of the problem is that while I tried to tell her I believed this to be true, that she does have the ability to do anything, she really felt I only said I believed in her because, well, what else is a father going to say.

Right now, for the first time ever, or since she was so small she couldn’t know any better, she believes that she has the ability to do anything. Right now, for the first time in too long, she believes that I fully believe in her, and that im not just saying it.

I’ve already told her, this feeling of victory, this feeling she deserves to feel, may wane. Doubt may creep back in. And that’s normal. For all of us. But I also told her that from now on, that feeling of doubt won’t feel exactly the same. That it won’t feel eternal. And she believes it. Fully.

I know there is much work to be done, but the willingness to do the work, and the ability to see the end goal in reach is now there, within her.

I know how this sounds, I didn’t think I would be this guy, but in a few hours she got so much farther than years of antidepressants ever got close to taking her.

In this moment I am happy. Its been long for me too. To feel happy. And my happiness stems from being happy for her. And that I can feel happy for someone else so authentically, makes me happy for me.

In this moment I am happy. And grateful. Grateful to anyone who had an authentic well wish. It worked. And I wish you all well. And happiness. I wish you all happiness.
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Am so very glad that it has helped.

It was a huge decision for you. You looked at it from every conceivable angle it seems, including reaching out here for advice and to throw around ideas, guage reaction etc.

In the end you went with your intuiton and it appears to have been the right way to have gone in this particular instance. That of course doesn't mean it would be the way forward for others in similar circumstances, or even for you and your girl in the future.

I've considered something similar for ages. I would have loved to have had a psychedelic experience with a parent. I mean, how many people get to experience that eh? Of course there's plenty of possibility for an awkward experience with that scenario. I'm quite talented at the set/setting thing though (and modest) and have sucessfully facilitated space for people to trip in the past, so kinda know what I'm doing there.

I have kids older than yours. All of them have tripped to a degree. One in particular is explorative, super-grounded and already pretty experienced with psychedelics. I woldn't be at all surprised if we embarked on a trip together sometime this summer - we'll see. My intuition tells me it could well be unforgettable for us both
 
Even though i had reservations about it all ....Im happy that it has turned out positive for both of you.All the best for the future.
 
I'm so glad this worked out for you guys. <3 It was controversial, especially for some, but I believe in this case it was a sensible thing to attempt, and it looks like it paid off. Please do be aware that follow-up therapy is going to be important... I imagine that when you mention that she's willing to do the work, that's what you meant, but just for the sake of saying it, the afterglow of psychedelic trips are usually somewhat long lasting, and things feel changed permanently, and easy, but without using that period of time to start doing sober work, it won't last forever. At least that is usually the case.
 
OP I first took mushrooms when I was 19. It may not precipitate immediately, but something to keep going is a good idea. Cannabis is what I'm saying here. Or the alcohol route, which is ill advised, but can be helpful moderately. Because it opens things up and alters thinking. Chasing a dream with safe substances. I see some go to benzos, some to cannabis, some to alcohol, heroin, speed and stuff.

College is a good opportunity for psychedelics, but law enforcement makes things difficult after the experience. It may lead to hospitalizations for schizophrenia related diagnosis. But it could also help to come down from self harm too. Set and setting are what old timers would say. All the best.
 
FredF said:
Hi folks. Looking for some opinions here.

A little context-
I am a full time single dad, basically raised my daughter alone from the get-go, but have fully raised her alone from about the age of 8-9.

So, her mom not being stable enough for my daughter to even want to be around her and ask to be in my sole custody on her own and not having her mom around, combined with whatever bullshit negative influence I’ve had on her (plenty, believe me) combined with the regular stresses of being a teenager in 2022 has taken its toll.

Over the past 3 years, she’s been hospitalized for self harm, or worse. She don’t want to live alot of the time. School hasn’t happened in about 3 years either.

She’s on Prozac and Quetiapine, and admittedly, things are not as dire today as they were a year ago. But as you know, she’s desensitized to her emotions through the pharmaceuticals, those issues are all still there, plus, aside from not being a danger to herself, and not being so gloomy all day, every day, there isn’t really much improvement in advancing with life itself. School etc. Shes very far behind, she has no self confidence or belief in the incredible gifts she does indeed possess.

I mean, the first time I experienced psychedelics all those years ago, I said - everyone has to feel this, at least once in their lives.

My kid is 17 now, and I look at and use the psychs much differently now than I did when I myself was a kid.

