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What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

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Yes, minor alterations in chemical structure can and do cause major changes in effects, usually idiopathically. As for the original topic, there is no doubt in my mind that SOMETHING is wrong with the mdma available today. At this point, I am willing to entertain any and all remotely plausible explanations. For example, perhaps the government is broadcasting the opposite of mdma's chemical resonance energy frequency, thereby cancelling out a person's roll via physical destructive electromagnetic interference?
 
@Dresden I cannot quite tell your tone. Hopefully you don't think the whole conversation is as plausible as mind beams from the government. Since there are users who are able to experience a classic roll, that seems implausible anyhow. ;)
 
Well, I'm glad you can for one still experience a plausible classic roll BUT did you ever experience the pre 1997 rolls (both mda, mde, and mdma) like us old skool ravers did?? There just is no comparison!
 
Yes, minor alterations in chemical structure can and do cause major changes in effects, usually idiopathically. As for the original topic, there is no doubt in my mind that SOMETHING is wrong with the mdma available today. At this point, I am willing to entertain any and all remotely plausible explanations. For example, perhaps the government is broadcasting the opposite of mdma's chemical resonance energy frequency, thereby cancelling out a person's roll via physical destructive electromagnetic interference?



@Dresden I cannot quite tell your tone. Hopefully you don't think the whole conversation is as plausible as mind beams from the government. Since there are users who are able to experience a classic roll, that seems implausible anyhow. ;)

I believe hes stretching the ideas of why its not the same into some new territory/idea, thats all. Cell phone towers for instance mess with frequencies all around you. While what hes suggesting seems like a big feat, (gov directly modifying waves to prevent people from feeling that love) i think he was just presenting a different idea. Me? I think its a stretch.
 
It's IS a huge stretch, so much so that I am in love with the idea and feel sure I have single handedly divined the true nature of our mdma drought! Either that, or we live in a post nuclear Hades where mdma could never be freely shared because of the pervasive and generally wretched and cynical and unloving and unappreciative and shallow attitude of the inhabitants here who do not even realize that they are in fact dead.
 
Actually, its not such a stretch at all, in fact its a very good shout.
Except their focus and intention is not to block the MDMA experience specifically.
But it is certainly to lower our vibrations and consciousness and keep us from feeling joy and happiness as much as possible in the most repressed fearful state we can be kept in like timid sheep.

And it is very deliberate we are bombarded heavily with all sorts of technology primarily EMF related. Some people are much more sensitive to EMF's than others. It has not been recognised a fraction enough for the absolute health hazard it has been for so long and the exposure is increasing exponentially I think 5G will unquestionably have an effect on people's rolls it is basically a military weapon which will serve no purpose other than being used against humanity for the sake of control and oppression.

So it is an idea very worth exploring that the toxic soup of EMF's and technology in which we bathe these days could be preventing our consciousness from achieving certain mental and physical states of bliss.

Now I'm not saying that I think this is the matter at Heart here I think the problem surely does lie with the substance itself and the methods of production, and I think it will be quite some time before the bottom is reached here with a satisfying and complete explanation.

@indigoaura one think I am curious about is what you were experience has been over recent years with pressed pills. I am assuming that the majority or all of your dark Web MDMA is coming from America, and I wondered if you had had any pressed pills which you were confident came from Holland and whether there was any difference in the experience.
 
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In all seriousness, Dresden, I currently am not one of the people able to experience a "classic roll." For all I know, my brain is just broken. It is possible.

@AutoTripper I only had one experience with pills since my original supplier quit. It was a really bad experience, and may have been one of the triggers for my partner's health decline. It was a long time ago (maybe 2009?), so hard to remember. But, a local acquaintance had some pills that we bought. They were large pills with no symbol, multi colored brown. Odd shape. They tested okay with reagent testing. I think we ended up eating 3 or 4 of them. Afterwords, we were SICK. So sick. This was the first time I ever encountered this bullshit nausea and stomach illness days later. It was one of the worst comedowns ever. I made a thread here on BL abt it, but I cannot find it now.

