Harm Reduction URGENT: METH USE & Scabies Infections - Correlated?

[cj]

I think he got scabies then got reinfected. Did you clean your house as directed OP?

 

[arthunter888]

Are you sure the immune system has little to do with scabies? What would make insects different than viruses, bacteria.

Both micro-organisms AND insects invade the body in the same way/process. A very small amount gets in (you can't know exactly when this happens because you only start feeling symptoms after they replicate and become populated enough in your system to cause symptoms), then it/they replicate, then depending on how strong the person's immune system is, either the body fights it off quickly (like when you sometimes feel you are getting a cold but it goes away the next day or 2). The only difference is that insects enter through the skin, vs, saliva or respiratory system.

Why would the way the foreign body enter change the way the immune system responds?

For example, (assuming these mites have been in my living environment for a long time) is it possible that (in the past) one or a few insects have in the past tried to invade my body, but were killed off with via strong/quick immune response before I was even aware of them infecting me? But now, since my immune system is down due to both being on a meth binge AND having ZERO sleep for 2 nights in a row (I know for a fact that sleep deprivation is almost certain to weaken one's immune system), the insects are able to able to survive my lower/weaker immune-response and were able to replicate to a point that I notice the infection? The spots are small enough (when I said huge, I mean when put together in large patches they are but not individual ones) that it wouldn't be farfetched to think that I could have had these same mites get inside my skin before, but I didn't notice because a 1 or a few infection sites as that is not enough to cause noticeable symptoms.

I am genuinely asking, is this scenario possible?

Are you saying that the immune system does NOT initiate any type of fighting response against invading insects/mites?
Or just that the immune response is not strong enough to noticeably kill/get rid of insect/mites before they replicate into very high numbers?

This is probably the most fascinating (intellectually) discussion I've had on BL in a while, because I never thought about this subject before (the differences in immune-response compared to different types/species of invading organisms).

 

[Slow_Mobius]

Are you sure the immune system has little to do with scabies? What would make insects different than viruses, bacteria.

Both micro-organisms AND insects invade the body in the same way/process. A very small amount gets in (you can't know exactly when this happens because you only start feeling symptoms after they replicate and become populated enough in your system to cause symptoms), then it/they replicate, then depending on how strong the person's immune system is, either the body fights it off quickly (like when you sometimes feel you are getting a cold but it goes away the next day or 2). The only difference is that insects enter through the skin, vs, saliva or respiratory system.

Why would the way the foreign body enter change the way the immune system responds?

For example, (assuming these mites have been in my living environment for a long time) is it possible that (in the past) one or a few insects have in the past tried to invade my body, but were killed off with via strong/quick immune response before I was even aware of them infecting me? But now, since my immune system is down due to both being on a meth binge AND having ZERO sleep for 2 nights in a row (I know for a fact that sleep deprivation is almost certain to weaken one's immune system), the insects are able to able to survive my lower/weaker immune-response and were able to replicate to a point that I notice the infection? The spots are small enough (when I said huge, I mean when put together in large patches they are but not individual ones) that it wouldn't be farfetched to think that I could have had these same mites get inside my skin before, but I didn't notice because a 1 or a few infection sites as that is not enough to cause noticeable symptoms.

I am genuinely asking, is this scenario possible?

Are you saying that the immune system does NOT initiate any type of fighting response against invading insects/mites?
Or just that the immune response is not strong enough to noticeably kill/get rid of insect/mites before they replicate into very high numbers?

This is probably the most fascinating (intellectually) discussion I've had on BL in a while, because I never thought about this subject before (the differences in immune-response compared to different types/species of invading organisms).

That is not a possible scenario. The mites are very very different from pathogens like bacteria or viruses. Bacteria are single-celled organisms that live inside of you. With most of those bacteria, we have a symbiotic relationship, but with pathogenic bacteria, there is something they do(it really varies between different bacterial infections) that causes you to become ill. Your body can illicit an immune response to hit the harmful bacteria with antibodies, and via numerous different pathways and different types of antibodies, the bacterial cells are killed.

With viruses it's a little different since viruses aren't even living organisms, but your body fights them off a similar way (keep in mind I'm explaining this at a very basic level. Immunology is extremely complicated).

