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    Drug Discussion

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  • AADD Moderators: andyturbo

Welcome to the NEW new Bluelight!

I noticed a few days ago that the views came up before the replies...nd I thought it a little strange. Then on a subsequent occasion, it was the other way around...since then it has been views then replies. I'm not sure what to make of that... just thought you might wanna know Jakoz.
 
It's a touchy subject because people keep whinging about it and not reading any of the gazillion notices where we have said this is a TEST phase. Honestly nobody knows if we'll keep the avatars or what the criteria will be to have them allowed.

The more people whinge/complain/voice the more pissed off everyone will get.

read this thread
and this thread

and many of the whinging replies to other threads across the board. Honestly I feel right now they are way more truoble than they are worth and they are the very last thing on an extremely long list of things for the admins to work on to have this board up and running smoothly as quickly as possible.

The avatar issue will be delt with and no doubt there will be somewhere (most likely in Announcements and Feedback) where you can have your say. Leave it the fuck alone for now. It is not important in the ovarall issue of getting bluelight up and running without the bugs.

Despite that, there will no doubt be a procedure to deal with people who spam needlessly to achieve enough posts to have an avatar.

I'm repeating myself here ten thousand times and I don't understand why people just don't get it.

I'll quote myself yet again from the first thread i have asked you to look at.
Stop whinging about it people, I'm really sick of this. It's getting to the stage where I'm almost positive if it came to a vote most of the board staff would vote to ditch the fucking avatar's just to quit all the crap about them. Re-read the announcement. They're on TRIAL and the more people whinge the less likely they will be kept.

JB is right, let the boys have some sleep if you had any idea how much WORK went into this upgrade (and believe me I was at Jakes and saw a smidgen of what he went through and I tell you now that tiny bit was still almost 24 hours of work so imagine that then times it by every other thing they had to do [and have yet to do] and you're still not even close to the amount of work they put in.) you'd all be on your knees praying to them for being such fucking legends and giving up time so you can have a place to post.

It's a picture. A tiny little picture under your name. Where on earth is it part of the user agreement that all users on bluelight despite their amount of time around/number of posts/number of nick changes all get to have a pretty little picture.

[/vent]

Sorry guys but seriously, the info is all there read it, don't shoot yourselves in the foot by whinging about a picture when the admins have worked so hard on everything else, and are still working hard to iron out bugs and make it a great place for everyone to play in.
Click to expand...
Get over the avatar issue, and get over it quickly. If you check again the people getting annoyed at those asking for avatars are all mods and people who have WORKED on this board and understand how much work has gone in and has still yet to go into it.

I get even more annoyed at people who have not been on the board that long and whinge because regulars and peple who have been around and worked at growing this board are able to have avatars. How many people with that many posts aren't mods or haven't been a mod at some stage.

Chill the fuck out about this issue and it will be delt with eventually. The possibility of them has never been "dangled in your face" it has always been noted as a test feature.

Have a look at the scope of bluelight as a board, how many members we have, some who have been around form the start and contributed as little as 10 posts and others who have been around for a few months and are almost at their avatar status. Contribution to the board should be rewarded, moderators and admins put a LOT of work into this site. Take a step back an just think for a moment.

The more everyone whinges the less likely they will be kept. No matter how nicely you construct your post you're still having a whinge becuause that kid over there has an ice cream and you don't.
 
Avatars

Ive bitten my tonuge so far trying to ubernice and ultrahelpful, but on a friday night I need to vent, seeing as Im spending it on here anyway.

Frankly I couldnt give a flying fuck whether you like them or not. The decision was made ages ago in the announcements forum and we went from there.

Frankly I am sick to shit of hearing about the fucking things, seeing as hundreds of hours were spent on the site between only 3 people, and avatars were the least of our worries.

Frankly I will get a certain sadistic pleasure in changing the avatar, FOREVER, to a picture of either a penis or John Howard, whichever is a bigger dick at the time, of whoever postwhores to reach 1000 posts...

...and finally....

...Frankly I never want to hear about avatars until the end of my life, and if you bring them up I will remeber you.

jake.

/vent
 
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hahaha! well done jake. that certainly needed to be said %)

everyone else...they're pictures for fucks sake. other boards make it necessary to have a certian number of posts before you can have one too. deal with it.
 
Not a huge amount to say that hasn't been said before. Love the new look (except the spaces between posts) and it all works fantastically. Not being able to search on small strings is a pain but I'm sure that'll happen in time and then the enhanced capabilities will really enhance the experience. Thanks to all those who spent so much time to get it happening.
:D
 
Searching small strings:

As an interim solution until we rebuild the search index, adding a * will get you results, eg. searching for "ghb*" instead of "ghb"

:)
 
Jakoz said:
As an interim solution until we rebuild the search index, adding a * will get you results, eg. searching for "ghb*" instead of "ghb"
Click to expand...

