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  • Current Events & Politics Moderators: deficiT | tryptakid | Foreigner

Covid-19 The New Covid Megathread v.Oh-my-cron!

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Based on what? How do you untangle the exponential increase in the number of reported cases and separate which ones are a result of people being made aware of VAERS and being encouraged to report anything from ones which might be legitimately caused by the vaccines.
If you know anything about VAERS and the nature of vaccine reporting, you'd know that adverse events are worryingly under-reported. Doctors are not encouraged to report truthfully about vaccines, they're much more likely to dismiss any link between an event and a vaccine, especially as more time elapses between the injection and the injury.

At this point in the game NO-ONE should be dropping references to uncited papers they associate with authoritative bodies.

AND —-GOTCHA

Your possibly very sneaky use of “Harvard” here does not relate to the University. It relates to “Harvard Pilgrim Inc” which is a for-profit healthcare company.

There was not a peer-reviewed academic paper. There was a government-funded project report. Relating to vaccinations/VAERS prior to 20010. So well before VAERS became a household name.

And the goal of the report was to justify increased State surveillance of people’s medical records as held by HMO’s etc.
AFAIK the report was funded by the Department of Health and Human Services. The researchers from Harvard analyzed and reworked their private healthcare system and found that vaccine injuries were MUCH higher than the BS "one in a million" mantra that the authorities (and everyone else) repeats constantly. When those researchers approached the CDC offering to do the same with the national database - they didn't even return their calls or emails. There are many examples of the governmental health bodies not actually being interested in developing a thorough and comprehensive vaccine injury reporting system. The reason why is because just like the Harvard Pilgrim study, they'd find that vaccine injuries are much more common and prevalent than the public have been led to believe and this obviously would threaten their profits.

Nobody on the pro-vax side says it should be used that way. It is an early warning system intended to indicate potential areas for further research. But it is not the only such system or starting point for research.
If it's not the only one then it's the most comprehensive and it's severely lacking, especially considering that we're injecting these vaccines into almost every baby in the country.
Similar to how the government could do a thorough and comprehensive vaccinated vs unvaccinated statistical comparative study yet they refuse to. The biggest one that I saw (roughly 700 kids) showed that the unvaccinated group possessed much better overall health than the vaccinated group. I'm not surprised by that and I'm sure someone like yourself would try and pick apart the study or find some "gotcha" to dismiss it. But then the question remains, why doesn't the government do the same thing on a national scale? It's because they would find out that unvaccinated people are overall much healthier and suffer from less medical conditions than vaccinated people. Which obviously destroys the entire justification behind the trillion-dollar producing vaccine schedule.

If you want to simply argue “we do know the full extent of vaccine injuries and they may be greater than people realise” most reasonable people would agree. I would. But you and others are inferring that true knowledge of serious and/or fatal injuries is obscured by a factor of 100 or more. That seems less credible and very speculative.
Well I don't know if most people are reasonable so most people get triggered and shut off whenever you even begin to question the ethics behind the vaccine schedule and the lack of safety testing and injury tracking. But that factor of <1% was a report by the HHS and Harvard University. So it's not like this is some randomly speculative number pulled out of the rabbit hole by conspiracy poofters. I did hear that that specific finding was related to the HPV vaccine, but McCullough gives a more specific estimation based on the covid vaccines and he stated 4-5x under-reported. Even the official figures of 20K aren't causing the alarm that it should. The goal should be saving lives, not stopping a virus. If the attempt to save lives ends up killing more people (and especially younger people) than the virus does, then shouldn't we reexamine what we're doing and perhaps consider alternatives or halting the program? Has that ever even been discussed? How many vax deaths would we need to see before that should happen?

What data proves there are 20,000 vaccine deaths? You drop that like it is self-evident fact that everyone agrees with.
That's VAERS bro. That's the accepted, official government statistic for deaths following covid vaccines. I wonder what the true number is.

