Dissociatives [Methoxetamine Subthread] Adverse Effects / Side-effects

[ColtDan]

4-FA gives me headaches sometimes as well, its annoying

I find MXE doesnt mix too well with most things. mixed it with meph before, 6-apb before, nasty combos

 

[Xorkoth]

I guess MXE doesn't play too well like ketamine does. Ah well. I still want to try combining it with tryptamines, I feel like that would go well. Anyone have experience that contradicts that?

 

[pharmakos]

my usual manageable MXE dose plus two grams of mushrooms (was a new combination for me) was way too intense, way too much mindfuck. cut your usual doses in half... half my normal MXE dose plus a gram of shrooms would have been much better.

they were really good shrooms tho btw, i never ate more than about 2.5grams of that batch at a time. a full eighth would have been too much.

 

[thikal]

I took about 180mg of 4-FA over a couple of doses last night. Towards the end I had a very minor headache and I felt not too great (from the comedown), so I took 15mg of MXE. It seemed to go alright, so I took 35mg more or a little more than that. I proceeded to have a weird MXE experience. It felt disconnected and random, I felt less connected to the experience and it was kinda strange. To top it off, the headache I had from the 4-FA turned into a very strange, super-concentrated headache, in the same spot that I had felt it from just the 4-FA, but much more intense. The headache persisted until I finally went to sleep, many hours later

It make me think that MXE made you more aware of the real location of your headache. When you meditate and a painful feeling arise, you can concentrate on it, and if you do it well, you understand that the pain isn't diffused on a big zone, but more so on a little point really painful. I think the mind disperse the pain intensity, a mean of escape from the reality of the feeling. When you are dissociated, you are fully equanimous and concentrated (not every times^^) and maybe that's why without effort from yourself you started to observe (or more conscious) the pain and found that it was really localised on a little point.

Hope this will make sense for you, but I'm not sure^^

 

[Xorkoth]

Perhaps. I also feel it was an adverse reaction as the MXE trip was odd and most of all because the hangover I had the next day was preposterously miserable, I felt like I was about to die from my head rushes, no joke, it scared me quite a bit.

 

[lenses]

I wonder if the beta-carbolines in coffee have a similar effect. I know I feel calmer having a cup or two after feeling cracked out from MXE abuse the night before. Are you not worried about the MAOI effects of harm(al)ine though, or does it not matter since you're only doing small doses?

The beta-carbolines in coffee are a few steps away from harmine and harmaline , if I remember correctly, coffee contains harmal , which is significantly weaker than the forementioned harmaloids.Coffee still has some of that magic in there. Isn't it funny that cigarettes (and burnt meat) contain harmaloids , too?

Harmaloids seem to be really quite safe, they are not true MAOIs, they are RIMAs (reversible inhibitors of monoamine A) . There is not really any risk of food interactions.

The reasons harmaloids seem to be so helpful is they upregulate EAAT1 receptors , which are glutamate sensing receptors...This is super helpful as PCP and its analogues seem to cause metabolic changes in glutamate and aspartate metabolism. One of the big factors in PCP/PCE abuse (and lets get it straight folks, this is 1 step removed from PCP abuse, this drug is 3-meo-2-oxo-PCE, you'll turn into the same kind of PCP moron with abuse, just will take a bit longer . If there is interest I can dig up the studies regarding glutamate receptor upregulation.

I was using 125mg-150mg total (oral) daily for about 4 months straight.

During the last month I started to suffer what I think was dyskinesia. Basically I lost significant control of my right hand - I could not grip with it and could not willingly move my pinky at all. The hand would sporadically go into a state of flexion and freeze there. My right foot was often numb (not in a pins and needles sense, rather it felt like dead meat) and rotated inwards. I also had trouble controlling my facial muscles and I developed facial twitching. These symptoms evolved over about a two week period and before that, I wasn't experiencing them.

The experience scared me into abstinence for a few weeks and the symptoms slowly abated. Things seem to be mostly back to normal now. I can grip with the right hand although its still hard to flex the pinky (feels incredibly stiff and unresponsive). My face only twitches if I strain the muscles (make a funny face, open mouth really wide, etc).

Anyone else experience symptoms like these? I know there are a lot of abusers out there but I haven't seen any other accounts of this nature.

Choline - afterwards! Will help. I'm telling ya, coluracetam will really fix things up after long term abuse. Choline re-uptake inhibitors? Yes mammy.

Yes- Weird movement problems too. On my right side of my body. Walking weird with my right leg, and I mentioned in previous posts involuntary gripping of things , and really disturbing at high doses was the tendency for my bottom lip and jaw to want to bite my top lip. Hunched up and lurchy walking too. Like a robot.

Don't think you won't turn into PCP man - you WILL. You think you are the shit-mcgrit and have it all figured out, but you turn into a fucking idiot with no memory, no understanding, walking strange, talking strange ... Those deficits can become a part of your being. You will become a blunted person, and the saddest part is , you won't care, at all.

