• MDMA &
    Empathogenic
    Drugs

    Welcome Guest!
  • MDMA Moderators:

What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

Status
Not open for further replies.
@indigoaura - Hmmm Interesting, how much evaporated out exactly? I wouldn’t put it past chemists to try and lock a lot of water into the crystal matrix. This probably wouldn’t be easy to detect as an “impurity” either.

@AutoTripper - I provided a wider range simply cuz we don’t know, like I was saying press filler can vary wildly. In the end it’s just a guesstimate. Pills are more standardized now then they were then.

-GC
 
@G_Chem He put 54 mg on the hot plate and was left with only 34 mg. So, only 63% remained a solid after the evaporation was complete. He suspects it was re-crystallized with water or something else.
 
Ahh I didn’t realize this. It is possible this is the reason you required more. The fact he was working with such a small amount id factor in a few mg lost to mechanical processes. Even then we’d be less than 70%. There’s also a few other factors, like how accurate the scale was, how hot he got the hot plate (could of vaporized a small portion). But no matter what there was definitely a fair amount of some volatile substance in there.

This could just be a batch of really pure product that also had water added in. Trapping water into the fused crystalline MDMA HCl may be one way they add weight that can then not be easily detected once lab tested.

In three months you should eat some “dried” product and see how that goes.

-GC
 
@G_Chem He said he used a very low heat setting, so I would assume it was not vaporized, but yet, some may have been lost during the overall process. It would make sense though, because the last time I did it I started with around 135 mg, but that would have only been 94.5 mg if it was 70% MDMA. The 155 I started with this time would have had me closer to an ideal starting dose at 108.5 mg.

Do you think it would be worthwhile to wash and purify this product with acetone then try to re-crystalize?
 
indigoaura said:
11:13 pm. I am definitely rolling and feeling good. The 155 mg got me over the hump where I usually would feel like I needed more to reach this state.
Click to expand...
Definitely got me MORE where i wanted to be, but still not quite. Im going 175 next time. haha

This water theory is holding more "weight" for me now with the new notes. Can water truly be put into the crystals to make its weight higher without adding impurities? Is this true or far-fetched?
indigoaura said:
Totally forgot to use this chart in my post. I will add it to that post as well. Looking at it like this...it does not seem so great. I am about to make a new thread to discuss hormones/drugs in more detail. It is relevant to this conversation, but also sort of its own conversation. Basically, depending on where I am in my cycle I am going to have fluctuating serotonin/dopamine levels. I personally find that doing MDMA around day 5-10 is ideal. Yesterday's roll was day 19. Not where I would place a roll for maximum impact. There is also a complex birth control issue...

Anyway...if you want to read, I will post all that in another thread.

ROLLDATE 06-22-19

Euphoria: 5
Empathy: 5
Energy: 2
Eye Wiggles: 1
Pupil Dilation: 6
Jaw Clenching: 1
Body High: 5
Sexuality: 4
Click to expand...

These numbers are weak, rookie numbers. You're gonna need to pump those up. (sorry, just quoting wolf of wall st.) lmao

The eye wiggs being only a 1 is shocking to me.

Thanks for the report. Some notes about my roll. 155 while it felt much better, still in the end, i dont think was enough for me. Thats also funny, cause i blacked out a bit of the night, which tells me shit was HITTING. Strange.
 
@epic11 Yeah, I found the overall lack of eye wiggles and jaw clenching to be odd. I will also be trying a higher dose at some point in the future. I don't know enough about chemistry to know if you can add water to a crystal. However, my friend insists it can be done to make a larger crystal. It would explain a lot. I am curious if it will even show up on a lab report though.
 
I really hate to hear this -- I used to take pill-tested E with dihydrocodeine and nitrazepam as a writing aid and even got Basson Brownies, capsules of about 135 mg of pure MDMA produced from a metric tonne of E made by the South African government which disappeared into the unsupervised drug user economy as the National Party government wound down in the early 1990s, on occasion.
 
Definitely feeling queasy today. Mentally, feel fine, but have that nauseous dizzy thing going on. So weird.
 
