• Philosophy and Spirituality
    Welcome Guest
    Posting Rules Bluelight Rules
    Threads of Note Socialize
  • P&S Moderators: JackARoe | Cheshire_Kat

Why isn't antinatalism a popular philosophy?

People in first and second world countries are not having fewer children because they lack money. We have never been as wealthy as we are now. It’s cultural. People are unwilling to sacrifice modern conveniences and luxuries. Childbirth has become horrifically medicalised, with many women terrified of childbearing, & having a family is now seen as unimportant or even low status - especially having a large family. Urbanisation is also a big problem because humans do not breed well in captivity and there aren’t even many apartments with enough rooms for proper families - especially by modern standards in which every child has his own room.

This is the pitch that the WHO is giving to us, but it's only partially true. There are people out there who were born to be parents, they love kids and want to have them; yet there are many who are not doing it because of lack of affordability. Ask the average person in Japan why they aren't having kids and they're not going to tell you "comfort and convenience." They're going to tell you it's because of slave-driving work culture and cost of living. Same in Korea, same in the expensive European cities, same in North American cities.

People need space to have families and if they can't afford space then they don't have them because they don't want to live in a shoebox yet can't afford to move to so-called rural areas. Or don't want to. Corporate capitalism has drained the life blood out of society and destroyed the nuclear family, such that people lack the social and capital resources to raise children on their own.

This is factually untrue. So much of the rapid technological progress we’ve seen since the industrial revolution has been due to the massive increase in population. The more people are born, the more high IQ genius innovators exist. And while it’s true that most people are not innovators, in high IQ societies, most people do contribute. The recent dysgenic decline combined with government welfare has resulted in so many useless eaters who are only a drain, if not actively destructive. But if we had better governance and eugenic policies, we’d probably already be colonising other planets at this point.

Eugenics was already tried, and failed. Socioeconomic determinants are way more important for success than a person's genetics.

I suppose if we got really good at genetic engineering we could breed uber humans with propensity for high intelligence, but we're a long way off from that. You would still need a research system with a lot of creative freedom to maximize that potential though.

Mostly it's corporate capitalism and the private sector stifling innovation. The 20th century saw the biggest innovations for the US, making it a world superpower, because scientific research and innovation was still public, and scientists had freedom to explore theories. Now it's all corporately captured and the grants process is about "acceptable theories" and work that will further profit. Academia and research is captured by the private sector, such that even high IQ people aren't given creative freedom with financial resources. The US gov scrapped think-tank type research funding. That's why the 1940s-70s were peak research. Almost all of our major discoveries in engineering, computing, medicine, chemistry, etc... were made during those times. We're just riding those coattails now.

Like... if Eistein were around today, he would be doing physics for corporations, not for his personal academic interests and passions. After he died they preserved his brain to examine it to see why he was so smart. And it's because they are so stupid and A-type that they don't realize this man was a combination of high intelligence and creative freedom. The system wasn't overwrought yet so they didn't put his mind in a box and force him to do mediocre research.

Eugenics won't save us if the resources to innovate are sequestered and locked up by the private sector. As long as the fiduciary responsibility of innovation remains about profit, we're going to keep going nowhere fast, and stay stagnant as a civilization. The woke shit in educational institutions now isn't helping things either.

I mean... if you take honest stock of what has changed since 1950 in terms of your daily life, it's really just computers. If you remove computers from the room, the rooms are essentially identical to how they were 80 years ago. We have stagnated. We need new physics badly but there's too much institutional capture.
 
Last edited:

. I've wondered if voluntary extinction is a solution to the fermi paradox.

Bc of this paradox, extinction on earth wouldn’t be sufficient to solve the problem. What is needed is obliteration of the universe; or a return to the singularity “pre” big bang.

As we know the singularity itself is “unstable” - otherwise the universe wouldn’t be here.

I believe we are indeed fucked. This horror show will continue for eternity. It is so tragic it breaks my heart. Even death is not a respite collectively speaking.
 
Last edited:
Separate post for a separate point.

For those of us that do see antinatalism and more specifically efilism as the ultimate “truth” or answer….how do we break out of that?

We must break out of that because these beliefs systems; even if the best representation of reality - are not advantageous or healthy for the individual that must keep living. The individual that must keep living is best off tricking themselves be it with religion, love, self gratification etc etc.

How do we trick ourselves out of this frame of mind?
 
Separate post for a separate point.

For those of us that do see antinatalism and more specifically efilism as the ultimate “truth” or answer….how do we break out of that?

We must break out of that because these beliefs systems; even if the best representation of reality - are not advantageous or healthy for the individual that must keep living. The individual that must keep living is best off tricking themselves be it with religion, love, self gratification etc etc.

How do we trick ourselves out of this frame of mind?
I’m desperate for this fucking answer people and I’m banned from Reddit where most of the antinatalism discussion happens.

But on Reddit they just bitch about ppl having kids they don’t address how to cope with seeing the world this way
 
Top