RCs 3F-Phenmetrazine (3-FPM)

[ComfortablyNumb95]

I fucking dumped a whole pound of it. Was meant to be a lifetime supply lol.

The rush is like nothing else. I'd pass on IV coke, hydromorphone, morphine and MDMA anytime to shoot some 3F-P. The boiling blood, the ice cold breath, arteries pounding all the way up to my skull, ears hissing, then my eyelids drop and there's perfect silence and tranquility. I haven't injected it in what will be 2 years sometime in summer, but still catch myself thinking about it several times per week. Everytime I look at a person who has some visible superficial vascularisation I get nostalgic. GOD IT'S SO FUCKING GOOD. I remember all those hours immediately before I'd get to shoot up like it was yesterday. The excitement, the sheer happiness and later the torn feeling, tears coming from my eyes while simultaneously anticipating that enormous full-body orgasmic rush. I never felt this out of control over my behaviour again.

I can only urge everyone to not ever IV this stuff, especially if you have an affinity for needles and stimulants. It's only really feasible using a butterfly anyway with a full-blown rush dose being between 400 and 500mg and needing 1ml water per 42mg of salt. I usually had to stop before the full 500mg entered my body simply because it'd feel like another mg would make my heart explode.

I really need to stress that a single year (or two) of IV 3F-P use left my arms scarred. The largest two veins on both my forearms became inflamed and died in a painful process lasting several months. I got an abscess due to the needle fixation it would trigger and the compulsive blood drawing that often followed. It's not fun having to clean your apartment of blood for a full 12 hours straight.
Even worse though, it fucked my nerves big time, eventhough I never went above 42mg/ml. It got to a point where I'd wake up screaming at night. Again, no fun. The symptoms dissipated after as little as a week and were gone after two months. A single injection would at least cause tingling sensations for days after.

However the main effects are the exact same in my experience. It's actually really good when used orally and the required dose is only 40% higher compared to IV use. It's my second favourite way to take this stuff. Keep in mind 150mg is plenty when administering it orally since it's not about the rush and anything above that will just increase the undesirable portion of it's effects.

I've had 10g 3F-P last year for oral use and enjoyed it a lot more than amphetamine and cocaine. Just ordered another 2g for a single session with the misses. The biggest challenge is not dosing too high or the beautiful slightly empathogenic stimulation will give way to that same compulsive hellhole all stimulants take me to.

By the way the experience seems to become a lot more serotonergic at very high doses. Hence the dropping eyelids and silence upon injection. At least that's what I assume.

EDIT: Ha noobcakes, I just read your post. Sounds like we are in the same boat! :D God that rush. I need to steer way clear of this thread!!

good thing you managed to quit this stuff. I remember 1 or 2 years ago you were slamming like what, a gram at a time? Was fun to read your posts but also very concerning.

 

[Draq]

Before I start, I'm not saying you are not correct in what you say! It's just not congruent with my experience, knowledge and pre-post research

Quite frankly, if you don't want a dick sizing contest, you best keep to yourself where you have and have or have not worked, what you have studied and whatever other testament of superior knowledge and experience you have to show. That being said, neuroleptics, butyrophenones or atypicals are first line treatment where I live which would be in Germany. If tachycardia gets dangerous, beta blockers are thrown into the mix.

Do you have any (American?) treatment guidelines which actually promote benzodiazepines over dopamine antagonists and beta blockers? I'd really like to see those if so.

Benzodiazepines will calm a person, but there simply aren't of that much use with much more selective medication being available.

I know antipsychotics are used in psychedelics overdoses as first line treatment, but only in cases that are diagnosed as acutely psychotic upon admission. Ome of the most direct way to stop a psychedelics experience is trazodone which among other things is a 5HT2 antagonist. Alas this medication is only very rarely used in psychedelic intoxications.

Just an American chiming in on er treatment. If it's not a matter of danger to the staff, IM lorazepam followed by oral diazepam for its longer half life is often used and the person is kept in the psych ward and evaluated for outpatient options. I've been in that situation. However, several weeks ago a friend of mine decided to see how fast he could consume 2g crystalmeth... due to attempting to assault staff he wound up with a haliperidol/lorazepam shot--- standard psych ward cocktail for violent episode. .. takes you from fighting off four people to on the ground 15 seconds later, then you sleep for a day. Been there too. But once psychological disorders ruled out they just try figure out if your insurance would cover rehab or not and they let you go.

