• N&PD Moderators: Skorpio

Viagra Protects Against MDMA "neurotoxicity"

BilZ0r

Bluelight Crew
Joined
Dec 15, 2003
Messages
6,675
Phosphodiesterase 5 inhibitors prevent 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine-induced 5-HT deficits in the rat
Elena Puerta*, Isabel Hervias*, Beatriz Goñi-Allo*, Berta Lasheras*, Joaquin Jordan† and Norberto Aguirre*,‡

*Department of Pharmacology, School of Medicine, University of Navarra, Pamplona, Spain
†Group of Neuropharmacology, Department of Medical Sciences, School of Medicine, University of Castilla-La Mancha Regional Centre for Biomedical Research, Albacete, Spain
‡Division of Neuroscience, CIMA, School of Medicine, University of Navarra, Pamplona, Spain
Address correspondence and reprint requests to Norberto Aguirre, Department of Pharmacology, School of Medicine, University of Navarra, c/ Irunlarrea 1, Pamplona 31008, Spain. E-mail: [email protected]
Copyright Journal compilation © 2009 International Society for Neurochemistry

KEYWORDS
3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine • 5-hydroxytryptamine • mitochondrial ATP-sensitive K+ channels • phosphodiesterase 5 inhibitor • protein kinase G • sildenafil • vardenafil

Phosphodiesterase 5 (PDE5) inhibitors are often used in combination with club drugs such as 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA or ecstasy). We investigated the consequences of such combination in the serotonergic system of the rat. Oral administration of sildenafil citrate (1.5 or 8 mg/kg) increased brain cGMP levels and protected in a dose-dependent manner against 5-hydroxytryptamine depletions caused by MDMA (3 × 5 mg/kg, i.p., every 2 h) in the striatum, frontal cortex and hippocampus without altering the acute hyperthermic response to MDMA. Intrastriatal administration of the protein kinase G (PKG) inhibitor, KT5823 [(9S, 10R, 12R)-2,3,9,10,11,12-Hexahydro-10-methoxy-2,9-dimethyl-1-oxo-9,12-epoxy-1H-diindolo[1,2,3-fg:3',2',1'-kl]pyrrolo[3,4-i][1,6]benzodiazocine-10-carboxylic acid, methyl ester)], suppressed sildenafil-mediated protection. By contrast, the cell permeable cGMP analogue, 8-bromoguanosine cyclic 3',5'-monophosphate, mimicked sildenafil effects further suggesting the involvement of the PKG pathway in mediating sildenafil protection. Because mitochondrial ATP-sensitive K+ channels are a target for PKG, we next administered the specific mitochondrial ATP-sensitive K+ channel blocker, 5-hydroxydecanoic acid, 30 min before sildenafil. 5-hydroxydecanoic acid completely reversed the protection afforded by sildenafil, thereby implicating the involvement of mitochondrial ATP-sensitive K+ channels. Sildenafil also increased Akt phosphorylation, and so the possible involvement of the Akt/endothelial nitric oxide synthase (eNOS)/sGC signalling pathway was analysed. Neither the phosphatidylinositol 3-kinase inhibitor, wortmannin, nor the selective eNOS inhibitor, l-N5-(1-iminoethyl)-l-ornithine dihydrochloride, reversed the protection afforded by sildenafil, suggesting that Akt/eNOS/sGC cascade does not participate in the protective mechanisms. Our data also show that the protective effect of sildenafil can be extended to vardenafil, another PDE5 inhibitor. In conclusion, sildenafil protects against MDMA-induced long-term reduction of indoles by a mechanism involving increased production of cGMP and subsequent activation of PKG and mitochondrial ATP-sensitive K+ channel opening.
 
Phosphodiesterase 5 (PDE5) inhibitors are often used in combination with club drugs such as 3,4-methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA or ecstasy).
Are they? Why?

Yo BilZ0r, could you plz provide name of the journal, volume and 1st page? Thanks a lot!

- Murphy
 
MDMA makes getting an erection difficult, the PDE5 inhibitors erectify that problem (sorry, I had to).
 
viagra (sildenafil citrate) reduces impotency by enhancing the effects of the neurotransmitter nitric oxide (NO), and maintaining higher levels of the enzyme cGMP, the two key factors in penile erection. viagra does this by selectively inhibiting the enzymes that destroy cGMP, leading to elevated cGMP levels.

rginine is a safer and cheaper way to support NO production than viagra. Like viagra, the amino acid arginine increases blood flow to the genital area, potentially increasing sex organ sensation and enhancing the pleasure of sex.
 
But it seems far less effective, arginine helps a bit but I don't see how it could enable a man with ED. It barely makes a difference for a healthy young male.
 
