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Opioids Opiates - the Cure for Depression?

I have always had to deal with depression ever since I first hit puberty. But after my time in the military... I am pretty messed up now. Depression does not even come close to describing what I go through on a day to day basis. However, rehab, AA, and VA support groups help keep me together.
 
Getting defensive about your addiction only makes you seem in denial. Are you aware of the first step of the twelve steps of Narcotics Anonymous? Also funny how it was another poster with a good memory who had to point out that less than four weeks ago you were claiming you had self-control over opiates

What? I was that poster with good memory who pointed that out about somebody else entirely, nobody else pointed out anything like that about me because those circumstances simply do not apply to me. You're confusing me for him, apparently. Go on and double check, if you really have to.

But is that really your idea of being respectful? Because it's arrogant at the very least. I know damn well I'm an opiate addict and have been okay with admitting that for years. The only advice I'm trying to give is to hopefully help SOMEONE from making some of the same mistakes I did, that's all.
 
What? I was said poster with good memory who pointed that out about somebody else entirely, nobody else pointed out anything like that about me because those circumstances simply do not apply to me. You're confusing me for him, apparently. Go on and double check, if you really have to.

But is that really your idea of being respectful? Because it's arrogant at the very least. I know damn well I'm an opiate addict and have been okay with admitting that for years. The only advice I'm trying to give is to hopefully help SOMEONE from making some of the same mistakes I did, that's all.

I am not being arrogant in the slightest. Apologies for my mistake. But here you are, metaphorically strutting around, seemingly proud of your addiction, telling others not to be like you and telling yourself being addicted to opiates is just fine & dandy as long as you occasionally hypocritically tell others not to do what you've done. What flimsy pretense do you use to justify your own use, then? Since apparently you're qualified enough to advise others about using opiates?
 
I am not being arrogant in the slightest. Apologies for my mistake. But here you are, metaphorically strutting around, seemingly proud of your addiction, telling others not to be like you and telling yourself being addicted to opiates is just fine & dandy as long as you occasionally hypocritically tell others not to do what you've done. What flimsy pretense do you use to justify your own use, then? Since apparently you're qualified enough to advise others about using opiates?
Proud? Not in the least bit. I'm disgusted with myself from the time I wake up until I finally fall asleep, and for anybody to see pride in any of that shows a great deal of insecurity.

As for what pretense I use to justify my continued use, I don't really justify it at all, I just found myself kneck-deep in this shit before I even saw it coming. The only reason I continue is because I am too much of a coward to do anything else. I don't try to dissuade others as a point of pride, there is too much self-loathing to be proud of anything. I'm not just speaking of addiction here, either... I literally don't have a single thing in my life to BE proud about. At the very least I hope it's given me a little insight on what NOT to do; people are free to use it or not as they see fit.

You claim there's no arrogance there but then pretend to know me. If that's not coming from a place of arrogance at all, then you must be deliberately trolling me. I don't particularly care which it is, though. I'm not interested in having an ePeen-measuring contest whatsoever.
 
Proud? Not in the least bit. I'm disgusted with myself from the time I wake up until I finally fall asleep, and for anybody to see pride in any of that shows a great deal of insecurity.

As for what pretense I use to justify my continued use, I don't really justify it at all, I just found myself kneck-deep in this shit before I even saw it coming. The only reason I continue is because I am too much of a coward to do anything else. I don't try to dissuade others as a point of pride, there is too much self-loathing to be proud of anything. I'm not just speaking of addiction here, either... I literally don't have a single thing in my life to BE proud about. At the very least I hope it's given me a little insight on what NOT to do; people are free to use it or not as they see fit.

You claim there's no arrogance there but then pretend to know me. If that's not coming from a place of arrogance at all, then you must be deliberately trolling me. I don't particularly care which it is, though. I'm not interested in having an ePeen-measuring contest whatsoever.

It appears we have made a breakthrough together. Now that I've helped you to see what you are, you can begin to work on your recovery. Don't be upset, just try to be positive and move forward. There is no need to thank me, I just helped you to see what was already obvious :)
 
Mad Dash: I wasn't belittling you like that one guy said. I was just saying don't waste your time or anyone else by even thinking about that when the science is out. It would be impossible, you would become tolerant in 1.5-2 days and need to up your dose. Even if the half life was 1,000 years. Because that is how the human body works in upregulating of opiate receptors on your cells. You would need to dose every 1.5-2 days no matter what.

That's all. The science is completely out on this. Your idea is a pipe dream. No offense, just had to say it. It's not that medicine or science hadn't got there yet.
Rather, it's: they never will get there because it is against the laws of nature.

edit: Just read your post detailing your depression and want to tell you: I have been depressed and completely crazy at times, but you will pull thru.
 
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Why does rio keep on saying opiates dude lmao... Am I missing something?

and btw the discussion between Mad Dash and rio is simply idiotic.. Mad Dash did nothing wrong
 
Mad Dash: I wasn't belittling you like that one guy said. I was just saying don't waste your time or anyone else by even thinking about that when the science is out. It would be impossible, you would become tolerant in 1.5-2 days and need to up your dose. Even if the half life was 1,000 years. Because that is how the human body works in upregulating of opiate receptors on your cells. You would need to dose every 1.5-2 days no matter what.