However, mites are multicellular organisms. They're collosal in comparison to bacteria. In fact, theyre about 10000x the size of some bacteria, and the mites are even bigger in comparison to viruses. Since antibodies only really work on things at the cellular level, theyre going to do next to nothing to fight the mites. Their burrows cause physical damage beneath your skin, so your body knows something's up. The red bumps (inflammation) are actually a result of your body trying to fight the mites--not the mites themselves. But your body's immune system is innefective against fighting organisms that are that large, so you just end up with a bunch of mites beneath your skin and red bumps that don't go away.

 

[g0to]

Sure, its possible to get reinfected by something like this. However it wouldnt just live on your body undetected and pop back up the moment youre high. I would think that if the immune system got that weakened, it wouldnt just be a single issue like scabies recurring over and over again. There would be a multitude of ailments, depending on your physiology beforehand.

I can see where the confusion lies though because in many ways meth may cause a weakened immune system, but its not permanent and its secondary to lack of nutrition, lack of water etc etc. Not just that but overall stress upon your brain function. This is where the immunosuppressive effects of drugs like alcohol, heroin, meth partially come from, the lack of rest and nutrition and increased physiological stress all boost toxic metabolic byproducts while the body is not in a optimum position to expel them/they get built back up quicker than they can be expelled.

The route of entry would affect their ability to invade the body based on the type of tissue exposed. For instance, you cant get a bacterial E.coli or salmonella infection simply by handling contaminated food, it must be ingested. Not to mention, the immune system even when heavily suppressed by things discussed is still quite powerful. We are exposed to bacteria, viruses constantly that we just brush off whereas someone afflicted by AIDS could get very very hurt by even something as innocuous as a cold.

Please take care of yourself, yes it is all fascinating but take care of your health. . First things first!

 

[g0to]

Perhaps consult the same doctor and let him know its occured again. I dont know much about scabies, i was under the impression its some type of bug that your body can fight off on its own. From what the poster above said, it sounds very gnarly! It wouldnt hurt to wash your sheets, clothes in hot water and perhaps not, erm.. do not frequent those same places you do whilst tweaking (you said youre walking around outside alot)

 

[mostly-human]

Fascinating. I had scabies once, over 10 years ago thank fuck. A million times worse than fleas, in case any one was curious. Interestingly; I was using a lot of meth at the time. Although, I didn't put a correlation directly to the meth, more the lifestyle. That said, never had them as an opiate addict. So hahaha maybe there's something to it lol - although it sounds a hell of a lot more like meth-psychosis (drawing the connection, not the actual scabies, those fuckers are real - and horrible).

 

[Slow_Mobius]

So I did some more reading to fact check myself, and one thing I said isn't quite right. The scabies mites are able to delay immune response until the reach a certain population, so it can actually take weeks to notice. I did not know this. Like I said before, your immune response is what actually causes the red itchy splotches on your skin, so before your immune system starts trying to fight off the mites, you might not even notice that youre infected.

New question: did the new splotches occur in the exact same places as before? Or did you get them in different places? It's actually possible that this is tied to your immune system in some way.

 

[arthunter888]

Fascinating. I had scabies once, over 10 years ago thank fuck. A million times worse than fleas, in case any one was curious. Interestingly; I was using a lot of meth at the time. Although, I didn't put a correlation directly to the meth, more the lifestyle. That said, never had them as an opiate addict. So hahaha maybe there's something to it lol - although it sounds a hell of a lot more like meth-psychosis (drawing the connection, not the actual scabies, those fuckers are real - and horrible).

Wow, I am the same exact way. When I was using heroin (daily) I never got sick with a cold/flu, never had any skin problems, slept great, emotionally stable, not one bit of problematic effects.

But, I don't understand how the "drawing the connection between the two' would suggest meth-psychosis thinking. It is a VERY valid hypothesis. Why? Because you just said that you experienced the same thing I did (skin infections popping up suddenly with Meth use, but NOT with opiates/heroin. This make the chance of it being just coincidence much much lower, when consider both you and I had the same experience.

[An aside: I hope you can trust that I am NOT in meth-psychosis, I am taking a moderate (not too much) amount of benzos (Klonopin or Diazepam during the day, and Temazepam for sleep), so I feel the benzos (for me) prevent the semi-delusion / paranoid state of mind that meth can cause when taken by itself. Also, I am only snorting 30mg of meth 2x per day, so it's really not a large amount compared to some users that just can't put down the glass pipe and stay up for a week (the longest I've stayed awake was 48 hours, so not really that bad).]

