Benzos Xanax to Klonipins (suddenly)

[Trebuchette]

New thread because I have a few special circumstances. (1) I'm ill right now. Superbug-ill, ill. That came from the reason for my anxiety: over-active thyroid. Took docs several years to find, and I was trying to "go natural" with the cure. (Hard to do when you're on benzos, smoke, etc.) But I tried hard, and my levels were getting better, in October, but then I got a tooth infection, and really sick from antibiotics (ER several times for re-hydration; then I had superbug without knowing it for a while, and by the time I saw doctor, it was pretty bad). (Edit: see other thread: I was major confused, didn't know I had bug, tried to hide X use.) Family freaked week before Christmas as I went (am going) through treatment. Lots of stress and pain. Lots of vomiting. Xanax really helped (does it all!), but...

(2) truthfully, my worst moments were "I'm out of benzos early." I didn't lie about it: I had taken more than I should. Well, doc said to do so, because I was throwing up a lot, and he had me putting benzos where sun doesn't shine (anal!), extras to account for not getting other drugs that keep heart rate down. They helped, but whereas I'd been on 3mg/day give-or-take, I ran through 100 in 2 weeks (during this treatment for superbug, where I'd also been on opiates for pain, other stuff for nausea). (Well, don't count em all against me, since edit: within last few weeks, as dry-heaving and dehydrated, so there was very little that stayed down. Even with back-end trick, superbug apparently equals diarrhea. So I have no idea how much was "ingested". This is why I was IVed some stuff — I was sick.) (If It's not clear, 5 ER trips in last few months. So embarrassing, though some for pain/dehydration/confusion. It was just pure suck.)

But I said, more than once, "This is a problem." Because the stress of seeing pills disappear: DAMN! The docs haven't really seen benzo was problem (edit: compared to superbug; let me stress they think I may have life-threatening illness), but yesterday agreed to switch me to 3mg/day Ks because I wanted longer-acting (so I could eventually wean off this isht). Doc won't give me Valium (NO idea why), but anything else goes, so K it was (I'd heard it was 2nd longest-acting).

Got Ks today, took one, slept like baby this morning for good 4 hours. (I hadn't slept in 24 hrs though). Questions:

1. How long does it take this shit to kick in?! DANG! Yes, I was on Ativan 5-6 yrs, then Xanax last 2 yrs almost (varying doses, usually 2-4mg/day of either), so fast-acting is what I'm used to. I opted to break these in half after pill #1, took half, and I waited, and waited... WTF?! Nothing! Panic set in, so I took other half, then other half... yep. Day 1, I'm already at 4mg (though I'm headed to bed after this, I hope). I feel like I'm sleepy, but having some w/d symptoms? (I think?! Cold hands, not "relaxed" like with Xanax.)

2. Tell me this gets better, like it builds up or something. I can wait the time for it to kick in, I guess, but I'd like to feel a little more relief than I do an hour after taking the things! I'd heard they were "equal" to xanax?? Big oops?

3. Can I divide them? They're not scored, so I'm wondering if the halves might be all filler in one half. Should I take a whole, thinking, "Maybe it'll kick in tomorrow!" and just go on a schedule?

Yeah my hope is a taper after my thyroid is squared away; it would be nice to get down to 0.5mg/day benzo. Then I'll be able to argue with doc for 5mg Valium. (He does NOT get that 10mg Valium = 1mg other benzos. But if I could get down that low, I could possibly get this monkey off my back.)

I love benzos and all (if you need em, you need em. Nothing like em.) But I'm getting over the love now. I'd like no more emergency visits begging for a pill that would cost me $0.10 pill and paying $200 for the "privilege." I've hit some lows, and that crap has just got to end. I'd hoped for a "controlled addiction" years ago, but since I've been sick, I don't feel any control. With Ks, I'm not feeling much of anything So any tips for this Xanax --> Klonipin switch would be a help. Thanks!

 

[T. Calderone]

Sorry you've been so ill. I was prescribed clonazepam once, years ago. Xanax definitely hit me much faster I agree with you there. What mg are you allotted per day? Some people really like them because they are longer lasting, but give it a couple days to settle in. For tonight take a whole tablet and that should help you sleep.

 

[Trebuchette]

3mg/day Klonipins, like the allotted 3mg/day Xanax (and 4mg/day Ativan before that, in 2012). I did take the whole tablet; thanks. I'm feeling sleepy. Just surprised how long it takes to kick in. Thanks for reading wall of text.