I agree that the hard evidence for the value of lockdowns, masks, social distancing etc etc is lacking
This right here should discredit and invalidate the entire covid-policy push by governments (strangely all national govts mostly following suit in lock step together).
The changes to our world and societies have been monumental and have severely negatively affected a staggering number of people. So shouldn't there have been the most watertight evidence presented to justify everything that's happened over the past 2 years? I mean simply the globally-coordinated programming mantra of "it's just 15 days to flatten the curve" turned out to be ridiculously inaccurate - so why are people still listening to and trusting the organisations that have blatantly lied and shifted the goalposts in order to increase and maintain the direct power they have over every individual person? How come the average person has no idea that the original computer model projections for how many people would die globally if we didn't lock down, were done by Ferguson at Imperial who was proven to be a fraud with completely dodgy data that vastly overestimated death counts? Not to mention he broke his own covid rules by secretly traveling to fuck his mistress. Funny how politicians don't seem to care to follow the same rules that they inflict on everyone else. I thought they were serious about this pandemic and what they believe would stop the spread and save the world? People need to wake the fuck up already.
 
I don't know if anyone has raised this point yet because I can't be arsed to wade through the bullshit.

But isn't it strange how the anti vaxxers are quick to point out that many of the recorded Covid deaths are people that have died WITH Covid, not BECAUSE of Covid; yet claim that every vaccinated young person that has a heart attack is due to the vaccine?

Anyone else see the fuckin irony here??
No. Old people dying from flu is normal. Young people dying from heart attacks is not normal.
 
No offense. But you certainly put a lot of trust and faith in ONE Doctor and his opinions. And this also smacks of well it was Joe Rogan so it must be true. Joe Rogan makes a living, and tries to stay current and relevant, by interviewing controversial figures and figures who are contrarians for the sake of it. Don't believe me? Take a look at the veritable list of nutcases that he's had on his show over the past few years. The more controversial and off the wall the better (for obvious reasons).
No offense but your analysis of this - which is really a justification for you refusing to watch the interview - is incredibly infantile and short-sighted.
This is a problem that many people have these days. they're very bad at assessing who is a credible (or more importantly, honest) source of information.
Rogan is an interviewer who is basically good at asking questions and allowing experts talk in long-form, unedited conversations (he recently exposed CNN lying about him by pressing guest Sanjay Gupta).
You can't really discredit Dr. McCullough because his track record is so solid.
He's not the only ONE doctor that I consider a credible source of information on covid, but a pattern that seems to emerge with any expert who speaks out against the official covid narrative - is that they're attacked and dismissed. It's actually fascinating for me to watch the mental gymnastics that people like yourself employ in order to avoid listening to certain information from qualified people, while simultaneously deciding in your mind that you're following science by adhering to consensus state thinking.

The above makes absolutely no sense. Supposedly we're talking about prevention yet your statement goes on to mention groups testing positive. Positive as in? So in effect then those little Bangladeshis were using the good doctor's "preventative" special spray and still got COVID? :ROFLMAO:


Notwithstanding the above: so at what point in the proceedings do you start with the "preventative" spray? Do you just start spraying away when you feel it's the right time or AFTER you have signs and symptoms of COVID (in which case it ain't "preventative" let's face it). If would be roughly equivalent to my starting a course of antibiotics today just in case I am going to end up with a secondary bacterial lung infection from pneumonia or bronchitis at some point in the future no?
What makes no sense is you writing this inane comment instead of actually looking at the study or listening to the interview.


I don't even know what the point of this entire thread is i.e. it's turned into a pissing contest seems to me. So I'm out. Feels like a person is arguing with themselves.
Stop responding with dumb comments then.

At least that's what it feels like for me anyway. Expending huge amounts of time and energy about something I really couldn't give less of a shit about (vaccines and vaccine mandates)
If you don't care about vaccine safety and vaccine mandates, especially considering what's happening in our world, then I'm afraid you may be completely dissociating.
 
This thread made me physically ill, I actually got nauseous reading this. The number one thing to always look for first thing when trying to critically view a debate is which side is getting emotional. Emotional almost always equates to a person who’s backed in a corner intellectually and then starts to attack in self defense. It’s very obvious which side is losing their emotional stability over this.