Anyway, my point in the post is that I am 99% convinced that Meth is doing something that allows MY skin infection to thrive. Every time I snort my 30mg line, for a few hours the red dots get brighter and more tender, the effected pores dilate and are more visually noticeable, not to mention they feel more irritated.

BUT, as time goes on and it gets to be 8 hours and my first dose has mostly worn off, these same red dots and rashes fade and become much less visible, and less irritated over time.

So, in my personal experience (because this happens consistently every day), My opinion is that this is sufficient evidence to scientifically confirm some type of correlation between Meth and skin infections FOR ME. Remember, I am speaking for only myself, I am not making this claim about EVERY Meth user). My gut is just telling me the Meth is doing SOMETHING to my skin, I just don't know medically what exactly that 'something' is (meaning- the biological mechanisms that makes this happen). If I had to guess I would say that since Meth makes a lot of users (including myself) dehydrated, perhaps the dryness of the skin makes it more vulnerable to an invader such as a mite? Just brainstorming...

Another thing: I can feel meth residue in my pores (more intensely after I sweat), it has a certain 'stickiness' feeling and I haven't experienced this with any other drug. And holy shit, THE SMELL. My god does it smell horrible. It's more noticeable and 3x stronger than regular body odor after an intense workout.

I am not aware of any scientific studies on the subject of meth's effects on the skin, but I believe it should be done because I'm confident some type of correlation would be found/proven (maybe not in all users, but in SOME of them). I'm open to the idea that since everyone responds differently to drugs, so not everyone would experience the negative effects on the skin. But I'm confident that SOME user DO experience them.

 

[arthunter888]

[ignore this] I wrote a response, then got auto-logged out, but when I logged back in it seems this blank post got posted somehow (so the initial post was lost).

Below is the response i was initially trying to post before getting logged-out...

 

[arthunter888]

So I did some more reading to fact check myself, and one thing I said isn't quite right. The scabies mites are able to delay immune response until the reach a certain population, so it can actually take weeks to notice. I did not know this. Like I said before, your immune response is what actually causes the red itchy splotches on your skin, so before your immune system starts trying to fight off the mites, you might not even notice that youre infected.

New question: did the new splotches occur in the exact same places as before? Or did you get them in different places? It's actually possible that this is tied to your immune system in some way.

YES. In the 2nd (current) infection, they occurred in the same exact places as the 1st infection, and exactly the same rash patterns also. My shoulders are covered in red dots (inflamed pores), my upper chest covered in a mostly-mild red rash that is not as bothersome as the other areas, and the worst part: my groin area (upper thigh area surrounding genitals) has a bunch of raised red bumps under the skin that are all position in a straight line, including testicles with a general red rash, both being VERY itchy, much worse than the shoulders and chest. the rash in my groin area actually looks identical to a scabies rash when I looked up google images of scabies. So, it is possible that I have more than one infection going on: scabies in groin area, and mites on the upper body

But again to your question: yes the same rashes (same size, same pattern, same locations on my body) with both the 1st infection, and the 2nd re-infection.

 

[G.R.S.H.]

Just curious, did you go back to the doctor?

 

[g0to]

For how extra urgent his post was, we have not seen him for quite a few days. Wishing him the best and hopefully he stays off that crap. Nothing good comes from it.

 

[arthunter888]

Srry for leaving everyone hanging. The last few weeks have been extra busy with work and personal stuff, and I didn't really have much to update anyway as the infection kind of stayed the same...

Update:

The infection seems to have hit a turning point and is now GRADUALLY healing up. For 2 weeks I have been showering with Selson Blue medicated body soap (Selenium Dioxide, recommended by the doctor), and also it has been much less hot and humid in my area and I am not seeing as many eggs pop up around the house now that it's getting colder, less rainy, less humid, etc.

I am generally less symptomatic than before and skin rashes are notably decreasing in size and itchiness. But my skin is definitely not 100% yet, I'd say maybe around 60%. I'm going to use the prescribed cream that the doctor told me to use every week in the next few nights, so I will see based on what is stuck to my bed sheets the following morning how much of these skin-burrowing tics I have left (they always fall-off and die the night I apply the prescription skin cream)...

