Why shooting pills is dangerous.

[rolls]

I've been reading about this more than I wish I was on these forums, this is a harm prevention web site and this is one of the most dangerous things people can do.

If you shoot pills, even if you filter them and get rid of all the solids, there are still water soluble binders in this solution. If you keep doing this your veins and lungs will slowly fill up with binders and pill particulates, you can end up with limbs amputated and bad abscesses if you miss a shot. Another thing, some people go 'oh he shot pills and was fine' but maybe he was shooting 160mg pills, and you are trying to shoot 16x 10mg pills, imagine how much more binder you will be banging up your arm?

So people, DO NOT SHOOT PILLS however if you absolutely must, make sure you invest in a chemical grade micron lab filter and filter the solution until it is crystal clear. This will involve many filtrations to achieve, and the final solution will still be unsafe to IV dose.

The only times I would say that IVing non IV vials of liquid is safe is when you have capsules with actual crystals in them, most of the time these are 99% pure and as long as you use sterile saline solution to dissolve in it will be very safe.

 

[Unknown]

Thanks...

 

[the_ketaman]

I believe this can never be said enough.

I started out snorting OC's then progressed to shooting them and MS-Contins and its the only thing in my life I can think of that I regret. I cant help but think that I will be dead in a few years or months even though I havent shot an OC in about a month and before that it would have been alot longer. Ive suffered some awful pains associated with injecting pills, fucked and scarred alot of veins to the point that it may very well be visible to the naked eye for the rest of my life not to mention becoming so addicted to the needle in the process.

Injecting pills truely is the most dangerous thing you can do with drugs IMO and once you start it is very, very hard to stop. At least if your going to IV drugs do heroin or meth or something, most pills arent even worth IV'ing and you get yourself addicted to something you and your brain might think is really great but in reality it isnt as good as some other drugs or plain emotions. IV meth and heroin are better IMO, just they were always way more expensive, usually around $50 for a shot of meth for me or $100 for a shot of heroin, once apon a time with the tolerance I still have now it was $5 for a shot of oxy or morphine and that price s pretty darn hard to pass up.

All I can say is just dont do it, I am a strong believer that we should have no regrets but I cant help but regret what I have done to myself through injecting pills.

Theres obviously going to be the people who read this and it goes in one ear(or eye) and out the other, I cant blame them I guess because I did the exact same thing, I knew what this could do to me but only after I was addicted for several months and until I started feeling what I was doing to myself did I start freaking out and by then it could have very well been to late.

If there were one group of drug users that I could save(obviously theoretically) then it would be pill injectors, its fucking bad and all you need to do to find out why it is bad is google "injecting pills" or "injecting oxycontin" and you will see some truely fucked up stuff.

Just out of curiosity does anyone know of anyone who has been an IV user of pills for more than a few months? Do they look or feel healthy? I doubt it but still, ill wait till I hear something back before I make any assumptions.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

IV Suboxone is a really popular option for many people, and here's a list of inactive ingredients.

lactose, mannitol, cornstarch, povidone K30, citric acid, sodium citrate, FD&C Yellow No. 6 color, magnesium stearate, and for flavoring, Acesulfame K sweetener and a lemon-lime flavor.

from http://www.suboxonerehab.com/

I cannot speak of long-term health, I do not know a lot about this and if anyone else can fill in that would be great.

 

[rolls]

If you have shot pills in your life, could you go on a dialysis machine that might filter out the particulates?

 

[svacheme3]

Hows about you cite some information for claims like this. The rate binders deposite in lung tissue makes this a problem only for people who use poor filtering procedures for decades. Show me case studies of small time users with IV related pulmonary edema.

Show me some statistics to prove that this isn't being blown way out of proportion and that anyone besides lifelong IV pill users should be concerned about it.

Just out of curiosity does anyone know of anyone who has been an IV user of pills for more than a few months? Do they look or feel healthy? I doubt it but still, ill wait till I hear something back before I make any assumptions.

Yes. I've been IVing 10+ 80s or 20+ roxies every day for 5 years with just a cotton ball. My lungs are fine according to nuclear imaging and x-rays.