Other than that, I have not encountered any pills or sought any out. I could try to order some, I suppose, but I hear so much about LTC coming from European pills, that makes me nervous.
 
I have emailed the university where researcher T. Awad may be faculty. I asked for his email address so I can email him directly. The website for the university is in Arabic, so, I cannot find his email by browsing the website.

Here is another potentially relevant article that he published:

"The methoxymethcathinones are uniquely regioisomeric with the controlled drug substance 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (3,4-MDMA) or Ecstacy. The various isomeric forms of the methoxymethcathinones have mass spectra essentially equivalent to 3,4-MDMA. They all have a molecular weight of 193 and major fragment ions in their electron ionization mass spectra at m/z 58 and 135/136. Differentiation by mass spectrometry was only possible after formation of the perfluoroacyl derivatives, pentafluoropropionylamides (PFPA), and heptafluorobutrylamides (HFBA). Gas chromatographic separation on nonpolar stationary phases successfully resolved the three methcathinones from 2,3- and 3,4-MDMA as the PFPA and HFBA derivatives."
 
Just one quick story folks. 2003, 4 day outdoor party in UK. No sleep, 4 days session. At least 30 pills, several tabs, loads of ket and some truffles.

But there was one remarkable moment. At the time I assumed it was just my imagination but it was so real to me I couldn't ignore it and it really stuck in my mind and made an impression.
I was so high and in such a free mental state and different level of perception on ecstasy LSD and ketamine which could be a wondrous combination and literally take you into different dimensions and portals while still being lucid and conscious of who you are and so much around you.

Anyway I suddenly became extremely bothered and tormented by what I was convinced was an external signal of some sort which was like a powerful suppressing irritant to my consciousness and brain.

It was genuinely as though I had suddenly tuned or tapped into this whatever it was I remember looking up at the sky being absolutely convinced that the government's or some malicious demonic entity or force was beaming some sort of technological wavelength frequency which was having an oppressive effect on my consciousness.

It was a remarkable and extremely real experience where it genuinely did seem as though I had broken through the usual filters to perceive something which was already present but normally beyond our conscious perception but affecting us the entire time.

I did not know anything about energy technology being used as a weapon Against Humanity back then which it has been for a seriously long time like since the second world war at least after all of the frequencies were studied for their effects on human biology and consciousness and these frequencies have been purposely used for all of our broadcasting and technology ever since not to mention the dark secret technologies which we have not been told about of course.

I am quite confident that I was not imagining that experience and I did indeed tune into whatever frequency it was at that time which was being used as a general population oppressent.

@indigoauara I understand your apprehension about the pressed pills. Its a shame you cant feel confident about them anymore because there may be some useful lessons to gain from trying pills from a variety of sources and locations.

Regarding LTC and pill location etc, from browsing on here and redditva lot lately, the impression I have got is that Europeans and Brits appear to be far less prone to, focussed on, or even aware of LTC.

And much more accepting of MDMA's side effects, with more reports and declarations of regular and heavy use over time without major problems.
Not making a point here. I have only dipped my nose into this subject just very recently of course. I have so much to get my head around.
 
Update on the product I just used.

My friend did a little experiment. He took some of the product, added some water to dissolve it, and then he heated it to dry up the water and re-crystalize it. He did this to 54 mg. However, after the water had evaporated, there were only 34 mg remaining. In his opinion, the product is only about 63% MDMA (assuming all of the remaining dry product is MDMA, which I think it doubtful).

This would mean that my doses were actually 85 mg, 65 mg, and 55 mg. Would this explain the experience? I am not entirely convinced it would, as I used to eat half a pill and still feel the euphoric effects. But, maybe my tolerance plus a low dose would create a substandard vibe.

I will be sending it off to Energy Control to gain more info about it.
 