It is definitely possible, @AutoTripper. I am trying to unravel the interplay between hormones/neurotransmitters more so I can understand it better.
 
indigoaura said:
This popped up when I followed another link posted in my hormone thread. It is interesting to this conversation, because it talks about the increase in dosage and increase in deaths occurring with more modern ecstasy. https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/exkzj4/why-are-young-british-girls-dying-from-mdma
Click to expand...
Just reading it now. Very interesting as I have been thinking subconsciously about all these frequent MDMA death headlines all over the world in recent years.

I mean, in terms of impact, its mute as hell now. Just another headline. Compared to some particularly famous and rupturing cases in the early years.

Just so common place now. It does make me think. But that isn't the point anyway. I was trying to make sense in my head of this current occurrence rate and the modern dosages. And in direct relation to what all you guys are saying here crucially.

As in- death risk is correlated to dosage, but is it also related to the modern (problematic )MDMA and dosage?

The main aspects of the article is interesting as well the fact that MDMA is generally harsher on the female body and brain. Looking back, I can see clearly how females always appeared to suffer more from MDMA use and would be far more easily deterred from continuing using it .

As well as generally much less keen and interested in it than most of the males I knew over time, which all fits with the picture I already had from general observation and memory, without having ever really thought about it.
 
@indigoaura I think here is a brief user's subjective report on one of your 2002 yellow crocodiles I thought may be of interest. 6th report up from the bottom.

I just notee the 30 mins to comeup. It seems like anything less than 45 minutes is rare nowadays. Something else which puzzles me. 30 minutes sounds about right for a single, decent pill (~100mg).

Double dropping would be more like 15 minutes and hit by a train coming up hard and fast.
And these longer comeups nowadays are reported in line with the higher dosages as well.

Edit- there is another report on the yellow alligators further up the same page.

Edit 2- 2 more yellow Gator reports from 2002 on this page:

 
Last edited:
Le Junk said:
I just want to clarify something here. If your pupils do not dilate all the way to the outer edge of your eyeball leaving only a microscopic sliver of color left, there is something wrong with your ecstasy. This is not something that is open for debate. I had read someone earlier saying their pupils didn’t dilate all the way to the outer edge but that all of positive effects were there in shitloads. I’m afraid that’s just a case of wishful thinking. We all like to think that what we’re doing is the real deal or that this time is going to be different, but the reality is that pupils dilating all the way to the outer edge is one of the non-negotiable visual markers associated with real MDMA.
Click to expand...

Pupil dilation is dose dependant and affects some people more than others. Not sure why an irrelevant side-effect matters more to you than it being an enjoyable experience? That's like gauging the quality of your MDMA on how many packs of gum you chew over the night.

indigoaura said:
When you think about it, the whole concept of "losing the magic" is a perfect cover for any unscrupulous manufacturers who want to sell shit product.
Click to expand...

"Losing the magic" is certainly a stupid term, but there is a reality to over-use, gaining tolerance and generally just growing up.

I don't enjoy alcohol like I did when I was sixteen, a lot of people say the same about weed, coke, meth, acid and every other drug.

You say that term is something that can be exploited by vendors, I've never heard that. Ever.

I have heard merchants claim that their 'type' of MDMA is better than other MDMA because bla bla bla.. similar to the unfounded claims I read here.

G_Chem said:
I wouldn’t put it past chemists to try and lock a lot of water into the crystal matrix. This probably wouldn’t be easy to detect as an “impurity” either.
Click to expand...
G_Chem said:
Trapping water into the fused crystalline MDMA HCl may be one way they add weight that can then not be easily detected once lab tested
Click to expand...

You think that chemists are purposefully trapping water in the crystals and this cannot be easily detected?

How do you figure that?
 
^^I know they can, I don’t know how easy it would be to detect though. That’s something I’d like another to come in and answer.

And to respond to your other message. I do understand people’s skepticism, I myself still ain’t quite sure.. But I’ve seen enough anecdotal evidence to make me lean towards the side that indeed there’s some issues with certain areas MDMA. A lot of the issues you bring up too have been addressed.

