Stimulants What works better Dexedrine IR or Vyvanse?

[glab]

I keep hearing that vyvanse works better and feels better. What do you guys think about this?

If vyvanse really feels better then do you still need an equivalent dose of dexedrine? I don't know how
lisdexamphetamine converts into dexamphetamine. Let's say your take 40mg dexedrine per day then how
much vyvanse would you need to get the same effect?

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

It comes down to dosage. Vyvanse is good because it has less abuse potential and lasts for a fairly long time. It would be converted to a lot of Vyvanse. Some doctors cap the Vyvanse dose at 70mg because it lasts so long. I may be off by a bit, but I believe 70mg Vyvanse is approximately equal to 30mg dextroamphetamine. The less medication you can get by on, the better. You might not like it now, but in the end it's better to take only as much medication as effectively deals with your symptoms.

As for which works better, that depends on the individual. If you're not tolerant to stimulants I think IR amphetamine is a bad idea, especially if you have an abusive personality.

It's a good thing that doctors rarely prescribe IR Dexedrine. It really has no place.

I found Adderall XR to be the best for my symptoms, which are now un-medicated (but that's a different story). When it came down to Adderall vs Vyvanse I found the former, even in XR version, to help my symptoms to a superior extent.

Were you actually given this choice for a legitimate medical reason, or are you just trying to get high? If the latter, just know that it ends in severe pain.

 

[glab]

Hi, no I have adhd and ritalin doesn't work for me. But the problem is I'm not in the US and we only have IR d-amph or IR dl-amph available.
And then there's also vyvanse but this is only allowed for children so my insurance wouldn't pay for it. This means I am basically stuck with IR d-amph.
I didn't know that IR is so bad. I always thought that IR works as well as XR the only difference is you have to dose twice. Like for example ritalin IR vs Ritalin LA.
I was told it's the same thing you only have to take the IR twice while the LA lasts twice as long.
I also wish I could try adderall but we don't have it.
The only thing we have is dl-amphetamine syrup which is mixed by a compound pharmacy and I'm a bit worried about this. What if they make a mistake during the
mixing process and then it's too strong or too weak? Or what if they decide to use the amphetamine for themselves and then say that my product is okay when I complain
that it's not working? I don't like the thought that somebody mixes something for me.

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

Hey,

I think that if you can keep to taking the medication as prescribed, you'll be fine.

dl-amphetamine is adderall, but with 75% dextroamphetamine and 25% levoamphetamine. Is the medication available to you in a different ratio?

Pharmaceutical companies are very careful. I don't think you have to worry about them screwing up their process.

We all have to trust others, whether we like it or not. That's the beauty of civilization, man.

 

[glab]

I don't know what's the ratio between D and L in the DL syrup. But this stuff is made by a pharmacist at a local pharmacy!
If this person makes a mistake then you end up with a too strong or too weak product! This is nothing like buying a product which comes from a factory
where everything is controlled. I also heard stories from people who complained that their syrup feels different depending on where they buy it!

Then I rather stick to the d-amph pills which are made my a huge pharmaceutical company. The only thing that sucks is that they are IR.
And I also don't even feel them. I usually put 5mg under the tongue and let it dissolve and I feel absolutely nothing! I don't know if this is normal.
Should I not feel a buzz or a surge or something like that?

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

No, ideally there is no buzz. It's only supposed to be enough to let you concentrate normally.

 

[glab]

But shouldn't it also make me feel better and more confident?

And how shall I tell if it works when I'm not doing anything where I have to focus and when I only watch TV?
I don't want to have to do any concentration stuff only in order to see if it works.

 

[jammin83]

Dex works better than adderall and vyvanse. It is superior to both IMO so I don't know why you would say it has no place esp. since adderall is 75% dex. Because it can be abused? Who cares? Most abusable medications work better for the patient, which is what really matters. Vyvanse doesn't work worth a shit and you can take naps on it. After you are on it for a month, it's hardly noticeable and does little to nothing for my symptoms. I don't mess with amps anymore but I would take the dex.

 

[glab]

Do you have adhd, jammin?

Today I took 10mg dex and also didn't really "feel" anything. I really don't know how to tell if it works.
I mean I don't sit down and then do concentration exercises to see if I perform better than before.
What I am hoping for is a clear difference. If the difference is so small that I cannot really notice it then it's not worth it.
I'd also not mind feeling more confident. I read that people take adderall and then they feel confident and optimistic.
I also want that. But maybe adderall is better than dex cause it also boost NE while dex only boosts DA. Maybe a bit of NE
wouldn't be bad.

 

[jammin83]

I do. After many years of stims though, I am glad to not be on them anymore. They help for a while, then they stop working, like most drugs. That's a pretty low dose. Usually you need at least double that to feel anything. Adderall works pretty well too but there is quite a bit of variation in the generic formulations, some people like the levo, some complain that they give them an increase in side effects. After a while, most people on stims just give up. It's really not very sustainable, esp. if you are getting high.

 

[Hodor]

Hey,

I think that if you can keep to taking the medication as prescribed, you'll be fine.

dl-amphetamine is adderall, but with 75% dextroamphetamine and 25% levoamphetamine. Is the medication available to you in a different ratio?

