What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

[indigoaura]

I don't think fentanyl is the issue. The testing companies are looking for fentanyl specifically. Also, many of the samples discussed in this thread were washed with acetone and re-crystallized and the issue was still there.

 

[draculic acid69]

I will help you with $100 worth of bitcoin if you decide to do it.


I'd expect only 2CB to have interactions.
If the MDMA was contaminated with a small amount of a potent opiate, then it would be virtually undetectable but an MDMA-only user would feel it, e.g. opiates shrink pupils and make people sleepy.
However an opiate user would not react to the contaminant because he'd have had built up a tolerance to it.

I bet you could take 100mg of pure Magic MDMA, add a 1mcg of a powerful opiate to it and convert it into Meh MDMA that would pass most of the lab tests.
Can the reverse be performed, e.g. taking Meh MDMA with a dose of an anti-opioid agent, such as Narcan ? I do not know.
Does a chemical exist that would inactivate opioids in-vitro, without destroying the MDMA and leaving toxic stuff behind ? I do not know.

A question for Sekio or Vector or other chem Pros:
How would you separate or selectively inactivate Fentanyl Hydrochloride + MDMA Hydrochloride ? ...without running a column.

I've found op8's definitely dampen a "roll" and make it more cruisy and less intense to me but I don't think I'd classify it as a meh experience.maybe.ive never had meh so someone else with op8 and mdma experience needs to chime in on this one.
Firstly this possibility can be ruled in or out with the use of fentanyl test strips but for the theory here goes:
Either distillation(probably ineffective)
or find something that one dissolves in but the other doesn't. I also think a recrystallization from water might be an option as the fentanyl being in such small amounts would easily stay in a solution of fully saturated mdma when the mdma starts crystallizing out. at the very least this would remove most fentanyl and concentrate it in the remaining water.

 

[draculic acid69]

Is this the right kind of polarimeter?

Lab Instrument Manual Disc Polarimeter with Sodium Lamp +/- 180° Manual Polarimeter Research Industry Type Disk Polarimeter 100mm and 200mm Polarimeter Tube Manual Polarimeter Tester - - Amazon.com

Lab Instrument Manual Disc Polarimeter with Sodium Lamp +/- 180° Manual Polarimeter Research Industry Type Disk Polarimeter 100mm and 200mm Polarimeter Tube Manual Polarimeter Tester - - Amazon.com

www.amazon.com

I would think so.

 

[draculic acid69]

I very much doubt it.

The commercial route to methylone (mdmethcathinone) was via the alpha bromoketone and reaction with methylamine, the cathinone product is racemic, therefore MDMA by reduction of commercial methylone is also going to be racemic.

The Alanine, MD Benzene, Friedel Crafts acylation route requires at least 5 steps to methylone and some more to MDMA. If the alcohol is an intermediate then add in an extra step or two there too. It is never going to be used commercially, not ever. Racemic Alanine is way cheaper than L-Alanine which makes the chiral theory even more unlikely.
L-Alanine is dextrorotatory, therefore L-Alanine = d-Alanine = (S)-(+)-Alanine
Look at the absolute configuration of the enantiomers of MDMA and Alanine, L alanine would always give eventually S-MDMA. It really doesn't matter at all what type of reduction is carried out, the configuration at the 2 position is locked. L-Alanine is (2S)-2-aminopropanoic acid which would give a (2S)-cathinone which would give a (2S)-methamphetamine.
Use R and S notation for chiral centers it is much easier to understand. rarely do modern chemists use dextro of levo or d/l or D and L if they can avoid it, because of the huge potential for confusion, use +/- for optical rotation and R and S for absolute configuration.

I know it might not be likely but it's still a possibility until ruled out. As for any cut such as glucose affecting the polarimeter test if this were done on confirmed sufficiently pure product wouldn't be an issue.im guessing that the testing facilities can tell u how pure a sample is and if pure can then go on to be tested in the polarimeter. Has anyone encountered mdma with glucose/dextrose in it?