If you think my idea is far fetched, then you underestimate our government's degree of sinisterity.
 
Dresden, I have actually looked into the electromagnetic radiation of 5G and other similar topics before. I find it interesting and troubling, but I don't know a lot about it. It is just hard to tell on a forum sometimes when people are being serious and when they are sort of making fun of you. Like, maybe you think all our ideas are far fetched and are just trying to make a point.
 
The reason i said dresdens thought was a stretch specifically when it comes to mdma, is that ive had amazing rolls with all this shit around us before. I absolutely believe there could be some manipulation going on, but i cant let it take over my mind, its just not healthy. I understand it though, truly i do. Dresden isnt trying to make fun of anyone. Just like we cant see certain things until a psyche is dropped (acid, 2cb, mushrooms), we also cant see all these frequencies around us. I know for a fact they dont exist in nature. While i believe theres a bit of merit to the idea, I think we are better off finding what specifically changed in the production process before moving on to that. Have we figured that out yet? Have they found a new cut? Wtf is going on? Im interested in indigo's recent test.
 
Update on the product I just used.

My friend did a little experiment. He took some of the product, added some water to dissolve it, and then he heated it to dry up the water and re-crystalize it. He did this to 54 mg. However, after the water had evaporated, there were only 34 mg remaining. In his opinion, the product is only about 63% MDMA (assuming all of the remaining dry product is MDMA, which I think it doubtful).

This would mean that my doses were actually 85 mg, 65 mg, and 55 mg. Would this explain the experience? I am not entirely convinced it would, as I used to eat half a pill and still feel the euphoric effects. But, maybe my tolerance plus a low dose would create a substandard vibe.

I will be sending it off to Energy Control to gain more info about it.


If those were you doses, and we know the initial dose is the most important with mdma, then yes it could explain your experience. 85 a starter dose would barely affect me. Likely, 85 would have me in an annoyed state of not feeling it enough. haha

@indigoaura, any chance you can take a macro shot of a small piece of this product? I would like to see what it looks like in comparison to other "meh dma" ive had. If you need help stripping a photos properties for privacy concerns im willing to help. :)

In my experience, most "Meh dma" follows the looks of this sample: https://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=7238 Its quite beautiful looking actually, but its not producing that mongy fucked up loving feeling.
 
"The methoxymethcathinones are uniquely regioisomeric with the controlled drug substance 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (3,4-MDMA) or Ecstacy. The various isomeric forms of the methoxymethcathinones have mass spectra essentially equivalent to 3,4-MDMA. They all have a molecular weight of 193 and major fragment ions in their electron ionization mass spectra at m/z 58 and 135/136. Differentiation by mass spectrometry was only possible after formation of the perfluoroacyl derivatives, pentafluoropropionylamides (PFPA), and heptafluorobutrylamides (HFBA). Gas chromatographic separation on nonpolar stationary phases successfully resolved the three methcathinones from 2,3- and 3,4-MDMA as the PFPA and HFBA derivatives."
I'm not a chemist but this looks interesting (thanks Indigoaura). There was earlier discussion about the possibility of 2,3 MDMA being synthesised (and subsequently discounted) and also about similar molecular masses of other possible substitute MDMA substances. The methoxymethcathinones include para-methoxymethcathinone which is Methedrone.

GChem - are you anywhere around and could comment on this? I've never used Methedrone but are there any folks here who could chime in about the similarities in effects. I can see from reading that Methedrone itself does not fit the effects profiles described for the MehDMA here, but could there be another methoxymethcathinone that does?
 
@epic11 - I posted a picture a few pages back. It does look like the pic that you just posted, but the crystals are bigger. I do not have a lot of faith in the test. I think it will show MDMA, but there is only one way to find out.

@Dresden - Interestingly, both of the best rolls I have had in recent memory occurred outside of my own city, now that I think about it.
 
Update on the product I just used.

