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Salvia, The Conveyor Belt & Other Common Themes

rickolasnice

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I just read a post from TwistedReality in the Bad Trip thread which made me remember that all of my salvia experiences (around 10) have included this kinda thing. It's like all existance, or a major part of it is on a conveyor belt, moving in whatever direction.

This is hard to explain so sorry but i'll try:

A few times i've done salvia it feels as though i am part of the machine. The machine being EVERYTHING. Reality and existance. It takes on a spherical shape and i am one side of it, looking through to the other (like i am a part of the inside of a ball looking at the other side) and everything i can see or hear is part of this same machine. The machine is constantly "rolling" as if it were a spherical conveyor belt.

Anyone else get this kinda conveyor belt feeling / hallucination?

Anyone have any ideas as to what causes it? (The push / pull feeling salvia gives probably has something to do with it)..
 

TRPPNASS_DSCOMONKE

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i get/got it. except mine was a subliminal message. which turned out to be good (though it scared/scarred the living fuck out of me) in the end.

there was several rows of me, probably 10 in each row. and we were moving forward on the conveyor/assembly line (as G.I. joe dolls or some such nonsense) and there was a machine coming down to pick up each row. and i knew when my row was picked something bad was going to happen (death perhaps?) . i tried to jump off the line but couldnt move.

so the machine picked up my row. and sure enough i died (just the ego) and entered the void. and spent what felt like 1000 years as a GIjoe doll in a box on a shelf. i thought i was going to be there for ever and i had thrown my life and friends all away for some silly drug. i was heart broken.

i later realized that the salvia goddess was just trying to tell me that i was being a fucking tool and trying to hard to fit in, and i needed to be my own individual person if i wanted to "live". thank you salvia goddess.

that shit still give me shivers thinking about it. should turn that into a trip report.
 

bluedolphin

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Ohh yes... I wish I had time to make a detailed post here. I don't know if this will get merged but I do have some thoughts on "the machine" and "the conveyor" belt.

We're talking multiple dimensions and quantum physics -- in yo face!

I'll come back and write more later..
 

TRPPNASS_DSCOMONKE

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i didnt think i would be able to put that experience into proper words. glad i could, not as hard as i thought.

yes, that particular experience seemed to occur in two seperate dimensions.
 

Inverse

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I just made a trip report. I had this sensation whenever I would move my head. It was pretty scary. When I started the trip I was rolling around in my sheets, and had this reaction. Though everything felt like they were "lines" or blocks. They were neatly in a row, and seemed to be connected to everything. This in itself was scary, but when the actual "series" (Basically the room I was in) fell apart, it was like the world shattered.

This drug really is something else. It's fascinating and scary at the same time.
 

EntheoDjinn

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rickolasnice - maybe what I feel is the same as your description of a conveyor belt, but I experience it as being on a perpetually turning Ferris Wheel.

Feeling as if I'm turning over and over and over and over ............. but knowing that I'm static at the same time. Weird. And not exactly comfortable. (This is only when smoked though, with tincture or plain leaf it doesn't happen).

I've read of this experience by others on this and other forums as well.
 

joef51

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rickolasnice said:
I just read a post from TwistedReality in the Bad Trip thread which made me remember that all of my salvia experiences (around 10) have included this kinda thing. It's like all existance, or a major part of it is on a conveyor belt, moving in whatever direction.

This is hard to explain so sorry but i'll try:

A few times i've done salvia it feels as though i am part of the machine. The machine being EVERYTHING. Reality and existance. It takes on a spherical shape and i am one side of it, looking through to the other (like i am a part of the inside of a ball looking at the other side) and everything i can see or hear is part of this same machine. The machine is constantly "rolling" as if it were a spherical conveyor belt.

Anyone else get this kinda conveyor belt feeling / hallucination?

Anyone have any ideas as to what causes it? (The push / pull feeling salvia gives probably has something to do with it)..

I compare it to rolling down a hill in a truck tire.
 

nonnihilnitoris

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I always get the feeling that I'm being dragging up a wall (like a on a conveyor belt) or that my body has been separated into pieces, each one slowly drifting apart. Also, I commonly feel that my flesh has merged with the matter around me, inseparably.

Salvia, for me, has the most novel ego-destroying tendencies of any substance I know.
 

headliner2007

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Salvia sometimes can make you feal pressure agaisnt your face...

