Withdrawal, Gabapentin, and Dependence

[probablyanxious]

I am looking for guidance on using prescribed gabapentin in the context of a benzo withdrawal. The fear is developing another dependency in trying to shake off a different dependency.

Currently I’m experiencing what I would describe as “moderate” benzo withdrawal. This has been occurring for a bit over two weeks. I spent about 14 months prior to this tapering, and it was brutal.

The credit for this relatively easy benzo withdrawal, at least in my case, should go to gabapentin. My dosages vary based on feel. I have never exceeded 1200mg in a day; typically my daily doses are 900mg. The dose spiked the last two weeks. Before the hat, since about January, my daily dosages ranged from 0mg-500mg.

It FEELS like the gabapentin really helps with the excitotoxicity. The excitotoxicity is super unpleasant, and sometimes it feels like a seizure is coming on. Historically I called this cluster of symptoms “anxiety.” I’m really starting to doubt that this is indeed anxiety in its true sense.

However I’m starting to get concerned about becoming dependent on gabapentin. It would seem that if the gabapentin is blunting benzo withdrawal, then it you take it out of the equation disaster strikes.

What are your experiences with gabapentin? If one is withdrawing from a benzo, do the usual rules like skipping days apply? I’m reluctant to skip days right now lest a seizure comes on. How much time can I expect to have until I start running into dependency issues? Am I already there?

Please help me devise a plan to keep the benzo crap managed while also not becoming dependent on gabapentin.

Edit: gabapentin is about the only tool I have for benzo withdrawal, I believe.

 

[Didgital]

Can you give a little more info regarding your prior benzo usage and taper?

14 months seems like an awfully long taper, but I suppose it really depends on prior use. There is always going to be some sort of rebound anxiety with benzo dependency and it does not necessarily mean a seizure is incoming. It's actually a natural symptom of benzo cessation IMO.

I only have minimal use with gabapentanoids but I definitely have benzo experience. I tapered off a 2 year daily flualprazolam habit (600-1200ug) to about 250ug (very anxious during this period) and held it there for a few months. Eventually i was gifted norfluorazepam which is a much longer acting benzo. I used it at the smallest doses possible to fend off serious* withdrawl. Then I finally had to pull the trigger and just stop. I used mushrooms for a few days straight before I finally just stopped with no seizure, though I had a lot of support from friends and family. It wasn't fun but I didn't go back for years.

When I did, I quickly became dependent on it. The 2nd dependency only went on for lets say 8 months. Hating it and knowing how it was controlling my life led me to flush my stash, and I had a seizure within 48 hrs. Fortunately was gifted some Diazepam and I basically did the same thing, took the smallest amount to stop the seizure but still had severe anxiety. I think I was taking like 2.5mg every 3rd day and it was terrible but I eventually again pulled the trigger and had to stop entirely.

I had been gifted both gabapentin and phenibut, but like you, I was worried about just transferring dependancies so I did not use either really for either of my tapers.

Years later I tried gabapentin for a week and it didn't seem to cause the same* sort of neurological effects and I was able to stop pretty easily. Now though, if I take any benzo more than once, I will feel withdrawl so I kinda ruined them for me and now I just don't take them. Ever. Maybe in a severe psychotic episode I would but otherwise, not worth the risk.

Wish I had more direct experience but thought maybe my story could help.
Again it really depends on your prior benzo usage

 

[probablyanxious]

Can you give a little more info regarding your prior benzo usage and taper?

14 months seems like an awfully long taper, but I suppose it really depends on prior use. There is always going to be some sort of rebound anxiety with benzo dependency and it does not necessarily mean a seizure is incoming. It's actually a natural symptom of benzo cessation IMO.

I only have minimal use with gabapentanoids but I definitely have benzo experience. I tapered off a 2 year daily flualprazolam habit (600-1200ug) to about 250ug (very anxious during this period) and held it there for a few months. Eventually i was gifted norfluorazepam which is a much longer acting benzo. I used it at the smallest doses possible to fend off serious* withdrawl. Then I finally had to pull the trigger and just stop. I used mushrooms for a few days straight before I finally just stopped with no seizure, though I had a lot of support from friends and family. It wasn't fun but I didn't go back for years.