Nice one !! Didnt know about this.

and whats GHB?


Also, is there anything I can do, to make sure the "show signature" box is ticked? A lot of the times, I find it being unticked... then I'll come try to post again and It'll be ticked...

Its very random...
 
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jake :

avatars. avatars. avatars. avatars.

when I reach 2000 posts, can I have 2 avatars!?

and how come i don't have my bluelight crew status yet ? huh ? huh ? huh ?

damn you're lazy...the whole lot of ya...
 
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i think we can "unsticky" this thread now.

any problems with the forum software, please check announcements and feedback for updates, post in there, or pm/email a mod/admin.

i hope everyone has had a smooth transition over to the new software and is enjoying it, cos i sure am.

here's to another era of bluelight! :)
 
I feel so naked, theres pages where you can see; who's online, who's reading what, who doing what....
come now, dont i frequent this board to live vicariously through others, a voyeristic pleasure, a descreet dirty addiction hidden quietly behind false names... and now, here i am, sticking out prominantly like some well endowed tom cats testicles.
:(
no its cool, tanty over, i do like it, lots :\ and lots:) and lots =D

nudity isnt half bad, its kinda... 'interesting'.
 
At first I did not like the appearance of the new NEW bluelight.... but after having a browse around and getting myself familiar with the new software I actaully like it alot more.. It reminds me of the inthemix forums.

I love all the new options that are available! It makes things more interesting. :)

top work guys!
 
Why I don't like some of the changes

Ok. I've been holding off on posting here until I gave myself a chance to get over my problems with the new style. But I haven't, so here goes.

First up, the reason why Bluelight has always been a great forum is two fold.

1. The information is good. This means that people can ask decent questions, get good responses and the general quality of discussion is very high. It is also very easy to find absorb the information available.

2. It's an attitude free zone. People feel comfortable to contribute when and where (and if) they feel like it. There is no strong hierarchy, no real or implied requirements to be a Bluelighter and no barrier to entry - everyone is on an even footing.

Ok. Before I continue, go and read this article. It's about using software (eg. a forum like this) to build a community. It's particularly focused on communities of programmers, but a lot of the ideas still apply in any web forum. I'm not going to suggest that all the things discussed in the article are the best practice because I realise the author takes a pretty hard line, but I do think he has some really good things to say - some of which I'll repeat here.

Now I'll list some of the things the new site introduces that I think will be detrimental to maintaining the community that is Bluelight. I may also list some things that are in the old site, but I still think they're should be reconsidered.