 

[Wilson Wilson]

I've found op8's definitely dampen a "roll" and make it more cruisy and less intense to me but I don't think I'd classify it as a meh experience.maybe.ive never had meh so someone else with op8 and mdma experience needs to chime in on this one.

I've mixed opiates and MDMA many times. It's a whole experience in and of itself, and it definitely does not feel "meh" in the slightest. Even if you are not familiar with opiates you would know if your MDMA has opiates in it and it wouldn't be because it felt meh. Likewise if you were opiate tolerant you'd recognise the opiate effects even if they didn't get you blasted.

Oxy and MDMA is a popular combo in and of itself. The body high you get from it is out of this absolute fucking world. If your opiate tolerance is low enough, even codeine and MDMA will feel good. It may well dull the roll in the sense you won't get the proper deep introspective stuff going on, but it will enhance the overall feel good party vibe, music appreciation, and body high, and you will get a super intense nod with closed eye visuals as you start to come down. It's a different experience, and I'd definitely argue much less therapeutic, but it's not meh.

If you happen to be a fan of The Weeknd (who, fwiw, sounds amazing when you're rolling) his XO symbol stands for "ecstasy and oxy". And there's a reason St Hendrix raps "Percocet, Molly, Percocet"

I doubt fent would feel so euphoric, but regardless, the effects you'd get wouldn't just be MehDMA, you'd notice if you'd took fent. And there'd be a lot more fucking ODs.

Plus as @indigoaura pointed out, labs specifically test for opioids especially fent and fentalogues, so the lab tests would show if that was the problem.

 

[vecktor]

I've found op8's definitely dampen a "roll" and make it more cruisy and less intense to me but I don't think I'd classify it as a meh experience.maybe.ive never had meh so someone else with op8 and mdma experience needs to chime in on this one.
Firstly this possibility can be ruled in or out with the use of fentanyl test strips but for the theory here goes:
Either distillation(probably ineffective)
or find something that one dissolves in but the other doesn't. I also think a recrystallization from water might be an option as the fentanyl being in such small amounts would easily stay in a solution of fully saturated mdma when the mdma starts crystallizing out. at the very least this would remove most fentanyl and concentrate it in the remaining water. If I remember correctly fentanyl citrate boils fairly low at around 160'c so one could put any mdma fent crystal in a pyrex bowl and put in the oven at @ 170'c and hope they don't die of a fent od from any vapour from the oven while also hoping that mdma HCl or sulfate doesn't degrade at these temperatures.
I know when the plasticy fent patches are put in an ice pipe the fent evaps off before the plastic breaks down but I've also put white mdma powder in a pipe and it just turned to harsh black shit and couldn't be smoked so I don't know how mdma handles heat.im unaware of if it was mdma sulfate or HCL.

There is no way in hell fentanyl citrate boils at 160oC at atmospheric pressure. it melts at 149-151 it doesn't boil just 10 degrees higher!

Cooking MDMA salt at 170oC is a pretty good way to destroy it.

 

[draculic acid69]

There is no way in hell fentanyl citrate boils at 160oC at atmospheric pressure. it melts at 149-151 it doesn't boil just 10 degrees higher!

Cooking MDMA salt at 170oC is a pretty good way to destroy it.

Can't find the b.p. for fent citrate anywhere. I might have gotten the m.p. and b.p. mixed up.

 

[draculic acid69]

I

There is no way in hell fentanyl citrate boils at 160oC at atmospheric pressure. it melts at 149-151 it doesn't boil just 10 degrees higher!

Cooking MDMA salt at 170oC is a pretty good way to destroy it.

I've edited the above post about fents b.p. as I can't verify it accurately. I remember 160'c somewhere to do with fent but it may have been the m.p. not b.p.

 

[nznity]

I've mixed opiates and MDMA many times. It's a whole experience in and of itself, and it definitely does not feel "meh" in the slightest. Even if you are not familiar with opiates you would know if your MDMA has opiates in it and it wouldn't be because it felt meh. Likewise if you were opiate tolerant you'd recognise the opiate effects even if they didn't get you blasted.