 

[arthunter888]

[double post]

 

[Uber_Penguin]

I can't add a ton because I'm not an expert on scabies or meth use in general (meth is kind of a blind spot in my drug knowledge), but I simply can't see how scabies would be attracted to meth. It sounds a lot more like a myth that would be perpetuated by people in unhygienic conditions making not so well thought out sexual choices who mistake correlation with causation.

I do have to contest the claim that one's immune system has nothing to do with scabies infection though, because there's a very heavy link between HIV/AIDS and scabies infection. With that being the case it wouldn't be outlandish to assume that the same would apply to drug-induced immunodeficiency, particularly since I don't know about others, but in my case I tend to get fairly unhealthy during those rare periods where I'm using meth. Not sleeping, not eating properly, and not staying hydrated alone, not even factoring in any number of other potential issues, all combines to make a rather dangerous combination in regards to one's well being.

As for being on meth and actually having bugs under one's skin...dear god, I'd lose it, I'd probably be seeing scabies everywhere I looked; shit, I wouldn't even have to be on meth to become slightly unhinged knowing there were tiny bugs burrowing into my body. But while I do agree a compromised immune system is probably largely responsible, remember the little bastards still have to be coming from somewhere, which means I'd still keep an eye out for who or what might be infecting you regardless of whether or not they clear up: can't be getting a hearty side helping of parasitic mites every time your body drops its guard.

 

[Shaleh]

Kwell lotion is the best thing for scabies.

When I was young, the entire 2nd grade class and kids in the community had an outbreak. Rich, poor, didn't matter...was contacted by door knobs, hugging, etc.
It started with ropey type welts on your hands and spread even to your butt cheeks. Lasted for a few weeks with the kwell treatment and cleaning items.

Scabies isn't as common now and NOT related to meth use. ( meth related psychosis)

 

[Meth novice 79]

Doctors often misdiagnose scabies, however the same creams seem to clear up other infections as well.
Unless a swab was taken you’ll likely never know it was even actually scabies.

Change dealers, this ones a grot

 

[Jungle7ake]

He would have to have hallucinated seeing the doctor if it's just meth-induced psychosis, but that could possibly explain the infection coming back. I would just get it checked again.

I believe meth increases our ability to minifest things and causes itching and paranoia. Mix those manifest scabies

 

[Ron c]

*** This is a lengthy post, but the first half just deals with my background and less-important stuff, which may or may not be relevant to the main issue. If you don't have time to read all this and want to get to the important issue I need help with, please skip down and start just past the dotted line ***

Background:

--Otherwise healthy male close to 30 years old. Have been using opiates semi-frequently for the past ten years, with the past 2 years being physically dependent (daily use on heroin, although the type I get is very pure/clean and I still always use .22 micron filter before injection).

I just recently had to take a break from heroin due to supply/source being dry for a while. I am currently using about 2mg of buprenorphine per day IV'd. (I use scale-measured amounts of powder from the Roxanne subutex pills to prepare the injections,) to maintain on, via injection of subutex pills, also .22 micron filter as the last step),

Since I was still suffering from major cravings, I thought I should move to a different drug, at least until the worst of the heroin detox period is over with. So I had a newfound curiosity to experience other drugs, and have tried high-purity cocaine a few times (also IV, it's the most intense IV rush I've gotten from ANY drug, but once that 'bell-ringing' head-rush is over it's pretty much just anxious racing thoughts for 30 minutes to an hour, not really a pleasant high for me).

Anyway, when I realized I could not afford the cocaine anymore (it was very expensive/taxed due to quality), so I came up with a brilliant thought, "Huh, I wonder what Methamphetamine is like" lol. Some research told me that not only is it much cheaper (less than half the price of high-end cocaine), but it also lasts all day and creates a far greater level of chemical euphoria in the brain, so it's generally superior in several ways. I was also aware that meth is toxic as fuck no matter what the purity, so I intended on just trying it a few times or at worst, chipping with it on the weekends. My main initial goal was just to experience it out of curiosity, as it's one of the only drugs left (that I'd be open to try) that I haven't tried in life (only other ones on my bucket list are DMT, mescaline, ketamine,. I certainly did not intend on regular use, but of course it (kind of) ended up that way (to an extent).