* New thread layout:
  • No. of posts. Really, why do we need to advertise the number of posts a user has made every time they post something up? Since when did the number of posts someone has make them better or worse than any other member of bluelight? We already have the classification of 'Greenlighter', which is useful to identify those who are new and might need some extra guidance or tolerance, but beyond that it should not matter (excepting moderators of course). It is trivial to argue that this can easily be perceived to violate the principle of Bluelight being an 'attitude free zone' as the only reason to advertise the number of posts is to give an impression that one persons opinion is in some way better than someone else's (which in many cases I would highly doubt is a valid assumption anyway).
  • Joined date. See previous point.
  • Avatars. Ok - got your attention now! My first question on these would be....what's the point? They conveys no additional information to the people reading the thread, they takes up screen space that could be better used with...ah...what people actually have to say, and they just detract from the real purpose of the site. Not only that, but as they're limited to only those with 1000 posts, we've immediately created a new class system within Bluelight (see previous point again). Again this is going to make a lot of people feel left out and is also going to encourage people to post inane garbage purely to increase their post count. Some of us (like me) have been around for quite a while, yet we only post when we actually have something informative to say. Does this mean we are less of a Bluelighter?
  • Graphics and stuff. Ok, the new look is very eye catching candy like. And it looks exactly like every other forum out there. And it still suxs. The nice candy graphics for each post (the button bars, etc) simply space all the posts out and reduce the quantity and quality information on the screen. Now the pages are much longer purely to make room for this cruft, the end result being that it's takes that much longer to actually read through what everyone is saying. You end up scrolling up and down trying to follow the thread, which is just inconvenient and annoying. Not to mention the fact that all the glossy candy colors make it that much harder to focus on the important stuff - what people have to say.
  • Fonts, colors, etc. Again - what exactly is the point? Font's and colors in posts do nothing to help improve the readability or quality of what people post on the site. In many cases I'd say it helps to reduce the quality, giving people the ability to try and dominate by increasing font sizes or setting crazy colors. I really can't think of anything useful that these options give. The ability to use bold or italic and to insert a smiley is more than sufficient to convey a general feeling or attitude in the text, and none of these overly expand the post of detract from the rest of the content.
  • Quote button. The quote button copies someone's entire post into your reply to the thread. But seeing as their post is in the same thread I fail to see the point in it at all, and I think that users would be rather annoyed at having to keep reading the same thing over again. Generally speaking, quoting someone else's post is a rather lame way at avoiding writing some proper text to explain what your trying to reply to. I admit there may be some situations where it is useful to quote a piece of text, but thats why there is a 'quote' button in the post editing page that allows arbitrary text input.
* New forum thread listings:
  • Ability to jump to the last page. This is something that might sound really useful at first (like many of the new 'features'). But what does this result in? It gives people an avenue to jump straight to the last page and bypass all the previous discussion. Which means people aren't going to know what's been said, and are going to end up posting the same thing or taking the thread off topic. It would be better to force people to at least open each page (in the hope they read it) at least once. Of course, it would be nice to be able to jump back to the last page you viewed in any thread when you return to the site. On the same topic, I would suggest that there shouldn't be a 'reply' button at the top of each page in a thread. People should have to read to the bottom before making a reply.
  • Thread view count. This sounds neat, but if you think about it what does it achieve? Because one thread was viewed more than another, does that make it better? If I put a thread up with the word 'sex' it's likely to get lots of views - but that doesn't make it a good thread. About the only time I can think of that it would be nice is for the person who starts a thread - to be able to tell if they got people's attention or not. But we're not really interested in attention seekers are we?
  • Last post. Again - what exactly is the point? Just because I made the last post in the thread, does anyone really care? And does it matter when the last post was made? Admittadly this doesn't do any harm - it's just kind of useless.
* General 'features':
  • Status (online/offline), private messages, buddys, etc. I'm grouping this entire set of functionality into one point, because it's all essentially the same. First I'd like to quote from the forum guidelines/rules. "This is not a chat site". I'm curious as to how exactly these features can be used in any way that doesn't violate that rule. They not only encourage private conversations between users, but also create the ability to form little social clique's out of the public view. Private messages also limit the moderators ability to control what goes on via the site (eg. how do you police drug dealing via private message?), and buddy lists once again detract from the 'attitude free zone' principle. I'm also not sure that having a list of 'buddies' on a site like this is such a great idea. And a final point - how does any of this add to the quality of the site? Not only does it encourage people to take their interesting comments out of the public view, it adds a whole new layer of complexity for the moderators to take care of (with no benefit to the general community). Lets face it, a web site is not an instant messaging tool. For those who think any of these features are good, I suggest you go download ICQ - you'll be blown away.
  • Email notification & subscribed threads. Again, this is one of those things that sounds really useful. But if you think about it, the people who are using such a feature are visiting bluelight, posting up a thread, and then only returning when there is a reply. They aren't revisiting and reading the other threads, and hence they aren't replying to any of the other threads. This isn't a very good way to build or maintain a community.
  • Post deletion. Not only does someone removing their post disrupt the flow of the thread, it can also cause entire threads to disappear. And giving someone the option to just back out means that people will feel more comfortable posting things they know they can delete later. By disabling this ability, people will be forced to consider a little more whether they really have anything useful to say. The same could be said for post editing, except that it does give people the ability to fix up spelling or bad grammar (and thus reduce embarrassment). But people should be encouraged not to edit away anything that makes the thread hard to follow, and it should be very clear that an edit has taken place.

In conclusion, I think it's great that Bluelight obviously has a great community around it. I just think that more care needs to be taken to make that community stay cohesive and I think the features (or non features) of the forum can make a big difference in that regard. Some of the suggestions I've made may be helpful, and there may be other approaches I haven't thought of. But I really do feel that more care has to be taken.

[ I also think that the attitudes (and ruthlessness) of mods can make a big difference too, but that discussion is for another time in another thread. ]
 
here are my personal opinions regarding the above post.

no. of posts, joined date, avatars: those are valid points u make and yet, bluelight is not the first nor only forum to have said displays. most of us who find our way to bluelight would have in the past, or future perhaps, stumble across any other online forums/communities with the same features. if every other net citizen deals with it, i dont see why users of this forum cant. it is quite ridiculous that users of this forum have to be babysat, pampered and cajoled over such prosaic features which other discussion board users do not even raise an eyebrow over.

you will find social hierarchies everywhere, regardless of having avatars, post counts or joined dates. bluelight is kicking up too much of a drama over an issue that exists all around us, be it in real life or cyberspace. if those three features are disabled, i would very much hazard to say a different form of social distinction will spring up. if we deal with social hierarchies everywhere else, i fail to see why bluelight should be any different. we cant please everyone... be it greenlighters, bluelighters, mods, admins, avatar holders, non-avatar holders, old skoolers, mid skoolers, new skoolers, post whores, non-post whores, suspended or banned users.

at some stage, certain things will have an arbitrary status.


graphics and stuff/font, colours, etc: besides the more obvious problem in slowing down the speed which a forum page loads up, i fail to see the rest of the points made.