Oxy and MDMA is a popular combo in and of itself. The body high you get from it is out of this absolute fucking world. If your opiate tolerance is low enough, even codeine and MDMA will feel good. It may well dull the roll in the sense you won't get the proper deep introspective stuff going on, but it will enhance the overall feel good party vibe, music appreciation, and body high, and you will get a super intense nod with closed eye visuals as you start to come down. It's a different experience, and I'd definitely argue much less therapeutic, but it's not meh.

If you happen to be a fan of The Weeknd (who, fwiw, sounds amazing when you're rolling) his XO symbol stands for "ecstasy and oxy". And there's a reason St Hendrix raps "Percocet, Molly, Percocet"

I doubt fent would feel so euphoric, but regardless, the effects you'd get wouldn't just be MehDMA, you'd notice if you'd took fent. And there'd be a lot more fucking ODs.

Plus as @indigoaura pointed out, labs specifically test for opioids especially fent and fentalogues, so the lab tests would show if that was the problem.

i always slam morphine before i roll and BANG after i comedown to sleep haha.

 

[ComicSansMS]

Let me first give you a little background. I'm 51 years old and started doing ecstasy the last year it was legal in 1985. Needless to say the legal ecstasy from the so called "Dallas Group" was nothing short of spectacular. In 1988 I made a connection with someone from the San Francisco area who was in the production field of making MDMA. I have maintained that friendship and connection ever since with only small periods of downtime. The MDMA I get from him is an extremely fine bleach white crystalline powder that is fluffy and lays just like snow. The high from this MDMA takes about 10-15 minutes to take effect and the high is always the same. An extremely smooth come up followed by excessive love and empathy. You will literally melt into the person you're with and sex is out of this world. Touch and feel is heavenly. All you want to do is touch and feel on the person youre with and tell them how beautiful they are and how much you love them etc. There are massive eye wiggles and conversation flows like new born buddas. The come down is just as smooth as the come up. It drops you off just like a feather and sleep comes like a baby. The next day is nothing short of spectacular. You wake up feeling anti-depressed and chatty. You'll want to talk on the phone, visit friends or just drive around and enjoy the day with the top down. It's all I've ever known as an MDMA experience.

Now that brings me to modern day MDMA. There was a period back in the early 2000's when my connection was down and I scored pills from a local guy. They were great and with some very small exceptions, nearly as good as my crystalline powder. But once again I've been forced to score something locally and the stuff is just plain crap. And I mean crap. I've done both the orange Tesla's and the red Supremes. Absolutely awful, but from reading the trip reports on Pillreports, you would have thought they were the best ever. They're actually anything but. I had both of these pills tested on ecstasydata and both came back as pure MDMA.

Both of them took about 30-40 minutes to kick in and when they did, there was a slight feeling of euphoria and empathy that quickly faded and from there on out it was just a fucked up buzz. There were eye wiggles, but I wasn't feeling good when they were happening. I became extremely tired and kind of gacked out. The high from these pills seemed to last forever, maybe just because they sucked so much. I felt like a crackhead on the comedown and the next day felt like a bad MDA hangover. There was no next day afterglow at all. Just a different kind of fucked up than the night before. And that lasted the entire next day. There is a HUGE giveaway that youre doing todays crappy MDMA. Your pupils will not dialate all the way to the very edge like old school ecstasy. With old school ecstasy your pupils consume literally all of the color in your eye with only a microscopic sliver of color left around the outer edge. With modern day ecstasy your pupils will only dialate to slightly beyond normal if at all. Thats a big giveaway youre doing new school MDMA junk.

Before you jump to the assumption that this Le Junk guy is just old, hes done way to much ecstasy over the course of his lifetime and this is just a matter of tolerance, please re-read my post stating that I still have access to old school MDMA that Ive had since the 1980s. So in one hand I have modern day lab tested MDMA crap and in the other hand, old school MDMA heaven. So tolerance is out the window. Moving forward...

