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Gabapentinoids The Lyrica (Pregabalin) Mega Thread v 2.0

Regenesis2 said:
Search for an article called "Lyrica and neurontin are death sentence to new synapses"
I just saw it the other day.
This is news to me and if it is accurate it would make it a really shitty choice to help someone get through benzo withdrawals or other addictions.
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I posted this in the 'feeling dumber' lyrica thread, in response to the presentation of that article by one poster:

Vaya said:
....not a good article by any stretch, and not nearly scientific enough to be believable. Consider:

Browsing the rest of the website will find you discovering weight-loss advertisements and a general lack of credibility to the content. Articles with dramatic titles like "Neurontin and Lyrica are a death sentence..." rarely provide any citations for the claims they make, and this article is no different.

"However, such uses can no longer be justified because the actual mechanism of the drugs is finally understood and they are creating a significant long-term reduction in nerve health."

What mechanism of action is that? Calcium channel flow reduction resulting in hyperpolarized, and thus less excitable, nerve cells? Or is it the result of more contemporary research? Irregardless of which it is that they omitted, the article still does not cite scientific evidence to explain why pregabalin's "actual mechanism" (which they didn't bother to define) would have any bearing on the "health" of nerve cells at all. For instance, in this context, define "health"? Is that the velocity with which it conducts its signal? is it the strength of axonal growth, re/generative abilities, or myelin integrity that determines the "health" of a nerve cell?

"The researchers in the above study try to downplay the serious nature of the drugs by saying “adult neurons don’t form many new synapses.” That is simply not true. The new science is showing that brain health during aging relies on the formation of new synapses."

I really haven't heard much speculation on the growth of new synapses in adult brains. "New synapses" could only form when a brand new nerve cell generates amongst the cluster of older ones, as a 'synapse' is the space between two separate nerve cells. And new nerve cells in adult brains don't occur very often - the most current research restricts neuronal growth in adult brains to very localized regions of the prefrontal cortex, which means that the researchers the article's author attempts to discredit *are* right. If new synapses form only when new nerve cells appear - an uncommon, unpredictable occurrence - then adult neurons certainly don't form many new synapses.

It's also very heavily biased against the pharmaceutical companies, being that the website claims to sell the "world's best nutritional supplements since 1985," so it makes perfect sense they want to discredit the safety of prescription medications. It is interesting, though, that they happened to target Lyrica and Neurontin with this one.

But. Sorry to go off. It irritates me when some shit-for-brains writer with a hidden agenda presents, as facts, moronic and unsubstantiated claims to the public.
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Also, Cane, bravo for posting that abstract and PR. Just reading the press release re-taught me a whole shitload about synaptogenesis (been a few years since college and clinical neuropsychology lol); I especially liked this part:

"Barres noted that he and his colleagues found that gabapentin does not dissolve pre-existing synapses, but only prevents formation of new ones. That greatly diminishes gabapentin’s potential danger to adults. In mature human brains, astrocytes ordinarily produce very little thrombospondin, and adult neurons don’t form many new synapses, although some new synapses do continue to be formed throughout life — for example, in a part of the brain where new memories are laid down and at sites of injury to neurons, such as occurs after a stroke."

I wonder if this paragraph provides implications for the idea that chronic use of either gabapentin or pregabalin may permanently impair memory encoding in adults when a multiple-year model of study would be used. I'm 25, and it's difficult to gage where an adolescent brain becomes an 'adult' brain - thus signaling the end of major new synaptogenesis and tissue plasticity in the brain. The short-term deficits in memory that I, and almost every other lyrica user here, have complained about must be caused by a2-d1 activation, but at the same time, it isn't the synapses that are being affected. Or maybe they are, in another in/direct manner. I dislike being the guinea pig, but nevertheless, THANK YOU for the wonderful abstract and press release!!!!

~ vaya
 
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I discovered that Cane's nice article is available as free text, and really worth reading (if you're a neuroscience/neuropsychology freak like I am) and is available with the click of your mouse.

Credit goes to Cane for finding it in the first place, though. I wouldn't have known where to begin looking for such an article :D

~ vaya
 
^I can't take any credit for finding that... I just googled the article that regenesis mentioned... all thanks should be directed his way.

Great contributions (as always), vaya.
 
i tried Lyrica for the first time today. early this morning, i was coming down from a moderate D-AMP binge and trying to decide if i should dose more Dex or try to go to sleep. i had some Lyrica sitting around but had no idea what it was and what it did. eventually read a post saying it worked well for stimulant comedowns. decided to take 150mg. instead of more Amps. i was amazed at how incredibly well it worked. easily the best substance for dealing with such. kills Clonidine. kills opie's. kills benzos. it's a dream come true.
 
^ good to hear.
it also provides a high to most people who seek it, it is addicting and w/d's from it are horrible and dangerous (kinda like benzos) so now that you have discovered this med i would save it for exactly what you used it for, stim come downs.. you don't wanna abuse it and become dependant.
just lookin out for your best interest.

-HOOD
 
^ good looking out. i'm right with you. i'm going to use to exclusively for stim comedowns. i would hate to develop a tolerance to such a helpful drug.
 
