Poppy Seed Tea Withdrawal Is Hell

[iamgollum]

@8thday: I would not use my lack of sleep as an example. Everyone is different plus I've struggled with chronic insomnia for years. Honestly, when not dealing with the other hell of WD, I actually function pretty well on 4 or 5 hours of sleep if it is continuous. My sleep doc said it was hereditary, which makes sense because my mother does not need much sleep and I don't think her father ever slept. It's the 1 hour here, 2 hours there that really messes with me. If you have not struggled with sleep issues in the past, I'm sure your natural patterns will return eventually.

Where I am at with the recovery, though, most of the other horrible symptoms have passed, so at least all I have to deal with is the insomnia. Based on my last WD, it took almost three months for me to get back to my normal 4-6 hours of sleep. It started improving around 60 days and there were good nights and bad ones in between. But, there people on the forum who say they were sleeping good at 30 days and others who say it took many months. I know it's not a great answer, but it will happen when your brain is ready for sleep again. As 10YearsGone suggested you may want to consider finding some relief at this point. And, as I noted above and based on your last post regarding the MS, you may want to get in to see your doctor and discuss it. Not sure of you relationship with your doc, but if you don't want to go into the whole addiction thing, you could just tell him you are suffering from intense insomnia and see what he says. BTW, very impressive that you were able to run even in pain--as I've said, you have inner strength and determination. Use it to beat this and take back your life.

Re: the plane...Actually it is more of a kit and needs a lot of love. It's more than a weekend project...Thing is in pieces but everything is there and seems structurally sound, so we will see. Guy just wanted it to go away so I got it cheap. Honestly, at this point in my WD, the project seems like a huge undertaking and I can't even picture having the energy to work on it--but I know the motivation and excitement will come back--it did last time. I think my wife was actually surprised that I wanted to get it. She said it seemed like the kind of weird project I used to work on all the time. She's right, I was forever doing something nutty or building things with the kids when they were younger. Just another reminder of how the tea took over my life and changed me, I guess.

 

[8thday]

gollum, this has been a terrible, hard day. 11 days of no sleep. The most I think I had was 2 hours one night from Gabapentin. I am like you, I'm resisting taking things for fear I will be addicted to something else to sleep and have to go through withdrawals all over again. I'm not sure what to do. I almost had a breakdown at church. Everyone was so happy and smiling and looked beautiful and clean and I couldn't see straight through my withdrawal insomnia. All I wanted to do was lay on the pew and sob. I got up and asked my hub to take me home. I sobbed all the way home. Tried to sleep but couldn't. Started thinking strange things. Threw on some clothes to go out and walk because it is beautiful today and I'm not feeling well. Before I knew it my hub was behind me. He is worried and doesn't know what to do. I felt better for a couple of hours, but the sickening feeling is back. This is so incredibly hard. I've cried more today than I have in a while. I'm losing it. I can deal with the other withdrawal stuff, I just need some sleep. I wish I was day 48 and almost through with this. Why does the time go by so slow? Help

 

[Stargazer]

8thday, I want to be clear that I think you are strong and an amazing woman. I agree with IAG, about it being remarkable that you went on a family vacation. Holy cow! It's bad enough being sick in the best of conditions, let alone not being home in a familiar place.

I know a thing or two about discomfort. I detoxed twice, in jail. With strangers. My house burned down, and empty drug bags and needles were found, and I was arrested. I never had a drug charge in my life prior. The judge was very tough. I was in jail, by night time, in full blown withdrawal.

I also have chronic cluster headaches, amongst a few other things. I honestly I get suffering.

However, I don't believe you should suffer, if you don't have to. I have spent years suffering one way or another - some self-inflicted, some not.

I'm so sorry you felt I'll from the loperamide. I actually have taken alot more than 12 at a time. I've taken up to 80mg at a time. If they are going to bring me relief from the constant mental and emotional anguish, I'd rather deal with some nausea at first. They grossed me out too. But, I was at my wit's end. It was either them, or shoot dope.

Im not implying that you're not strong, the tone of your posts sound like you're , well, at your wits end. Who wouldn't be? I don't care how strong anyone is - I'm strong, believe me, but the constancy of w/d on top of the lack of sleep - gets to be too much for anyone.

Everyone has a breaking point. IAG gave great advice, talk to your/a doctor. Yes, gabapentin does have withdrawal, but not when taken for a few weeks.

How you handle your detox/kick is entirely up to you. As I said before, it's a very personal thing. We each have to choose whats best for us. It's not easy, or possible to stop using on willpower alone. Why you use in the first place needs to be addressed and treated. It's very difficult to white knuckle it.