I’m not so much a “all MDMA is crap” person like some in this thread, I’m more of a “all MDMA varies” kinda guy. I think batches have always varied, it’s just as the years have gone on and the market has grown, we have more chemists with more synthesis routes than ever before.

If you read over the old Hive board you’ll see even back then they were beginning to see certain routes produced inferior product compared to others. (Pressure O2 SRV Ketone reaction gives a product when aminated that’s inferior.)

-GC
 
I remember a Rhodium thread, early 2000s, mentioning a 'big crystal finish' using ice cold water I believe. That may be what indigoaura's friend is talking about? I'll try to find a link.

G_Chem said:
I’m not so much a “all MDMA is crap” person like some in this thread, I’m more of a “all MDMA varies” kinda guy. I think batches have always varied, it’s just as the years have gone on and the market has grown, we have more chemists with more synthesis routes than ever before.
Click to expand...

That makes sense.

G_Chem said:
If you read over the old Hive board you’ll see even back then they were beginning to see certain routes produced inferior product compared to others. (Pressure O2 SRV Ketone reaction gives a product when aminated that’s inferior.)
Click to expand...

I know of certain shortcuts that can be taken which will get inferior results, but I think that can be attributed to lackluster clean-up.
 

@AutoTripper - I’ve never seen those pages before but they have excellent information and actually further solidify my theory on 90’s MDMA.

If you guys remember I talked about the Leuckart reaction being king in the early to mid 90’s. I’ve in past posts made the many connections there are via research articles and anecdotes.

Well one thing that I found interesting was that in the 90’s the Marquis actually went a bluish black instead of a purple to black or straight black like we see today. In fact as I mentioned this caused lots of confusion once the synthesis route changed towards the turn of the millennia, and all the MDMA started turning purple to black instead.

There were 3 pills which went bluish black and 2 of them sounded like way better than average pills, the other one sounded decent but like it was a weak dosage.

The duration of 6 hours on one sounds a lot like early 90’s MDMA.

Link any more pages similar to that one please. Or where you found those..

Edit- Lol it appears every tab on that page was the users “best pill ever!!!” So guess take it all with a grain of salt. I found another reaction turned blue on that page though which tells me it was fairly common into the early 2000’s to stumble upon Leuckart MDMA. Lab testing on tabs from Hong Kong in 2002 I believe seem to corroborate this.

-GC
 
Last edited:
G_Chem said:

@AutoTripper - I’ve never seen those pages before but they have excellent information and actually further solidify my theory on 90’s MDMA.

If you guys remember I talked about the Leuckart reaction being king in the early to mid 90’s. I’ve in past posts made the many connections there are via research articles and anecdotes.

Well one thing that I found interesting was that in the 90’s the Marquis actually went a bluish black instead of a purple to black or straight black like we see today. In fact as I mentioned this caused lots of confusion once the synthesis route changed towards the turn of the millennia, and all the MDMA started turning purple to black instead.

There were 3 pills which went bluish black and 2 of them sounded like way better than average pills, the other one sounded decent but like it was a weak dosage.

The duration of 6 hours on one sounds a lot like early 90’s MDMA.

Link any more pages similar to that one please. Or where you found those..

Edit- Lol it appears every tab on that page was the users “best pill ever!!!” So guess take it all with a grain of salt. I found another reaction turned blue on that page though which tells me it was fairly common into the early 2000’s to stumble upon Leuckart MDMA. Lab testing on tabs from Hong Kong in 2002 I believe seem to corroborate this.

-GC
Click to expand...
Hey good day mate. I'm glad you found those links interesting I have scoured for such resources on and off over the years out of interest and curiosity about the past pills I took and when.

Regarding the exclamations of the best pill ever I don't think that has to detract from the substance of the reports I mean these people are probably more likely to report these pills if they had an amazing time and the fact is there were a lot of really high quality amazing MDMA pills around throughout those years alongside the trash.

Interesting the spotlight you draw on the Marquis reaction going straight to Black now or purple black vs blue to black in the past because I definitely remember seeing that blue to black reaction.