My friend did a little experiment. He took some of the product, added some water to dissolve it, and then he heated it to dry up the water and re-crystalize it. He did this to 54 mg. However, after the water had evaporated, there were only 34 mg remaining. In his opinion, the product is only about 63% MDMA (assuming all of the remaining dry product is MDMA, which I think it doubtful).

This would mean that my doses were actually 85 mg, 65 mg, and 55 mg. Would this explain the experience? I am not entirely convinced it would, as I used to eat half a pill and still feel the euphoric effects. But, maybe my tolerance plus a low dose would create a substandard vibe.

I will be sending it off to Energy Control to gain more info about it.

That is not recrystalization. that is just heating something up in water and then removing the water which is totally pointless, everything that was there at the start will be there at the end.

If you take something dissolve it in water then evaporate the water then you will have exactly the same mass that you started with because otherwise where does the mass go??? In this case you lose stuff to mechanical losses (stuck to things) due to handling and poor technique so the experiment is completely useless and a waste of time.

recrystalization in its most basic form is this, dissolve in the minimum hot solvent, cool or concentrate until it starts to crystallize, cool filter of the liquid (the mother liquor) and wash solids with cold solvent. The impurities are retained dissolved in the mother liquor along with some of the product. The solid is higher purity than the starting material but there is less of it, some is loss of impurities and loss of some product in the mother, even if the starting meterial was extremely pure there would still be losses in recrystalization.

The most plausible and scientific explanation for the recent bleating about MDMA quality is due to several factors.

The modern binders in pills are terrible for reliable release (see the paper below) and dissolution. Polyvinylpyrrolidinone binders also can hold MDMA even in solution further slowing release.

Most crystalline MDMA has an inactive bulking agent it, this cut quite possibly doesn't show up on GC-MS or LC-MS analysis the only clue is the MDMA freebase content is lower than it should be, but Energy Control do not have quantitative calibration curves for MDMA.

The active ingredient is pretty much only MDMA and not cut with other active stimulants as it used to be previously

Pure racemic MDMA is quite sedating. Pure S enantiomer is more sedating but there is next to zero chance of optically active MDMA being out there.

lastly people change and nostalgia along with set and setting play a big part in the effects.


This is interesting:

Variability in content and dissolution profiles of MDMA tablets collected in the UK between 2001 and 2018 - A potential risk to users?
10.1002/dta.2605

MDMA (‘ecstasy’) tablets are widely used recreationally, and not only vary in their appearance, but also in MDMA content. Recently, the prevalence of high‐content tablets is of concern to public health authorities. To compare UK data with other countries, we have evaluated MDMA content of 412 tablets collected from the UK, 2001‐2018, and have investigated within‐batch content variability for a sub‐set of these samples. In addition, we have investigated dissolution profiles of tablets using pharmaceutical industry‐standard dissolution experiments on 247 tablets. All analyses were carried out using LC‐MS/MS. Our data supported other studies, in that recent samples (2016 – 2018) tend to have higher MDMA content compared to earlier years. In 2018, the median MDMA content exceeded 100 mg free‐base for the first time. Dramatic within‐batch content variability (up to 136 mg difference) was also demonstrated. Statistical evaluation of dissolution profiles at 15‐minutes allowed tablets to be categorised as fast‐, intermediate‐, or slow‐releasing, but no tablet characteristics correlated with dissolution classification. Hence, there would be no way of users knowing a priori whether a tablet is more likely to be fast or slow‐releasing. Further, within‐batch variation in dissolution rate was observed. Rapid assessment of MDMA content alone provides important data for harm reduction, but does not account for variability in (i) the remainder of tablets in a batch, nor (ii) MDMA dissolution profiles. Clinical manifestations of MDMA toxicity, especially for high‐content, slow‐releasing tablets, may be delayed or prolonged, and there is a significant risk of users re‐dosing if absorption is delayed.
 
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