Then when we see how much bias can be inserted into the debate from all this emotion, it’s obvious there’s no amount of logic that will win.

I used to care about the unvaccinated and their health but now I could care less.

And while on the anecdotes, I know multiple people who’ve died from Covid. Not a single person who’s had any complications with the vaccines. I’ve got multiple people close to me in healthcare, they see first hand what’s going on and every person coming in sick is unvaccinated. Every person with long Covid symptoms is unvaccinated. If the vaccines were so dangerous I’m positive I’d know someone with issues.

Foreign influences have done an excellent job finishing off what our horrible US public schools started. It’s almost too easy in this country. Just keep believing those Facebook memes and everything will be ok.

-GC
Same here man. My old coke dealer died from covid... and he was only 40. He was an antivaxxer too. I wonder if he regretting that decision in his last moments. I wish other people would come to their senses before its too late.
 
It's hilarious how the story isn't "damn he should've looked after his health, lost weight, took supplements, exercised and not have done so much coke".
There's this illusion being created where the only marker of health is the vaccine. It's very religious in nature.
 
It's hilarious how the story isn't "damn he should've looked after his health, lost weight, took supplements, exercised and not have done so much coke".
There's this illusion being created where the only marker of health is the vaccine. It's very religious in nature.
... I'm glad you got a good laugh out of the preventable death of my friend.
 
I just think your anger and blame is completely misdirected. I agree his death was preventable but for different reasons.
What anger? What do you mean misdirected? Really dont get what you are talking about. A diet change.. might have made a difference... but we don't know that. What we do know is that 95% of deaths are among the unvaccinated so if there was one variable to point to, that would be it.
 
What anger? What do you mean misdirected? Really dont get what you are talking about. A diet change.. might have made a difference... but we don't know that. What we do know is that 95% of deaths are among the unvaccinated so if there was one variable to point to, that would be it.
That's just incorrect information. Why do we have more cases and deaths this year compared to the same time last year after most people have been vaxxed? The deaths from a seasonal flu virus should've lessened over time. Why was the UK govt recently admitting that 70%+ of their covid hospital deaths were vaxxed?


What I mean by misdirected is saying that a 'covid death' "should've been vaxxed" when there are many other, more important markers of health that people should be aware of with regards to being in a high-risk group. Like why isn't there an obsessive government push to tackle obesity at this moment which is such a significant covid death risk factor? Why would they shut down gyms but leave "essential" poisonous fast-food outlets open? It makes absolutely zero sense to the people who are paying attention and who are actually thinking for themselves.
 
Like why isn't there an obsessive government push to tackle obesity at this moment which is such a significant covid death risk factor? Why would they shut down gyms but leave "essential" poisonous fast-food outlets open? It makes absolutely zero sense to the people who are paying attention and who are actually thinking for themselves.
Addressing obesity isn't profitable for big business and their stocks that our gov't bureaucrats own.
 
If you know anything about VAERS and the nature of vaccine reporting, you'd know that adverse events are worryingly under-reported. Doctors are not encouraged to report truthfully about vaccines, they're much more likely to dismiss any link between an event and a vaccine, especially as more time elapses between the injection and the injury.


AFAIK the report was funded by the Department of Health and Human Services. The researchers from Harvard analyzed and reworked their private healthcare system and found that vaccine injuries were MUCH higher than the BS "one in a million" mantra that the authorities (and everyone else) repeats constantly. When those researchers approached the CDC offering to do the same with the national database - they didn't even return their calls or emails. There are many examples of the governmental health bodies not actually being interested in developing a thorough and comprehensive vaccine injury reporting system. The reason why is because just like the Harvard Pilgrim study, they'd find that vaccine injuries are much more common and prevalent than the public have been led to believe and this obviously would threaten their profits.


