Tryptamines Toad vs. Freebase 5MeO-DMT dosage

[scabbard]

Can anyone provide some guidance on the relative potency between the toad secretions containing 5MeO-DMT, and the actual freebase molecule? I know there's obviously variation in the potency of the toad secretions. For a moderate dose of freebase 5MeO-DMT, I believe that's approximately 10mg - how much toad secretion would one have to smoke in order to achieve the same effect?

 

[Didgital]

5 to 15%.

Low range. 10mg ÷ .05 = 200mg
Mid range. 10 ÷ .10 = 100mg
High range 10mg ÷ .15mg/mg = 66mg

so quite the range for such a potent compound. 66-200mg...

All that said, 10mg of freebase is actually approaching a strong dose. I would consider 5mg to be a "moderate" dose. Due to the pretty large variation, i would start slow. Safe travels.

Sources:

A single inhalation of vapor from dried toad secretion containing 5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-DMT) in a naturalistic setting is related to sustained enhancement of satisfaction with life, mindfulness-related capacities, and a decrement of

5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (hereinafter referred to as 5-MeO-DMT) is a psychedelic substance found in the secretion from the parotoid glands of the Bufo alvarius toad. Inhalation of vapor from toad secretion containing 5-MeO-DMT has become ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Since a toad yields about 0.25–0.50 g of dried secretion from a “milking session,” with a 5-MeO-DMT content of up to 15% (Erspamer et al. 1967), a single toad may generate 75 mg of 5-MeO-DMT in its secretion that, when smoked, is already psychoactive in humans at doses as low as 3–5 mg"

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0006295267901475

The most abundant representative of 5-hydroxyindolealkylamines is, as in numerous other toads, bufotenine (up to 3 mg per g dry skin), the most abundant representative of 5-methoxyindolealkylamines, O-methylbufotenine. In parotoid and coxal glands as much as 5–15 per cent of the dry weight is made up by this compound

 

[Fire&Water]

Leave those toads alone
they were my cats other buddy

experience to extremes

 

[scabbard]

5 to 15%.

Low range. 10mg ÷ .05 = 200mg
Mid range. 10 ÷ .10 = 100mg
High range 10mg ÷ .15mg/mg = 66mg

so quite the range for such a potent compound. 66-200mg...

All that said, 10mg of freebase is actually approaching a strong dose. I would consider 5mg to be a "moderate" dose. Due to the pretty large variation, i would start slow. Safe travels.

Sources:

A single inhalation of vapor from dried toad secretion containing 5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-DMT) in a naturalistic setting is related to sustained enhancement of satisfaction with life, mindfulness-related capacities, and a decrement of

5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (hereinafter referred to as 5-MeO-DMT) is a psychedelic substance found in the secretion from the parotoid glands of the Bufo alvarius toad. Inhalation of vapor from toad secretion containing 5-MeO-DMT has become ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Since a toad yields about 0.25–0.50 g of dried secretion from a “milking session,” with a 5-MeO-DMT content of up to 15% (Erspamer et al. 1967), a single toad may generate 75 mg of 5-MeO-DMT in its secretion that, when smoked, is already psychoactive in humans at doses as low as 3–5 mg"

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0006295267901475

The most abundant representative of 5-hydroxyindolealkylamines is, as in numerous other toads, bufotenine (up to 3 mg per g dry skin), the most abundant representative of 5-methoxyindolealkylamines, O-methylbufotenine. In parotoid and coxal glands as much as 5–15 per cent of the dry weight is made up by this compound

Thanks for the info, that basically corroborated what I had heard anecdotally. I got the 10mg number from Martin Ball's Entheogenic Liberation book. He gives dosage guidelines as follows for the freebase molecule:

5-10mg - moderate
10-15mg - strong
15-20mg - very strong
20-30mg -

I did a recent session with a practitioner where we I did a first round of 19mg followed by a second round of 23mg of toad, so that would be the equivalent of .95-2.85mg for the first round and 1.15-3.45mg for the second round had I used the freebase molecule. Pretty low overall. I am returning in a week to do a larger dose, hopefully it will be more effective therapeutically.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

Seeing the sad lonely Bufo Alvarius sitting alone behind glass.
I can see they would make great Pets,
don t know if the Toad would agree though ?

But better then being prisoned in the ZOO, i think.
And they are real cute, do they move i wonder,
never saw that one move.

Sat like a living statue, same spot every time i visited.

 

[scabbard]

You know what's strange though? That article says that toad secretions contain up to 15% 5MeO-DMT. But then farther down, they analyzed 5 samples of toad and show the following data in this table:

The minimum concentration of 5MeO-DMT in that table is >20%. That's a bit of a contradiction within their own paper.

 

[Didgital]

You know what's strange though? That article says that toad secretions contain up to 15% 5MeO-DMT. But then farther down, they analyzed 5 samples of toad and show the following data in this table:

The minimum concentration of 5MeO-DMT in that table is >20%. That's a bit of a contradiction within their own paper.

Good find, I only perused it for the key word.

So what's the consensus?

 

[scabbard]

I would go based on the factual data. Sounds like it's closer to 25% instead of the advertised 15% max.