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Positive The Tapering Supportive/Social Thread

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Shroomsatori, thank you. I'm not sure what I can post here and I hope replying wasn't difficult or too difficult. I am recovering too. It's hard not to be hard on yourself. I had cancer and I'm impatient to get on with it.
POkemomma- just getting settled here. Keep warm!
 
Cduggles: As you probably already know, at the top of each forum there are guidelines which indicate what can and cannot be posted. There is also a "stickies" section which precedes the regular threads. There is often valuable information listed there, including posting guidelines. I would say, generally speaking, duplicate posting is not allowed, we do not use SWIM here, no sourcing questions or questions regarding drug testing or questions asking for legal advice are allowed. There are more, but these seem to be the most common. Of course, BL also discourage rudeness, meanness, or judgmental posts as well. The moderators will let you know if you have posted something that goes against the guidelines.I wouldn't worry too much... they give us warnings and I have gotten reasons for deleted posts; you have to really ignore the mods feedback to get banned.
 
POkemama, thank you. I had a duplicate deleted- and I got disciplined! :) The mobile skin prevents FAQ reading and although I did read section guidelines, I'm still getting the feel for each of the individual threads and the unwritten etiquette that eludes newcomers. In short, is it appropriate to ask what a drug is on a taper support thread? I also felt afterwards that answering me might have brought up other issues, which can hurt or help. Obviously the latter is desired.
 
^You are welcome. Remember, you can ask questions, such as what a certain drug is, and as long as someone has the answer, and feels like answering, there is no problem.
You say you got "disciplined"... what does that mean? I have never heard that term used here on BL before. You sound very wary around posting issues. Have you had problems on other forums? You might want to look at who the mods are for TDS, and send one of them a private message regarding any concerns. As for the "unwritten etiquette", I am not aware of anything like that here... maybe BL is just a good fit for me? The only thing to remember is that no one "owes" anyone an answer. Some threads die out quickly; some last longer. Just the nature of online posting. People find some threads easy to relate to; others, not so much. I would think you might find the November Sober Living Thread to be a good place to voice your thoughts and questions, and find support. Each month, the mods start at least two threads: A social thread and a Sober Living thread where you can seek support.
I find BL refreshingly open and accepting of a lot of posts, people, cultural differences, etc. It is a very liberal site and if I was worried about my posts, I certainly would not stick around. I certainly have not seen any red flags in what you have posted on the tapering thread so far.
 
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I am seeking feedback and experience sharing: I just found out I will have 8 days in a row where I am free to try to achieve one of my tapering goals: move from sniffing my oxymorph to taking all meds as prescribed. That means I will have 3 15mg oxycodone, and 2 10mg oxymorphone per day available. I will suffer wd as the bioavailability of the oxymorphone is only 10% orally; whereas it is 30-40% when sniffed. Should I take 1/2 of each oxycodone, 7.5mg to start and see how long it works at keeping me out of the worst of withdrawals? I would appreciate hearing how others have decreased/changed routes of administration successfully.
 
Poke- my troubles with tapering were all centered around the short half life of my pills and my superhuman liver. I take whatever dose, it takes 30 minutes to start working, and I'm feeling WD's 1 hour after that. That meant if I tried to taper with 30 mg pills I would be in withdrawl for most of the day! I figured that out and I have been breaking the pills into 7.5 mg pieces. I dose every 2-3 hours. THAT's how I broke through my wall at 75 mg/day. Now I'm down to a solid 60 mg/day and I feel WD's for only 30 minutes at a time. That's 8 doses per day and so much easier. My next drop will likely involve crushing my 30 mg pills and dosing 5 mg at a time/ 8 per day / tot 40 mg a day and I think it will be easy.

Shroomy - after my first back surgery(6 screws and all) I wasn't getting better and I decided to quit oxycodone cold turkey. The reason was:
1: possible side effects of opiates was pain like I was having from the surgery, so it was a bit of an experiment for myself to know what was ACTUALLUY happening with my pain problem.
2: i wanted to know if I could handle life without help from pills.

In short , i chose cold turkey so that I would have the shortest time between using the pills and being completely off of them so I could know the difference.
That experience really helped me because I knew after that I wasn't just an addict. Later the Dr found one of my implants had shifted and was pushing on my spinal chord. That's why I had the second surgery and why I'm back on the pills. Also, now I can feel when my pain is withdrawls vs real pain and I am able to have that conversation with my Dr in a way that I sound like an expert on my own pain and not like a junkie.