I know at least 2 dozen other people IVing for years who don't seem to have any problem other than being addicted. That causes lots of problems, but the people who IV pills are no different than the addicts who don't.

 

[rolls]

Hows about you cite some information for claims like this. The rate binders deposite in lung tissue makes this a problem only for people who use poor filtering procedures for decades. Show me case studies of small time users with IV related pulmonary edema.t.

There was a case in another thread where a user mentioned someone he knew who had his arm amputated from shooting pills for 6 months. Probably missed a few shots and didn't do anything about it.

 

[xui]

It's all about procedure, man. In case you didn't notice, it's usually the fuckheads who don't give a shit about their life that go and reuse dirty needles or make a shot out of a month's worth of cotton balls.

I have re-used a dirty needle a couple of times when I was out of options. Hydrogen peroxide wash to get rid of the clotted blood followed by hot water, then an iso wash and another hot water rinse. Have never had any problems.

I've been spoonin' for a half a year now, no problems really. I barely missed probably .05cc of a shot once in my life. I felt the sting immediately and drew back and, behold! no blood in the plunger. I'm pretty careful when it comes to shit like this. Filtering particulate matter with sterile hospital-grade cotton swabs and then filtering with a fine micron filter is the way to go.

There are healthier ways to shoot pills, so get off yer soapbox man. I'm sure nobody is going to think twice after reading what you wrote simply because they have probably already weighed the risks out.

My addiction isn't as bad as svacheme3's, but I bang average of 3 80's a day and all my checkups for lung problems have been okay. When my doctor was speaking into his tape, he said, and I quote, "A fine example of good health in this 19 year old individual."

So eh, shooting pills is the last of my worries man. I know plenty of people alive and fine that do it 10x worse than me. I even know some that "shake n' shoot" k4's, don't even filter those bitches at all.. Now that's disgusting.

 

[Geist89]

If you have shot pills in your life, could you go on a dialysis machine that might filter out the particulates?

That's probably a question for a doctor to answer, but my guess is no. The human body is designed to take a pretty damn hard beating before it'll give up and is pretty good at repairing itself if you give it time and proper care. Your kidneys, liver, and lymphatic system, I assume, would be pretty good at handling that if you drop the habit and get proper nutrition, exercise, etc.

I had a brief IV hydromorphone addiction that left my arms looking like pincushions, and I noticed that my arms would "fall asleep" much easier than before I had the habit. Once I stopped, though, my veins reappeared and presumably repaired themselves.

EDIT: The exception being if you blow a valve in one of your veins. To my understanding, those don't ever heal.

 

[Cane2theLeft]

It's all about procedure, man. In case you didn't notice, it's usually the fuckheads who don't give a shit about their life that go and reuse dirty needles or make a shot out of a month's worth of cotton balls.

Its so condescending and inaccurate to make statements like this. There are too many variables to just blame it on people being "fuckheads".... for example- inaccessibility to clean needles, fear of legal issues from possessing paraphernalia, inaccessibility to clean/sterile water, lack of education regarding what is necessary to more safely inject, having to rush a shot for fear of being apprehended, and so many other factors that are not a result of being a "fuckhead".

Some people are sucked so deeply into the sinkhole of addiction that its not an issue of apathy about their life, but just sheer desperation.

Maybe Rolls is over blowing the risk, maybe not... what matters to me is that he is going out of his way to try to educate people about the risk and he is trying to REDUCE HARM... he's not being judgmental, attacking, insulting or condescending. I think its productive that you are sharing your safe methods, its just a shame you have to attack rolls and other people in the throws of addiction to do so.

 

[Mr Blonde]

Talcosis Associated with IV Abuse of Oral Medications: CT Findings -- Ward et al. 174 (3): 789 -- American Journal of Roentgenology.

Interesting because it compares IV use of other drugs to IV use of ritalin, but also because of their findings that this talcosis can appear as ground glass in the lung tissue; google James Zadroga and read about him, a 9/11 rescue worker who it is believed died from injecting pills, rather then toxic dust inhaled at Ground Zero. One of the arguments against this was the appearance of ground glass in his lungs.

I mention Zadroga because one of the articles I read a while ago stated that he had only been a pill injector for a few years at the most, but I'm unable to find that article now.