 

[Draq]

Before I start, I'm not saying you are not correct in what you say! It's just not congruent with my experience, knowledge and pre-post research

Quite frankly, if you don't want a dick sizing contest, you best keep to yourself where you have and have or have not worked, what you have studied and whatever other testament of superior knowledge and experience you have to show. That being said, neuroleptics, butyrophenones or atypicals are first line treatment where I live which would be in Germany. If tachycardia gets dangerous, beta blockers are thrown into the mix.

Do you have any (American?) treatment guidelines which actually promote benzodiazepines over dopamine antagonists and beta blockers? I'd really like to see those if so.

Benzodiazepines will calm a person, but there simply aren't of that much use with much more selective medication being available.

I know antipsychotics are used in psychedelics overdoses as first line treatment, but only in cases that are diagnosed as acutely psychotic upon admission. Ome of the most direct way to stop a psychedelics experience is trazodone which among other things is a 5HT2 antagonist. Alas this medication is only very rarely used in psychedelic intoxications.

Just an American chiming in on er treatment. If it's not a matter of danger to the staff, IM lorazepam followed by oral diazepam for its longer half life is often used and the person is kept in the psych ward and evaluated for outpatient options. I've been in that situation. However, several weeks ago a friend of mine decided to see how fast he could consume 2g crystalmeth... due to attempting to assault staff he wound up with a haliperidol/lorazepam shot--- standard psych ward cocktail for violent episode. .. takes you from fighting off four people to on the ground 15 seconds later, then you sleep for a day. Been there too. But once psychological disorders ruled out they just try figure out if your insurance would cover rehab or not and they let you go.

 

[Phenpsycho]

I've been experimenting with this stuff for the past two weeks, one or two days in a row with a couple days off. I intended to test it out as a motivation enhancer and for brain fog, etc. and I started off with 25mg oral doses which I slowly bumped up to 50mg which is pretty much the sweet spot for me without any tolerance. I have only taken a single oral dose per day and the nice clean stimulation lasts all day. It only becomes recreational if I dose it with Kratom simultaneously (the stimulation + euphoria of a morning burn makes me feel unnaturally happy for a couple hours). It brings back this memory of being on Ritalin as a child when I was prescribed it for ADD but was stubborn and didn't want to take my meds so begged my mom to let me quit taking it, oh the irony

The side effects aren't noticeable at all, i.e. no anxiety, teeth grinding, paranoia and whatever else stimulants can cause. I would even say a few strong cups of coffee causes more edginess and anxiety in me than 3-FPM but obviously the coffee gives much less stimulation than it does. For some reason on the come-up there's a bit of a compulsion to redose but I can easily ignore it and don't indulge in that hunger for excess. I was after a functional, non-euphoric stimulant and something drew me towards this substance and so far I haven't been disappointed. I breeze through any work I have to tackle and still have plenty of energy to enjoy the rest of my day feeling a little perked up with no noticeable comedown. I'll be stocking up on this one in the event it gets banned since i'm not sure if i'll ever get any stimulants re-prescribed.

 

[Phenpsycho]

Ok, so i've been reading more through this thread and haven't made it all the way through yet but i'm in my fourth week now of using this as a functional stimulant and have to say i'm not relating to these posts where everyone has a compulsion to re-dose constantly. There's still only a slight compulsion on the come-up and it's easily ignored but after the effects kick in fully I have no desire to do so.

My current routine is to parachute 50mg in the morning and i'm finding now every three days is a better fit since the second day I can still feel the metabolite(s) working(although they don't disrupt me from getting a few hours of rest) and a coffee extends the stimulation through the second day. The third day after dosing is when I feel the effects have completely worn off and that's my rest day where I will survive off of some caffeine or Kratom but i'm taking a break from the latter atm.

Do you folks think continuing to take a 50mg dose every three days is a bad idea to control symptoms of ADD? I'm not planning to seek a high from it and will keep my routine to strictly medicinal, so i'm asking for feedback in that sense only. I just paid 450 dollars to get assessed again as an adult and I indeed tested positive for having ADD/ADHD using several tests but upon going to a GP and then a psychiatrist I was refused the medicine I need and told since the government has imposed stricter controls on prescribing these medicines I will have to do with taking behavioral courses to manage the symptoms...If I pay another 350 dollars and get a summary of the findings from the ADHD Assessment Center I went through the psychiatrist said he might consider it but there was no guarantee; I guess it just depends if I catch him on a good day? FFS it shouldn't be so hard to get the meds I need when I have a legit diagnosis but such is life. Will have to stick to these RC stimulants for now.