My first dose was 30mg of nice glass, didn't do much, so I did more, total of 100mg, and that was just the right dose for me (nasal/snorted). Of course I loved it on the first try when those tingly waves began running through my whole body, the heavenly euphoric sensation of pleasant electricity that is in many ways comparable to the upbeat euphoria of Oxycodone just different energy level. Also seems great for sex as orgasms became unbelievably intense that it felt unreal; like easily 3x the intensity vs non-meth orgasms. Oddly though no matter how high the dose, I never get the stereotypical motivation to be productive like clean my house and stuff like that as most meth heads do (my house still looks like crap despite this being the 3rd week (not in a row) of meth use since I started. It gives me energy, but unfortunately not any motivation at all to direct that energy into something specific, sometimes I just end up pacing around the house while listening to good music). Sometimes it can feel very stimulating, but other times I can describe the feeling as 'relaxing' and euphoric at the same time (I can even nod a little when combining with strong benzos), and I think the reason is because I do have a moderate case (somewhere between mild and severe) of ADD (medically confirmed), meaning amphetamines typical have some opposite effects on ADD/ADHD people compared to non-ADD/ADHD so that may explain why I react differently and don't get totally tweaked out. And the high also felt very lucid and 'clean' (if the batch of meth isn't cut/dirty) unlike cocaine which can really give me an anxiety attack no matter how pure it is.

But something this powerful obviously makes it equally very addictive, I find myself more psychologically addicted to meth than even opiates (and I consider opiate effects to be the best sensations a person can ever experience). With opiates, I could do a certain amount of pills or heroin and then leave it alone for the rest of the day, but with meth there is a higher 'compulsion' to do 'just a little bit more' even before the initial dose has worn off. Although it is mostly psychological addictive, there is definitely some level of physical dependence after repeated usage because I experienced withdrawal symptoms after stopping a 3-4 day binge, and I found the physical sensations to be SURPRISINGLY similar to opiate withdrawal, especially that depleted/run-down feeling when waking up for the day (and the intense dreams/nightmares), just a bit less intense than opiates but nonetheless unexpectedly similar (for me at least).

So to summarize, the aspects I liked about meth include powerful orgasms, euphoria and smooth/energy that lasts all day, and the very cheap price of it compared to nearly every other narcotic drug.

The negative side-effects I experienced: besides the obvious toxicity and negative health effects, severe insomnia (worse with higher dosages), constant energy that can cause tension at times when I don't want/need it, LOTS of teeth grinding and jaw clenching (now I know why meth heads loose a lot of teeth, they grind them to nothing over the years), the tendency to uncontrollably ramble on in conversations (and generally talking WAY WAY more frequently especially for me (I'm very quiet/reserved most of the time around strangers, as most introverts are of course). This one has made my co-workers suspect I am on something (not sure if they know for certain) but it's pretty obvious when just yesterday I didn't say a word, and now all the sudden, overnight, I'm a social butterfly that talks to EVERYONE I work with (lol) about random and fast-changing topics that just pop into my head at that moment, so obviously social problems can be caused by this aspect of meth. But for me, the worst side-effect so far caused by meth (the main reason for this thread):

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[SCABIES]:

For those who don't know, scabies are a type of parasitic insect (very small almost microscopic) that are extremely contagious and burrow under human skin and lay eggs, causing itchy/burning scaly skin and/or painful rashes that are red in color, vary from small to large sizes, contain many tiny raised bumps, similar to small pimples in appearance. I am NOT talking about hallucinated "meth bugs" that I *think* are crawling on my skin, I never stayed up for more than 2 days in a row so fortunately I did not get that 'common' part of the meth experience (hallucinations).

This first 2 grams of meth I bought seemed quite pure/clean (I could tell by the mild taste when vaporizing). 1st gram was about a month ago, and I did it all in one binge (5 days) then was out for a week and a half. So at that point when it was around again I bought another 1.5g, and this batch was very similar purity to the 1st, definitely high quailty. Anyway, sometime during my 2nd meth binge (2nd one lasted 7 days), I noticed that after work I had a burning, red-colored rash between my upper legs in the groin area- including near/under the testicles, and the general area of skin on each side of my groin, and also a portion of the taint (the area between testicles and anus).