Injecting pills can have consequences. All things do, this practice just happens to have some nasty ones. Some people don't experience any, others get the worst.

I guess that everyone has to make their own choice regarding whether they will inject pills or not; my answer would be no. I've done it before, admittedly only a couple of times and I didn't experience any side-effects from that small use, but I won't be doing it again.

Maybe Rolls is over blowing the risk, maybe not... what matters to me is that he is going out of his way to try to educate people about the risk and he is trying to REDUCE HARM... he's not being judgmental, attacking, insulting or condescending. I think its productive that you are sharing your safe methods, its just a shame you have to attack rolls and other people in the throws of addiction to do so.

Emphasis mine. Exactly; this is a harm reduction website so of course we are going to push the dangers because we want people to take precautions. And C2tL is also right about generalizing people as fuckheads; some people just get lucky, others not so lucky. People can smoke tobacco all their lives and never have any problems, whereas a lot of tobacco smokers will experience problems.

 

[firesilverlullaby]

I remember seeing someone on here that said their were pictures of peoples lungs after they had injected, anyone have any links? I couldn't find any

 

[Lifeonthepharm]

dilaudid

So consensus (for safety) - is chew or snort them. Only IV H. End of story.

Consensus (for euphoria and risk taking) - IV it no matter what. Anything else is a waste.

I like to think about safety first, but I would hate to waste these. Thanks alot guys

 

[the_ketaman]

This makes me so fucking glad I stopped banging pills and pretty much banging all together. the only thing I will let in my veins is washed meth/coke/heroin and RC's obtained from a factory but I still havent done that. Pill shit will never find its way inside me ever again.

Its such a shame how ignorant people are when it comes to banging pills, some people just choose to believe what theyre doing is ok but it is far from.

 

[Erowid]

I am relatively old by junkie standards, having survived 52 years, 40 of which has been addicted to opiates of every shape and form. I have injected several pharmacy loads of pills over the years and and can testify to the havoc wreaked on my veins. I have no peripheral arteries or veins left resulting in a BP reading of 220/180. I have also been told by doctors that if in a serious accident, etc.. needing an IV therapy, I am a dead man due to what I have done to myself.

Even after all this I am pissed that I now have to snort or smoke heroin to get high as cooking it up into a rig will just result into me wasting up to a bundle at a time.

I sucks, but the pills really do fuck up your veins, even with filtering until clear.

 

[Lost and Confused]

Erowid, you're not the author of smacks past, are you?

If so...A+++ read.

I am relatively old by junkie standards, having survived 52 years, 40 of which has been addicted to opiates of every shape and form. I have injected several pharmacy loads of pills over the years and and can testify to the havoc wreaked on my veins. I have no peripheral arteries or veins left resulting in a BP reading of 220/180. I have also been told by doctors that if in a serious accident, etc.. needing an IV therapy, I am a dead man due to what I have done to myself.

Even after all this I am pissed that I now have to snort or smoke heroin to get high as cooking it up into a rig will just result into me wasting up to a bundle at a time.

I sucks, but the pills really do fuck up your veins, even with filtering until clear.

 

[ranunky]

If you shoot pills, even if you filter them and get rid of all the solids, there are still water soluble binders in this solution.

I don't see how a water soluable binder would harm you. 8) Your kidneys will excrete them just like every other water soluable chemical that enters your bloodstream.

Micron filter will make it as safe as it can be with regards to binders.

 

[Lifeonthepharm]

Obviously from those with experience, it's not worth doing it regularely.

But would it be worth it if you were quite sure the supply won't last? Is it something that can be attempted without an experienced IV'er present?

I found eating them is great, but they don't go very far.

 

[jon420]

is there really any need to do this...H is so easy to come by...

 

[the_ketaman]

The thing with injecting oxy Lifeonthepharm, is that the bio-availability isnt that much different to oral vs IV only about a 20% different unlike most other opiates where youd shoot half or even a quarter of what you'd use orally or snorted, when banging oxy you still need the same amount and it doesnt last as long so its not really that good for making the oxy last longer, in fact im sure you will go through the oxy much quicker.