My bad it's in this months issue of J Neurochem.

Journal of Neurochemistry
Volume 108 Issue 3, Pages 755 - 766
DOI: 10.1111/j.1471-4159.2008.05825.x
 
But it seems far less effective, arginine helps a bit but I don't see how it could enable a man with ED. It barely makes a difference for a healthy young male.

so you suffer from ED? LOL

That's why it's usually used in conjunction with yohimbe and something else. It's really hard for most old people to get it up.
 
Before anybody gets any ideas, isn't viagra dangerous to combine with serotonergic or dopaminergic stimulants?
 
viagra (sildenafil citrate) reduces impotency by enhancing the effects of the neurotransmitter nitric oxide (NO), and maintaining higher levels of the enzyme cGMP, the two key factors in penile erection. viagra does this by selectively inhibiting the enzymes that destroy cGMP, leading to elevated cGMP levels.
Thanks for the kind explanation, but I was aware of the mechanism behind sildenafil. Then again was my question imprecise. Again: WHY should I take sildenafil on MDMA?

Hammilton answered that it is difficult to get an erection while being on MDMA. This was absolutely new to me (otherwise the answer would have been obvious). Personally, I rather have a problem not to get a boner on MDMA. Am I an exception here?

How prevalent is the combo MDMA/sildenafil?

- Murphy
 
Before anybody gets any ideas, isn't viagra dangerous to combine with serotonergic or dopaminergic stimulants?

Why do you think so? The abstract in post #1 suggested something different (at least with respect to MDMA). Do you have reasons to think so (if yes, please share them with us).?- Murphy
 
Just in case anyone is ripping on people with ED, my dick gets limp as a 5 week old carrot.

I wouldn't make fun of that shit. It happens to 80% of people of 50, so it'll probably happen to you too.

(Not that I'm over 50. SSRIs are a bitch).

And as MurphyClox wisely suggests, the paper I cite suggests that mixed viagra with MDMA is better not MDMA alone.

There are reasons to be cautious (see people hypotensive crisis causes by viagra alone), but I just highlighted this paper because I thought this combo was at least vaguely common (and one would hope that if a huge percentage more rats died on MDMA + viagra, than MDMA alone, they might report it in this study.)
 
Just in case anyone is ripping on people with ED, my dick gets limp as a 5 week old carrot.

I wouldn't make fun of that shit. It happens to 80% of people of 50, so it'll probably happen to you too.

I love statistics.. I heard it was 80% of men of 50,

otherwise we have a problem with meat packing ladies. :)
 
Sounds like good news. I think in the spirit of Bluelight those in the know should compile a list of semi-safe chemicals that increase brain cGMP levels and don't cost as much as Viagra...
 
Interesting.

It would be fantastic if Bluelight could have a huge sticky on what can be taken with MDMA to reduce neurotoxicity/harm, and that is continually updated with research like this.
 
Sildenafil also increased Akt phosphorylation, and so the possible involvement of the Akt/endothelial nitric oxide synthase (eNOS)/sGC signalling pathway was analysed. Neither the phosphatidylinositol 3-kinase inhibitor, wortmannin, nor the selective eNOS inhibitor, l-N5-(1-iminoethyl)-l-ornithine dihydrochloride, reversed the protection afforded by sildenafil, suggesting that Akt/eNOS/sGC cascade does not participate in the protective mechanisms.

This would mean then that l-arginine wouldn't likely protect from MDMA neurotoxicity?
 
viagra (sildenafil citrate) reduces impotency by enhancing the effects of the neurotransmitter nitric oxide (NO), and maintaining higher levels of the enzyme cGMP, the two key factors in penile erection. buy viagra does this by selectively inhibiting the enzymes that destroy cGMP, leading to elevated cGMP levels.

rginine is a safer and cheaper way to support NO production than viagra. Like viagra, the amino acid arginine increases blood flow to the genital area, potentially increasing sex organ sensation and enhancing the pleasure of sex.
I prefer to use herbal viagra - it's much safer
 
Last edited:
So would it be worth attempting to supplement with Viagra for the sake of harm reduction?

The only unwanted side effect of this would be feeling embarrassed from dancing around with a hardon. Unless the Viagra is taken on the comedown and just before sleep, but I wonder if delaying the dose would still effectively be neuroprotective.
 
I prefer to use herbal viagra - it's much safer

What is entrenched in this word "herbal viagra" and what studies on the safety of it has been done? And how this it relate to the specific topic in this thread, how "non-herbal" viagra might contribute to lessen MDMA neurotoxicity?
 
I've seen some analysis showing that herbal viagra actually contains synthetics, so I don't know how much this is worth.
 
Top