When Snorting Heroin is No Longer Practical

[SonOF]

I mean whatever man. But if I was able to say for certain of myself that I couldn't handle the 'next level', then I would seriously reconsider using that drug on any level at all.

I can't say for certain if I could or couldn't handle IV because I have never done it, ya dig? But at the same time, I don't feel like I need to take that next step for "research purposes" or anything.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

After reading your definition of a binge chipper, that isn't what I want to become. I don't like the idea of using every day. I don't think that would work for me and my moa. I don't think I could handle the peaks and valleys of such use. If you can, more power to you.

Yea man I mean I think I've only heard of two other people doing similarly and they were both just people who posted on Bluelight. It's not common at all, especially to binge for so long, and to keep such a pattern up for years and years as I have. I just want dope real bad sometimes, and then it goes away. It's like my desire is cyclical, and it doesn't appear to be really triggered by anything like stress or depression in my life.

Of course I understood you, but when you toss those strange specific hypotheticals instead of asking for a general princicple seems kinda goofy

I can't say for certain if I could or couldn't handle IV because I have never done it, ya dig? But at the same time, I don't feel like I need to take that next step for "research purposes" or anything.

Yea I dig, I mean if you don't know then whatever. I'm just saying if you somehow KNEW that you couldn't handle IV, which apparently is quite a few people, then I wouldn't snort/smoke it either. It's like why play with fire like that you know, just too risky in my opinion. Ignorance may be excusable but a risky situation I don't think is really that smart to be around.

If you don't want to IV because you don't have a desire to, that's fine man I'm down with that. I'm just ragging on people who's sole reason for not IVing is because they say they know they'll get addicted that way. If you just don't want to IV because you like to snort your dope, then cool man do your thing.

Doing drugs is about having fun man, not about what's most economic or safest. If you like to take your heroin by slowly absorbing it through a wet band-aid that's fine with me man.

It's just the sort of logic I'm attacking, not how you actually do it. If you like snorting man go for it. You enjoi it, absolutely no reason for you to move up to IVing if you don't share that curiousity you know.

 

[sixpartseven]

With your logic, people shouldn't "go near" powder cocaine unless they "can handle" crack. 8)

Correct. I don't see what you find so outrageous about this comment or logic.

TR, I respect you and everything, but Id really like to see if you could say that with a straight face.

How can you say that and not realize how ridiculous it sound? A lot of people find crack very intense, while at the same time can handle themselves perfectly on coke, so youre going to tell me because they cant handle the crack, they cant handle the coke either, despite the fact that they can, and should stay away from it? That makes no sense. Some people never make it to crack from coke, so how are they supposed to even know if they could handle it or not? With your logic, youd have to smoke crack first to know if you can handle it, and most people dont start that way, and Im sure most dont try it just to see if they could handle it.

I dont get what you have against SonOF's questions with the A B and C options. Its a perfectly acceptable question. Its not hypotheticals, its ideas of how he wants his usage to be, and hes asking which ones we think he would benefit from. How is that "fairytales and hypotheticals?"

 

[rashandreflex]

TR, I respect you and everything, but Id really like to see if you could say that with a straight face.

How can you say that and not realize how ridiculous it sound? A lot of people find crack very intense, while at the same time can handle themselves perfectly on coke, so youre going to tell me because they cant handle the crack, they cant handle the coke either, despite the fact that they can, and should stay away from it? That makes no sense. Some people never make it to crack from coke, so how are they supposed to even know if they could handle it or not? With your logic, youd have to smoke crack first to know if you can handle it, and most people dont start that way, and Im sure most dont try it just to see if they could handle it.