A sharp pressure,, that eventually turns into a soothing massage..

Anyone else have this experience?
 

psood0nym

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This is a pretty universal theme of salvia trips. I remember discussing it before.

From the "salvia vs. DMT thread":
frasierdog said:
also what's with recurring themes and stuff in psychedelics, like wheels, rollercoasters, zippers, multiple dimensions etc etc. I'm real interested in this stuff, but it's nearly impossible to find any information above speculation about these themes. But I also suppose where we're going, we don't need facts.
psood0nym said:
This really fascinates me too. The last discussion of this kind of thing I know of was in regards to "the ferris wheel" in the salvia thread. While it is just speculation--and will likely forever remain so--there are some parallels between these reoccurring themes and objects. In my experience the "roller coaster" is replaced with "fluctuating gravity," the "ferris wheel" is replaced with a "saw blade," and the "zipper" is replaced with "ripping fabric."

In many cases I think that our brains simply pick out the closest association we have in memory for whatever salvinorin A is doing to our sense of equilibrium and proprioception i.e. a roller coaster, similar to how the wind through an open window during sleep might translate into a dream of riding a motorcycle. Cyclical processes and infinite repetition seem to be major themes, as do cogs on wheels, saw teeth and zipper teeth. I imagine the "ferris wheel" could simply be the natural correlate to the overarching theme of cyclical processes and repetition fused with the amusement park associations most of us have with fluctuating gravity effects. I think the shared themes of different user's salvia experiences are entirely the production of unique simple sensations and concepts artificially evoked by salvia being explained and wildly elaborated on by our VERY confused brains through reference to memories healthy teenage and young adult western males (the bulk of salvia users and report writers) and friends all share. That's not to say the individual experiences are not utterly unique, but I certainly don't feel, as some do, that the themes are any indication of a shared glimpse into an objectively existing metaphysical realm, universal consciousness, telepathy etc.
 

zerograv

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the "conveyor belt" feeling!
i know exactly what you are talking about.
it happens to me every time i smoke salvia. it is also quite common for my friends to experience as well.
 

qwe

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rickolasnice said:
I just read a post from TwistedReality in the Bad Trip thread which made me remember that all of my salvia experiences (around 10) have included this kinda thing. It's like all existance, or a major part of it is on a conveyor belt, moving in whatever direction.

This is hard to explain so sorry but i'll try:

A few times i've done salvia it feels as though i am part of the machine. The machine being EVERYTHING. Reality and existance. It takes on a spherical shape and i am one side of it, looking through to the other (like i am a part of the inside of a ball looking at the other side) and everything i can see or hear is part of this same machine. The machine is constantly "rolling" as if it were a spherical conveyor belt.

Anyone else get this kinda conveyor belt feeling / hallucination?

Anyone have any ideas as to what causes it? (The push / pull feeling salvia gives probably has something to do with it)..
"conveyor belt"

ive been looking to describe my salvia trips ever since they happened, and i cant believe i never thought of that word

my trips were similar. reality completely dissolved, and next thing i knew i sort of fell into this contraption:

it was pure movement, as i was forcefully pushed and pulled and shredded in every direction, and i was part of that which was around me. and what was around me? a giant machine totally enclosing me (and it doesnt matter if you are claustrophobic, that part of your psyche is totally blown out of the water by now...) and i am part of that machine, but 'my' part keeps getting pulled and changed through-out the machine.

it has a metallicy-shiny look to it, but also a cartoony look as if it is a 'human brain machine' not a normal 'steam engine' machine. there were a lot of stripes and geometrics, sort of like a fractal machine

it was very traumatic at first, and when i came to i was part of the ceiling/wall and kneeling on the floor, and wondering whether this is real and im getting my mind back or is this another part of the trip?

once i was normal i just sat back and said 'holy fucking shit'

never have i been deeper into my consciousness, and never have i been that scared

there was several rows of me, probably 10 in each row
i got this too! there was an array of infinite yellow 'L' shapes which were all me

we were moving forward on the conveyor/assembly line (as G.I. joe dolls or some such nonsense) and there was a machine coming down to pick up each row. and i knew when my row was picked something bad was going to happen (death perhaps?) . i tried to jump off the line but couldnt move.

same, at the end of each section of the conveyor belt is a trip within a trip. a lot of times, the conveyor belt would go on, but i wouldnt be able to follow it, so i thought i was going to get lost in the abyss. once it receeded into darkness i was squeezed back onto the track, because spacetime behind me closed in on me :p

We're talking multiple dimensions and quantum physics -- in yo face!
that's how i feel. i feel like it's a clue on the track to both newer physics and how consciousness arises

rickolasnice - maybe what I feel is the same as your description of a conveyor belt, but I experience it as being on a perpetually turning Ferris Wheel.

