Trying Kratom for the first time, advice?

[SaosinEngaged]

So I have a light Oxy habit, generally between 7.5-15mg/ day. Just enough to relax me and take some stress out of my life at night after a shitty day at work.

I recognize and fully understand this isn't the smartest way to relieve depression and stress, but be aware that I've disciplined myself enough to keep my dosages very low for a very long time, and never to very rarely redose twice in one day.

This has allowed me to escape any real withdrawal, and I've been able to "stop" for a week "here and there" for various reasons.

I've seen Kratom talked about many times on this site, and particularly the fact that it offers an "Opiate like" experience and has a legal status in the US has convinced me to try it.

I just ordered 8 grams of "Premium Bali leaf" from a shop, and plan to throw that in boiling water for 15 minutes to make "tea."

What I'm not sure of is dosage. I'm not looking to get fucked up, just mellowed and relaxed. That small a dosage of Oxy gets me high and euphoric, so use that as a guideline.

Also, I know I'm a bitch, but how safe is Kratom? I'm very picky about what I put in my body. I wouldn't touch Oxy until I read about every possible side effect and reaction several times over, and even then the first few times I took it I barely swallowed a chip of a 30mg Roxi.

Is it possible to be allergic to Kratom? I think I'm alllergic to Codeine after a pretty bad reaction to a T3 I took. I know it's not an opiate per-se.

The primary thing I'm looking for is dosing recommendations and also the "safety" of it. I know each and every time when I swallow X amount of Oxy how it will effect me and what I can and cannot handle. I'd like to have some bearing before I go making Kratom tea and feeling overwhelmed or being out of control, which I don't like (I grew up hating being shitfaced drunk because the loss of control of my actions scared me, I know, I have some issues with this).

Thanks for any and all advice guys.

 

[amapola]

Actually kratom does contain alkaloids which are opioid agonists so it can correctly be called an opioid. Health effects are no worse than oxycodone although there have been some reports of liver damage in life long chronic malaysian users. It's always wise to do an allergy test and some people are sensitive to kratom's nausea.

Performing a water extraction is not that effective and the best bang for your buck will be ingesting the plant material. A tea may reduce nausea though.

The best advice I can give is don't expect anything like oxy. It's a subtle experience that can range from empathy with an energy boost (more likely with a previous opiate tolerance) to sedation with waves of euphoria. The dosing is quite individually varied due to a complex alkaloid profile and activity at multiple opioid receptors, and more kratom does not always create stronger effects.

Check out the threads under Kratom in the OD Directory as found in my signature for more info and discussion.

 

[Cane2theLeft]

^ what he said.

Also, this is a harm reduction site so if concern over safety makes you a bitch, any poster worth listening to around here is a bitch and I'm a huge bitch. That last part part might be true anyway, but I digress.

As amapola said, in acute moderate doses it won't be more harmful than any other opioid is. Its hard to gauge dose because potency will vary batch to batch, let alone brand to brand, vendor to vendor, etc. but if you want to be safe and you have basically less than no tolerance to opioids, I'd start around 3 grams probably. I'm used to dosing whole though (toss and wash or capsules) so I don't know how much less effective tea is that the methods I utilize and I tend to suggest and personally start at rather conservative doses.

I wouldn't at all be surprised if you have people coming on here saying that suggestion is too much or too little because of the aforementioned variation. For reference, to get something vaguely resembling the effects of about 15-20mg of oxy, I'll consume 6-8g of finely ground bali kratom in capsules but keep in mind what amapola said, this will NOT feel exactly the same as oxy.

 

[SaosinEngaged]

Thanks for the responses. Appreciated.

I'd like to try out the tea at first, even if there are better methods of consumption. Does it sound "smart" to cook the batch of tea with all 8 grams, strain it into a container and drink small amounts at a time to gauge how it effects me? "Hey this feels good, but not strong at all" *drink a few more gulps* etc.

I also bought a gram scale to measure this stuff out. What's confusing me is how you mentioned 6-8mg, but the "tea" recipee I saw from another poster mentioned cooking 8 grams of leaves. Is this different because you're basically ingesting the whole leaf, versus me straining a tea, or basically extracting from the leaf?

 

[Cane2theLeft]

^it likely is different but I couldn't tell you how much less potent the tea will be than consuming whole. Perhaps someone with more experience and knowledge about solubility can better comment.