 

[InterestingFACT]

Ok, so i've been reading more through this thread and haven't made it all the way through yet but i'm in my fourth week now of using this as a functional stimulant and have to say i'm not relating to these posts where everyone has a compulsion to re-dose constantly. There's still only a slight compulsion on the come-up and it's easily ignored but after the effects kick in fully I have no desire to do so.

My current routine is to parachute 50mg in the morning and i'm finding now every three days is a better fit since the second day I can still feel the metabolite(s) working(although they don't disrupt me from getting a few hours of rest) and a coffee extends the stimulation through the second day. The third day after dosing is when I feel the effects have completely worn off and that's my rest day where I will survive off of some caffeine or Kratom but i'm taking a break from the latter atm.

Do you folks think continuing to take a 50mg dose every three days is a bad idea to control symptoms of ADD? I'm not planning to seek a high from it and will keep my routine to strictly medicinal, so i'm asking for feedback in that sense only. I just paid 450 dollars to get assessed again as an adult and I indeed tested positive for having ADD/ADHD using several tests but upon going to a GP and then a psychiatrist I was refused the medicine I need and told since the government has imposed stricter controls on prescribing these medicines I will have to do with taking behavioral courses to manage the symptoms...If I pay another 350 dollars and get a summary of the findings from the ADHD Assessment Center I went through the psychiatrist said he might consider it but there was no guarantee; I guess it just depends if I catch him on a good day? FFS it shouldn't be so hard to get the meds I need when I have a legit diagnosis but such is life. Will have to stick to these RC stimulants for now.

If it's working for you, you're not "cheating" on your dosing schedule or otherwise tempted to abuse it, and you're not experiencing significant negative symptoms like some describe (low grade fever, aches, etc), then there's no harm that I can see.

I don't want to put too fine a point on this, because I don't know your weekly schedule in terms of workload... but if you can really survive having all these "off" days without a monoaminergic stimulant, are you so sure you really need the stimulant at all? ADHD therapy is traditionally an every (working) day thing, or else a PRN thing for particular difficult tasks.

Is this the only stimulant you've tried?

It's good that you're not compulsive with it, but that doesn't mean that it's providing you with the best possible effect in terms of treating your symptoms. IMO just about any stimulant can be functionally useful in the sense that they delay fatigue and decrease impatience with repetitive tasks... but some are simply much better than others. Amphetamines--including black market speed, as well as crystal meth--are more functionally useful than 3-fpm, cathinones, or serotonergic amphetamine derivatives like 4-fa or MDMA. But the -phenidates are, in my opinion, the best options on the RC market for treating ADHD symptoms. Both in terms of their relatively lower abuse potential and their relatively stronger functional effects. On the other hand, they tend to have stronger "crashes." If you're trying to avoid feeling "drug-like" effects, or feeling like you're on a pendulum of chemically-induced ups and downs, 3-fpm is probably just about the best drug to use. If it's working for you, keep using it... just make sure that you're honest with yourself when it comes to self-assessment, and make sure to "check in" with yourself down the line about whether anything's changed in terms of either positive or negative effects of use.

 

[Atmozfears]

I LOVE this compound. Recently tried 3-MePhenmetrazine and, while they had similarities, 3-fpm was a bit more "pushy" and at times scatter brained but theres' no stim that is as good as meth

I've nver gotten these flu like symptoms and Ive done dozns of grams from different vendors before. I dunno what everyone else is tlaking about but Canadian vendrs stick on thei game.

Also I wonder how civilization ever advaced the way it has so fast due to "ADHD".... I'm "ADHD" mtself diagnosed at 23 after suicide attempt. Unmedicated. Not sure if non-medication and coping mechanisms/ CBT woud bet better frontline than stims. Docs dont even start with non-stims for crying out loud.

Also quit being a big baby and just swallow the 3-fpm with some juice. Or be a real OG and do 30mg sublingual.