Feeling as if I'm turning over and over and over and over ............. but knowing that I'm static at the same time. Weird. And not exactly comfortable. (This is only when smoked though, with tincture or plain leaf it doesn't happen).

I've read of this experience by others on this and other forums as well.
this is how i felt during my non breakthrough experience, and how i feel on low dose marijuana and/or alcohol. its just a vestibular hallucination, it feels like you're being linearly or centripitally accelerated when youre just sitting there

here are my two breakthroughs:

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=301531

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=303081

the first link describes the machine and the conveyor belt and the cogs and a lot of similar wording to yours
 

TwistedReality

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I'm really glad you made this thread. It's interesting to see that others have had the same experience I had. I like noticing similarities between people's trips on a certain drug - I've noticed some patterns with DMT too.
 

psood0nym

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qwe said:
that's how i feel. i feel like it's a clue on the track to both newer physics and how consciousness arises ...
It was partially due to my experiences with salvia that I came to consider panexperientialism--even before I knew that panexperientialism was a philosophy.

It wasn't the result of any insight from within the trip itself. Rather, what led me to the basic notion of panexperientialism was considering the mere fact that it's possible to be so far from normal, functional, consciousness as salvia takes me without blacking out. If consciousness--as basic intentionality, simple subjectiveness, the referent of "the hard problem of consciousness," etc. without regard to higher order qualities like self-consciousness or the experience of agency--is a pattern that arose by accident as a delicate assembly of neurons that then became functional to survival, then how is it that it's so damned durable and wide in scope so as to retain its fundamental integrity during an experience as tangential to those natural and functional ends as salvia's?

For the scope of possible conscious experience to be as wide as salvia has revealed it to be, it seems unlikely that simple subjectiveness can be wholly confined within a pattern, because patterns are easy to disrupt. Rather, it's intriguing to consider that this simple subjectiveness is inherent within something far more vast and various--matter itself--which is then organized in the myriad patterns that provide the basic subjectivity inherent in that matter with different qualities of being.
...the first link describes the machine and the conveyor belt and the cogs and a lot of similar wording to yours.
I don't know if you read my previous post in this thread, but, yet again, with your "cogs" there's another parallel in multiple user's experience of salvia. EntheoDjinn's ferris wheel is my saw blade, is the OP's conveyor belt. I experienced myself as one of the saw blade's teeth (homologous to a cog on a wheel) that was ripping through fabric (similar to the "zipper" many describe.)
 

dread

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I'd really like to experience a full salvia experience someday. Too bad my medication won't let me (buprenorphine is a kappa-antagonist)
 

Inverse

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I wish I had the cojones to try it again, I honestly do. But my first was so frightening, does it get better? I tried it a second time, a smaller dose (smokes, same 40x). I got trapped in the bed I lay in. I felt my eyes blinking, but all I saw were patterns that kept shifting to the left and right as I turned my head. As if I was in some kind of tube and I couldn't get out.

What's strange, is my hands and feet were still existing in this low dose, so I could feel the bed, when I reached outward I felt the corner of my dresser and when I stumbled toward the door I could feel my fingers fumble with te knob, but I could see nothing but endless, and endless series of lines, or patterns. Everytime I turned my head, it was like I was moving inside a cylinder. Imagine a painting drawn on the inside of a lamp shade and you wearing it over your head or something. Being trapped in something like that, and yet ever so "open spaced" is like the opposite of claustrophobia yet with all the same symptoms.

What is with these circular, tube, spinning, ferris wheel themes? Are we somehow free of the sense of gravity or something? Going against the spinning of the world? It's so damn bizzare to hear all these reports. It's definitely destroying me sense of balance. Though the first time, I don't even have a reccollection of having a body, so it's more than just messing with equilibrium. It's almost eliminating the limitation of "physical" sensory input in the first place. Replacing them. The same kind of sensations one has in dreams, like when you're running in a dream, or climbing something. You "feel" it, yet you're not doing any of it. Whatever it is that controls that aspect of our mind is doing it, yet we're wide awake.