My question is this. Is this the best there is out there today? And since both pills tested on ecstasydata as pure MDMA, what is wrong with MDMA production nowdays? Does anyone else feel what I'm talking about here? My setting is pretty much always the same so that's not it. I always hear people talk about the setting as if that's an issue. With the crystalline powder, it doesn't matter where I am, it's always great. But with these Supremes and Teslas, it's just a sub-par, little euphoria, no real love or empathy, fucked up kinda buzz. Let me put it this way, if this was all that was available to me, I'd quit taking MDMA altogether. Terrible!

\



I believe there was a thread started about this on the SR Forums in 2012
So many people used to suck this seller's dick about how great he was. It went on for hundreds of pages.

"Someone" started a thread on there identical to this and apparently received five different batches from this seller with testing kits, quantities, how it got through etc.
If there is a SR forums backup, apparently there is a lot of information inside it. A lot of posts with more knowledge than I

It spoke to a lot of these questions and answers!

 

[Negi]

\



I believe there was a thread started about this on the SR Forums in 2012
So many people used to suck this seller's dick about how great he was. It went on for hundreds of pages.

"Someone" started a thread on there identical to this and apparently received five different batches from this seller with testing kits, quantities, how it got through etc.
If there is a SR forums backup, apparently there is a lot of information inside it. A lot of posts with more knowledge than I

It spoke to a lot of these questions and answers!

There are a couple of archives:

Darknet Market Archives (2013–2015)

<p>Mirrors of ~89 Tor-Bitcoin darknet markets & forums 2011–2015, and related material.</p>

www.gwern.net

I grabbed one, if you can remember any more information to narrow down the thread let me know.

 

[Negi]

Ok, I have extracted a large number of pages/posts from the "MDMA quality, from sellers on SR. please post reviews" Thread. This had 464 pages of posts on the SR1 forums. I'm not sure all of them are in the archive, as the way the pages were archived makes navigation impossible. I've tried to remove as many duplicates as I could (there were over 100 copies of the final page). To read them you'll need to open them with a web browser, either by dragging them onto it or by selecting the browser when the open with.. dialog box appears.
Here's the link: https://files.catbox.moe/6rc9d5.zip

While lots of the thread is about shipping issues and other vendor specific problems, you can find a good number of fairly detailed reviews from just jumping in on random parts of the archive.

I've pulled some quotes

In terms of the “feel” of the roll, the empathy and euphoria were all there. I also had the most mental clarity I’ve EVER had while rolling, and never stopped dancing or got tired. It was actually validating to show some of my friends, who are staunch supporters of meth rolls, that pure MDMA doesn’t necessarily make you tired (at least not when you obliterate yourself, like I did). One interesting point, though, is that my pupils weren’t nearly as dilated as they usually are. In fact, by the time we returned to the house, they were back to normal. This is especially strange for me, as usually my pupils quite noticeably swallow my irises, and stay at least somewhat dilated the whole next day. It’s even more perplexing as my visuals were stronger than they had been in over a year. I had to practically wrestle my phone to read a text. I actually consider that a positive point (no “demon eyes”); I just wish I knew the reason behind it.

My review of supertrips green ?'s
Tried them last night with my girl and 2 other couples.
my stats: Male/185lbs/went through my rolling phase but now only do it once every two months maybe once a month. usually with presses i take at most 4 in a night.
00:00 4 of us Dropped one green ? each
00:30 Getting tingly, 3rd couple arrives....they havent rolled in 9+ months. They each drop 1
01:00 Im rollin tits....we are all watching alice in wonderland blueray amazed at the picture but unable to follow the storyline. 3rd couple getting excited to be as fucked up as we are
02:00 Everybody's rolling tits and every 20 minutes someone stops and says "dude, gooooooood fucking pill!"
02:15 pills so hard press i could snap it in half and was too lazy to get a knife so i dropped another whole one
03:00 Haven't felt like this in a long time......nice clean roll. buddys got light gloves.....im spinnin on my turntables......awesomeness. slight clenched jaw but not bad at all. mild eye wiggles...mild shakey jaw......lovin it
04:00 other couple leaves to drop their second when they get home. meanwhile the music and energy is still amazing
05:00 a nice hot shower feels amazing. Didnt eat for about 3 hours before i dropped, its not 4 am and I can feel im not peaking anymore, but still have a nice clean buzz with a slight hunger(i always eat before i fall asleep when i roll it makes me feel better in the morning) so i ate a small bowl of ziti, layed down had no problem "in bed" and passed the fuck out right after.

woke up at 11a today and feel great! felt like i took 4 pills last night but i only took 2. no after seritonin felt depletion......great way to relax on a saturday! thanks Supertrips! come back soon!