Our bodies and minds can be so miserably affected by everything we injest. The bottom line is that the only true way to know what the minimum amount of meds we need to feel O.K. is to stop taking them all and be off of everything for a few weeks. I recommend keeping a leger of every pill you take. Include Things like Coffee and Soda. And have a space for your symptoms (pain, anxiety, headaches, sleep, etc) Doing this helped me to figure out the best way to take my Ativan and my painc attacks went from 1-2 a day to 1 a month. It also inspired my idea to break up my pills for tapering and that has helped tremendously. I can also go back and see what worked and what failed.
 
^Thank you so much, Squeaky, for the detailed post. :) It sounds like you took the time to get to understand yourself: the way your own body and mind respond to what you ingest. Then, you were able to come up with a plan that worked for you. As I may have mentioned, I do document my dosages of opiates, but not of my vitamin/supplements or when my sugar intake is what I consider unhealthy. So, I will look at tracking more of what I eat/ingest and then see what the results are in terms of how I feel/symptoms.
 
I keep my doses at the same time each day, and when I wanted to take lower amounts I would just reduce the dose that I took at that same time. So, my body always expects a dose at midnight or noon, it just gets lower as I taper. It took around two weeks for my body to get used to only dosing every 12 hours. However, I am no longer tapering. I am done for now. I know what my pain is like without pills as I did not get on them right away, I waited 2 years in hell. I'm not all that concerned about seeing that it's just as bad as before. I only dose twice a day, and this has made it straightforward for me to taper, as I am keeping one variable (dose time) constant while altering the other variable (dose) instead of both. Especially because with percocet I can drop by 2.5mg if I want since they are scored and do it slowly.

Then there is Squeaky with his more frequent but lower dosing that is working out great too. That's a good method because you always have a dose in the near future to look forward to and keep you going. There are so many ways of doing this and you have to find out what works best for you. My body likes it best when it expects a dose at a specific time of day, but only dosing twice a day so that I do not have the pills on my mind very often.

Poke mama, I think it is going to be tougher for you to switch from sniffing oxymorphone to taking it orally, than to taper your oxy's. i'd maybe keep taking the oxycodone like you normally do, and focus on the oxymorphone. If you can cut them in half, you could start out by sniffing 3/4 of the oxymorphone daily dose one day, and taking the other 1/4 of it orally. Then, gradually start to take 1/2 orally and 1/2 sniffed for a few days... then 3/4 orally and 1/4 sniffed. Then all oral. Perhaps, for 2 days each time before moving down, so that would be 8 days. That is just an idea... I have no idea really how you have been tapering, but I feel like that could work. I have never even seen an oxymorphone pill before though.

Days 1,2: 15mg oxymorphone insufflated; 5mg oxymorphone oral
Days 3,4: 10mg oxymorphone insufflated; 10mg oxymorphone oral
Days 5,6: 5mg oxymorphone insufflated; 15mg oxymorphone oral
Days 7,8: 20mg oxymorphone oral

That is for total daily dose... it would depend on how you want to do it. Probably easiest to take all your oxymorphone for the day all at once... if you did it 12 hours apart, for example, you would have to sniff 7.5mg oxymorphone on days 1 and 2, and 2.5mg orally, 12 hours apart which I don't think you could do with your pills. So I would just dose the oxymorphone all at once in the morning maybe (getting it over with, no further temptation), and then take your oxycodone later on in the day once it wears off, oxy's spread out like you usually do or to make the withdrawal symptoms least unbearable. That part is harder for me to say, because I don't really know how long oxymorphone lasts, or how strong it is compared to oxycodone. Once it wears off... like say 6 hours later... then you would have 18 hours left in the day to take your 45mg oxycodone. So you could dose one 15mg pill every 6 hours or something, after waiting 6 hours post oxymorphone.

I am on coke right now and just full of brilliant ideas so yeah... there is my coked out idea for you... if it even makes any sense. Didn't fuck with my oxy's today, but played guitar for hours upon hours, restringed my guitar, learned musical theory, and now I am just resting because I remembered that I have back pain. I cannot seem to shut up. It is a good thing, I guess, that I do not like stimulants as much. Way too much anxiety and paranoia for me, and a shitty comedown, but this has still been a very productive day. I have not been able to concentrate on my music like that in ages.
 