I'm here to support you, in whatever you decide is best.

 

[iamgollum]

@8thday: If you are unable to sleep tonight, why don;t you go ahead and go see your doctor? At the very least it may put you and your husband's mind at ease that there is not some other medical thing going on that the seed tea may have been covering up. Perhaps and anti-depressant would make a difference. Your brain is trying to remember how to make dopamine on it's own, but perhaps it is a serotonin issue as well. If you discuss your insomnia, the doc may be to prescribe something to help you sleep. If you have a good relationship with him/her perhaps you should go ahead and discuss the PST addiction--it may make a difference on what med they prescribe.

There are a lot of sleep meds out there. You may want to just start with a Tylenol PM and see what that does. Many people really like Trazadone--it is not supposed to be addictive. DebbieCombs, a poster here, said that she used it and Melatonin during WD and it really helped her. I prefer Lunesta over Ambien, but again its a personal preference. Both can be habit forming if you take them too long, but not if only used on a sporadic basis. Ativan and Restoril are are benzos which can be addictive if taken too long and the WD's are supposed to be hellish. CJ, a Bluelight moderator, suggested Remeron and dsaid he had luck with it. Also, I have been told that Seroquel will knock you out as well. Obviously all of them come with their side effects and issues, but if used responsibly, I doubt you will be trading addictions. I really believe that your natural sleep patterns will return, but I think a bit of shut-eye would go a long way to calm your mind/body and help you deal with everything else much better. I agree with 10YearsGone that it may be time for you to try and get some support meds to help you sleep. There is no defeat in that and it may make a huge difference in your recovery.

The fact that you made it out and to church feeling like you do is simply amazing. You are doing great and going to beat this but I think some rest is needed at this point to help you push forward.

 

[ThePresence]

Dude.. How can you even write being sick? I can't concentrate at all when sick. Let alone write a book

 

[iamgollum]

Day 21. At the end of the day, I will have made it 3 weeks. Did not use anything for sleep last night but actually managed to sleep for about 4 hours which is a good sign, I think. Feel the best I have in the past few weeks and even somewhat rested--my brain does not feel like a bowl of Jello today and the continual dull headache is gone. My legs/arms are not aching as much, but my back is killing me today which sucks. I don't think that is from the WD. Took some Tylenol/Aleve earlier but not having much effect at this point. I probably need to get in to see my ortho...I'm just concerned he is going to start handing out Oxy's again and I don't want that temptation. I was hoping to talk to a therapist/drug counselor before going to the spine doc. Kind of hoping he might suggest another Rhizotomy which is a horrible procedure, but definitely did block the pain.

Mood is definitely improving each day and no anxiety/depression anymore. Appetite is back and gastro issue are all gone. Just need to get past the mental fog/sleep issues although I know I probably have a good month in front of me before that happens. But, I can feel "normal" slowly returning (again...). Plan to go for a brisk walk, hit the elliptical for a while, and head into the office. My daughter is getting ready to go back to school from break which is kind of sad--she is truly her father's daughter and we have similar personality/sense of humors. It's been good having her around this week.

Still cold here, but the sun is coming up on a new day like it always does (when you can see it...).

 

[iamgollum]

Dude.. How can you even write being sick? I can't concentrate at all when sick. Let alone write a book

I don't know--it's about the only thing I can do in withdrawal. But, it really helps being able to write down my thoughts and how I'm feeling in a forum where others understand what I'm going through. Hopefully it also keeps others from trying poppy seed tea....

 

[Stargazer]

Awesome news IAG! You're definitely getting closer to the sunshine.

I know I've told you before, but how you've handled yourself during your detox is... amazing. I'm in awe at how well you're able to write, with such clarity, while being very ill. Not to mention when the depression was crushing. Sharing your journey is so helpful to so many. I appreciate the time and effort you put into your thread.

Through all of this, you kept a positive attitude. That is really what's the most helpful thing.

When I was on OxyContin, and running out early every month, I learned how to "keep my head out of it", if you will. Yes, it still sucked. I'd vomit everytime I moved my eyes the first couple days. I was hot, cold and all that jazz. But, I learned how to cope with it. It makes a huge difference. I remained positive, and had a "it is what it is" attitude.

I have alot less tolerance for withdrawal now. I feel over it, I guess. And get angry with myself. At any rate, I'm so happy that at the end of today, you made it three weeks! That's nothing to sneeze at. (pun intended). You're doing so well.

 

[iamgollum]

Thanks, 10Years--really appreciate the encouragement. I hear you on the WD's--I really hope this is the last one for me (I'm getting too old for this shit!) Plan to really focus on staying sober this time and get into therapy/counseling.