I dont get what you have against SonOF's questions with the A B and C options. Its a perfectly acceptable question. Its not hypotheticals, its ideas of how he wants his usage to be, and hes asking which ones we think he would benefit from. How is that "fairytales and hypotheticals?"

yeah, sorry TR, but your argument makes no sense. the MOA affects the addictiveness of the substance. the quicker/more efficiently the substance reaches the brain, the more dopamine released, the more nucleus accumbens (reward center) stimulated, the more deeply cortical-thalamic-striatal loops are grooved (pathways that encourage one to 'seek' the drug based on its past 'rewardingness,') the more likely addiction is.

if someone's trying to avoid going down the road of dependency, more mild MOA makes sense - (sorry to throw out more of your hated hypotheticals) if 5% of regular oral heroin users develop addiction, 20% of pluggers, 30% of snorters, 40% of smokers, and 50% of intravaneous users, restraining oneself to the mildest MOA that still provides worthwhile euphoria is completely logical. what if based on one's personal environment and genetics, one is in the 70% of snorters who wouldn't develop a serious addiction but were in the 50% of IV users who would.....that is, one could handle snorting heroin but not handle injecting it....or apply the same to cocaine....one could handle snorting coke but not handle smoking crack.....seems perfectly reasonable to stick with the weaker MOA. one's inability to handle the more potent MOA shouldn't stop one from enjoying the substance via alternate MOA.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Some people never make it to crack from coke, so how are they supposed to even know if they could handle it or not? With your logic, youd have to smoke crack first to know if you can handle it, and most people dont start that way, and Im sure most dont try it just to see if they could handle it.

I'm just talking about those people who are sure they could not handle IV drugs, and the sole reason they avoid IV is because they say they would go out of control with it.

I mean, if you avoid IV because you're content with snorting, that's fine. But if you avoid injecting solely because you know you will go out of control, and then go snorting away, it just seems silly to me, you know? I mean, the move form snorting to IV isn't that far, and if you regard IV as so self-destructive, why would you play with snorting?

Just seems like you're playing with fire and begging to be burned.

the MOA affects the addictiveness of the substance.

Yea I know, I know. I just don't think you should be using drugs if you are irresponsible, and if you truthfully acknowledge that you aren't responsible enough to IV, it just seems weird to play with snorting.

I would think you have to be extremely confident in your ability to responsible to use drugs.

 

[garuda]

Well I can say IV is somewhere I won't go with street dope, If I had pharm grade stuff in an ampule and a clean rig yea I might give it a go. I've seen people destroy their veins with street cuts and crap.

You can't deny IV is a whole other level with whole other risks not present in other methods of administration. And not all those risks come from unsanitary syringe sharing, there is always a risk when injecting powders of unknown origin.

I think anyone should think long and hard before making their first forays into IV use, its not the same thing as oral or snorting or rectal admin period.

 

[GlassAss420]

If you know your dealer and don't score on the street it could be VERY consistent and if you really know them well they might tell you what they cut it with. I've had some dope cook up clear as water.. well almost clear, no particles left floating after it was cooked.

Also I was going to say doing all your H in one day instead of over the course of a few days, you'd prolly fell less withdrawl. I notice I feel shittier if I drag it out over a couple days rather than doing it all on the day I score it.

 

[phr]

If you know your dealer and don't score on the street it could be VERY consistent and if you really know them well they might tell you what they cut it with. I've had some dope cook up clear as water.. well almost clear, no particles left floating after it was cooked.

You say it like it's an uncommon thing. 99% of my dope cooked up clear with no particulates etc.

 

[xxanxxtwo]

You say it like it's an uncommon thing. 99% of my dope cooked up clear with no particulates etc.

Same here.

 

[garuda]

Ah you all are east coast, not everyone is so lucky.
Rest of us are stuck with tar or this fucking cheese shit, you guys have no clue how good you have it.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Well I can say IV is somewhere I won't go with street dope, If I had pharm grade stuff in an ampule and a clean rig yea I might give it a go. I've seen people destroy their veins with street cuts and crap.

You can't deny IV is a whole other level with whole other risks not present in other methods of administration. And not all those risks come from unsanitary syringe sharing, there is always a risk when injecting powders of unknown origin.

No, I understand IV is a whole other level. If people avoid IV because they think it's too much of a hassle, too dangerous, too risky, or worried about the purity of their drugs, that's fine. My only criticism is people who solely say they avoid IV because they say they aren't responsible enough for it.

Ah you all are east coast, not everyone is so lucky.
Rest of us are stuck with tar or this fucking cheese shit, you guys have no clue how good you have it.