D,L Amphetamine normally refers to the racemate, i.e. a 50:50 ratio of D to L, usually as the sulfate salt.

Adderall is a mix of 4 different salts of amphetamine, two of which are racemic and two being enantiopure D-amphetamine, so you end up with 75% dex and 25% levo.

 

[Ksa]

^ you're not answering his question...if you don't know, don't talk.

Yes you can alter the rotary ratio by compounding adderall IR with dextroamphetamine IR, in the ranges of 75% dextro and 100% dextro. For example, if you mix up 5mg of dexedrine with 5mg of adderall, you get a 10mg IR mixture that has 87.5% dextro-rotary properties. By changing the masses mixed, you can obtain any percentage from 75% to 100%.

 

[Hodor]

^ you're not answering his question...if you don't know, don't talk.

Yes you can alter the rotary ratio by compounding adderall IR with dextroamphetamine IR, in the ranges of 75% dextro and 100% dextro. For example, if you mix up 5mg of dexedrine with 5mg of adderall, you get a 10mg IR mixture that has 87.5% dextro-rotary properties. By changing the masses mixed, you can obtain any percentage from 75% to 100%.

The original poster can't get Adderall, that's the point. Just a quick primer on the treatment options for ADD for us across the Atlantic: In a lot of European countries, they never introduced Adderall, so you're basically stuck with some version of Methylphenidate, and while they recently did approve Vyvanse in some places, insurances often won't cover it (heck, my insurance won't even cover my Ritalin LA). So if you absolutely require amphetamines, what you're stuck with is either D,L Amp syrup from a compounding pharmacy or D-Amphetamine pills.

That's why I was pointing out that the D:L ratio in racemic D,L Amphetamine sulphate syrup (50:50) is different from the ratio in Adderall (75:25).

But yes, if he can get a script for both the racemic syrup and the enantiopure pills, there might be some benefit to experimenting with different D:L ratios.
Or maybe you can take Dex for the dopamine, and a bit of Strattera for the NA (or, if your insurance does not cover Strattera for adult ADD, maybe they'll cover Edronax - also a NARI - for depression).

 

[glab]

Yes, we don't have adderall here. This really sucks.
Even the dexamphetamine is only allowed for children with adhd. If you want to get it the doc has to prescribe it off lable.

Do adhd stims always stop working after a while? This is scary. I mean what sense does it make to even get off them if they stop working?

 

[punkftl]

Hi, no I have adhd and ritalin doesn't work for me. But the problem is I'm not in the US and we only have IR d-amph or IR dl-amph available.
And then there's also vyvanse but this is only allowed for children so my insurance wouldn't pay for it. This means I am basically stuck with IR d-amph.
I didn't know that IR is so bad. I always thought that IR works as well as XR the only difference is you have to dose twice. Like for example ritalin IR vs Ritalin LA.
I was told it's the same thing you only have to take the IR twice while the LA lasts twice as long.
I also wish I could try adderall but we don't have it.
The only thing we have is dl-amphetamine syrup which is mixed by a compound pharmacy and I'm a bit worried about this. What if they make a mistake during the
mixing process and then it's too strong or too weak? Or what if they decide to use the amphetamine for themselves and then say that my product is okay when I complain
that it's not working? I don't like the thought that somebody mixes something for me.

D-Amphetamine or Dextroamphetamine is much better than d,l-amphetamine, or Adderall. Adderall makes my heart race and makes me feel like I am on ephedrine. Stay with the dextroamphetamine

 

[BritishLad]

Vyvanse for me, there the same drug but Vyvanse is a prodrug. Dextroamptheramine IR makes me get very edgy and triggers a psychotic reaction, it didn't for the first 4 days I was on it then it took a turn. Problem it Vyvanse only lasts 4 hours now on 30mg doses, but I've been given to 30s so I have 8 hours coverage. I'm in the UK so doctors never go above 70mgs a day because they don't get extra money, maybe if I see seeing a private doctor he would but other than that stuck at two 30s. I found one day break gave me back more strengh and had the nice buzz that you get on it for a bit.
Breaks are always good on ADD/ADHD meds though if you can, I struggle as it covers my depression/anxiety.

 

[glab]

I know that L-Amphetamine rather causes side effects but I often read that people says that Adderall is more energizing than Dexedrine and that they feel it much more.
I really wouldn't mind of the Dexedrine was a bit more energizing and made me want to be more active.

Vyvanse lasts only 4 hours!? I thought it lasts 10-12 hours.

 

[sean107]

Vyvanse at 60mg+ lasts 8-11 hours for me, 50mg or less lasts about 5-7 hours.

 

[glab]

I read that you can undo the effects of amphetamines when you take a high dose of ascorbic acid. Some people do this when they want to sleep but still have amphetamines in their system.

What would happen if you try this with vyvanse? Since it's time-released does this mean that it wouldn't work?

 

[Speed King]

I don't think its that much of an effect but the vitamin C has an effect on amphetamine in your system. The vitamin C seems to smooth the comedown for me a bit. IMO, Vyvanse is better than IR d- amph. Like people before me have said, way smooth and way less abuse potential than IR. I have taken doses as high as 140mg of Vyvanse which is great, but would suck if you let your tolerance run amuck. I take 70mg Vyvanse daily and its just right. Even 90mg is great, but 70mg works.