When I did, I quickly became dependent on it. The 2nd dependency only went on for lets say 8 months. Hating it and knowing how it was controlling my life led me to flush my stash, and I had a seizure within 48 hrs. Fortunately was gifted some Diazepam and I basically did the same thing, took the smallest amount to stop the seizure but still had severe anxiety. I think I was taking like 2.5mg every 3rd day and it was terrible but I eventually again pulled the trigger and had to stop entirely.

I had been gifted both gabapentin and phenibut, but like you, I was worried about just transferring dependancies so I did not use either really for either of my tapers.

Years later I tried gabapentin for a week and it didn't seem to cause the same* sort of neurological effects and I was able to stop pretty easily. Now though, if I take any benzo more than once, I will feel withdrawl so I kinda ruined them for me and now I just don't take them. Ever. Maybe in a severe psychotic episode I would but otherwise, not worth the risk.

Wish I had more direct experience but thought maybe my story could help.
Again it really depends on your prior benzo usage

Thanks for sharing your story. It is very helpful. Are you prone to seizures or was that the result solely of your benzo use? What, if anything, would you do differently now?

I’ve been on benzos about 14 of the last 20 years. Dosage of clonazepam reached 3mg/day with some triazolam mixed in. My ignorance of tapering did me in I think. I followed the direction of my shrink. The first reduction he had me go from 3mg to 2mg. Then to 1mg.

I put several pauses on the taper because I instantly started having panic attacks and ferocious anxiety. Once I reached 0.5mg I paused for 2 months, and by the time I was going to drop dosage again, serious life stuff happened so I stayed paused. I only jumped due to my refill getting lost in UPS’s system. They finally delivered the package 14 days late, and knowing clonazepam was in there, I refused delivery.

Looking back, I believe the clonazepam was worsening my anxiety. I think my erratic tapering also was ping ponging me around. I feel better on the whole and I’ve been able to notice some “muted” aspects of my personality, mainly dealing with social things. The anxiety or excitotoxicity can get bad at times.

Against this backdrop, it has become a major concern that I’m becoming dependent on gabapentin. It’s such a colossal struggle because while I’m doing all of this, I’m being counted on by my young son, for whom I am the primary caretaker in a single parent situation. With no family and few supporters, I do not have the agency not to work and not to be a good and present dad. IF it came down to a binary choice, either take the benzos to fulfill these obligations OR stay off all of it but not be a dad, then I’m choosing benzos everyday of the week.

Enter gabapentin. Sometimes I am filled with hope and think I got this. The rest of the time it feels like I’m slowly drowning.

 

[Didgital]

Are you prone to seizures or was that the result solely of your benzo use? What, if anything, would you do differently now?

No that was my one and only seizure and it was solely due to my benzo use. If I would do anything differently now, it would be to never take a benzo again unless a true psychic emergency.

I’ve been on benzos about 14 of the last 20 years.

That is definitely a long time, and the longer the dependency, the longer the taper should be though I still think 14 months is a long long taper. I really can't give you medical recommendations I only know what worked for me and the hardest part was always flicking the light switch from on to off (completely stopping).

Once you fully stop, expect anxiety for weeks if not months. For me it was weeks but again, I put myself in a place where I minimized stress as much as possible and had plenty of emotional support and that helped a lot. I even quit my job which was a huge cause of stress/anxiety and likely the root cause of my usage. Not sure I could have done it without doing that, though that's clearly not always an option.

I can definitely see where you're coming from and your source of stress. I did not have any dependents but I knew that the benzos were actually holding me back from enjoying my life. I didn't have a script, so I was afraid to travel (which is my love and joy). You seem to think that those are the only 2 choices and I could be wrong but I think you can stop and still be present for your son, but you may need additional support. I know how tough it can be.

I used to say "Well, there's worse things than being addicted to benzos for the rest of my life". And I'm sure there are, but that was not the life I wanted and I slowly took steps to lower usage, then I stopped (and it sucked for weeks) but eventually I was able to balance it out. I did use alcohol to lessen the post withdrawl anxiety which it did BUT it didn't help my life in the long run. I've since become a lot better with that substance as well though it can still rear it's head. I'd probably rather be addicted to gabapentanoids than benzos or alcohol, but the goal is to be free of all addictions.