 

[brutus]

You will enjoy Klonopin when compared to Xanax for anxiety. I made the switch and it definitely has helped a great deal.

 

[RustedHalo]

It sounds like you have maybe C-diff when you refer to "the superbug," and anything like that is a vicious, evil illness that no one should have to suffer through!

I'm going to give you the best advice I have based on the available information.

Have you tried to take your tablets sublingually (under the tongue)? If not, this should help you immensely!!! Powder them up, place it under your tongue and hold it as long as possible. Get the powder a little wet with saliva or a couple drops of warm water and hold the underside of your tongue down against the floor of your mouth. Try not to swallow as long as possible, ideally 20 minutes if you can manage. Klonopin actually tastes sort of minty, but if you try this with xanax it's absolutely vile... In either case, it's an extremely effective way to get the medicine into your system where it belongs. In the future, you can ask your doc for orally disintegrating tablets that are actually made for this purpose.

I absolutely believe you should go on a scheduled dosage temporarily. You kind of need to stay one step ahead of the panic attack and if you try to wait until it sets in, it will be much harder to get relief. Keep in mind that this is more likely to increase the risk of physical and mental dependence. I do believe that in your case, the benefits to you would be worth the risk. You need all of your energy to go towards your immune system killing off this bug. Panic attacks waste a lot of valuable energy. Just keep in mind that you should never, ever let yourself run totally out of benzos and you will need to taper off them slowly.

Don't try to chase that feeling that you like. Your goal is to 1. Kill the super bug and 2. Prevent panic. Once you get through this your needs may change but for now, if you really want help you have to be disciplined. Can someone hand out your doses to you on a schedule?

As an aside, I have to ask... Were you advised to take a probiotic or eat lots of yogurt? This is an absolutely essential thing you should ask your doctor about as soon as possible. Make sure you and everyone you contact washes their hands with hot soapy water to kill the bacterial spores and prevent you from being re-infected.

 

[Trebuchette]

I'm sorry Rusty: I never should have turned off notifs!

It sounds like you have maybe C-diff when you refer to "the superbug," and anything like that is a vicious, evil illness that no one should have to suffer through!

Yes, that's it. And I'm struggling because I already weighed very little (5'6, 100 lbs), but I got up to 110lbs with the c-diff, before diagnosis. Weight went away after 14 days Vancomycin, but I have zero hunger and have to force-feed myself. I'm supplementing with Ensure now, but it hurts. The yogurt, regular, is very good; but that Jamie Lee Curtis Activia brand almost killed me I think LOL: seriously, I stayed on bathroom floor just bunched up in pain last week, hoping Vicodin or Klonipin or anything would kick in. Doc said to take the more Vicodins (up to 4x/day), but I just knew that the Activia has something in it that's extra-special painful.) The other probiotics hurt too, though not as bad. I can take them with Gas-X and Vicodin (and stool softeners)

Have you tried to take your tablets sublingually (under the tongue)? If not, this should help you immensely!!! Powder them up, place it under your tongue and hold it as long as possible. Get the powder a little wet with saliva or a couple drops of warm water and hold the underside of your tongue down against the floor of your mouth. Try not to swallow as long as possible, ideally 20 minutes if you can manage. Klonopin actually tastes sort of minty, but if you try this with xanax it's absolutely vile... In either case, it's an extremely effective way to get the medicine into your system where it belongs. In the future, you can ask your doc for orally disintegrating tablets that are actually made for this purpose.

Actually, I've taken Ativan that way(tasty, too!), but Xanax **ugh**. Problem I had was I was so dehydrated, I didn't have saliva, so sublinguals just sat in mouth like rock. But now I'm doing better, so I'll def. try the 20mts on the Klonipin, thanks! Ks usually last in my mouth a few seconds (when I'm properly hydrated) and then I swallow, so no, I haven't tried this 20 mt method at all!!! YAY! I think I could do it; I just didn't know to do it, so Ks were gone in under a minute. THANK YOU! %) :D

And I'm using pill box now (embarrassing since I'd thought they were only for old people, LOL). But my pills got confusing and when you have c-diff, you're just confused anyway. Not sure I could have said my name if asked! At least I was naturally sleepy (no nutrition is probably why, heh), but my husband/kids put pills in box for me first week of treatment. So frustrating because I felt like that guy in Flowers for Algernon (losing intelligence). And my Vicodins and other pills got confusing (I literally couldn't remember if I'd taken a dose of thyroid blocker, or propanolol, much less Vicodin or Xanax!!), so I def. let family dose me.