That's all. The science is completely out on this. Your idea is a pipe dream. No offense, just had to say it. It's not that medicine or science hadn't got there yet.
Rather, it's: they never will get there because it is against the laws of nature.

edit: Just read your post detailing your depression and want to tell you: I have been depressed and completely crazy at times, but you will pull thru.

Thanks man, it has been a rough ride, and my wife just gave up on me now I am in the middle of a divorce. I really would just rather not be alive anymore. Not really suicidal, just no desire to keep trying anymore. And after everything I did for my country they just dumped in the garbage like most of us disabled vets and said let the VA deal with you. And yes I realize this I was just making up a magical pill that could never exist to make a point to the OP that there is no way this would be possible.

Why does rio keep on saying opiates dude lmao... Am I missing something?

and btw the discussion between Mad Dash and rio is simply idiotic.. Mad Dash did nothing wrong

Brother I have no idea what happened there...
 
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super low dose buprenorphine seems like it would work perfectly as an anti-depressant. super long half life. no reason to desire extra dosage as, I've learned anyway, less is more with bupe.
 
an off label use for opiates is depression, but no doctor will prescribed for that reason, since they highly addicting. So im not surprised it "cured" ur depression.

Opiates help me feel happy when im feeling down as well too.
 
^It may be more common than you think.

That said, just as when prescribed a stimulant, opiates can seem like a panacea. That is, until tolerance develops.

In totality, from what I've read, drugs which force happiness, whether opiates, stimulants, or even benzos in some cases, tend to produce a very small benefit on depression if used long-term. That said, the delta subtype of the opiate receptor is supposed to be a valid target for treating depression (it's mu-agonism which produces euphoria). It appears that some medications, including venlafaxine and clozapine, act partially on this subtype. If one can not raise their dose of whatever opiate they're on, in theory, an antidepressant effect would manifest without too much danger of addiction. But of course, it takes a lot of willpower for one not to do that, and those with depression generally don't have that kind of control over their passions, which abuse led to opiates being phased out as psychiatric medications (by-and-large) in the 1950's.

buprenorphine and tramadol may be the most likely opioids to help depression.
 
^It may be more common than you think.

That said, just as when prescribed a stimulant, opiates can seem like a panacea. That is, until tolerance develops.

In totality, from what I've read, drugs which force happiness, whether opiates, stimulants, or even benzos in some cases, tend to produce a very small benefit on depression if used long-term. That said, the delta subtype of the opiate receptor is supposed to be a valid target for treating depression (it's mu-agonism which produces euphoria). It appears that some medications, including venlafaxine and clozapine, act partially on this subtype. If one can not raise their dose of whatever opiate they're on, in theory, an antidepressant effect would manifest without too much danger of addiction. But of course, it takes a lot of willpower for one not to do that, and those with depression generally don't have that kind of control over their passions, which abuse led to opiates being phased out as psychiatric medications (by-and-large) in the 1950's.

buprenorphine and tramadol may be the most likely opioids to help depression.

wow thats interesting i didnt know that. you learn alot on this site :)
 
Yes I was going to say bupe and tramadol actually have an SSRI like effect. The others only makes you feel good covering you depression. But I mean in reality saying opiates cure depression is the same as saying winning a million dollars cures depression. It sure does for a while! But if you just spend through it and don't find a way to make it last it becomes poverty and right back to depression.
 
Yes I was going to say bupe and tramadol actually have an SSRI like effect. The others only makes you feel good covering you depression. But I mean in reality saying opiates cure depression is the same as saying winning a million dollars cures depression. It sure does for a while! But if you just spend through it and don't find a way to make it last it becomes poverty and right back to depression.

Tramadol's SSRI-like effect is well documented, but do you have a source for bupe having a similar action? I knew that bupe can have an anti-depressant like action but I've never heard of it having an SSRI effect?
 
Tramadol's SSRI-like effect is well documented, but do you have a source for bupe having a similar action? I knew that bupe can have an anti-depressant like action but I've never heard of it having an SSRI effect?

You know, let me double check my facts good call, I never actually looked up why it does that. That may not be for sure. I know tramadol has SSRI effects, and I always assumed bupe's antidepressant effects were due to a similar action.

EDIT: Good call Rio, what I actually found is even more interesting. Apparently Bupe is now being used for TRD. That is wild. Another reason Bupe is a miracle drug. http://www.psychiatryadvisor.com/mood-disorders/buprenorphine-improved-resistant-depression-outcomes/article/368764/
 
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They are meds for people in severe physical pain, and even then you want to be really cautious with the doses due to massive tolerance increases. Using opiates for depression? Sounds like a horrible idea to me, considering that people tend to get depressed when they are withdrawing. Of course they are going to make you feel great when you're high, but tolerance and addiction should not be underestimated. I live with extreme chronic pain, I'm young but I'm like an 80 year old man, just sheer torture 24/7 and still I am fighting to take the lowest possible dose. If you don't have chronic pain, then be grateful for that and don't touch opiates (just my advice... it makes it really tough for people who are actually in pain to get pain meds as well).

Maybe ask yourself why you are depressed? It's probably solvable, unlike my mangled spine.
 
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