Do you want to mess up all other drugs you take, too? I feel like it can do that.

So many time in the midst of a high dose MXE trip, has the urge and inner safety mechanism overcomes oneself, that I have throw out my stash of MXE and 3-meo-pcp. I have done it 3 times now, and you know what, I think it is for the best, I think I am saving myself.

Highly relevant - The documentary featuring PCP man.Please watch ... there are not many documentations of PCP(PCE, you get it) effects and this is pretty accurate- really.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3VsWR_nOYI

Don't think you found the shortcut to life with this stuff. It is not it. I'm telling you.

 

[Halif]

I find MXE doesnt mix too well with most things.

Sounds like you've burnt out on it, because I can think of nothing that mixes better than MXE.

Great caution needs to be taken, however, and do it (combos or just MXE by itself) too often and you're far more likely to get bad experiences.

I'm enjoying a big, indefinite break from MXE after using an obscene amount over the last couple of years. I abused it and fucked myself up like a lot of people have reported here on this forum, but when I was being sensible in the early days I had some of the best experiences ever from combos. I could not believe how well it synergised - I mean really worked together - with so many other substances.

Funny though, while a lot of people enjoy MXE combos it seems a major point of contention is MXE and cannabis. Seems to be a real love/hate thing. I can't stand it, personally. Way too intense - which is strange considering I had overwhelmingly positive experiences with the 2Cs, the 4-substituted tryptamines, other dissociatives (with the exception of 4-MeO-PCP - had three bad experiences mixing the two), downers, and stims (not at the same time but hours later to smooth out the comedown and even make it into something enjoyable).

So many good times, but sadly I ruined it for myself by overuse and turned it into 'just another habitual drug'. But bless MXE, you can cane the shit out of it and then walk away so easily compared to other substances.

 

[Halif]

he documentary featuring PCP man.Please watch

Seen that one before - love it! Does anyone else find THAT guy (who first appears around the 12 minute mark) seems quite likeable? He seems so matter of fact and despite being visibly messed up, he knows what he's doing and why. he's not in denial and is just straight up.

Best lines ever in an interview:

Interviewer: Say the alphabet.
PCP Dude: A..B..C..D.....what?!


I love the fact that one substance can have a cool name like "angel dust" and at the same time be known as "sherman"!! Does anyone know where the hell that nickname came from?!

It's like if you're on the street looking to score and someone comes out of the shadows saying "pssst, yo man, you looking for some gertrude?! I got the bomb right here! "

 

[SnackAttack]

Yes in heavy doses this makes perfect sense... Valium is a necessary component for any heavy (or light) Ket, PCP or MXE user (search Onleys lesions for further explanation). I have had a variety of oddities happen to me on this compound and eyelid removal is one of the many.

My suggestion to any and all of you who have had any interest in the compound (rather it be minute or major) step forward with caution (or run for the heavens), I have had a long standing (multiple year, on and off) 'relationship' with this compound and things get very, very out of touch, dark, frightening and catatonic...dangerously out of touch. Out of touch to the point of no return if you don't have a family member to pick you up out of the shit... the withdrawal is satanic to say the least, a more socially accepted word would be Paranoid Schizophrenic with delusions of grandeur accompanied by a major messiah complex that causes rampant paranoia, auditory hallucinations and obscure delusions and hallucinations that will leave you in a catatonic state... feeling as if you have totally lost free will... be careful with your NMDA receptors kids.. and adults... I'll leave it at that for now.

 

[Xorkoth]

There's never been any proof that Olney's lesions occur in humans... I always thought benzos and dissociatives were dangerous to combine. Not sure it's an essential component at all.

 

[mozaik0000]

I am pretty keen on nutrients and nutraceuticals... From what information I have collected about dissociative and MXE effects, I have identified some nutrients that get depleted as a result of use of MXE (and other arylcyclohexamines ) Anyone who is suffering from after effects, please try these simple remedies:

1. B12 ! It is recommended for nitrous use, right ? Tingling in the fingers? Grab some B12 (methyl-b12 is the best)

2. B6 - I prefer P-5-P , which gets converted to B6. 50 mgs ... Too much can cause problems, so don't hyper-dose.

3.Inositol! The glutamate systems seems to be buffered by inositol. Too little can be bad. Take as much inositol as you want.

Simple, and safe.

Some other reccommendations:

Harmaloids - Harmine and harmaline . Small doses... 40mgs of the hcl salt of mixed harmaloids REALLY REALLY helped with MXE after-burnout... After heavy use, the only way I can explain how my vision was , was comparable to taking a small dose of the 2cX-nbomes - cheesy visuals, rainbowey over stimulated serotoniney feel. Felt terrible. Unsafe.

