Trying to kick mild opiate habit - what helps?

[pinkanga]

We all have our different strategies....

One more I forgot to add - if youre near the coast go for a morning swim then lay in the sun. That salt water works wonders IMO.

 

[What was it?]

^ I dunno though, I think xanax - valium is much of a muchness, and if he wants to avoid benzos it's prob not something he wants to investigate.

I know it's not the same, but I feel the comparison of xanax to valium would be kind of similar to someone suggesting I did dexies while quitting my meth addiction. At that time I needed to not feel anything even remotely similar to my addiction, as getting the hint of it seems to ignite those cravings. Once an addict brain feels something even slightly similar, in my experience at least, the addict part goes nuts, and it's far harder to ingore. I know What was it? said his addiction was to opies, but if he wants to avoid benzos, there's prob a reason for that.

Couldn't have put it in better words - this is exactly the issue. I don't mind benzos at all feeling-wise but long ago kicked them as the side effects are too big. I arguably still think opiates have less side effects and thus are for me more addictive as I push the limits further - and as a result obviously get addicted or flirt with addiction (because I can't feel the damage like with benzos, cigarettes, stims or alcohol I just sort of keep on going)

 

[What was it?]

I used to be addicted to few different opiates mainly Oxy's and Hydromorphone. Was getting out of control and decided to stop. I tried to cut back down limiting my usage or replacing it with something. At first I lowered the dosages few times then once that happened I quit taking them and started suboxone without increasing the amount just to help with WD's then decreasing it gradually. Replaced the Suboxone with Codeine (always have been using Codeine) so tapered off that too.

Had alot of other WD's especially when I stopped benzos too. Couldnt sleep or have any appetite so started to smoke weed and eventually Vaporize. Im glad I managed to kick my Opiate habit (Apart from the Codeine) but the only problem is I became a pothead pretty much. I am working on quitting Codeine and replacing it with Kava Kava. Pretty sure at one stage I will be doing the same thing for weed.

I know this feeling and endless game of drug cycling/substituting etc......I am getting tired of it....too rough and exshausting. Things of the past for me are alcohol, psychedelics, and too the largest extent benzos. it seems there really isn't much to cycle into once one gets to opiates except for benzos or weed. Benzos I wanna avoid as above and I get schizophrenic from weed.....so for me it's clean living or a highly controlled opiate regimen maybe somewhere down the track, even though I think that would be a bad idea. 8(

 

[What was it?]

Well, been off em since the above post....10 days. The physical aspect is gone since Thursday, but the fiending/cravings this Friday, Saturday and Sunday have been intense to say the least. When alone at home, I have not had a minute of peace. It's absolutely horrible and I feel quite desperate and helpless. How the heel will I get over these thoughts and cravings? I am quite lethargic and don"t have a lot of motivation to do anything. I am sure there are a zillion posts on this but I am just looking for some emotional support here at the moment. PAWS absolutely suck and I wonder if this well ever get much better ........

Been doing my 14.-23. a lot. Can't believe the amount of w*nking.....rebound testosterone is full-on.

 

[Sustanon]

Keep up the good work buddy, we are all here to support u We are sure u will be able to quit.

 

[Halif]

It will definitely get better - and soon.

I agree that PAWS sucks. The emotional emptiness is worse than the physical discomfort of the initial acute phase of WDs.

The cravings will ease up and you'll start to feel better soon. 10 days off is a fine effort

 

[Mr Blonde]

Well, been off em since the above post....10 days. The physical aspect is gone since Thursday, but the fiending/cravings this Friday, Saturday and Sunday have been intense to say the least. When alone at home, I have not had a minute of peace. It's absolutely horrible and I feel quite desperate and helpless. How the heel will I get over these thoughts and cravings? I am quite lethargic and don"t have a lot of motivation to do anything. I am sure there are a zillion posts on this but I am just looking for some emotional support here at the moment. PAWS absolutely suck and I wonder if this well ever get much better ........

Been doing my 14.-23. a lot. Can't believe the amount of w*nking.....rebound testosterone is full-on.

That's good to hear you have stopped using and are over the physical WD. That's tough, so you should be happy you've got this far.

The cravings are hard to deal with. When I stopped daily opioid use (mainly codeine but also morphine), I struggled each day with trying to fill that gap both in what to do with myself and how to deal with that intense desire to dose up again, knowing how easy it would be to make everything feel good again if only for a short while. Have you thought about seeing a psychologist or anything like that? I can't recommend therapy highly enough. It helped me not only with addiction problems but also the terrible anxiety and depression I used to suffer from, as well as helping me become a functional person again. I never thought I'd be able to achieve some of what I have now, but I did because of the things I learned through therapy. I'm not saying I don't still have issues, I certainly do but getting help like that has gotten me further then I thought I could get.