If it's not the only one then it's the most comprehensive and it's severely lacking, especially considering that we're injecting these vaccines into almost every baby in the country.
Similar to how the government could do a thorough and comprehensive vaccinated vs unvaccinated statistical comparative study yet they refuse to. The biggest one that I saw (roughly 700 kids) showed that the unvaccinated group possessed much better overall health than the vaccinated group. I'm not surprised by that and I'm sure someone like yourself would try and pick apart the study or find some "gotcha" to dismiss it. But then the question remains, why doesn't the government do the same thing on a national scale? It's because they would find out that unvaccinated people are overall much healthier and suffer from less medical conditions than vaccinated people. Which obviously destroys the entire justification behind the trillion-dollar producing vaccine schedule.


Well I don't know if most people are reasonable so most people get triggered and shut off whenever you even begin to question the ethics behind the vaccine schedule and the lack of safety testing and injury tracking. But that factor of <1% was a report by the HHS and Harvard University. So it's not like this is some randomly speculative number pulled out of the rabbit hole by conspiracy poofters. I did hear that that specific finding was related to the HPV vaccine, but McCullough gives a more specific estimation based on the covid vaccines and he stated 4-5x under-reported. Even the official figures of 20K aren't causing the alarm that it should. The goal should be saving lives, not stopping a virus. If the attempt to save lives ends up killing more people (and especially younger people) than the virus does, then shouldn't we reexamine what we're doing and perhaps consider alternatives or halting the program? Has that ever even been discussed? How many vax deaths would we need to see before that should happen?


That's VAERS bro. That's the accepted, official government statistic for deaths following covid vaccines. I wonder what the true number is.


This right here should discredit and invalidate the entire covid-policy push by governments (strangely all national govts mostly following suit in lock step together).
The changes to our world and societies have been monumental and have severely negatively affected a staggering number of people. So shouldn't there have been the most watertight evidence presented to justify everything that's happened over the past 2 years? I mean simply the globally-coordinated programming mantra of "it's just 15 days to flatten the curve" turned out to be ridiculously inaccurate - so why are people still listening to and trusting the organisations that have blatantly lied and shifted the goalposts in order to increase and maintain the direct power they have over every individual person? How come the average person has no idea that the original computer model projections for how many people would die globally if we didn't lock down, were done by Ferguson at Imperial who was proven to be a fraud with completely dodgy data that vastly overestimated death counts? Not to mention he broke his own covid rules by secretly traveling to fuck his mistress. Funny how politicians don't seem to care to follow the same rules that they inflict on everyone else. I thought they were serious about this pandemic and what they believe would stop the spread and save the world? People need to wake the fuck up already.

After calling into question many previous posts you have made, I want to acknowledge that this one is pretty reasonable and I don’t seen anything shifty.

However, on the matter of 20,000 deaths in VAERS: can you point me to the analysis that demonstrates that the official cause of death, as certified or accepted by the Medical Examiner/Coroner in the relevant case and jurisdiction was ‘Deadly Reaction to Covid Vaccine’ or something similarly conclusive? I’m prepared to believe it, but having looked at the VAERS database I can’t see the evidence for an argument for causation (i.e. Covid vaccination caused death in all probability). It would only be possible to count such cases where some appropriate professional examined both medical history and autopsy results of the individual in question.

It seems that that 20,000 number contains a very high proportion of cases where someone has hypothesised that the vaccination was the immediate cause of death.

As I said, I’m very open-minded to being convinced but I just cannot see that the VAERS dataset provides for such a conclusion.

I do also generally think that the nexus between government, big pharma, and academia is both highly dangerous and and as sketchy as fuck in a general sense. We all knew that before COVID turned up. So this definitely justifies suspicion. I certainly don’t think people who are dubious or suspicious are all cranks and I think vaccine hesitancy is a legitimate position for people to take up temporarily while they develop the knowledge required for informed consent.

However, as I have highlighted a few times in this thread and others the ‘evidence’ circulating that many people claim justifies shifting from a vaccine hesitant position to a definitively anti-vax position does not stand up to scrutiny and in some cases has been unmitigated bullshit when looked at closely. For example, people circulating the document alleged to be an internal Pfizer document containing trials data which was nothing of the sort.

I’m all for continuing the discussion about the safety or otherwise of the COVID vaccines so long as people are a bit more scrupulous about the validity of the data their arguments reset on.
 