 

[General alcazar]

This has become sort of a dated thread, and I don't post often, but I've binged on this substance 3 times so thought I'd share. I've gone on massive benders with most of the good research chemical stimulants over the last 15 years, including plenty of beta ketones, mdpv (favorite), alpha-pvp (also favorite), fluoridated amphetamines, etc. I had to toss them all because I'd use for weeks and go psychotic with some regularity, but there were some good times in between. Anyways, suffice to say I have a broad perspective, and 3-fmp is a good choice for someone with poor self control like me, especially preferring intravenous use and unable to check my usage - that is, in a harm reduction sorta way.
The big positive of this drug is the lack of psychosis. Even wth my recent 3.5 gram in 36 hours binge, no voices, paranoia, fear someone is about to assault me on the other side of the door, and I injected all of it. This is always what I hate most about binging on strong stims, and it takes a lot of self discipline to ignore. Worse, it distracts from the euphoria. Maybe this does not apply to some people, but it does to me.
The rush is really lame relative to the aforementioned (except mdpv which has no rush iv), but still better than anything else available to me now. It's short acting, and even trying crook's 500 mg dose, I was disappointed. Maybe this was because I was at the 24 hour mark and had a big tolerance; next time I'll start with a larger dose than 100 mg to before my tolerance has a chance to build...
The duration of stimulation with IV or vaping is too long. Then again, that applies to most stims used in excess IV, but it seems to drag on longer with 3fpm, especially with the mydriasis.
The comedown, however, is infinitely more forgiving than and other strong IV stim I've ever used. It just slowly wore off, I didn't get the usual horrible rebound depression and mania. Minor issues common with other stimulants were acid reflux, vasoconstriction, canker sores from vaping, and fatigue. Haven't experienced flu symptoms and since i dilute chems to avoid phlebitis, no real problems with vascularisation like some other stims, like ethylphenidate, for instance.
I think vaping is the best roa even though I tend to reach fir the needle by default. The rush is better with a smaller dose.
Lastly, don't iv any stimulant because it will rapidly become overwhelmingly compulsive and you with shoot up many times an hour and have obviously macerated veins. Ultimately it will haunt you, and in this case it's not worth the rush. Also it's not forgiving if tou miss your shot.

 

[THCified]

Damn, this one sounds way too intriguing to me! A functional euphoric Stimulant with no downsides to it, no comedown (never have them, i‘ve ADHD), no nothing? F#%! I should try it...NOT

 

[OntarioGuy]

I just ordered a gram of this substance, reading through this thread and other places I'm getting mixed reports. From people saying it's very subtle euphoria and others saying It has a stimulant rush, when smoked or IV'd.

I'm hoping it's better then methylphenidate. But it was quite cheap, so I figured I'd try it. I will probably sniff or vape a very small amount, before testing it IV. I unfortunately don't have any reagent tests, but the product is coming from a trusted well known Canadian vendor . From the reports I've read, I don't think I will be exceeding 25 mgs IV

 

[darknesss111]

3-fpm really has me by the balls this time.

I've known this RC for 3 years now, occasionally dabbling every few months.

3 grams every 6 months (over 10 days) went to 5 grams every 3 months (over 8 days).

In the summer, I would learn of the great deals with 10g purchases. I would go through 10g in 2 weeks every 2 months or so.

In mid december, my doc took my prescribed Concerta for adhd away (Since it did not show up in a piss test, I had not taken for 3 days because I was on 3-fpm and do not mix)

I was getting 10g bags which would last 2 weeks and then I would spend a week recovering, another week feeling fine then I would order another bag, repeat cycle.

As of now, I have gone through an embarassing amount of 3-fpm in the past 5-6 weeks. Some days as high as 2.5g (I still have an intact nose somehow).

After a 3 day break (which I spent sleeping nearly the entire time) my order came in today and I have already gone through 1g in the past 12 hours.



My first plan is to liquify the remainder so I cannot snort/vape. First I need to know if it will hold up fine in distilled water or alcohol (preferably distilled water as I am a recovering alcoholic).
From there, implement a taper plan which I will then take vacation days to crash from.

Shit, that was the plan this time, but it was horrid. I could barely move from bed for all of those days let alone eat proper and take my supplements in a timely manner (L-tyrosine, multi-V, b12, magnesium citrate, buproprion, lots of protein shakes, BCAA's) No matter how much caffeine I would drink stacked with ephedrine and kratom allowed me to stay awake for anymore than 4 hours.