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cduggles: Unfortunately, the depression and anhedonia stick around for awhile... I usually lump it under PAWS... (Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome). I was not successful in staving off these symptoms when I went cold turkey in 2013. So, when I did have the opportunity to get back into pain management, utilizing opioids, I did so. I do have physical symptoms causing chronic pain so easily "qualify" for medication. Unfortunately, being prone to depression, I find opiates treat my depression better than any anti-depressant i have tried. A lot of people here on BL utilize physical exercise to help alleviate depression; I however, do have neck, back and knee issues that make it difficult to get to the point where exercise helps. Swimming would work; I do have issues with going to a swimming pool at my ago and with my current body image. So, that has not been an option for years. I would suggest therapy/counseling so that you can work on the issues underlying the depression and find the coping skills that help you specifically.
One thing that does work for me is simply spending time with my family: my children and grandchild, as well as their pets are simply delightful and help my mood improve.

Shroomy: Thank you for the detailed ideas for my taper! You do present with a lot of energy! I will definitely consider some of these ideas and try them out when I start my "experiment".
 
Basically I am ready to take oxycodone again. I do see a great therapist and that's not what is happening right now. This is withdrawal and it's so much worse than being sick. Thanks though.
 
I don't mean to sound curt so please understand. I don't have the option of a slower taper. I have a leftover med schedule from cancer and supplements can interact, although it's not well-studied and patients underreport usage. I'd rather relive the first part than this and no one is answering messages or threads except this one. 5htp interacts with something I take further down the line.
My thread is in Basic Drug Discussion and I'm sorry I can't write all that out again. I really appreciate your comments and kindness but I don't think site is very responsive.
My worst symptoms are my whole body screaming anhedonia and depression.
 
Hi

Please HELP me with LARGE amount of Valium/ Diazepam withdrawal!!!!!

Sorry for hijacking this post but I can't seem to start a new one, I need HELP and advice please...

Sorry for the long post, any advice or help is much appreciated. If you can help but don't have time to read the background I've written below please scroll down to the main question in capitals. Thank you!

I know there is lots of information on here all all over the net but really lots of contradicting advice, can someone please help.

I am 33 and have been taking large amounts (up to 200mg) a day/night at its peak for around.

It started about 5 years ago when I used to do quite a bit of the white stuff. I hated the come down/craving for years till a friend of mine told me to take a Valium, so like an idiot I took it and within 20 minutes I felt normal and could sleep after doing the other thing.

As a year went on my tollerance obviously built up 1 a night became 2 a night 3,4.... In the end I was taking around 20 10mgs just to get to sleep. This was a bad depressing time and I tried the NHS route which was to drop 2mg every 2-4 weeks. That didn't work, I wasn't motivated and the thought of having to do that for years meant I just tried myself. Biggest mistake ever.

Anyway 4 years later I have stopped the white stuff which was the reason I started taking them in the first place (I know how dangerous it is mixing those two together especially with such a high amount of Valium, I can't believe it looking back. I was in a very dark place where no one knew the secret life I was living. I was working and still am full time.

So about two months ago I finally told my mum (about just the Valium problem) she said she will pay for rehab or whatever it takes to get me off these but can only afford a month which is a lot of money! For her/me.

Over the years as my tollerance was so high I only managed to cut it down to 14 x10mg (140mg) taking all at night.

Since telling my mum and being really motivated to kick this I have managed to cut down to 95mg per night. By dropping between 5-10 mg every week at the weekend.

I am booked into rehab for a month starting 3/1/2017 (that's all my mum can afford as its a lot of money) after speaking to them and other treatment centres quite a few said the hardest part is the last 30-40mg.

I told them Them I am on 95mg and they THINK if I can get it down to 60-70mg in the 6 weeks between now and then, they can get me off them completely.

I am a bit unsure how they can claim this as they have never met me, all they know is what I've said above. But even if they can reduce it to the smallest amount possible and I am still on them when I come out at the end of Jan it's my best hope.

THE MAIN QUESTION

I've been on these for about 5 years. I have cut down myself to 95mg a night to be able to just about function properly at work etc along with the nasty withdrawal symptoms.

I have 6 weeks to cut as much as I can before I go into rehab for a month. I have managed to cut around 50mg in about two months by tapering between 5-10 mg every weekend as I am so focused and determined to get off these. I know everyone reacts differently to tapering/withdrawal.