There are plenty of threads on this on BL and elsewhere so at least know you're not alone in this struggle. Everyone's particular situation is unique. I've a lot of empathy and sympathy for you and I wish you the best outcome. If you can taper to get over the danger of seizure then you can stop and just deal with the shit for a while. I promise it will get better, you just have to learn other ways to keep the stress from overwhelming you. Sorry I don't have a magic bullet. Again I can only share what worked for me.

 

[probablyanxious]

Thank you for the excellent response. You are providing some real good insight.

Your reply prompted a lot of thought and reflection. When you mentioned the two options that I presented, you have a good point. So now I am asking myself if I “had” to go back on a benzo, how would I or anyone even really know that?

I mean you probably could figure it out eventually, but I imagine by the time that clarity arrived, it would possibly be under a circumstance where I would not be, and possibly would not have been, able to continue being a good steward for (in my case) my son. Hypothetically speaking, as I’m still keeping it all together even if the seams are being stretched and the optics are not nearly as pretty.

It gets really difficult but having reached this side where I’m not having seizures, not dealing with psychosis, and have not taken active steps to harm myself (just thinking and wishing), then it seems absolutely crazy to resume a habit that helped put me in this mess. I’m not saying things can’t change, but this is where I’m at now.

I appreciate your words of support, your fountain of knowledge, and your stream of lived experience. I have not made many posts or replies, but I have spent a significant amount of time coming here. This is a great community of folks.

 

[probablyanxious]

Is anyone aware if there is a gabapentin tapering schedule akin to the Ashton Manual?

 

[Kurt Cobain]

I am looking for guidance on using prescribed gabapentin in the context of a benzo withdrawal. The fear is developing another dependency in trying to shake off a different dependency.

Currently I’m experiencing what I would describe as “moderate” benzo withdrawal. This has been occurring for a bit over two weeks. I spent about 14 months prior to this tapering, and it was brutal.

The credit for this relatively easy benzo withdrawal, at least in my case, should go to gabapentin. My dosages vary based on feel. I have never exceeded 1200mg in a day; typically my daily doses are 900mg. The dose spiked the last two weeks. Before the hat, since about January, my daily dosages ranged from 0mg-500mg.

It FEELS like the gabapentin really helps with the excitotoxicity. The excitotoxicity is super unpleasant, and sometimes it feels like a seizure is coming on. Historically I called this cluster of symptoms “anxiety.” I’m really starting to doubt that this is indeed anxiety in its true sense.

However I’m starting to get concerned about becoming dependent on gabapentin. It would seem that if the gabapentin is blunting benzo withdrawal, then it you take it out of the equation disaster strikes.

What are your experiences with gabapentin? If one is withdrawing from a benzo, do the usual rules like skipping days apply? I’m reluctant to skip days right now lest a seizure comes on. How much time can I expect to have until I start running into dependency issues? Am I already there?

Please help me devise a plan to keep the benzo crap managed while also not becoming dependent on gabapentin.

Edit: gabapentin is about the only tool I have for benzo withdrawal, I believe.

Look into kava kava and valerian root some theanine wouldnt hurt either. Take gabapentin fkr 2 to 3 weeks during benzo wd and then do a rapid taper for a week then use kava kava and the rest of what i mentioned to gradually get u down to baseline. Passion flower tea is even better if you can find GOOD passio. Flower tea. Theres a lot of shit stuff and you want the kind that makes the tea pruple or red not the clear kind

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Is anyone aware if there is a gabapentin tapering schedule akin to the Ashton Manual?

Ya and gabapentin is essy to taper

 

[probablyanxious]

Look into kava kava and valerian root some theanine wouldnt hurt either. Take gabapentin fkr 2 to 3 weeks during benzo wd and then do a rapid taper for a week then use kava kava and the rest of what i mentioned to gradually get u down to baseline. Passion flower tea is even better if you can find GOOD passio. Flower tea. Theres a lot of shit stuff and you want the kind that makes the tea pruple or red not the clear kind

Thank you so much. That is very helpful information that I was struggling to synthesize from disparate sources. It seems big pharma really does not want it to be known that gabapentin (and pregabalin) cause dependency. I mean they have to know. Mr shrink still says I shouldn’t worry because I’m off benzos.