Harmaloids are amazing. In a nutshell, harmaloids increase the amount of glutamate receptors.I can't find the study at this moment, but they have been shown to upregulate the EAAT1 system. This is one of the glutamate handling systems. This is good because the supression of NMDA function causes an over expression of glutamate afterwards. This can lead to neurotoxicity(not able to metabolize glutamate as well), and general feeling terrible (over-sensitivity to pain, light, sound) .

MXE and other related compounds can change metabolism of aspartate metabolites and glutamate metabolites... Under regulation of these metabolites can lead to schizophrenia like symptoms... Would likely occur in chronic use.

I have found huge relief from harmaloids alone.

DHA / Omega 3's - MXE promotes massive neurogenisis. I found big improvements in fluidity and lucidity with DHA (around 900mgs) .

I believe the mechanism of action is between the NMDA inhibition and agonism of glutamate receptors (mGluR1 especially). From wikipedia

"It has been suggested that mGluRs may act as regulators of neurons' vulnerability to excitotoxicity (a deadly neurochemical process involving glutamate receptor overactivation) through their modulation of NMDARs, the receptor most involved in that process.[23] Excessive amounts of N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA), the selective specific agonist of NMDARs, has been found to cause more damage to neurons in the presence of group I mGluR agonists."

GABA-drugs (especially benzos) will be neuroprotective with dissociatives.

Things to avoid :

Stimulants!!!

Wonder why such bad experiences with stimulants and MXE? Stimulants activate glutamate receptors like crazy. Increase (acetyl)choline flow...

Choline! Indirect dopamine activation. May be okay for after use. But not when any MXE is in the system.

If you are having severe memory problems, coluracetam will really help.

Hope this dump of information is helpful to someone. If i could reccommend just one thing for MXE after-effect healing, it would be the harmaloids.

-lenses

Very interesting!

Which of these could be used right before MXE intake so as to help limit adverse effects? I'd rather prevent than cure!

 

[Mahakali]

Hey y'all,

Been doing MXE for a little over 15 months nearly daily in the amounts of appr. ~ 250-300mg a day spaced out over the course of the day...taking bunches of supplements along with that, including 5-HTP, L-tyrosine, Sam-E, GABA, melatonin, Gabapentin, Inositol, L-DOPA, B vitamins, Fish oils high in EPA/DHA, and more...also take 300mg Wellbutrin, 40mg Strattera...

side effects include raised BP, increased HR, occasional numbness/tingling like effects in peripheral limbs, slight motor-control issues which I've adjusted to (got my MXE 'sea legs'), increased movement speed (amphetamine like essentially), some disasociative personality effects (ungrounded, head in clouds)...

NOt sure yet what I can add to the discussion because I haven't really participated much here yet, but I am open to questions. I have M-holed about ~15 times...I feel that I am relatively experienced. I have had a couple of psychotic breaks on it (lost consciousness but was still up and about doing crazy stuff)...I am already diagnosed with schizoaffective bipolar type. I have found a balance of sorts where I no longer do anything crazy...

I have no idea what I will be like when I quit for a long period of time. The longest I have gone clean on this stuff during this time period was 4 months...have had about 4-5 times where I quit for appr. 2-3 weeks.

It is interesting to say the least...

EDIT: one effect that I have noted is that it seems that MXE seems to be not only a vasoconstrictor in terms of venuous activity, but also seems to cause constriction of the bladder, etc...as in, when I am on it, it is hard to urinate...so it seems to be contraindicated for those with existing urinary disfunctions due to inflammatory or tense urinary systems...sorry if I am not completely clear, as I am not a doctor, but I would say that if you already have problems with urination due to lack of ability to relax the 'tubing' in related areas, you should pay attention to this. - This could lead to problems down the road...

 

[phuckingnutz]

To what end?^

 

[pharmakos]

250-300mg of MXE a day for 15 months? holy hell dude.

 

[《Plasticity》]

Anybody have any problems with stomach bloating on MXE? My girlfriends been indulging in my MXE and complaining of bloating, enough bloating that's visible from an outside perspective. I haven't touched the stuff in a long time so I can't remember for sure if I also had this problem, but I'm quite sure I did. Nothing worrying, but it's not a complaint I hear often.

Ps: No, it's not that time of the month either lol.

 

[Xorkoth]

Not bloating but me and a friend both agree that MXE makes us fart a lot, it feels like from deep down inside, farts straight from the stomach is what it feels like.

 

[《Plasticity》]

Hmm, I guess a buildup of gas could/would explain this. Thanks Xork

 

[phuckingnutz]

Yep, makes me fart too...at first I thought my GF blew out my sphincter with an anal plug, but now I think it's the MXE...lol.

 

[pharmakos]

gas-x should relieve the bloating if it is indeed just a built up gas bubble in her stomach

 

[《Plasticity》]

^ Good idea, that should also rule out whether this is gas related.

Yep, makes me fart too...at first I thought my GF blew out my sphincter with an anal plug, but now I think it's the MXE...lol.

Jesus christ lol, ain't no shame in your game eh phuck .