No way dude, east coast dope sucks compared to tar. Trust me, every junky I've heard of who's tried both say they prefer tar much more than the east coast dope.

Your shit is pennys on the dollar compared to what we have to get, plus it lasts much, much longer. The high is more relaxing and the nod is much stronger. The only bad thing about tar is perhaps more side effects but when you're that high you don't give a shit.

I'm so envious of the west coast ;/

 

[Khadijah]

Yea, Im super envious of the people who only smoke shwag too. Man, i hate that blueberry and kush. I wish i could just smoke giant blunts of mexican ditch weed alllll day long baby.


8)

Our dope here aint expensive at all. Its cheap and potent as hell. So i dont really know how it could get much better or why you would be sayin this kind of shit. if you wanna go do some dirty ass tar treat yourself. From what i understand the average potency in cali was about 12% last time i read a report on it. that was a year or 2 ago. but whatever its your preference, but actin like its fact is silly. Oh well do what you want, Thats more high quality, inexpensive east coast heroin for us. =P

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Some people prefer schwag because of how much cheaper it is ;o

No, our dope isn't that expensive. But compared to tar, it's crazy cheap. I mean you hear the prices they get? Like less then 60 bucks for a gram, that's crazy.

I know the purity is way lower in tar, but that's just heroin purity. Tar is full of non-heroin opiate goodness like monacetlymorphine and morphine. I'd imagine that the total amount of opiates in tar and their relative strengths is somewhat closer to the levels found in east coast dope.

Obviously, these high lvls of non-reacted opiates and such make the high substantially different. But I like it, the extra morphine makes it last much longer and complements the actual heroin quite well in my opinion.

Have you ever had tar heroin lacey k? I know negrogesic was one of the more popular Bluelighters on this website who was an avid fan of tar over east coast dope, and if anyone knew about heroin, he would be one of them.

Not saying it qualifies his/this opinion, but just pointing out that it's not unheard of or as silly as you think.

 

[phr]

No way dude, east coast dope sucks compared to tar. Trust me, every junky I've heard of who's tried both say they prefer tar much more than the east coast dope.

Your shit is pennys on the dollar compared to what we have to get, plus it lasts much, much longer. The high is more relaxing and the nod is much stronger. The only bad thing about tar is perhaps more side effects but when you're that high you don't give a shit.

I'm so envious of the west coast ;/

That's not what I've heard when I talked to people that have tried both.

But I like it, the extra morphine makes it last much longer and complements the actual heroin quite well in my opinion.

That doesn't make any sense. Heroin is a prodrug, so it is essentially morphine that gets you high.

Have you ever had tar heroin lacey k? I know negrogesic was one of the more popular Bluelighters on this website who was an avid fan of tar over east coast dope, and if anyone knew about heroin, he would be one of them.

He said he preferred the mellow "longer" high.


From what I've read, tar may or may not last longer and it's rush is typically weaker. Regardless, the many drawbacks of tar negate any supposed benefit.

I'm sorry, but east coast powder pwns tar.

 

['medicine cabinet']

yea i like tar and all because it does feel more natural and relaxing and has a deeper nod, but the shit is nasty lookin and i dont like having to heat my dope. EC powder is nice and clean and goes into solution usually instantly. its a faster high in terms of duration, but id rather the cleanness over a heavier nod.

 

[Khadijah]

Some people prefer schwag because of how much cheaper it is ;o

No, our dope isn't that expensive. But compared to tar, it's crazy cheap. I mean you hear the prices they get? Like less then 60 bucks for a gram, .

What does this mean? it makes no sense dude. You are saying that east coast dope aint that expensive. And that compared to tar, its extremely inexpensive. And then you say that tar is mad cheap, and the cheapness of tar is unbelievable? Wtf man? Did you post this when you were high or some shit?

A bundle is pretty much a gram, and you can get a bundle for $60 out here that is a cheap price for it but its possible, but a bun for 80 is the same shit, and like 5 times as potent, so i would say they are definately the ones gettin the short end of the stick. Your post is kinda nonsense dude. Youre pretty much saying that its better to pay a inexpensive price for something shitty, than it is to pay pretty much almost the same amount, for something thats way better. I wish they had that lil smiley with the question marks over his head so i could use it right here.