I did not ration my remaining 3-fpm from last batch and just took until I was out. 12g in a week.

I feel the only way I will be able to taper is by liquefying the powder. Snorting/vaping is too compulsive.
Wreckless, irresponsible, idiot.....I know, feel free to remind me.

Just have to post this and perhaps someone out there can help me pull through. Overall, I feel normal, I rest nearly every night for at least 6 hours and do not feel any alarming physical sides. I do notice delirium is prominent at times
but I am probably not the best one to judge my current mental state. I just know that days without 3-fpm I cannot function whatsoever but binge unnecessarily.

Shit, any advice will surely help as I can not listen to my own. Thanks all!

 

[MDPV_Psychosis]

Tapering never worked out for me with stimulants.

I was using MDPV heavily for years. Got to a point where I felt I couldn't quit because I would sleep over 20hrs a day for days on end without it. Just couldn't function without it, at all.

Only thing that worked for me was to stop. I slept over 20hrs a day for almost a week. Then 16hrs a day for a few days and then it slowly normalized down to 8-10hrs a day.

I don't know what will work best for you, but for me, it was as simple (and as hard) as just stopping and getting over the resulting extreme lethargy.

 

[Coolwhip]

reading through this thread and other places I'm getting mixed reports. From people saying it's very subtle euphoria and others saying It has a stimulant rush, when smoked or IV'd.

I thought the same thing, and you'd think with 70 pages a consensus would have been reached by now. 3-FPM can be used in a variety of ways, but it seems people do have varied responses to it as well.

You can get a real nice rush on the first shot with a very large dose, after that the rush is severely stunted for a long time. While much lower doses do provide a sustained and functional effect especially with oral dosing. It's very free of many of the side effects associated with other stims, especially after repeated dosing; makes it abusable by people who normally can't get off properly on stims because they know how it ends but the euphoria can't quite match most other stims of abuse.

I would put that first dose, or how you feel 12+ hours later above the phenidates, but you can have more fun for 4-6 hours with them.

 

[Phenpsycho]

I've still been relying on this one as my staple ADD medication, still never increased the dose from 50 mg x 2 daily when I do take it. I have an Rx now for Ritalin but prefer 3-FPM as it has less of a crash and less PNS side effects ime. Ritalin is nice while it's working but the crash leaves me depressed and my symptoms/scatterbrain issues much worse. I'm glad I have an Rx to fall back on now as relying on an RC that could be banned any day doesn't do wonders for my anxiety.

 

[darknesss111]

I once took my last 3 grams and added to a bottled water solution of 300ml. It helped me sort of ween but I stored in the fridge and likely degraded the chem. All for the better I guess.

I shall take your advice and extend my sleeping binge for a week as opposed to a few days, thanks

After having my ritalin (concerta) prescription taken away, I've come to rely on this chem too much.

Perhaps a good week of nothing but rest and nutrients will have me somewhat functional and 3 weeks for a tolerance break I could take as you do. I managed to stick to 10-20mg oral meth for a 3 week period (put in water right away to avoid snorting and I found it to be incredibly functional and much less compulsive than 3-fpm.

Would rather keep things legal and may follow your routine. With my compulsiveness to overdo it on 3-fpm, I would require a sustainable liquid base (perhaps propylene glycol for volumetric dosing), a time lock safe and order in small quantities as opposed to large (1g vs 10g).

I would definitely have to place in a suitable solution asap as the "Just take a couple lines, then put in solution" voice would creep up.

I do miss the days of low dosed oral meth as an adhd med replacement. By following guidelines similar to a desoxyn prescription, I have never had anything come close to such a highly functioning adhd med in my life. Way better than even dexedrine.
It would not get me high at all, but rather....I felt sober for the first time in my life.

Tasks were no longer scatterbrained, they were all lined up perfectly in order according to importance. I even found myself drastically reducing my use of kratom and phenibut as a voice of reason would kick in "Dude, you kinda take a lot of this stuff, how about we taper it down and not use these daily". Instead of thinking "I should do this", I would simply DO.

I don't recommend anyone do this, not only for the sake of harm reduction, but the dosing protical calls for 5 days a week. I was doing every day and 10mg daily soon turned to 30mg a day after a couple of weeks. Had I have had more, I suspect I would be dosing a lot higher by now to achieve that initial effect. We all know where that spiral leads.