I giddily took my goods to an art festival for the weekend, excited to show and tell my friends. After much deliberation, however, and seeing, eating, and discussing the different types of molly we'd all acquired for the weekend, we're pretty sure that this was sass. I looked at all different kinds and talked with friends who have extensive experience in buying, selling, and doing molly (including through Silk Road and directly from the Netherlands) and have determined that the smell, taste, consistency, and overall experience when ingested all points to some really good sass.

That said, I still had a great time. Ate the stuff all weekend with no complaints, really, though I did have slight headaches in the mornings, near my temples. The main difference, I'd say, is that it's a more mellow high. It will help you to dance, if that's what you want to do, but it won't force you to move and it won't make it impossible to pry yourself from the dance floor. I felt that I had a lot more self-control. Definite great euphoric feelings and definite energy, but I spent a lot more time talking than dancing, and I'm in the market for something that gives me the sprint, not the jog. I'll probably be looking for something better for next time (before halloween if anyone wants to spam me with advertisements).

In reply to that one:

I feel like you just expected something that MDMA is not. MDMA generally doesnt have the effect of keeping you dancing for hours unless its cut with speed/meth. Thus being said i do not believe it was Sass. Sass is most commonly known as MDA. and based off of your explination it was not that. Also, if it was MDA the seller would know and would be putting it in that section since there are no sellers currently. It would sell like hotcaked. Next time you roll try ordering some speed from some of the vendors and mix some of that in with your mix.

There's some interesting discussion in file "index.php_topic=1006.3400"

Alot of MDMA I have ordered recently from multiple vendors, whether it be white or brown/tan has had a lot more of the "speedy" effects of classic MDMA and not as much of the "loved up" effects/feelings, why could this be?

I'll bite. Given you've tried product from multiple sources and find the effects to be similar in nature, we can largely discount the drug itself being the source of the difference in subjective experience. That leaves set and setting, and the current configuration of your synapses.
I don't know you and your chemical history, frequency of use, nor social environ, so I can't do anything but wildly speculate about the way it's affecting you, and how that differs from other experiences.
I can say this: In a prior stage of life I was involved in the production of MDMA for recreational purposes. The prevailing ethos in my circles was one of shared creation and experimentation, and financial involvement was frowned upon. Those on the periphery of the circle got to taste a great variety of compounds without any money changing hands, and without ever knowing where it came from, which I mention to give a frame of reference.
Dosed with MDMA.HCl from the very same batch, produced under optimal conditions and at a purity seldom seen where I am these days, people would ascribe different properties to the product as their state of mind and their neurochemical state changed with circumstance, and whatever else they'd been taking.
I had people telling me that this batch was smacky and mellow while the last batch was speedy and uptight, and another batch was trippy, when unbeknownst to the describer the MDMA was all from the same batch. We'd made the stuff they were taking, and were educated and equipped to say that what they'd described as multiple different batches was a product entirely identical across doses.
It appears that with a fixed quality and purity people's experience of the drug will change as their neurochemistry changes, and as their life circumstances changed.

I appreciate that this isn't really an answer, but it's the information I have. Try to remember what it was you did when the feeling was "loved up", and see if you can recreate the circumstances. My experience suggests that this will allow you to attain the same state of mind and feelings as you once did, presuming you haven't burned your receptors or neuromodulated yourself into a state that precludes such delightful states.

It seems this really is an age old discussion.

 

[Kaden_Nite]

In reply to that one:

MDMA generally doesnt have the effect of keeping you dancing for hours unless its cut with speed/meth

I would disagree with that. MDMA can certainly keep people up and going to the music for hours - just not everyone gets that effect though, or it seems to wear off a lot faster for some.