But I'm averaging way more Ks, even on schedule (4mg/day vs 3mg/day), and that was "just making it", no joy or panic relief. Oh there's anxiety relief, and I was sleeping well (I had also quit Ambien in December since it seemed useless), but lately I started to wake up around 3am or so with (best way to explain it) "night terrors". I keep thinking, "Maybe I'm withdrawing form short-acting benzo a bit!", so I would get up and check heart rate (doctor's orders) on machine. Heart rate would be fine, even 10bpm lower than usual (70 bpm!!! Versus 140bpm!!!),but blood pressure was strangely high, and that's new to me and just plain scary (and painful — your arms hurt and you're sluggish!). But that time is probably when Vicodin cleared system and I got the c-diff pain back, which made blood pressure shoot way up.

When I'm not in pain, I could probably skip benzos (except the 0.5/day -- my anti-seizure dosage), but I think I'd rather have more benzos than more opiates. I'm just not fond of opiates AT ALL. I fall down like a freaking zoo animal on crack!!! At least if anxiety is under control, I can think clearly.

Maybe doc was right after all that now's not the time to get off Xanax. But boy I hope not. I like K taste so much better, and overall, I really do feel more calm "all over" all the time. I was going to ask doc, should I take extra Vicodin at night, or extra Klonipin. I'd gone with the Ks, since Vicodins can actually keep me awake, but maybe I did it backwards.

(Sorry so long: I took half a morphine sulfate IR, which I thought equaled a Vicodin, which I'm out of because my follow-up was cancelled due to impeding snow ). Doctor just doesn't understand. Well, he stays super-busy; at least I don't have flu like everyone else here, so that's a blessing.) Again, thanks for 20mt Klonipin tip!!!

 

[Trebuchette]

You will enjoy Klonopin when compared to Xanax for anxiety. I made the switch and it definitely has helped a great deal.

Just, brutus, this is NO LIE! Today is first day I switched back to Xanax (long story: emergency refill at old pharmacy since, due to snowstorm, doc had to cancel one appointment so far, and hopefully I can see him Friday but they're calling on more snow).

I'd called him a week ago, left messages, that for this month, I'd need a refill on Ks, and maybe an increase for a month on the Ks until they "got into system". Or maybe a supplement (he's done that: supplemented ativan 4mg/day with temazepam for sleep). He hadn't done any refills in case I didn't like K, and for dosing.

Now, I don't think I needed even an increase: once I got on every 8 hours, sure, I'd have an occasional panic flare-up, but I was mild all over, and panic symptoms weren't intolerable (like first week, when I'd wait and wait for Ks to kick in). Guess it took me into week 3 to see this, but had I taken them on schedule all along (versus "as needed", which is printed on bottle), I think Ks would have worked better from the get-go. I'm just not used to long-terms. And zomg the taste!

I had to refill old Xanax Rx today, and stopped my sad leftover amount of Klonipins (so doc could count and make sure I wasn't double-dipping). And I tell you, I miss the Klonipins!!! OMG do I miss Ks. And it's only been a day off! (I'm tempted to take leftovers, but want to show some good faith here, that I "switched back" until I could get appointment).

I took Xanax, and only 2mg vs 3mg, because I feel like whale shit. I guess the X brought my breathing down to a near halt (thought I was having heart attack, got out ice bags and bp machine). Now it's true, I'm having (unrelated c-diff) pain which I'm not treating except with motrin, because I didn't want to refill Vicodin and Phenergans and all that at the old pharmacy — I want new Rxes for that (with refills I hope), or maybe he can transfer Rxes to new pharmacy. But anyway, you don't really see what the Xanax does until you get off it, and onto Ks for a while, and then try X again. It's like ...being hit with brick upside head!

I think I withdrew from Xanax even while on Ks, so that's another reason I'm taking it easy on X. I'm going to do half pills until I see doc, and just pray doc can keep Friday appt (no snowstorm!) so I can get my Klonipins back! (Again, I'm GIVING him the bottles, including the new X with hopefully over 85 pills in it. I WAS going to suggest I keep 10 for "breakthrough" panic, but I don't want even 10 of these things.)

Do you use anything for "breakthrough panic", or do you get to where you don't need that? Thanks again!