Have you heard from 8thday? Kind of concerned she has not posted lately. I hope that she is doing better and is getting some relief from the withdrawal.

 

[Stargazer]

^Same IAG, in regard to being concerned about 8thday. She's been quiet. I'm hoping she's ok and stops in soon.

I could just vomit every miserable time I'm reinducting myself. I curse myself out. I feel ridiculous.

You're doing great. Very rarely does anyone get it on the first try. We seem to have heads made of cement.

It gets better. How are you today?

 

[iamgollum]

Day 22: Managed to get about 4 hours straight of sleep last night again with no meds so feeling pretty good again. Wish it were a bit more but I'll take what I can get at this point. Have a pounding headache today that Tylenol/Ibuprophen won't touch. I think it may be sinus related though so I took some decongestant to see what that would do. I was reading that opiates/poppy seed tea have a dramatic antihistamine effect and when you suddenly stop using the histamine receptors freak out which causes the congestion, runny nose, watery eyes, and sneezing (and sneezing and sneezing...). It may also explain the dull sinus-type headache I've had for the past 2 weeks. Just another thing the body has to figure out again during recovery, I guess. Other than that I feel good and somewhat rested--can't say I have 100% clarity at this point as I still feel kind of spacey/foggy at times. Back feels better today which is good and legs/arms do not seem to be aching too bad. Attitude seems positive and no other major issues to report aside from a slight tremor in my hands that I have noticed the past few days. I've had issues with the nerves in my elbows and had transplantation of both ulnar nerves so I hope it' not related to that and is just another WD symptom.

Yesterday started good and went fairly well. I was out and about most of the day but about 5 pm I felt like someone had just unplugged me. Completely ran out of energy for some reason and had to lay down for a while. I fell asleep on the couch for about 20 minutes and must have been having a nightmare because I snapped awake and yelled out. Freaked the wife out who was sitting next to me. Had a weird anxious/nervous feeling as well that took about an hour to pass. Finally managed to get my shit back together and go meet our son for dinner, but it was weird. My brain is obviously still really pissed-off at me...

 

[Stargazer]

The negative/bad dreams and snapping awake with anxiety is a pretty common w/d symptom. One I dislike very strongly. Anxiety is unsettling and uncomfortable. I almost hate falling asleep, as much as I need it, because of the waking in panic.

You're still doing incredible.

 

[8thday]

Day 22.....I can't even imagine how that will feel....hopefully better than day 13! I just posted today on- 8thday poppyseed tea week of hell- if you care to read it. I got Xanax from a sister and slept Sunday night. Went to a doc, he gave me an anti-depressant and more Xanax which I am terrified to use either. I took less Xanax last night and didn't fall asleep so I took a little more and slept a little. Not sure why my brain won't turn off. I am so beyond exhausted. Honestly, feels like the last 8 miles of a marathon every minute of every day. I can hardly move. I usually am in a hurry, even when I'm not in a hurry. I noticed everywhere I went I was having cars speed past me because I was driving so slow....sooooo not like me. I just want to have some energy and feel better. I had no idea that almost two weeks later I would feel like absolute hell. I got kids off to school and came home and laid in bed thinking I might get a nap, even though I have stayed away from even trying so that I could sleep at night. I just laid in my bed, WIDE AWAKE.

I'm so glad you are getting some sleep on your own and doing a little better every day. Everyone warns about the nightmares. Hope you have the best day. I'm going to make my body move and probably cry a lot inbetween. haha.

 

[iamgollum]

@8thday: I read your update on your thread. Try not to beat yourself up about things or feel ashamed--you are making an incredible attempt to get sober and take your life back. You know as well as I that a good marriage is a partnership and I would guess no one wants the old you back more than your husband. I obviously do not know you or him, but he sounds concerned and supportive, so lean on him--I doubt he sees it as a burden. There's a lot covered in that "for better or for worse" clause...Once you are past this, you can make it up to him 10 fold--maybe together you can make a plan to find a job he loves--who knows.

Since you have a huge sleep deficit from the past 13 days it will take a few nights of even limited sleep to really feel it. But, a bit of sleep here and there will make a huge difference as long as you use the meds responsibly, and you know what that is. Your mind is not your own yet and is not thinking clearly--and not just from lack of sleep. You used the PST daily for a long time and while you may not have used it to get high--it still worked the same way on your brain. You went from supplying your body with a daily dose of dopamine for 3-4 years and then took it away in a split second. The human body is an amazing machine and yours will figure out how to get back into a natural balance. But first, it has to recover from the shock of not having a regular dose of drugs, then it has to remember how to get the chemistry back to normal. Time is really the only thing that will fix this. The only way to reduce the pain of the WD is to consider a detox program like 10YearsGone suggested.