After the Conejo Guardian’s report on alarming trends in Ventura County hospitals, more nurses have come forward to affirm the rise in unexplained heart problems, strokes and blood clotting in local vaccinated patient populations. They also say doctors refuse to consider that these could be adverse reactions to Covid shots.....


 
However, on the matter of 20,000 deaths in VAERS: can you point me to the analysis that demonstrates that the official cause of death, as certified or accepted by the Medical Examiner/Coroner in the relevant case and jurisdiction was ‘Deadly Reaction to Covid Vaccine’ or something similarly conclusive? I’m prepared to believe it, but having looked at the VAERS database I can’t see the evidence for an argum
Well I personally don't have the time or the inclination to go through tens of thousands of VAERS submissions.


The latest VAERS data has been published.

Dr. Peter McCullough (@PeterMcCullough) estimates that VAERS is underreported by a factor of "4 to 5".

983,756 Adverse Events
108,572 Hospitalizations
107,860 Urgent Care
12,317 Bell's Palsy
10,429 Heart Attacks
20,560 Myocarditis
34,615 Permanently Disabled
20,622 Deaths

“100% Safe And Effective” 🙄



However, as I have highlighted a few times in this thread and others the ‘evidence’ circulating that many people claim justifies shifting from a vaccine hesitant position to a definitively anti-vax position does not stand up to scrutiny and in some cases has been unmitigated bullshit when looked at closely. For example, people circulating the document alleged to be an internal Pfizer document containing trials data which was nothing of the sort.

I’m all for continuing the discussion about the safety or otherwise of the COVID vaccines so long as people are a bit more scrupulous about the validity of the data their arguments reset on.
You're going to have to be much more specific about your definition of "antivax" if you wish to clearly present your viewpoint. For eg, long before covid came around I was arguing that not one vaccine on the schedule goes through rigorous enough safety testing. Back then, was demanding safer vaccines considered an antivax position? It probably was which shows how the term is meaningless political BS to get people to keep quiet and just accept the vaccine schedule without question. Now since then the term 'antivax' been modified significantly, now if you take every vaccine but oppose vaccine mandate laws - you are considered an antivaxxer. So there's plenty of people out there who are antivaxxers under the new definition who don't even realize.

This speech (with references) is incredibly illuminating with regards to vaccine safety testing and the vaccine industry in general:
The Irrefutable Argument AGAINST Vaccine Safety with Author Del Bigtree
Inbe4 anyone tries to smear Bigtree to avoid watching the clip - he has won court cases against government agencies with regards to vaccine information. So good luck going up against the government, and winning, by using fake science.
 
Dr Robert Malone just had his twitter account suspended. He created mRNA vaccine technology but lately has been very vocally critical over how these drugs are being used.
Why would they censor his speech? Must be saying accurate things that are politically sensitive and threaten the agenda.

This was one of his last tweets before they nuked his account:

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That's just incorrect information. Why do we have more cases and deaths this year compared to the same time last year after most people have been vaxxed? The deaths from a seasonal flu virus should've lessened over time. Why was the UK govt recently admitting that 70%+ of their covid hospital deaths were vaxxed?


What I mean by misdirected is saying that a 'covid death' "should've been vaxxed" when there are many other, more important markers of health that people should be aware of with regards to being in a high-risk group. Like why isn't there an obsessive government push to tackle obesity at this moment which is such a significant covid death risk factor? Why would they shut down gyms but leave "essential" poisonous fast-food outlets open? It makes absolutely zero sense to the people who are paying attention and who are actually thinking for themselves.
Sigh... I think the answer should be obvious. A vaccine injection is easy to do and has a great impact on health outcomes. A war on fast food is messy, it would involve telling private companies how to conduct their business and its just not easy to change a lifestyle, and we dont even know for sure if it would work. Vaccine rollout is an achievable goal with a real world tangible effect and no significant downside. Thats something a government can do... Thats a battle they could win. Telling people what to eat everyday, thats a battle they would lose.
 
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