This is nothing new for me, and has happened on several occasions in the past when I have had busy nights at work that are also very hot/humid nights (so only happens in summer). It's basically a moisture rash (practically the same skin irritation babies get in the same area, only that is called 'diaper' rash, but it's also due to the skin being too moist). What happens (for me) is that the heat, humidity, and increased physical activity all combine and cause me to sweat a LOT (and I generally sweat more than the average person to begin with during physical activity), meaning my entire body gets soaked in sweat to the extent that even my clothes become damp/wet from all the sweating. So, given that I am walking WAY more on a busy night, the skin that is already irritated from being very moist via the sweat on the inside of my upper thighs (groin area: near/under testicles and around taint also). As far as I know this type of thing normally only happens to people who are overweight enough that they have a lot of fat in their upper thighs or general groin area, making it more likely that the skin of the inner/upper thighs rub together frequently when walking, causing enough irritation to cause a buring rash. I am overweight- not obese- but moderately overweight so I now have huge fatty upper thighs that are the perfecdt size for rubbing together when I do a lot of walking.

NORMALLY, I just take a shower and make sure to thoroughly clean the irritated area of skin with soap, and the rash goes away in a day or 2 max.

BUT, this time was different. The rash did not go away in 2 days, it got worse with each new day (more itchy and painful/burning every day), and I could tell by the unusual size and appearance of it that this time it was more urgent. Also the rash was different this time. It was not just a simple red and burning rash, but this time it also came with small raised bumps, and also patches of raised skin (I actually thought I had worms under my skin for the first week due to the shape and length of most of these 'patches' of skin). So of course, I did some google research and *thought* what I had was the common "jock-itch" (a fungal infection that is easily treated with OTC anti-fungal cream). So I bought some Lamasil (spray can) at a pharmacy, and completely saturated that whole area till it was soaked in the liquid Lamisil. This seemed to work a *little bit* by slowing the spreading down. For the first 4 days, the rash became smaller, less red, and less itchy. But eventually it came back, and continued to get more severe again. And even worse, it eventually spread beyond the groin area. I had it on my shoulders, arms, upper chest, neck and back also. It spread so rapidly that it was nearly covering my whole body (which the exception of my legs, feet and stomach). I even had some of it on my face (cheeks, forehead, etc).

Trust me, it can be extremely mind racking (especially when strung out on meth, let alone sober) when you have thousands of tiny little insects you can't even see digging under your skin and laying eggs inside. I can literally feel some of these mites moving around under my skin, which leads to constant itching that you are not supposed to scratch, so it's almost as bad as torture, especially at night trying to sleep.

At this point, I began to worry, and saw a doctor. It wasn't what I thought (worms). He actually diagnosed these rashes as (with 99.9% certainty) a progressing Scabies infection (already summarized this infection, but just wikipedia it if you want to know more). Since these are parasitic 'mites' (so small they are usually invisible but you can see some of the bigger ones if you look hard enough or use magnifying glass), rather than worms or fungi, the Lamisil spray slowed down the speed of progression, but didn't kill all of them.

So the doctor prescribed me some topical cream specifically for treatment of Scabies, called "Permethrin". I had to apply it to my entire body before bedtime so it fully absorbs into the skin overnight. He said it should clear up with just one application within a week, but sometimes a 2nd application is needed, in which case, that is done 7 days after the 1st application. So, after my first application, I had some success. The rashes diminished and did not bother me as much, but there were certain sections that would not disappear fully despite not bothering me much. So I did the 2nd application after 7 days. That seemed to be enough, because by the end of that week, 80% of my rashes/bumps cleared up, and I frequently saw dead mites (SO MANY OF THEM) on the surface of my skin.

I was happy that it **seemed to be over with**, but what baffled me was the question of: how the hell did I get this in the first place. The doctor said the Scabies mites are usually spread between people via physical contact (most commonly during sex, but more rarely, even handshakes can do it), but I haven't had sex in over a year, haven't been to a gym, had not physical contact with anyone, and have been shaking the hands of strangers for years without any problems. After thinking about it, I realized that I got this infection at the same time I was in the middle of a meth binge, so I concluded that most the infection was most likely due to meth (I'm not sure why exactly since meth is toxic I'd expect living things to stay away from traces of it, but some google searches have suggested Scabies mite in particular is attracted to the scent of meth residue that ends up in the user's pores/sweat (not sure why, maybe they are immune to it's toxic properties)? I wasn't really sure why, but I was 100% sure that the Meth was the cause (or catalyst, whatever the case may be). During the 1st outbreak, I thought it MIGHT have just been a coincidence that the outbreak occurred during a meth binge, but:

Right around the time that my infection was reduced/cured by about 80% (I was 2 weeks clean at this point, and the infection lasted a full 3 weeks since the first outbreak), my heroin supply ran out again! So what does my dumb ass do? I just hate going on with life without any heroin/opiates at all, so I buy another 1.5 of meth to satisfy my cravings to get high (I rationalized it as just a coincidence and convinced myself the Meth was unrelated to the Scabies infection, WRONG). Only the batch of meth this time around seems lower purity as it tastes terrible when vaporizing and leaves a small amount of brown residue behind, unlike the previous 2 batches.