 

[footscrazy]

I'll tell you what helped me with the cravings when I was quitting methamphetamine, a crazy intense addiction I had for years and years. I know it's not the same drug, but I feel that the psychological need for something is pretty similar, and I've found now I've got into daily opies, and previously, stupid 1,4 B use, that cravings are cravings, they're all the same shit, really.

For me, cravings were born out of the conflict. The conflict being - I could get it...but no, I shouldn't! It was that part of my brain that knew I could get high again, that really drove the shit feelings. It was that addict part of my brain that drove those thoughts for one purpose - to get high. If you take away the possibility of getting high again, I feel that cravings lose most of their power. During a methamphetamine recovery group I went to I learnt that during a meth craving, your brain releases dopamine - just a taste - to really drive you to get the real deal. That made sense to me, because in craving I felt the meth high - the adrenaline, the shakiness, the anxiety - but without the euphoria. Intense cravings remain to me as the 2nd worst feeling I have ever felt in my life, the first being suicidal despair. They fucking suck.

Anyway, after that long winded explanation, the best response I found for cravings was, as soon as they happened, telling myself, nup, not happening, I'm not getting on. Straight away, not even entertaining the thought. Doesn't matter why, I don't need to justify it, I'm just not, and that's the end of it. Because I truly believe it's the addict part of your brain that wants you to think it through, imagine yourself doing it, imagine the high. Because it knows the more you think about it, the harder it will be to say no. Justifying it wont work. I don't believe that anyone who quits a habit is 100% sure they want to quit. So in thinking about the reasons why you've quit, the addict part will grab onto that 1% uncertainty, and it'll grow into a rationalisation to use.

I find the best thing to think when you're craving is, I'm not doing it, I've thought through my reasons for this previously, and I don't need to go over them again now. Because during a craving, you're not rational.

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ Great post, and so right about the dopamine release. I find that even just starting up the ritual of a CWE or crushing up a morphine tablet or making a move to acquire benzodiazepines starts that release and sates the cravings and fuels the drive to go through with it... for me, even making the first step towards using again makes it very hard to step back.

 

[footscrazy]

^ I always felt that by the time I'd decided I was going to get high again (whenever that was) the relapse was 80% complete, even if I didn't actually get on for another week or two. Sometimes I've felt those two voices arguing, I should, I shouldn't, then all of a sudden, I'm high again. I feel like there's some part of me that feels if I don't think about it properly, if I don't acknowledge it while it's happening, I'm not 100% reponsible...

 

[tyrael]

....At this point it comes down to will power and all the strategies you are already implementing.....

Good post M_B! Agreed (especially seeing as it's a "mild" addiction) that it would mostly come down to will power - often not what a lot wants to hear but true!

By the sounds of it "What was it?" I'm in a similar position! (PM me if ya wanna chat/need someone to talk to about it! )

Definitely (try to!) stay away from using any other medications (illegal, illicit or prescribed). Especially any type of benzo .... one evil for another tbh!
Having said that, if it does get too bad a packet of p.forts can work .... more so to ease with physical effects of WD (diarrhoea, hot/cold flushes, nausea, pains, etc). I think the addition of the paracetamol can sometimes prevent (or make one "double think" about) abuse.

.... or other mindfulness techniques? .... Mindfulness also helps with stress and anxiety, and just happiness in general. I really can't encourage enough learning some mindfulness meditation techniques, it's probably been the most important tool for me in improving my mental state and dealing with addiction.

Yes! Glad someone mentioned this! I've just started MiCBT training with my psychologist and although it's only be about a week, I've already noticed a change! Tbh it is not for everybody, but if you're willing to try anything, give it a bash!

"Formal" MiCBT training should be done with a mental health professional (psychologist, psychiatrist, [Mindfullness-trained] councillor, etc). Going down the counselling-path in itself might not be a bad idea - get down to maybe why this addiction (albeit mild) began in the first place?*

....Ultimately YOU are in control of your thoughts. Don't just surrender to past habits and let addictive thinking rule your actions. You do have the power to change your thinking....