Regarding the 6-8mg, it was just a typo because I'm more used to typing 'mg' than 'g' here. It should've been grams. Thanks for catching that so I could correct it.

 

[amapola]

I'd like to try out the tea at first, even if there are better methods of consumption. Does it sound "smart" to cook the batch of tea with all 8 grams, strain it into a container and drink small amounts at a time to gauge how it effects me? "Hey this feels good, but not strong at all" *drink a few more gulps* etc.

The onset will be relatively slow and judging slight changes in effects from drinking a bit more tea will be very difficult to judge. I personally enjoy the come-up the most as well when you start to feel the waves of euphoria and excitement so it isn't smart for me . Your method makes sense from a logical viewpoint, but I don't think it is practically feasible. I suppose dosing and then redosing once if unsatisfied after an hour or so might work though. I still prefer to not ever redose my opiates and just enjoy whatever the experience brings.

I also bought a gram scale to measure this stuff out. What's confusing me is how you mentioned 6-8mg, but the "tea" recipee I saw from another poster mentioned cooking 8 grams of leaves. Is this different because you're basically ingesting the whole leaf, versus me straining a tea, or basically extracting from the leaf?

You just can't get too caught up in the doses. The long term enthusiasts who use nothing else will tell you 1.5g is better than 3g and then only need 0.5 of the UEI (ultra enhanced indo) but the people who are used to banging heroin and want a rush will say they needed 20g to feel anything. I usually use 3-4g for energy and euphoria, and 6 for sedation with 7 making me melt into my bed.

 

[SaosinEngaged]

^^^

Thanks a lot. Very helpful, exactly why I made this thread.

Now I can't wait for this stuff to get here, I'm excited to try it.

 

[NeighborhoodThreat]

Kratom is quite effective for opiate WD symptoms, but the effectiveness varies from person to person. I found making the tea is the easiest way to work your dosage up to a comfortable level, and the tea hits pretty quick (20-30 minutes on a mostly-empty stomach) so its easy to tell if you need more or not.

If you get some free time, I recommend reading through The Kratom Thread, it has a lot more people's input and experiences with kratom in it, and you will find it very useful.

-NT

 

[SaosinEngaged]

Reading through the Kratom thread now.

I just have one last question as my Kratom is arriving tomorrow and I want to jump right into making the tea.

The recipee I saw mentioned distilled water. Is this necessary? I can't just take tap water, throw it in a pot and boil it? Thanks.

 

[theotherside]

My experiences with kratom range from feeling like I'm on a stimulant mixed with a low dose hydrocodone, to feeling so sedated I fall asleep. Every single time you get it, even the same type, feels different to me. Hydrocodone/oxy feel the same every time to me. Kratom is addictive as hell so be very careful not to take it everyday. Be safe and enjoy.

 

[amapola]

The recipee I saw mentioned distilled water. Is this necessary? I can't just take tap water, throw it in a pot and boil it? Thanks.

With some sensitive alkaloids like ergine this is necessary to prevent the chlorine in tap water from destroying it. This is more because of the tiny amounts you are using though and I don't think you'll have any problem with kratom.

 

[thelonegunman]

All this sounds exactly up my aisle. Especially since opiate based meds give me the most relief from pain, and everything...

NO SOURCE DISCUSSION

 

[Lysis]

I place about 8g in a cup with ice, boil some water, pour the water in the cup (about a cup of water), then I let it sit for about 15 minutes. Works great for me as a replacement for coffee...it's a stimulant for me. I actually can't sleep on kratom.

 

[Pegasus]

^Neither can I... Even when in withdrawal I can't dose before bed and so I usually wake up in w/d...

 

[SaosinEngaged]

Okay so I made some tea with a mere 2g (just wanted to test the waters) and quite honestly it was pretty awesome. It felt like a nice mellow body high similar to hydrocodone. It wasn't too intense and it wasn't like I was just thinking, "gimme some damn Oxy," it was really nice.

I could definitely see the w/d aid potential in this.

 

[SaosinEngaged]

Also, I have to be honest. I liked the taste. Is there something wrong with me?

I read about how nasty this stuff is, and for real, the tea tasted like a more pungent green tea, which I enjoy.

Wasn't bad at all, but I can see how just straight downing plant matter can be unpleasant.