So, as I am writing this, I am 2 days into my 3rd meth binge, and guess what happens? The Scabies infection, which I was CERTAIN would be COMPLETELY gone in just a few more days, comes back full force (only took 2 days), and this time the irrritation/itching is even more severe, and now it has also spread to my back unlike before. The bumps on my arms/shoulders are larger and more red, so the Scabies infection seems to be more aggressive and spreading more quickly this time. But both times, the outbreak occurred when using meth, so that's why I'm certain that was the cause. But, even knowing this, I know I won't be able to stop the meth because of how addictive it is. I just don't have to discipline to just stop right now (although I have been trying to use lower doses, both due to the lower purity and also so the withdraw next time after I run out won't be as bad). So basically for now I just plan on using it continually till it's gone, so that may be another week or more given I still have about 1.2g as I write this, and I don't want to waste it either.

I have one tube of cream left, so I am going to apply that after I post this and see what happens. I'm going to let the cream do it's job again, but if that fails and the infection continues to worsen then that may give me just enough motivation to just quit and discard the remaining meth I have left.

I was just so un-aware that Meth use could/would cause a Scabies infection that I have a few questions about this bizarre situation I've never been in before:


1) Has it ever been scientifically proven that Meth can/does lead to Scabies infections? If yes, why? Weakened immune system making the user vulnerable to ALL types of infections, or is it specifically just Scabies infections correlated with meth use primarily?

2) Is it true that the Scabies mite is actually attracted to Meth and/or the scent of it? And if yes, what is the reason for this (how does meth benefit a microscopic mite? Logically I would have assume the toxic chemicals in meth would kill organisms, not attract them!), so I am very curious as to the scientific explanation if there is in fact a well-known correlation between meth use and Scabies infections. I actually didn't find any info on this via google, so that's why I'm posting here.

3) Normally I used meth only via snorting and vaporizing (cleaned out glass light-bulb and torch lighter), but there were 2 times (1 with the 1st batch, and 1 with the 2nd) out of curiousity that I IV'd the meth as I was curious what the rush was like. The first injection was only one day after I tried it for the first time, so that happened early enough that I wonder about it as the potential cause. The shot actually caused burning sensations in my vein (the one used for injection) that lasted a few hours. The 2nd shot (using the 2nd batch) oddly did not burn at all (I specifically told my source to get me a batch that won't cause pain when IV'd, and stunningly, he did, lol), maybe because it was a different batch (fewer leftover cuts and/or laboratory chemicals perhaps).

But I'm wondering: even though I used a .22 micron filter before injecting (both times), is it possible that the Scabies mites (or eggs) somehow made it into the shot and then into my bloodstream, or would I likely have gotten the infection regardless of ROA (even if I did not inject it at all), in which case the mites would have invaded just by landing on my skin correct?

4) Is it possible that Meth shards can actually contain these mites or their eggs? I've seen a few shards of meth (not many though) that had tiny tiny little black specs on them, which could possibly be the Scabies mite but I can only speculate.

5) If I use up this last tube of cream and I still have the infection a week later, would it seem suspicious if I returned to the doctor that saw me the first time? He said the majority of Scabies cases resolve in 1 or 2 weeks MAX with the use of the Permethrin cream, and for me it's now been a full month since the first outbreak so he may think that is very unusual for someone in my age with relatively good health, which would be a reasonable reaction). Just in case, I avoided going to my 'family doctor' and went to an urgent express place to ensure I saw a doctor that didn't know me, and I will do the same if it's still needed by next week. I am just a little worried that (if it is true that Meth use and Scabies are well-known to be correlated), the doctor may put the 2 together and may know that I am on meth (given how long the infection is lasting even with the application of the cream 3 separate times) and he could put a "drug seeker" alert on my medical file. I did not mention the meth use on the first visit and I don't ever plan on mentioning it or any other drug use to any doctor. Being labeled a drug-seeker on your medical file stays in your medical history for life so is just something I'm not willing to risk, and if that DID happen, that would mean I can never (or at least will have extreme difficulty) be prescribed any medication that can be abused recreationally. So if I happen to get into a bad car wreck or some other very painful injury, I will be forced to suffer hellish pain without any pain meds. I wouldn't even be surprised if doctors withheld benzo scripts from patients labeled 'drug seekers', which I currently use regularly (I currently rely on benzos frequently for chronic, sometimes severe anxiety, related to PTSD so that's another thing I don't want to lose by mentioning meth use to a doctor. Unless there is a place I could go to locally that is more anonymous and does not report drug users (I don't know of any). This is probably just the meth paranoia, but figured it can't hurt to float this overall thought.