While I agree with you (personally learning this and how to "fix" the negative mind patterns) this is definitely one of those things which are a lot easier to say - and even "know" from a logical perspective - yet quite difficult to change the thought process! When it comes down to it - our thought processes, reactions to outside (or even internal [afferent/efferent] for that matter) stimuli, emotions, etc. - are all a consequence of ourselves (read: we have control of! ) due to wrongly (if the consequence incapacitates) or helpful learnt cognitive processes.

i'll stop there, otherwise i'll go on forever! 8(

No no! We're druggies because we're smart)

Haha, love it! Seriously though, it doesn't surprise me! I know many (although it could be the people who I associate with tbh!) people who par-take in drug use (to varying degrees) and some are the smartest people I know!




* feel free to totally disregard if this doesn't quite apply for you of course. just throwing suggestions out there!

 

[Halif]

Footscrazy: That's such a great point you made about the struggle you face when you know you CAN use and the only thing stopping you is your own will power. Nothing increases the suffering of going without more than knowing that you could end it, even if only for a short while.

 

[Charles Bronson]

Harden the fuck up and go through it cold turkey...It's your bodies way of rejecting the drugs in the first place, for which you've been naughty. How else will you learn?

Get some Clonidine, Valium 5 mg...t.i.d. both of them for about 2 weeks.

Then go back to using 1 time every week/month/year etc. or whatever you want to do.

 

[tyrael]

Harden the fuck up and go through it cold turkey...

Spoken from someone who clearly has never been through WD or seen someone who has. Those comments aren't helpful, don't bother posting them!

 

[Charles Bronson]

I've been through about 9 benzodiazepine withdrawals since the age of late 17 to 21 (current age). I know my fair deal of druggos who have gone through opiate withdrawals as well, you bore me friend! lol.

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ He bores you, you bore us.

 

[Gen. Concensus]

Greenlight says go for the OP with WD

I don't know, but I think pinkanga has a point. I have a more than moderate opiate dependency, and my Psych decided I was ADHD (strange but true) and the addies seem to help my opiate intake. ( it lessens my need)
I get crazy busy, and take less and less oxy's or oxymorphones. I asked the Pharmacist about coming off adderall and he said it makes you pretty sleepy. This sounds crazy, but if you can ease the opiates w/ something that makes you not conciously crave. Then quit the addies after a while, feel like sleeping all the time. Then that solves the benzo problem! Use the other 14 things on the list and maybe it could help with the intense cravings. Just a thought or get Naloxone, like they gave me for alcohol craving in rehab. Sorry if I am in the wrong part or this is too long. 1st post

 

[Chainer]

will power and accepting the shittiness to come. I believe it helped that I put myself through opana w/ds rather then opt for treatment from suboxone - that sure taught me a lasting week long memory.

I didn't know you could throw up entirely through your nasal passages, for instance. Quiet a learning experience.

Stay strong, avoid the temptation, flush your oppies, delete your dealers, give your cash to someone trust able, adapt to living without them... Time, it takes time and will power. Be safe and best of luck, I know how difficult it can be, even if your habit isn't as bad as many others it doesn't make it any less of a shitty situation.

 

[What was it?]

I REALLY appreciate all the posts here guys - thanks for the help.

The main problem is that I essentially have unlimited supply at PBS cost to Morphine, Hydromorphone, Oxycodone, Alprazolam, Diazepam, Nitrazepam, Oxazepam and a few more, but mainly the highlighted 3 that cause the issues. Had 3 glasses of wine to smooth things over today and 10mgs of temazepam yesterday for sleep so not been completely clean, however another day without opioids ...I find more than 3 glasses of booze and the cravings turn into complete fiending so I avoid it. Another mate of mine told me that days 1-5 are worst for physical WDs and days 10-12 (as you physically feel much better) worst for psychological cravings. Really must say I agree with that up until now. Work was surprisingly good today as it took my mind of things - the weekend was ffaaaaarked.....one more day down. It's like I am waiting for something...but what? A relapse?

 

[What was it?]

Harden the fuck up and go through it cold turkey...It's your bodies way of rejecting the drugs in the first place, for which you've been naughty. How else will you learn?

Get some Clonidine, Valium 5 mg...t.i.d. both of them for about 2 weeks.

Then go back to using 1 time every week/month/year etc. or whatever you want to do.

Hey dude, be nice...what's the point of the above post? You don't know the full circumstances and the above post helps nobody...neither me nor you. Karma mate, karma. How about I throw a box of Dilaudid 8mgs, MSContins 100mgs and Oxycontins 80mgs in front of you everyday and see how you go???