Not to mention very high quality meth for this purpose is extremely hit/miss but holy shit, once I tried that initial 10mg dose, 50-60 mins later, everything just started falling into place like when Eddy Morra took his first NZT pill (Obviously not to that extent). I just suddenly knew what had to be done and exactly how to do it. I found I could even get away with a once daily dose (usually did not happen and would redose after 4-6 hours) but the effects lasted just long enough so I would not crash, rather just feel tired when I am supposed to and get a good nights rest at 10pm.

The only way I would do this again is if I were able to acquire a prescription for Desoxyn. I do not foresee myself ever having a Doc who would be cool with that.

After having my ritalin (concerta) prescription taken away, I've come to rely on this chem too much.

Perhaps a good week of nothing but rest and nutrients will have me somewhat functional and 3 weeks for a tolerance break I could take as you do. I managed to stick to 10-20mg oral meth for a 3 week period (put in water right away to avoid snorting and I found it to be incredibly functional and much less compulsive than 3-fpm.

Would rather keep things legal and may follow your routine. With my compulsiveness to overdo it on 3-fpm, I would require a sustainable liquid base (perhaps propylene glycol for volumetric dosing), a time lock safe and order in small quantities as opposed to large (1g vs 10g).

I would definitely have to place in a suitable solution asap as the "Just take a couple lines, then put in solution" voice would creep up.

I do miss the days of low dosed oral meth as an adhd med replacement. By following guidelines similar to a desoxyn prescription, I have never had anything come close to such a highly functioning adhd med in my life. Way better than even dexedrine.
It would not get me high at all, but rather....I felt sober for the first time in my life.

Tasks were no longer scatterbrained, they were all lined up perfectly in order according to importance. I even found myself drastically reducing my use of kratom and phenibut as a voice of reason would kick in "Dude, you kinda take a lot of this stuff, how about we taper it down and not use these daily". Instead of thinking "I should do this", I would simply DO.

I don't recommend anyone do this, not only for the sake of harm reduction, but the dosing protical calls for 5 days a week. I was doing every day and 10mg daily soon turned to 30mg a day after a couple of weeks. Had I have had more, I suspect I would be dosing a lot higher by now to achieve that initial effect. We all know where that spiral leads.

Not to mention very high quality meth for this purpose is extremely hit/miss but holy shit, once I tried that initial 10mg dose, 50-60 mins later, everything just started falling into place like when Eddy Morra took his first NZT pill (Obviously not to that extent). I just suddenly knew what had to be done and exactly how to do it. I found I could even get away with a once daily dose (usually did not happen and would redose after 4-6 hours) but the effects lasted just long enough so I would not crash, rather just feel tired when I am supposed to and get a good nights rest at 10pm.

The only way I would do this again is if I were able to acquire a prescription for Desoxyn. I do not foresee myself ever having a Doc who would be cool with that.

With 3-fpm's long half life, I do not see why it could not work in a similar fashion.

 

[gymstud]

A long lost live 3fpm

 

[gymstud]

I didn't realise it could be prescribed

 

[Hodor]

Compounds	3-FPM	Phenmetrazine
DA Release	43	87
5-HT Release	2558	3246
NE Release	30	38

While 3-FPM/3-Fluorophenmetrazine is a novel drug it pales in comparison to it's parent compound
​

​

Doesn't a lower value usually mean that a drug is *stronger*?

 

[g0to]

It's 'active' in lower concentrations supposedly. Something can be actively releasing dopamine but if it never reaches pleasure centers in high enough concentration no euphoria would be felt. That doesn't necessarily mean anything in regards to effects, though.

All that chart really shows is that 3-fpm releases less serotonin than phenmetrazine for an equivalent dosage. That's according to that chart, at least. Things are a bit more complex than that.

 

[Scrofula]

Yeah, I think those numbers aren't "release", they're either IC50s for reuptake (in nM) or transporter Ki (in nM). In all cases, the smaller the more potent. Doesn't always translate clinically (cf. the potent DAT inhibitor (= or > methylphenidate) Zoloft).

Or, honestly, don't know. The wikipedia entry lists different but similar numbers for EC50 for release, not prepared to dig through refs yet.

Mr. Anhydride may have a research lab he's been hiding from me.