 

[phr]

^
Yeah, that quote made no sense lacey.

A gram of powder typically goes for $80-100. A gram of tar is anywhere from $60-80, the latter being much more common.

Tar drawbacks:
-Tar can contain nasty bacteria(which can readily grow due to its consistency) (I'm talking about tar specific bacteria; wound botulism, flesh eating bacteria etc.)
-It could contain organic material
-On average it's weaker than powder
-It's tough to register with(due to lack of solution transparency)
-Requires heat
-Requires more water
-Can't be readily snorted
-Weaker rush than powder on average
-Ruins veins faster than powder

Tar pros:
-Can be smoked without further preparation
-Cheaper(but you essentially get what you pay for, poorer quality vs powder)
-May contain more alkaloids(some of which can be dangerous to shoot;codeine, thebaine)
-Longer duration(Some report longer duration. How much longer though?)

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

That doesn't make any sense. Heroin is a prodrug, so it is essentially morphine that gets you high.

Right but there's definitely a difference between injecting heroin and morphine. I think it has something to do do with breaking down the heroin once past the BBB.

Regardless, the many drawbacks of tar negate any supposed benefit.

Yea there are alot of drawback to tar, I used to hate tar but I later learned to appreciate it. You puke alot more, you itch alot more (which I hate, some like though), you get more pins and needles on the rush, you tend to breakout more, and tar is usually itself not pure so a missed shot burns more, it's alot grosser and nastier smelling so you puke upon injection more.

But the high lasts alot longer and the high is alot more sedating. Which I prefer. Probably why I don't like Oxycontin at all but love heroin.

What does this mean? it makes no sense dude. You are saying that east coast dope aint that expensive. And that compared to tar, its extremely inexpensive. And then you say that tar is mad cheap, and the cheapness of tar is unbelievable? Wtf man? Did you post this when you were high or some shit?

Small typo. Meant that tar is extremely cheap compared to east coast dope.

A bundle is pretty much a gram, and you can get a bundle for $60 out here that is a cheap price for it but its possible, but a bun for 80 is the same shit, and like 5 times as potent, so i would say they are definately the ones gettin the short end of the stick. Your post is kinda nonsense dude. Youre pretty much saying that its better to pay a inexpensive price for something shitty, than it is to pay pretty much almost the same amount, for something thats way better. I wish they had that lil smiley with the question marks over his head so i could use it right here.

I know that east coast is alot more pure and stronger, but the high doesn't last nearly as long as tar does, probably due to the morphine and acetylmorphine content in tar. As for price, I find it far more expensive than just 80 for a gram around here. I mean, you can get an 80 for shitty quality dope, but high quality is 120-200...

And no, I'm not getting bad deals. Quite a few bluelighters know the same dealers I did or do know (out of coincidence, I've never met them which is kinda funny that we go to the same people) and can vouch I'm not getting shitty dope.

Phrozen:

For tars pros... The duration is many times longer. It's literally an all-day high. You can remain at or near peak levels for about 6-8 hours. For east coast I've noticed peak/nearpeak levels last for about an hour to 2 hours max.

Another thing to add for tar is that the high is qualitatively different - it's much more sedating and gives you a stronger nod. This may or may not be something you prefer, but personally, I prefer it. Some people like their dope a little more stimulating and able to be able to actually move on it. Others prefer to be knocked the fuck out and completely relaxed to the point you can't move.

 

[phr]

Right but there's definitely a difference between injecting heroin and morphine. I think it has something to do do with breaking down the heroin once past the BBB.

You were saying that tar's duration is increased due to the fact that it contains morphine. That's wrong.

As for the duration, I'd like to see a study on exactly what's behind it, and I'd like to see the duration difference quantified.

 

[TheodoreRoosevelt]

Oh. Well, I don't know what causes the duration to be soooo much longer but it's definitely alot longer.

I mean, it's not like "me" or just the tar I got. It lasts a fuckload longer. Like it's really obvious. Like 6+ hours of peak/nearpeak, whereas the high on east coast starts to taper after 1 hour.

I'd be interested too, I assumed it was the morphine. Could be something else.