"The nice candy graphics for each post (the button bars, etc) simply space all the posts out and reduce the quantity and quality information on the screen. "

i do agree the spacing of posts are creating longer forum pages to read and i believe that is an issue the admins are planning on tackling. however, the quality of information is set by users and i doubt if some graphics will suddenly affect that standard, unless users become blinded by said graphics or are too distracted to post. from outward appearances, forums like Aus Drug Discussions are running fine with no deterioation in quality so i'd say this is a moot point.

i'd agree font features dont do anything to improve the quantity or quality of the discussion board. however, they do add some personality or characteristics. they help users become more than just dry faceless san serif text on a flat forum page. though i myself dont see many occassions when i would use them, why restrict the more creative, expressive users from becoming more personable through their posts?

"giving people the ability to try and dominate by increasing font sizes or setting crazy colors."

these features are liable to be abused, as with anything which we have to trust users and their discretion with. mods of drug discussion forums might have less tolerance for such antics while social or the lounge might have more. this is up to mods of their respective forums to police.


quote reply button: this is somewhat of a nitpicking point. a person who uses the "quote text" as opposed to the "quote reply" button, can just as easily copy an entire post. i like to use the "quote reply" button because in addition to inserting the quoted text, it also inserts the name of the user i am quoting, nicely laid out. for me as a reader, i find it useful when i read a quote and know who is being referenced. now in the case of my current post, obviousy the post i am referencing is too long to be quoted and i have chosen not to use the "quote reply" button.

once again, user discretion.


ability to jump to the last page/last post: "It would be better to force people to at least open each page (in the hope they read it) at least once. Of course, it would be nice to be able to jump back to the last page you viewed in any thread when you return to the site. On the same topic, I would suggest that there shouldn't be a 'reply' button at the top of each page in a thread. People should have to read to the bottom before making a reply."

i'm not sure if there is any forum software that allows or has such features, but i do agree.

"It gives people an avenue to jump straight to the last page and bypass all the previous discussion."

i would say, doing so is detrimental to the user and it is his/her loss. unfortunately it is not something we can, or should, control.

i myself find it useful to jump to the last page, or the last post, namely because im modding this forum and i would've read the threads that come through this forum. this feature makes it more efficient for me to keep track of posts.


thread views: i agree.


status, private messaging, etc: no doubt this is not a chat site, and trust me, it is a much finer line for us mods to police. bluelight might not be a chat site, however, no one can deny bluelight is a community. the "online status" feature bolsters bluelight's status as a community.

if you had checked your control panel, each user is only allowed to have two buddies on their list. in my mind, that is quite pointless. im not sure if we are actually keeping these features or if they're under trial, as with private messaging and avatars.

i would think that, as suggested in the previous post, with the increased usage of internet messaging clients, users dont need these features offered by bluelight.


email notification/subscribe thread: it is a useful and convenient feature, not just for mods but any users. ultimately, if a user so chooses to visit bluelight only when they are notified that a subscribed thread is updated, it is their loss

it is their decision to make sporadic visits to the discussion boards. this is something that is entirely without our control and it certainly should be!.

the users who come to bluelight seeking information or social banter, will continue to do so with or without this feature.


post deletion: i am undecided about this... if this feature were to be disabled (if it can be), that would mean post editting would have to be disabled as well. as much as i would like every user to have culpability, it might just end up as more trouble than its worth.

whew that was a long post 8)
 
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both of u (vurt and mort) have made valid points. i can see where both of u are coming from.

however, this is still a forum where people from everywhere come together for information as well as entertainment. therefore, the forum is set up in a way to try to cater to everyone as a whole.

In my opinion, I dun think that BL forums should not look sterile. The use of your own choice of fonts and avatars actually make this place feel more at home. Like vurt had suggested, "they do add some personality or characteristics". I find this true.

I do agree that post counts and date joined is actually pretty useless and it just makes more people become post whore :\ Personally, I had this experience myself 8(

There are points that i agree and some that i dun. i cannot really be bothered pointing it out one by one. The nature of this forum is to educate. And if we can a little bit of spice into it and make it more enjoyable, then why not? %)

:)
 
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