That you are starting to recognize the things you stopped doing (decorating the house) when on the tea is a really good sign. It means that you are regaining clarity even though you may not feel great mentally right now. I vividly remember coming to that realization during my last quit as I started noticing things that I ignored or stopped doing. I mean I was aware of those things, I just stopped caring. Once I got my energy back and before I started drinking the tea again, there were about 4 months where I was a flurry of activity at home and work. It was such a dramatic change from my slug-like behavior everyone got used to seeing the past few years, that I'm sure they thought I was on drugs when in fact it was because I wasn't on them anymore.

You have to convince yourself that this is not a permanent condition and it shall pass. Remember even the longest journey begins with a single step--and you have taken a number of them at this point. Think about that. You have made it 13 days in cold turkey withdrawal. Those are 13 days that you never have to repeat if you choose not to. 13 days closer to success--you can do this.

 

[8thday]

Gollum, I kind of hate even calling you that because he is the creepiest, little thing alive, haha! When I looked in the mirror this morning, that is who I looked like, GOLLUM! hahaaa! I look like a walking skeleton with sunken in eyes, creepily ugly, and can hardly move around. My precious is no more though. ugh! noooo thanks!

I just want you to know how much I appreciate you and the others on here. Wow, this is an ASS KICKER!!! Your advice along with 10 years, and Chris, have really helped me and kept me thinking positively. I used to be on a running blog when I was running marathons with a bunch of people all over the country that were trying to get a Boston qualifying time (BQ) or those getting ready for the next Boston Marathon or other marathons. We all became best friends. We ran some marathons together, ate together at Boston and one came and ran a marathon here a couple of years ago and stayed with us. I actually still think of them and miss them. I'm FB friends with a bunch of them still. This blog is starting to remind me of that. It is such a great support network and a great way to get new ideas and stay motivated. I'd much rather be training for a marathon than this, but this is a new time in my life and I have learned so incredibly much and have so much concern for the people that are struggling with this beast, like me.

I talked to my mom about everything yesterday. She was so understanding and sweet. My sister is another strength to me along with my daughter and husband. After reading so many things about opiate addiction, I am horrified at how many of us there are. Usually starting from a difficult surgery. I remember my first knee surgery, I was depressed for three months after. I didn't know what was wrong. I read up on surgeries and it said you go through a depression after having surgery. Wellll, yes, your body needs to heal and it is difficult on it, but what I think it is is you are used to being fed dopamine for weeks to heal and then it is gone and your body needs to readjust. That first one just wasn't as severe and the one I am going through because I have been using for years. I know I will have more surgeries in my future and it honestly scares me to death. I NEVER want opiates again, ever! I am terrified to take the Xanax, because getting off of that causes horrible insomnia and that is the reason I am taking the stuff.

I made myself get going today, only cleaned one of my bathrooms and kitchen because my daughter came home and wanted to hike. We hiked all the time, that is something I could do for some reason with my ruined knee. I can't run anymore but I can hike and I hike all over the place. We walked to the trailhead and my heart was pounding and I didn't think I would even be able to make it up to this lake that is a 3/4 mile hike from the trailhead. I did it. It was so hard! A heavier woman was coming down the trail huffing and puffing and I am betting we probably felt the same. I wanted to hug her and tell her how amazing she was!!! I have always had a ton of energy and motivation and I'm really struggling right now. Even after giving birth, I have never had this little energy. I am sure it is the lack of sleep for 11 days and having everything flow right out of me. My stomach is hurting today. My guts still aren't back to working normally. But, I've been pushing through. Went to the grocery store, spent way too much. 25 bucks on two watermelons, but they are actually tasting pretty good here, even in March. Made dinner and now have to go to a track meet for one of my other kids. I am exhausted, but I can do this....If I could just get some sleep. I would love it without meds. The doc gave me an antidepressant and I am terrified to take it. What if it even makes me worse instead of helping? My hub says to just take the Xanax a few days and just get some sleep first. I've talked to my hub for years about maybe switching what he does, but he has spent his entire life training, 14 years upper education. He is brilliant, unfortunately he married me, so maybe he really isn't that smart. hahaha

I love reading how you are doing since you are 9 ahead of me. I wish you were getting some sleep. I am hoping we both get a full 8 and are feeling fabulous tomorrow. No such luck, but we can dream!

 

[Stargazer]

There you are 8th day. Hello again.

You're doing great. Yes. You really are. The journey you're on is grueling. We understand completely.

Having my daughter was easier than detoxing. I agree with that.