I tried lyrica at diff points on diff doses with mixed results. Sometimes didn't have an empty stomach. Experienced mostly nothing besides a hazy stupor 12hrs later when I woke up. Till I discovered the right dose and to dose on an empty stomach. I then went on a lil binge. N tolerance rose high that week. It's a hard high to bump after the first initial 4-7hrs. N 2 days in a row is very hit or miss. To get good results 4 the day after required empty stomach and an increase in dosing from 7-800mg to 1g or more. After a wk or 2 I blew threw 60 pills and tolerance and rebound anxiety AND insomnia. So watch out crew!
 
Right, well it's been a good 6 weeks since my last post and thought I would update on how I'm getting on this drug. I'm taking it under the directions of my GP; to be used in conjunction with CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy). I originally started on 75mg a day and have rapidly developed a tolerance and am now taking 400mg daily.

I'm not sure how high I will go in dose but my doc seems to be very happy throwing them at me. My mood has stabilised and I feel a lot happier so they must be doing something right.

As for effects on higher than usual doses, I must report that one night I took around 700mg to try and get a bit high and at first I didn't notice anything. I sat there watching a film and suddenely when I stood up I realised I was feeling incredibly euphoric, and I mean seriously euphoric, up there with MDMA and Psilocybin but in a different way that's hard to explain, less of a head fuck and more of a pure body buzz. It was really exciting and highly enjoyable, obviously LOL. ;) I wish I could get that feeling from it all the time, I'm not sure what I done different as I took that amount before and never got euphoria like that.

So yeah, I just wanted to confirm that the people in this thread who said they experience intense euphria weren't embelishing the truth. You can get pretty high of this stuff!

I just hope my brain doesn't rot if I end up on this for 6 months or so, and I also hope I don't get any w/d symptoms, I'll keep you updated guys. :)
 
^Hey man it sounds like we are in similar positions. Bi-polar perhaps? Regardless watch out because tolerance grows FAST (at least for me) because I could take a whole script of it stupid fast and not have any withdrawal, no negatives, except for some twitching on early high doses but it wasn't that bad.

It feels like I'm rolling on in now and I popped 2000mg on a full stomach. I've taken more than that but get best effects around 1400mg. I'm just stupid and can't get over the "more pills are more fun" mentality.

Just watch out and be careful because some people talk about bad wd's and if you are trying to be stable and are doing CBT your goal should not include getting high. You will probably have best results if taken as directed honestly.
 
I tried Lyrica twice and did'nt really like it. I only took 500mg the first time and then 700mg the next time.
 
So I don't post much here, more of an observer.

But Lyrica is very safe at high doses IMO.

2PM - Took 6 x 100mg tabs - felt an okay rush
4pm- Took 6 more tabs
6pm - Getting ready for an hour & 1/2 drive, I popped in 800mg
*felt good* not great but good
12:30am - Taking 1g as I type this

I've taken these practically since they came out. My ex-girlfriend got them for nerve damage. I miss the 300mg's x 3 per day. 100mg x 3 per day.

So I don't do them daily. But today is day number 2 since I got the bottle.


I find you develop a tolerance VERY quickly to this.

I am considering downing the entire bottle as a test to see how safe they are.

I have about 40-50 pills left.

Hah, but no it would be a waste. Taking 1g... wishing I had an IV.


*Peace from*

Raoul Duke
 
You serious about downing a whole bottle? That could be fatal please don't do!

@ luxurious beagle:

Nah, I'm not Bi-Polar, I think I suffer from ADHD tbh and a chemical imbalance which I think is a lack of Dopamine. I've been taking L-Tyrosine supplements (500mg) and Pregabalin now for a 7-8 weeks odd and I feel much better, no social hang ups like I had before it really is a drug that works for me on doses of 400mg per day.

The only thing is I just feel a bit....dense on it. It's like you can feel it eating away at your IQ, maybe that's just me being a little scared after reading some of the comments on here saying it will cause brain damage and that it inhibits certain neurotransmitters vital to learning etc.

I hope I'll be ok because this drug makes me feel good, and I don't have to resort to evil benzo's which don't allow you to enjoy life same way.

Be safe peeps. :)
 
I have fibromyalgia and was prescribed Lyrica back in August. I was supposed to take one 75mg capsule per day. I feel it is far from recreational for me. Instead of putting my mind at ease and in a gentle hypnotic state like I've heard from so many people here, instead it made me *really* anxious and confused. I thought oncoming traffic was driving head on towards me in my lane while driving. It definitely made me feel dumb as hell too - something I hate. I just don't like not being able to articulate my thoughts. It's sad though really, because it gives me so much relief from my neck, shoulder and lower back pain from FMS. I'm going to try to take it again because I've been hurting real bad the past week.

Anyone else had this kind of experience with Lyrica? Specifically the anxiety? It seems odd that a drug like this that is approved for treatment of GAD would cause intense anxiety. Maybe it's just me.
 
Yeah I can relate to that. When I first started taking Pregabalin at 75mg I got anxious/confused feeling. Eventually those feelings stopped, you need to give it a bit of a chance for your body to get used to it so you can move up to the high doses as I think that is where this drugs starts coming into it's own.