Any insight on these questions will be great help. thx for reading this far.

I believe that meth use is a strong attractsamt for insects, I recently had an experience with lacewings and whitemoths, aka white flies that are normally harmless to humans.
While smoking meth in my place alone these exposed moths became aggressive and started biting and actually boring into and getting under inside my skin. I fought and sprayed these moths and my entire mobile home with insecticides for a couple of weeks. They would die but were very resistant. Nothing like Off would repel them. They would basically commit suicide wanting to get to my meth saturated blood. I even had these lint/floating dust mites that were activated by my smoking and would attack and bite me as well. I have 50 hours or more of googling skin boring moths, befire I found Bluelight with a couple of open minds in it .No such thing as skin burrowing moths, a few blood sucking ones but none that fully penitrate. You try to explain like I am doing now, people think you are nuts or were hallucinating. My Physicians immediately wanted me to take a drug test.. The moths when they bore into you leave behind their body covering, they skin themselves alive as they burrow in beak first and become wormlike with whats left of their eyes and their beak like mouth they usually use to suck nectar out of garden plants or lesser insects that they prey upon. You feel the bite, slap at it, all that is left is what appears to be a couple of silky feather pieces. Many Can be scraped out, I used my finger and alternating between soapy water and peroxide.You would scrape out white silky matter and scum. I am posting this because many/most believe it, write it off as an hallucination. I have pictures of the crazed moths that skinned themselves trying bore in or that I was able to extract. And of a half alive insecticide spayed moth still wanting to drink/come in contact with my meth infused blood. I should have let them bore in and caught them on film. At the time I was just trying to stop/kill them. I know they were induced and had a fatal attraction to my being saturated with Meth. These were real, hundreds bored in..taking doxycycline and ivermectin and back off the meth.

 

[Atomic_Decay]

I believe that meth use is a strong attractsamt for insects, I recently had an experience with lacewings and whitemoths, aka white flies that are normally harmless to humans.
While smoking meth in my place alone these exposed moths became aggressive and started biting and actually boring into and getting under inside my skin. I fought and sprayed these moths and my entire mobile home with insecticides for a couple of weeks. They would die but were very resistant. Nothing like Off would repel them. They would basically commit suicide wanting to get to my meth saturated blood. I even had these lint/floating dust mites that were activated by my smoking and would attack and bite me as well. I have 50 hours or more of googling skin boring moths, befire I found Bluelight with a couple of open minds in it .No such thing as skin burrowing moths, a few blood sucking ones but none that fully penitrate. You try to explain like I am doing now, people think you are nuts or were hallucinating. My Physicians immediately wanted me to take a drug test.. The moths when they bore into you leave behind their body covering, they skin themselves alive as they burrow in beak first and become wormlike with whats left of their eyes and their beak like mouth they usually use to suck nectar out of garden plants or lesser insects that they prey upon. You feel the bite, slap at it, all that is left is what appears to be a couple of silky feather pieces. Many Can be scraped out, I used my finger and alternating between soapy water and peroxide.You would scrape out white silky matter and scum. I am posting this because many/most believe it, write it off as an hallucination. I have pictures of the crazed moths that skinned themselves trying bore in or that I was able to extract. And of a half alive insecticide spayed moth still wanting to drink/come in contact with my meth infused blood. I should have let them bore in and caught them on film. At the time I was just trying to stop/kill them. I know they were induced and had a fatal attraction to my being saturated with Meth. These were real, hundreds bored in..taking doxycycline and ivermectin and back off the meth.

Hey @Ron c . Welcome to BL. That’s a really interesting phenomena / experience you describe.

How’s it going. All recovered? Not still happening?