The thing I found with speed and MDMA is that it kind of dulls the effect of the MDMA, but makes it last longer. Like a flatter, but more drawn-out peak. The alert feeling kind of stops me from really being immersed in the MDMA space.. I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with that though.


The only thing I've seen evidence of in this thread is that people experience a much wider range of effects from lab-tested, reasonably pure MDMA than they believe MDMA alone is capable of producing.

Anyone who consistently has negative experiences or feels sick for days after should probably stop taking it.

 

[indigoaura]

@Negi Do you know of anywhere the old pillreports website would be backed up?

I'm not really seeing the kind of discussion @ComicSansMS referenced in the highlights you posted. Also, seems important to keep in mind that sellers posting to DW forums have specific motivations and want to continue to sell their products and make money. Of course someone selling less than stellar than MDMA would want the buyers to believe the only variation in product is with them, and not with the product itself.

@ComicSansMS Are you recalling that someone specifically had multiple batches of MDMA provided to them from one seller, with variation in those batches?

 

[AutoTripper]

I would disagree with that. MDMA can certainly keep people up and going to the music for hours - just not everyone gets that effect though, or it seems to wear off a lot faster for some.

The thing I found with speed and MDMA is that it kind of dulls the effect of the MDMA, but makes it last longer. Like a flatter, but more drawn-out peak. The alert feeling kind of stops me from really being immersed in the MDMA space.. I'm sure a lot of people would disagree with that though.


The only thing I've seen evidence of in this thread is that people experience a much wider range of effects from lab-tested, reasonably pure MDMA than they believe MDMA alone is capable of producing.

Anyone who consistently has negative experiences or feels sick for days after should probably stop taking it.

Yes, classic Original pure white Doves, early 90's, 120-130mg, tested as MDMA only, had THE reputation for getting you on and keeping you on that dance floor with boundless limitless energy.

 

[indigoaura]

I have not had time to read the whole article yet:

Synthesis and Analytical Profiles for Regioisomeric and Isobaric Amines Related to MDMA

 

[Negi]

@Negi Do you know of anywhere the old pillreports website would be backed up?

Kind of. If you load the old pillreports.com website in the internet archive you can see sections of reports, but not the full list. Here's an example: https://web.archive.org/web/20010504085547/http://www.pillreports.com/showreport.php3?area=1 You can't go back in the history, you can only see the reports that were on the front section when the site was archived at that point in time. The full site wasn't crawled so it's also hit or miss if you can get the full reports and comments for a pill that is visible.
The site design screws with the internet archive so you also have to manually create the navigation links (Ie add /showreport.php3?area=2 to the end of https://web.archive.org/web/20010712234255/http://www.pillreports.com).

Also, seems important to keep in mind that sellers posting to DW forums have specific motivations and want to continue to sell their products and make money. Of course someone selling less than stellar than MDMA would want the buyers to believe the only variation in product is with them, and not with the product itself.

That was another user replying, not a vendor account. I even did a search on their other posts and didn't see any shill stuff.

It's funny, there was even discussion about the synthesis routes in that thread:

I heard that not all batches are made using high amounts of saff oil, especially post 2009 drought. Could this not be the cause of the change in feelings?

The sassafras oil itself isn't important; It's a source of safrole, which is converted to isosafrole and then generally oxidised to MDP-2-P, which is subsequently reductively aminated to MDMA. Safrole is available from lots of essential oils, not just sassafras, it just occurs at the highest concentration in sassafras oil. But safrole isn't the only starting point for MDMA, just one of the simplest. There are many other sources of safrole, just as there are many other possible starting points that end up with MDMA.
Provided people are getting from their precursor to MDP-2-P, and cleaning up properly at each stage of the synthesis, it doesn't matter what the initial reagent is, and won't alter the resulting high.

I don't know what the typical commercial routes to MDMA are these days, so I can't really speculate on other reaction products that aren't MDMA that might be contaminating the end product and providing an altered experience. I know there's still a shitload of sassafras oil available in Asia so I'd surmise most of the MDMA is still produced through the tried and true methods it's just ahrder to order a few litres of safrole over the internet than it used to be.