And yes 6 hours, that is not unthinkable at all. For the size of the current dosages, the actual durations of the rolls reported seems pretty short cut to me.

So I do think the majority of these subjective pill reports have strong legitimacy.

Anyway I'm not sure if you were able to navigate your way to this page I'm about to link which is the main one from which I accessd those other pages but this is a slightly funny site and the search function is not that easy to find what you want.

I have been on this site a number of times in the past and currently I have bookmarked this main page because I lost it or couldn't find it before.

Some of the links to time periods have actual quantities especially the earlier 90s which is especially interesting lots of MDA and MDEA in there.


Have fun with all that, I know I did.
 
Last edited:
^^^Dude.. Thank you! Really not sure how I’ve never seen this before..

And you remember the bluish reaction on marquis? When did you start again? Did you notice any difference between that reagent reaction and others?

Yea as you may know the EZTest Marquis chart showed a bluish blackish reaction for MDMA, so once the synthesis routes started to change around 2000 people began to question if everything was MDEA (as they had MDEA as a purple to black.) Similar to the change near 2010 when reagent tests showed a lot more straight to black results.

6 hours isn’t weird for me or some of the batches of MDMA I take but I’ve heard many claim MDMA only lasts 2-3 hours which was never the case before. I’d say MDMA typically lasts 4-6 hours. I’ve had a few rolls last 2-3 and I wasn’t too happy about it.

-GC
 
G_Chem said:
^^^Dude.. Thank you! Really not sure how I’ve never seen this before..

And you remember the bluish reaction on marquis? When did you start again? Did you notice any difference between that reagent reaction and others?

Yea as you may know the EZTest Marquis chart showed a bluish blackish reaction for MDMA, so once the synthesis routes started to change around 2000 people began to question if everything was MDEA (as they had MDEA as a purple to black.) Similar to the change near 2010 when reagent tests showed a lot more straight to black results.

6 hours isn’t weird for me or some of the batches of MDMA I take but I’ve heard many claim MDMA only lasts 2-3 hours which was never the case before. I’d say MDMA typically lasts 4-6 hours. I’ve had a few rolls last 2-3 and I wasn’t too happy about it.

-GC
Click to expand...
My first ever "e" lol (still love that term, its the controversy I like, right from the origin) was 1996. Half actually, of a Californian Sunriser. Not the best pill at all in terms of dosage I would estimate 50 to 70mg maximum. It was right about 96 when the average MDMA quantity dipped substantially.

I would say averages wete 40-70 mg for a few years, or at least until the latter of 1997 when the first legendary Mitsubishis came onto the scene and I think average quantities bumped back up to nearer 80 mg, but those very first Mitsubishis must have been at least 200 mg of the finest old skool stuff.

They were 7 hours plus on 1 pill. A whole night, the entire rave. Pretty much everybody at the place had the same experience with just needing one pill and being totally blown away and speechless, no comedown at all, just like bringing a plane down gently onto the runway and before you know it you were landed and it is time to get off.

Now I do have to confess that I never actually tested a pill myself with a Marquis testing kit and I only ever saw one pill tested in front of me it was a very clean good quality Mercedes pill which we took with us to the 1999 summer exodus Festival.

On making our way into the large farmfield complex which was basically like a gigantic fairground festival sites with marquees all over the place, a girl approached me and asked if I wanted to swap a pill and showed me a big tasty looking Mitsubishi.

I said yes sure and gave her a Mercedes which she instantly tested in front of me and was very impressed with in seconds and was up for the swap she offered to test the Mitsubishi in front of me, it already had a little chip broken off of it but I was pretty sure I could trust her so I declined.

Anyway I did watch the reaction of my Mercedes pill which we already knew was clean uncut MDMA, and I definitely have a memory forged in my mind which I had not even thought about of distinctly seeing a blue to black reaction in a matter of seconds.

And I'm not sure how but the impression does appear to have been formed in my mind that that was fairly typical, blue to black.

So lol, 3000 plus pills, and I never actually tested a single one!
I'm not sure if that is shameful or assuring. Still, I survived!

Yes 2-3 hours I would feel rather short changed.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top