Wish there was more research on Salvia Divonorum.
 

TRPPNASS_DSCOMONKE

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psood0- could you please put the bulk part of your last post into laymans terms so that i may undersand it, lol. im getting the basics, but trying to figure out a little more plainly what it is that your saying so that i may comment. thanks.

also i feel like there were two specific dimensions traveled through on my "trip", lol.

in the first dimension, while i was traveling down the belt, there was the image of my girlfriends face far off in the top right distance. this was the only thing i could relate to my previous conscious reality, the only thing that gave me hope that i could go back "there". though i could not quite remember what "there" was, lol.

there also seemed to be a distinctly different dimension when i was picked up, boxed, and put on the shelf. i feel that this was the infamous "void". though my eyes were wide open, i had no idea of anything "here". no concept of anything from my "real life" and no hope of going back, because the image of my girlfriends face, the one thing that held me on, had been lost when i was picked up and boxed.
i thought that "rick" was gone forever. ego loss. and i guess that "rick" has gone forever. as with every psychadelic experience, "I" was changed.

this was about three years ago, but yet the whole experience is so clear in my mind, i can recall it with a strange exactness.

ive just gotten comfortable enough to even think about trying it again and convincing myself to relax. after three years! lol.

any thought out there about trying it on lyrica or small dose mdma or something that would keep you from freaking out so much?

many apologies for derailment, lol.
 
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Ugster

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I had a brief encounter with something like this on mushrooms, it was very fun , but it had some of the same essence to it as what you all are describing.
 

psood0nym

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TRPPNASS_DSCOMONKE said:
psood0- could you please put the bulk part of your last post into laymans terms so that i may undersand it, lol. im getting the basics, but trying to figure out a little more plainly what it is that your saying so that i may comment. thanks.
I'll try, though I'm afraid some will get lost in translation (I know qwe is familiar with some of the terminology, which is why I used it).

Basically, I'm saying that, if consciousness (as it pertains to the hard problem of consciousness) came about as a fortunate accident of brain cell configuration and signal patterning, which was then shaped by evolutionary forces to deal with problems associated with survival and reproduction (as goes the popular conception of it), then it's strange that we can experience something so radically removed from normal functional human experience as the experience of salvia.

It's like trying to play a drum solo with a harp--it's simply not within the instrument's design specs or range to perform (or at least the strings should break if you try.)

I don't mean this to be an argument; I'm just relaying one of the reasons, among many, that I came to consider panexperientialism because it seemed relevant to the comment qwe made within his post.

Panexperientialism is the idea that all physical matter--even "non-living" matter--is imbued with some quality of phenomenal experience (an inner quality of being.) That phenomal experience differs by the type of matter and its arrangement (carbon in graphite has a different quality of inner being than carbon in a diamond). When I say "experience," I don't mean thoughts or feelings, or necessarily anything humans can relate to, just some innate "what-it-is-like-to-be-ness" rather than the "innate nothingness" of physicalism.

Panexperientialism helps a lot with the mind/body problem, the problem of distinguishing between life and non-life, etc. It also makes radically altered experience easier to explain because it says that experience exists beyond the confines of a certain narrow range of bio-electrical patterning (it is NOT a philosophical endorsement of telepathy or astral projection.) It certainly does not deny that such patterning is crucial to certain qualities of experience, it just says that types of matter ... matter, because it allows the diversity of physical substances to play a larger role as substrates underlying the range of possible experiences than does the idea that a specialized range of electrical sequences alone "give rise to" the total range of phenomonal experience. It allows matter to contribute its diversity of form and substance to the diversity we experience--in addition to the contribution of electrical patterning. Panexperientialism says that something like unified awareness did not arise spontaneously from sterile matter, but rather that something like unified awareness is a particular organization of the innate phenomenal qualities of the matter in our brains. On the contrasting view described above, the total quality of human experience can be digitized and translated faithfully to many different physical substances (like microchips), because this view understands consciousness to be, essentially, a function. However, panexperientialism at least implies that the substance that a unified consciousness exists in (for us, the stuff of the brain) necessarily impacts what it is "like to be" that consciousness. (Don't mistake panexperientialism with the belief in an immaterial soul or pantheism).
 
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