All the things you're feeling, thinking, doing or not doing are a normal part of detoxing.

You're on our minds. We're rooting for you. Always. We're standing at the finish line with our arms open. We know you're capable of doing this - you're doing it, right now. It's worth it. Trust that.

You really are a better you off of opiates. You mentioned you noticed you''re not decorating. I know what a big deal that is as a wife and mother.

You're getting closer and closer 8th day. Hang on.

 

[iamgollum]

Gollum, I kind of hate even calling you that because he is the creepiest, little thing alive, haha! When I looked in the mirror this morning, that is who I looked like, GOLLUM! hahaaa! I look like a walking skeleton with sunken in eyes, creepily ugly, and can hardly move around. My precious is no more though. ugh! noooo thanks!

Obviously why I chose that screen name...I was a JRR Tolkien fan before Peter Jackson made it cool to be one and always kind of thought Tolkien was thinking of addicts when he created Gollum. The two sides to him, the Precious, the internal battles, the torture of not having the ring, etc. Kind of sad when that it the kind of character you relate to...I'd much rather be a Wizard. Anyway, maybe someday I can change my screen name to Smeagol but I'm not there yet.

Keep pushing forward--your're energy levels will return and may actually be higher. I know I had a ton of pent up energy once I got past the WD symptoms. Even seemed like too much some days since I suddenly had a lot more hours to fill sober. I don't think the Xanax will be habit forming if you use it sparingly and sporadic and stop once you start getting a few hours of natural sleep.

You are doing great. The fact that you continue to function and take care of responsibilities while in WD is amazing.

 

[iamgollum]

Day 24: Last two nights sucked--maybe a couple of hours of sleep each, but not surprised. I remember during the last kick that the recovery just seemed so inconsistent and hard to figure out--definitely not a logarithmic scale. I would get so excited when I had a good day/night and then I would have a crappy one or two. It's similar to how I play golf--I will go out and hit 3 or 4 shots that suck and be ready to throw the sticks in the water, but then I will hit one perfectly and think--My God, I'm ready for the tour and keep playing. I just need to keep hitting away, I guess.

Even with little sleep, I don't feel horrible today. Obviously very tired, but my attitude seems up and feeling more myself which makes a huge difference and probably the only reason I can function at all. I'm sure I am on the downward side of the WD at this point. Still having some tremors in my hands which I don't remember last time. I am feeling a lot of aches/pains but it is cold, damp, and rainy out so I think it is the weather mostly. Really looking forward to hitting a beach and seeing the sun in the next 2 weeks. Concentration is not great and I have dull headache again. I have a whole day of meetings ahead which I am not looking forward to. I hate meetings so I try to save them up and schedule them all in one day so I can just get it over with. I have a poster in my office that says "No small problem cannot be made worse if enough meetings are held to discuss it". Love that.

 

[Stargazer]

I like that IAG. Lol. Over-thinking and over-talking something does make it worse.

You have this. I say that because of your attitude. I also know there's no way you want to start this over again. Omg.

My probation officer used to tell me he knew I'd complete probation successfully. After 6.5 monthes in jail and 31 in court ordered rehab, I still had 5 or 6 months of probation left.

I used to say, "I'm not done yet. Until I sign that paper on September 5th, I'm not done.". I didn't feel as sure of me as he did.

I can tell by the tone of your posts that you are pushing through. Remember how you felt in your first post in this thread? Your anxiety was palpable. I really felt for you - I understood exactly what you were thinking and feeling.

Your tone has been different since you re-started this thread. Knowing there really is an end maybe is helping? I don't know. Not important really. You're getting closer.

Well done IAG.

 

[iamgollum]

@10YearsGone: Thanks for the props and you're right I DO NOT want to do this again. But...after going through the 7 levels of hell of my last WD, I didn't think I would ever touch the tea again either, but I did. I like to think I have learned a bit more about myself this time which may help relapsing again. It was just so crazy how my brain was able to just erase that trauma and convince me it was OK to start using again. Live and learn, I guess.

You are right, I seem a little less psychotic/manic this round which I think is because I have a baseline this time and kinda sorta know when I will be past the WD. Last time I had no idea it would last as long as it did or the misery it would cause and it just did not seem to end which caused even more anxiety. Plus, I had unrealistic expectations about what would happen. Figured 4-5 days and everything would be back to normal. More like 40-50 days of very incremental improvement that was even hard to notice day-to-day. I will admit that I do not have a lot of fear, but I was scared shitless last time that I had really screwed myself up and that was how I would feel for the rest of my life. At least with this WD I know better days are ahead and it is helping me keep my head together.