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Women: how would you feel if a new man pulled out a female condom instead of a male?

JessFR said:
Totally agree.



Ok shit like this is why I stopped posting. Who are you to say "but the reduction is greater for the one wearing it", you're not a woman and I'm not a man, neither of us can make that claim because neither of us really know for sure. Look, you don't have to believe all the female posters, or anyone else, but unless you want to run with the manipulative asshole boyfriend personality, you will simply have to accept it. And maybe have the humility to accept you may not have to truly appreciate someone else's perspective to respect it.
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Who am I to say? I guess I'm somebody who understands that textures moving across skin create sensations that feel good? That's presumably why the quote the post I just posted stated "the plastic ring inside rubs against the tip of the penis during intercourse, intensifying the man's orgasm. Subsequently, the prostitutes started charging more for sex with a female condom." That plastic ring increased the man's sexual sensations and orgasm by providing a source of friction for the man to feel. That's why the slogan of ribbed male condoms is "for her pleasure" instead of "for his pleasure." You ask me how I can make that claim? Sorry, but I can make that claim because it's entirely obvious that it's true. It doesn't matter if you're a woman or a man, it's something that can be verified by anything that has nerve endings. I don't know how else to respond.

I also don't understand why you're telling me I don't have to "believe" all the female posters' claims, since I've already addressed these claims with logical counter responses. You've just ignored them. I'm not refusing to believe anything. If you take issue with those counter responses the way to advance discussion is to refute them logically point by point as I've asked in this thread before. But you haven't done that, instead you're telling me I "simply have to accept" claims I've already dealt with in detail above without offering any new arguments of your own and claimed that because I'm abiding by the rules of productive debate it makes me a "manipulative asshole." I'm sorry if you don't like the conclusions this thread is leaning towards, but if they're not true and that's so obvious it shouldn't be taking this long to show that's so rationally, should it?
 
psood0nym said:
Who am I to say? I guess I'm somebody who understands that textures moving across skin create sensations that feel good? That's presumably why the quote the post I just posted stated "the plastic ring inside rubs against the tip of the penis during intercourse, intensifying the man's orgasm. Subsequently, the prostitutes started charging more for sex with a female condom." That plastic ring increased the man's sexual sensations and orgasm by providing a source of friction for the man to feel. That's why the slogan of ribbed male condoms is "for her pleasure" instead of "for his pleasure." You ask me how I can make that claim? Sorry, but I can make that claim because it's entirely obvious that it's true. It doesn't matter if you're a woman or a man, it's something that can be verified by anything that has nerve endings. I don't know how else to respond.

I also don't understand why you're telling me I don't have to "believe" all the female posters' claims, since I've already addressed these claims with logical counter responses. You've just ignored them. I'm not refusing to believe anything. If you take issue with those counter responses the way to advance discussion is to refute them logically point by point as I've asked in this thread before. But you haven't done that, instead you're telling me I "simply have to accept" claims I've already dealt with in detail above without offering any new arguments of your own and claimed that because I'm abiding by the rules of productive debate it makes me manipulative. I'm sorry if you don't like the conclusions this thread is leaning towards, but if they're not true and that's so obvious it shouldn't be taking this long to show that rationally, should it?
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What exactly is it you want to hear? Plenty of people including myself have said that we agree couples should talk about it and consider each other's needs. Are you looking for a woman to agree on behalf of all women that it should be a 50/50 split? Because even if that happened it wouldn't change a thing. Individual women would still decide for themselves. Do you want someone to agree that it's being sexist or counter feminist for the woman to insist the man wear a condom? Because that wouldn't matter either. And I already gave my view on that position. Or are you giving your position so that when it can't be refuted to your satisfaction you can believe it is right? What exactly is it that you're looking for here? As far as I can see, nobody is arguing that in theory couples shouldn't have a spirit of compromising for each other when possible. Are you looking for someone to explain why it's ok for women to assume the man will have a male condom rather than a female condom? I would say it's simply the case that it's much more common, and so goes without saying. Asking for anything that doesn't go without saying requires discussion with your partner, not it being sprung on them followed by a lecture. In which case I can't see sex being what happens next regardless.

I keep ignoring your points because I can't see what their actual point is.

Nobody was arguing that the girl SHOULD refuse to accommodate their partner for no real reason. Just that it IS her decision, and if she's not comfortable in having sex with a female condom, well if you don't like it, find someone else. You can throw all the factoids and anecdotes out you want, but it's not for you to decide if she's convinced by them or not.
 
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What exactly is it you want to hear? Plenty of people including myself have said that we agree couples should talk about it and consider each other's needs. Are you looking for a woman to agree on behalf of all women that it should be a 50/50 split? Because even if that happened it wouldn't change a thing. Individual women would still decide for themselves. Do you want someone to agree that it's being sexist or counter feminist for the woman to insist the man wear a condom? Because that wouldn't matter either. And I already gave my view on that position. Or are you giving your position so that when it can't be refuted to your satisfaction you can believe it is right? What exactly is it that you're looking for here? As far as I can see, nobody is arguing that in theory couples shouldn't have a spirit of compromising for each other when possible. Are you looking for someone to explain why it's ok for women to assume the man will have a male condom rather than a female condom? I would say it's simply the case that it's much more common, and so goes without saying. Asking for anything that doesn't go without saying requires discussion with your partner, not it being sprung on them followed by a lecture. In which case I can't see sex being what happens next regardless.