Am I ok to keep cutting such large amounts every week to reach my goal of being on 60-70mg from 95mg (now) in 6 weeks before I go into rehab for a month and hopefully get myself clean?

Or am I rushing this two fast which will at some point hit me bad?

I tried cold turkey for a week once about 4 years ago when I was on about 60mg (yes I know it's very dangerous and I wish I never bothered as it was pure hell so I have been through and know the really really bad effects of withdrawal)

Any advice is much appreciated... Thank you in advance and sorry for the long post!

Regards
 
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cdug: Thank you for letting us know that you will not be posting... good luck in the future. Please realize that I know your struggle with the depressive symptoms is real. Unfortunately, it is one of the main reasons people relapse on opioids. I do not know of any sure cure for it at this point in time. When I read the posts of those struggling with PAWS for long periods of time, they seem to accept that the depression will come and go, and take their recovery one day at a time.

Sindy: Sorry I cannot answer any of your questions. My experience is around tapering opioids only, which are considered less dangerous to quit than benzos. Maybe someone else can help you... please try to post in the Basic Drugs or Other Drugs section if you want more input.
 
So I made the mistake of taking a bump of cocaine yesterday, which was definitely laced with meth - the high was great at first, typical coke high, but then I felt extremely anxious and had an extreme panic attack for the following 16 hours. It was an absolutely nightmare, I stayed up all night begging god for another chance at life and I learned yet another lesson - I hate stimulants, and whatever they cut coke with these days is straight poison. I am certain it was meth because I've used that before and it felt exactly the same shit.

Miserable experience. I was expecting it to last 2 hours, not 16 and ongoing. Didn't fuck with my oxy taper but I needed a lot of etizolam to calm myself down. I took 2mg alprazolam, 2mg clonazepam, 20mg diazepam, 30mg baclofen, and 10mg etizolam before I finally calmed down. Had wake a family member up to check my blood pressure which was very high. It was horrendous, truly felt like I was going to die. I think I'm still anxious underneath. It really sucked... but I sure as hell won't be doing that again. It is unfathomable to me how anyone could find those types of drugs pleasurable or useful in any way.

Today I am just trying to relax and get over it. Didn't really mess with my oxy taper, but it messed with me in other respects.
 
^it sounds like you are finally feeling calmer. I hope you have something relaxing you can do so you can enjoy your day somewhat. I am so tired from the dogs... two nights of broken sleep does not help me stay motivated to taper. I love them, but they are sure high maintenance. They go home in a few hours, thank goodness.
 
I've been sleeping all day, and missed my oxy dose at noon. Woke up disoriented with bad back pain...

I am just thankful that experience is over. Me and stimulants just don't match up.

It's not even over though... that shit was cut with meth. I thought I was going to die last night. I had to stay up all night with a loved one to monitor my blood pressure, I was considering the hospital. It was one monster of a stimulant-induced panic attack. I don't know what the fuck I was thinking but I cannot be destroying myself like that. I was self harming before I did the bump, I just needed to somehow escape. Even now, 27 hours later, I am experiencing chest pains and tightness. I despise stimulants, they are the worst possible thing for someone so high strung and mentally ill. I was certainly not expecting this reaction though. Who knows what was in that shit, and hopefully my heart begins to feel better soon. I think that it will take a couple of days, as every time I use a stimulant drug I experience reactions like this. That is why I hadn't touched them in 5 years. No more setbacks, this is just miserable. Completely ruined my day and I thought I was going to die last night. Really did.

I took 2mg klonopin, 2mg xanax, 20mg valium, and finally 10mg etizolam and in the morning I was still wired out of my mind. Normally, all of that would knock me out cold for at least 24 hours. I finally fell asleep around noon and napped most of the day. I woke up and I still feel over-stimulated. This was off a single bump.

I suppose there is a lesson to be learned here too. At least I got addicted to a family of drugs that simply don't cause long term damage to health like this stimulant shit would. I feel as healthy as I ever have, after all the opioid abuse. So... not very healthy. Physically sound apart from pain, and mentally a trainwreck. I still look vibrant and healthy which is nice. You would think these opiates would do more damage to the body but they honestly just don't. Everything is temporary. I personally don't think that opiate abuse causes any long term damage to physical or mental health at all in most cases, so that is a good thing at least. If I had been abusing some filth like coke, I'd probably have heart problems (this was strictly mental health related).
 
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