Im contemplating macro dosing her. I know micro dosing is an approach…

Right now, sober, I’m critical of myself and there’s a feeling of what kind of father contemplates dosing his kid. But when I’m tripping, I’m so convinced that if the trip goes right, she could so benefit from a guided trip. I want to wake her up when I’m tripping. Show her without any shame everything that her dad is, and isn’t. Articulate to her how special she is. And I think she’d start buying in. I think about her a lot when I trip. Well, I always do, but you know what I mean.

Any thoughts or if anyone has experience with this would share it with me, it would be greatly appreciated.

Am a bad dad? Just a harmless hippy?
Click to expand...


Mate, it really doesn't sound like she's in a good enough place psychologically to handle a trip yet and the medication she's on could complicate matters.

I too, in my younger days, was of the opinion that "everyone should experience this at least once in their lives".

I still believe this, because there would probably be fewer cunts in the world.

HOWEVER, now that I'm much older, I would add the caveat "but wait until your mid twenties before you do".


Both of my kids have tripped, but I didn't facilitate that (well, indirectly I suppose when my lad helped himself to my stash of 1p-LSD).


I personally wouldn't feel comfortable dosing my kids because I'm only too aware of how dark shit can get with psychedelics.
 
F.U.B.A.R. said:
Mate, it really doesn't sound like she's in a good enough place psychologically to handle a trip yet and the medication she's on could complicate matters.

I too, in my younger days, was of the opinion that "everyone should experience this at least once in their lives".

I still believe this, because there would probably be fewer cunts in the world.

HOWEVER, now that I'm much older, I would add the caveat "but wait until your mid twenties before you do".


Both of my kids have tripped, but I didn't facilitate that (well, indirectly I suppose when my lad helped himself to my stash of 1p-LSD).


I personally wouldn't feel comfortable dosing my kids because I'm only too aware of how dark shit can get with psychedelics.
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they've gone ahead with some success already bro
 
Put thumbs up of all above posts 'cause there is true in any of them.Glad for the guy and his daughter that everything pass smooth
 
ageingpartyfiend said:
Am so very glad that it has helped.

It was a huge decision for you. You looked at it from every conceivable angle it seems, including reaching out here for advice and to throw around ideas, guage reaction etc.

In the end you went with your intuiton and it appears to have been the right way to have gone in this particular instance. That of course doesn't mean it would be the way forward for others in similar circumstances, or even for you and your girl in the future.

I've considered something similar for ages. I would have loved to have had a psychedelic experience with a parent. I mean, how many people get to experience that eh? Of course there's plenty of possibility for an awkward experience with that scenario. I'm quite talented at the set/setting thing though (and modest) and have sucessfully facilitated space for people to trip in the past, so kinda know what I'm doing there.

I have kids older than yours. All of them have tripped to a degree. One in particular is explorative, super-grounded and already pretty experienced with psychedelics. I woldn't be at all surprised if we embarked on a trip together sometime this summer - we'll see. My intuition tells me it could well be unforgettable for us both
Click to expand...
Thank you for understanding.

You know, her dose wasn’t exactly small. We prepped for a long time, and she was not afraid, at all. That’s the whole point. Naturally, she is so much more brave than me, but she forgot it somewhere. Needed to go in deep for her to remember. I’ve tried to tell her she’s so much better than me, in every way. And even if it is only an attempt to validate her, she never felt I was giving her any validation. She now understands, I just didn’t know how to do it in a way that would resonate with her. We’re past that. She feels validated by dad, for the first time ever, and she believes it was always my intent.

A lot of it, the experience, in a way went right past her. You know how it is, things go so fast some times. I had to go through the entire trip with her the next day. Remind her of how she was, the things she said, why she may have said them.

Like, for this first time, I asked her what her clear intent would be. She said her intent would he to only to know the feeling, to see of its potential. I told her that its important to have a clear intent, but don’t be surprised if you get something else out of it. She honestly felt that she didn’t have too much introspection until the next day. Then there were a lot of “holy shit” and “wow” coming out of her mouth.

Now, as a parent relating to what you said in terms of the possible magic of a psychedelic experience with a parent ir child. Aside from anything therapeutic going on, yes, it was great. As good as you can imagine it might go, thats how good it was for her and I. Magical.

I saw her eyes in a way I haven’t seen since she was a baby. Pure innocence. Pure wonderment. Oh how she loved the colours. The look in her eye when she saw those clouds dancing. I’ll take it to my grave.

Man, I saw her demeanour change almost instantly. Her posture straight ing out. It was as if she was a foot taller. She was so confident. So sure of herself, even when vomiting. She always has trouble vomiting. Like its the worst ordeal anyone could ever experience. She was vomiting on shrooms, saying “that’s ok” and boom, deal with it. She never felt she could deal with anything. Now, because if the trip and the early integration we’ve done, she feels she can lear to deal with the shit life throws at her.
 
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