Remember, I suffer from anxiety on a daily basis and I am totally familiar with the feelings you describe, but this drug has really helped me. When I was first taking 75mg it felt quite strong to me and I wondered how other people here at Bluelight were taking does in the 400/600mg range (let alone 1 gram and beyond, lol you nutters). But I am taking those doses and beyond now and I do not get anxious, it removes my anxiety. I think you need to just ride it through, it's like quite a lot of drugs actually, Tramadol being a good example, it's shit when you first take it, cause dyspohria, anxiety etc etc but when you ride through that from taking it regularly all these symptoms disappear and the real benefits of the drug start to show their face.
 
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ThePharmicist said:
Anyone else had this kind of experience with Lyrica? Specifically the anxiety? It seems odd that a drug like this that is approved for treatment of GAD would cause intense anxiety. Maybe it's just me.
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Regarding anxiety, lyrica is amazing for me. It makes me happy and removes anxiety. I was diagnosed with GAD four years back, and have been taking lyrica for a couple years sporadically. Just like a poster above mine is prescribed to my girlfriend who rarely uses it for her back injury. She mostly uses her methadone and percoset and gives the lyrica to me. I usually finish a bottle of 120 100mg in a week.

The first day I take 1400 mg and feel fantastic for two days. The next time I take it I take like 2g and feel good. Then I just finish the bottle over time popping here and there, being stupid knowing its not really gonna help. Then once a few months ago I didnt have any for a month and got 500mg and it really helped in a number of ways and I had a pretty good high actually.

I've thought about just popping the bottle too just to see what happens, but then I though hmm that's either a)going to do nothing b)really fuck me up (likely to fuck me up in a bad way like with motor control or stupidity factor) or c) kill me

So yea you can take a ton of lyrica and not have any/many problems. But keep in mind my gf started getting them two years ago so I have been taking them for a while. I have never had wds from it. I started taking 75 mg and then 150mg which totally messed me up in a great way. Then I went to 300 and it made me feel crappy. Then I went to 650 and felt great. The rest is history.

For people not liking lyrica: lyrica is all about getting the dose right. It varies greatly depending on how long you've taken it, how recently you've taken it, and what your body is like.

And finally regarding feeling stupid and lyrica preventing neurons from forming: early on I felt stupid on it - I couldn't even speak properly - I would try to say something like "I saw a screwdriver on the bench" and I'll say "I saw a spoon on the form" Like it's not even screwing the word up it's changing it entirely and seemingly at random. That happens very infrequently though. And sometimes I actually feel smarter or more sharp on it. I was learning sign language with my girl and we were practicing and reviewing for her test. I literally learned everything she had learned in the past month in a night. My reading outloud with spot on and quick, regardless of the sentence length/structure or word difficulty. But really with everything it comes down to dose and how long you've tried it.

To ThePharmacist: Do you just take 75mg a day or is it PO BID or what? If it is only 75mg a day and it is helping your pain but messing up your mind, then I would suggest opening the capsule and dumping out the powder and then dividing it into three even piles. Try taking one or two of the piles at a time and see if that helps your pain without messing up your mind. You may just be hypersensitive to it. Let me know how long you've been on it and what exactly you take during the day and maybe I can help you. Good luck!
 
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Do doctors actually prescribe this for anxiety and stuff or does everyone who uses it for that get it from someone with nerve pain?
 
Ph0r.W3-R-m4ny said:
Do doctors actually prescribe this for anxiety and stuff or does everyone who uses it for that get it from someone with nerve pain?
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I don't know anyone first person that gets it for anxiety, but I've read that a few bluelight members get it prescribed off-label for anxiety.
 
I have seen it available in Europe for anxiety but not here, it it just a money thing with the pharmaceutical companies? Like they are afraid to lose money or something? It seems well established that it works for GAD based on it's success over seas
 
luxurious beagle said:
To ThePharmacist: Do you just take 75mg a day or is it PO BID or what? If it is only 75mg a day and it is helping your pain but messing up your mind, then I would suggest opening the capsule and dumping out the powder and then dividing it into three even piles. Try taking one or two of the piles at a time and see if that helps your pain without messing up your mind. You may just be hypersensitive to it. Let me know how long you've been on it and what exactly you take during the day and maybe I can help you. Good luck!
Click to expand...

I don't take it that often, only when my pain is really bad. I've had a whole bottle of it since August. I took it for 4 days straight as prescribed - 75mg once daily. It seemed like I would be okay for about 3-hours then the confusion and anxiety would set in, as well as the social awkwardness. I just decided it wasn't worth it due to the adverse effects. Since my pain has been really bad lately I'm thinking of taking it again. Right now I'm prescribed Neurontin 300mg x3 daily and that isn't really doing shit. Perhaps now that I have a tolerance to Neurontin, the Lyrica may work better for me. Maybe I'll try taking a small dose today and report back.
 
personally got mixed results from lyrica whats are anyones opinions on them compared to gapapentin which i have a chance to try but would like some feedback first cheers
 
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