I also found a 69 page "MDMA Avengers" thread where people were reagent testing and acetone washing MDMA from different vendors, so I'll clean that up and post it as well.

 

[psy997]

It seems this really is an age old discussion.

The discussions you linked are not the same as what we're having here. We're not talking smacky and mellow vs speedy and uptight. We're talking empathy vs no empathy, desire to talk or hear someone talk vs not wanting to socialize in any way, wanting to move or at least touch oneself vs lie completely still under a blanket, etc. It's a much different conversation than texture of effects, it's completely different and atypical effects.

The only thing I've seen evidence of in this thread is that people experience a much wider range of effects from lab-tested, reasonably pure MDMA than they believe MDMA alone is capable of producing.

Anyone who consistently has negative experiences or feels sick for days after should probably stop taking it.

In response to your first paragraph, have you ever had MDMA that completely removes all desire to socialize, listen to music, or do anything besides lie under a blanket in total silence? If not, again, you won't understand why we're having this discussion, and why some of us care so much.

I've used psychedelics hundreds of times, I think 16-17 different compounds at this point, and despite there being a huge variance in qualitative effects between trips, I've never had a trip that doesn't give me at least a few of the usual effects: open eye visuals, closed eye visuals, increased tactile and bodily awareness, increased perceptions and awareness, inability to sleep, movement into present moment awareness, etc. In contrast, MehDMA has none of the usual MDMA effects for me.

In response to your second paragraph, those of us who consistently find MehDMA have no problem having mind-blowing experiences on good product when we find it. Again, you assume that it is an issue of the individual when we have collected IMO adequate evidence that tells a different picture. Coming to the conclusion that it is an individual phenomenon, not an issue with product, is an ok conclusion. But, if you're not willing to include the evidence we have collected here that points to Set and Setting not being the issue and provide adequate explanations for said evidence, I would argue that you're not engaging here in good faith.

 

[indigoaura]

I've used psychedelics hundreds of times, I think 16-17 different compounds at this point, and despite there being a huge variance in qualitative effects between trips, I've never had a trip that doesn't give me at least a few of the usual effects: open eye visuals, closed eye visuals, increased tactile and bodily awareness, increased perceptions and awareness, inability to sleep, movement into present moment awareness, etc. In contrast, MehDMA has none of the usual MDMA effects for me.

I agree with this. I have substantial tolerance to 2CB. Despite that, I can 100% recognize when I have taken 2CB, whether it is 15 mg, 25 mg, or 35 mg. In fact, I had stashed half of a 2CB in a jar of supplements and forgot about it. Reached in one night before bed and pulled out a capsule and took it. Went to bed. All of a sudden, about 45 minutes later, woke up and had a jolt of energy and unusual thought patterns. Immediately thought, "Weird, it feels like 2CB." I did not even know I had taken 2CB at that point, but it was identifiable immediately.

The same was true for my MDMA use before my supplier changed. Yes, I had some tolerance, but I could tell the difference between MDMA and another compound.

 

[Negi]

The discussions you linked are not the same as what we're having here. We're not talking smacky and mellow vs speedy and uptight. We're talking empathy vs no empathy, desire to talk or hear someone talk vs not wanting to socialize in any way, wanting to move or at least touch oneself vs lie completely still under a blanket, etc. It's a much different conversation than texture of effects, it's completely different and atypical effects.

I find it pretty interesting that there were no reports like that in either of the threads. The two threads covered pretty much every vendor selling MDMA on Silkroad, from US domestic, Canadian ones and big vendors out of NL. The main review thread covered from July 2011 to October 2013 when Silkroad got shutdown.