I keep ignoring your points because I can't see what their actual point is.

Nobody was arguing that the girl SHOULD refuse to accommodate their partner for no real reason. Just that it IS her decision, and if she's not comfortable in having sex with a female condom, well if you don't like it, find someone else. You can throw all the factoids and anecdotes out you want, but it's not for you to decide if she's convinced by them or not.
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For the second time I've posted it in this thread, the question is: “If condom using heterosexual partners truly respect sexual equality, and assuming each party is willing to evenly split all monetary birth control costs, is it fair to males who prefer or want to try female condoms if females aren’t willing to wear a condom an equal amount of the time?”

The reason it's a relevant question is because surveys indicate male condoms are used more than female condoms in practice by about this much:
Current Contraceptive Method Used by U.S. Women Ages 15 to 44 Who Are Using Contraception, 2006-2008
contraceptive-prevalence.gif

*Includes emergency contraception, female condom or vaginal pouch, foam, cervical cap, Today sponge, suppository or insert, jelly or cream (without diaphragm), and other methods.
†Data do not meet standards of reliability or precision.

Source: William D. Mosher and Jo Jones, "Use of Contraception in the United States: 1982–2008," Vital and Health Statistics 23, no. 29 (2010).
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... and that's not reflective of "equality" is it? So why?

I suppose from other people I'm looking for a qualified "yes" or "no" to the question and engagement in productive discussion rather than glib dismissals. So far my conclusion about it is that the ultimate decision depends largely on how a couple weighs the increase in the male’s sexual pleasure against the decrease in female condom effectiveness relative to male condoms. Without using additional contraceptive methods, the decrease in effectiveness of alternating between the proper use of the two condom types over time relative to using male condoms only is ~1.53%. With the addition of 99% effective oral contraception the difference in effectiveness at preventing pregnancy (though not STDs) is nearly negligible. So, assuming no other intruding factors, in a case where the concern is chiefly the risk of pregnancy and both the 50/50 split is practiced and oral contraception is used, the question of who wears the condom really can seemingly be fairly decided by a coin flip.

You ask me hypothetically above: "Are you looking for someone to explain why it's ok for women to assume the man will have a male condom rather than a female condom?" and respond "I would say it's simply the case that it's much more common, and so goes without saying."

Exactly, it is common, and it's a practice that appears discriminatory towards males whether it's occurred to them it's discriminatory or not. I already stated earlier that I believe the reason male condoms are used so much more is because the female condom is so far in the periphery of both sexes' awareness that it doesn't even occur to either of them to use it. The whole point of this thread is to get those who read it to examine their assumptions about why the male is always the one to wear the condom and debate what's at stake if that were to change. And the reason it may be worth changing is because it's plausible that it would improve many males sex lives. That's my motive, as I've stated throughout this thread. So I'm not sure why you're so confused about my motives.

I keep ignoring your points because I can't see what their actual point is.
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Then quote the text and describe what you don't understand so I can explain it. (I'll come back to this thread tomorrow)
Tude said:
To each their own
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Hah ha. Yes, I believe that’s how engineers talk when comparing calculations of minimal stress capacities required of materials to prevent the collapse of new bridges!
 
Yes... it's equal. It's equal because either partner has the right to refuse sex for any reason. You can do it, she can do it. Nobody should ever be compelled to have sex in a way they aren't completely ok with. You can disagree with their reason for not being ok with it. But it is a plenty fair standard for an unfair world.
 
JessFR said:
Yes... it's equal. It's equal because either partner has the right to refuse sex for any reason. You can do it, she can do it. Nobody should ever be compelled to have sex in a way they aren't completely ok with. You can disagree with their reason for not being ok with it. But it is a plenty fair standard for an unfair world.
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What does the right to refuse sex for any reason have to do with the concern of ensuring that an equal chance for sexual pleasure is available to both sexes? What I’m proposing is like flipping a coin to decide who gets the ball first in a game. What you’re claiming is like one team saying they’re offering the other team an equal chance to start with the ball because either of them could forfeit before anything can be played. It’s beside the point. A woman’s inherent risk cannot logically figure into the question of fairness as it’s concerned here. It’s a categorically different concern that you’re treating as a categorically same concern while claiming the fact that we live in “an unfair world” is somehow its justification. That’s not an argument, it’s an expression of spite.
 
Years ago, I got some free female condoms from Planned Parenthood. My then-partner and I tried it out. We both found it to be squeaky (seriously) to the point it broke our concentration. It was back to polyurethane male condoms after that.

Both partners should bear responsibility for contraception and STD protection.
 
OP, how about you quit whinging about your friction and your pleasure, while your girl pumps pill hormones that have serious side effects and can and do increase the risk of certain cancers into her body and remember the other point of a condom - which is to take self responsibility for protecting YOUR health!!!!!

Your girl is on the pill - therefore she, not you, is the one putting serious drugs in her body long term (read about the list of potential side effects of the pill including deep vein thrombosis and much more) - while you only use a condom for the odd extra risky times - I'd say you're getting a damn good deal there. Can't quite believe you are still whinging.

If you hate condoms so much, you could always have a vasectomy.
 
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(generalizing here) guys enjoy cumming on girls faces and in their mouths. If it was pleasurable for your girl would you let her bust a massive squirt in your mouth and all over your face?

50/50 right?
 
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