The closest reports to "mehDMA" are ones like this:

From various reports on the internet and also the sellers 'homepage', it seemed like it may be wise to start of on just half of one of these things and this is what me and a couple of mates intended on doing. However, for various reasons, two of us (myself included) failed to ingest just a half and ended up taking almost a whole one to start. My experience was of a nice floaty and pretty damn potent hit, that would come in a wave, before subsiding to be then followed by another wave and so on. These pills never compelled me to turn into Captain Socialite (which is not really in keeping with my character anyways), and whilst bobbing around on the dancefloor with my girlfriend, I was spared the usual stream of big happy ultra optimistic, but ultimately empty 'knowwhere plans' hatching in my head and in my books, being spared from all this bullshit happy head mince is a big bonus. In summation, the hit I got from these was nice, warm and floaty. Definitely not speedy, and also not a hit that I would describe particularly as being of the 'clear headed' variety.

My friend who also started on a whole pill, also has very positive things to say about these pills. My other friend however, who successfully stuck to the 'advice' and took his doses in half pill increments (until 3am when he finally took a full one), reported having his (ultra high) expectations somewhat let down. He reported that he never quite felt as though he managed to hit the same 'pleasure plateau' as the rest of us did. He suspects his problems boil down to the half doses he was taking in the first half of the night.

In summation, I am overall very pleased with these White Speakers and intend on grabbing some more in the very near future. However, I wouldn't say that they were the absolute very best pills that I ever had in terms of 'quality' (although certainly much better than most I have had in recent times) and I would also suggest that whilst they are pretty strong (if a whole one is taken), they are not so strong that taking a half pill would really be recommended, at least not for an experienced user.

My rating for the White Speakers from Chemical Brothers is 8.5/10. (Strong potency, very nice quality warm happy hit, but not hitting that AAA crystal clear MDMA Nirvana)

Qualitatively I would say that Tony's mdma is real, but it's not as "strong" as skyy's product. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying his stuff is bad (I'm about to order more from Tony in just a few days) but at .2 I did not have the extreme empathogenic feelings that I have gotten from the pink stars. I did feel AWESOME and I did have some empathogenic feelings but they just were not as strong. I haven't rolled in over two months so I know I don't have a tolerance built up. Everyone there stated the same thing so it wasn't just me. Everyone however had a great time and it is still light years better than anything else we can get locally.

I am a somewhat regular user of MDMA at maybe 5 - 6 times a year with no more than 350mg of MDMA consumed over the course of a night (I'm about 200lbs with a high metabolism). I wouldn't consider myself an expert on quality by any means and of course I am simply sharing my personal experience. This is also my standard day of food intake and pre-load when I am expecting to take MDMA that night. With that said it had been about 3 months since the last time I rolled.

8:00am - I started the day with a high protein breakfast and a of a cup of grapefruit juice.
11:30am - A small cod fillet for lunch, 200mg 5-HTP, 200mg Magnesium, and some Orange Juice.
6:00pm - Ingested 150mg of MDMA (my standard rule is 1.6mg/kg of body weight)
6:40pm - Started to feel the effects, lightened mood, notice pupils starting to dilate, and slight body high. (Typically I am at this point within 30 minutes)
7:20pm - Very light mood, tactile sensations are feeling better, and have the loved up mood but it seems very mellow. Took a 100mg bump
8:00pm - Pupils are decently dilated lights and visuals seem very attractive. Tactile sensation still feels good, feel like talking more (which is a little unusual for me). The bump definitely hit me but I am not floored still feel very relaxed. I thought about bumping an extra 50mg but at this point if it hasn't hit me I doubt it wouldn't make much difference.
10:00pm - Starting to feel more relaxed than before, still have a good body high visuals are less, tactile sensations feel normal not tired but don't feel like doing anything.
11:00pm - Most all effects have faded away very cleanly, starting to get tired and still super relaxed.

I bought this batch in late November of last year (or some time around then) and overall it was one of the cleanest rolls I have ever had but at no point did I ever feel "floored" even at the peak. I think this batch would be great if you wanted to have some fun and get a good body high but not have to worry about people really noticing. Shipment was fast and discreet and is a solid vendor if you ask me, Thanks 3Jane.

There were a few "these were crap" reports, but they were about pills so I'm chalking that up to dosage issues (since people were still putting in great reviews for the crystal MDMA from the same vendor).