I am aware I have posted bits and peces of this before so forgive repetition. I feel it necessary to almalgamte my various and desparate musings!
A little too late for most now, but here goes, Mods feel free to move where needed also, just the prevalence of G in eadd made me choose this forum.
Not being know in these parts for my moderation, I was surprised to learn of the use of sodium oxybate in Europe to assist in not just short but longer abstinence therapy. Essentially a healthier substitute for alcohol without the toxicity and general nuttiness of benzodiazepines. is the slipperiest slope. Remember these are detox agents used on those of an addictive nature and also have recreational value.
When I first tried GHB it was amazing, euphoric anxiolytic, everything I needed.
It was okay at first. Couple of times a week. Then ,I, like others, abused it 24/7 for three weeks. Bit jttery on the withdrawal but I’ve had worse.
But the fool returns to his folly as a dog does to his own vomit!
As anybody who has ever been addicted knows, your body remembers and each time the rattle is harder. The second time bad, third time worse still. The final time we were stuck after 3 weeks of 24/7. Here in the U.K. its easy and legal to get hold of GBL ; damned cheap too. But we were stuck with it. After two hours since each last dose it was unbearable anxiety, shakes and vomits.
Easy as it is to get GHB in the UK you CANNOT get hold of benzos, even if withdrawing you have to prove you can taper. Only ever given for DT's for alcoholics (usually impatient) and then after a point they will give up. I asked my Dr for 40mg of diazepam to come off GHB. She didn’t know what it was, so, this being my only hope, I said that the GHB is just something I’ve been using while I drink 2 bottles of vodka a day! She said to get in touch with the drug clinic and would arrange for alcohol worker to arrange for a visit to my home. I explained I am in early twenties and staying with my folks briefly, would it be possible rather to visit the worker each day as I needed it keeping confidential. She declined and the next day parents were told about my drug use and the strange fact I had been drinking 2 bottles of vodka a day. I told them I hide it well and have special mints. Hypocratic oath my arse. The alcohol worker was due to visit in 2 week, but I was doubting how much my kidneys were gonna take 50 grams of sodium a day!
I told the drug counsellor at the local drug clinic I was addicted to GHB. She gave me a funny look, then told me it is impossible, GHB is liquid ecstasy And that or any amphetamines are not addictive at all! I may be psychotically craving the stuff, but the best thing to do would be to go home, let the ecstasy wear off and get some sleep. I had not sleep for 2 days due to withdrawal!
I maintainded the terrible GHB regime for a few days trying desperately to taper. Many of you will know it can be protracted and distressing especially for those prone to panic attacks.
A few days later I stopped and got some diphenhydramine ,a sleep aid.. I knew I’d still be jittery but I might get drowsy at least. Also 2 bottles of wine to assist in GABA agonist withdrawals. I took twice the recommended dose of sleep aid, but not too many being educated in the dangers of anti-cholinergenics. Last thing I needed was ghb withdrawal and delirium! The choline thing will later prove to be crucial.
Last dose having tapered to 4 grams every 3 hours. 75mg of diphenhydramine and 3 glasses of wine. 2 hours nothing, 3 hours nothing. 4 then 5. I did’t know what happened but a bottle of wine and 150mg of diphenhydramine spaced out worked..
Here’s my best explanation, although I am no scientist. It has been suggested GHB binds to gaba and controls release of dopamine. This is a subject of some contention.
What is true of all reports is that GHB shows that each dose raises levels pf a neurotransmitter called acetylcholine Its mechanism , amongst others, is that it controls the contraction of muscle tissue (ring any bells?) and is also responsible for REM sleep (incidentally the sleep responsible for growth hprmone release.) It is also vital for memeory and learning (in itself connected to REM sleep)
I think by now you know what I am getting at. The rem sleep cycle is usually shorter, but with these massive levels of acetylcholine, they are long vivid and memorable. Ring any bells to users of GHB?These high levels of acetylcholine are being inhibited by GHBs affinity for the GABA centre. Take one dose, you are high but relaxed, as its affinity for GABA wears off you feel wired, rather like the stimulant effect of having had a cigarette. Nicotine IIRC correctly has its stimulant effect due to raised acetycholine (amongst other factors), and is also a potent pesticide because it prevents ther breakdown of acetylcholine. Nicotine too, can be highly addictive.
Now if you have been suppressing these levels of acetycholine for a while you are in big trouble. It always interested me that strictly speaking it was not like withdrawal from drugs like benzos and alcohol. It would build quicker too. There was something jittery about I the withdrawal, eyes watering stuffed nose ,twitching.
In conclusion my laymans belief then is that the withdrawal is both GABAdownregulation ( Although I can take massive amounts of benzos and booze for weeks and merely feel shakey). But also the raised levels of acetylcholine must play a part. Essentially raised levels of this neurotransmitter are used by many nerve agents and pesticides by preventing its breakdown.
Again someone correct my laymans neurochemistry. Just trying to find out why diphenhydramine shoul work.
Solution in absence of benzos is 1 unit alcohol an hour and 75mg diphenydramine every 4 hours until symptoms desist.
A little too late for most now, but here goes, Mods feel free to move where needed also, just the prevalence of G in eadd made me choose this forum.
Not being know in these parts for my moderation, I was surprised to learn of the use of sodium oxybate in Europe to assist in not just short but longer abstinence therapy. Essentially a healthier substitute for alcohol without the toxicity and general nuttiness of benzodiazepines. is the slipperiest slope. Remember these are detox agents used on those of an addictive nature and also have recreational value.
When I first tried GHB it was amazing, euphoric anxiolytic, everything I needed.
It was okay at first. Couple of times a week. Then ,I, like others, abused it 24/7 for three weeks. Bit jttery on the withdrawal but I’ve had worse.
But the fool returns to his folly as a dog does to his own vomit!
As anybody who has ever been addicted knows, your body remembers and each time the rattle is harder. The second time bad, third time worse still. The final time we were stuck after 3 weeks of 24/7. Here in the U.K. its easy and legal to get hold of GBL ; damned cheap too. But we were stuck with it. After two hours since each last dose it was unbearable anxiety, shakes and vomits.
Easy as it is to get GHB in the UK you CANNOT get hold of benzos, even if withdrawing you have to prove you can taper. Only ever given for DT's for alcoholics (usually impatient) and then after a point they will give up. I asked my Dr for 40mg of diazepam to come off GHB. She didn’t know what it was, so, this being my only hope, I said that the GHB is just something I’ve been using while I drink 2 bottles of vodka a day! She said to get in touch with the drug clinic and would arrange for alcohol worker to arrange for a visit to my home. I explained I am in early twenties and staying with my folks briefly, would it be possible rather to visit the worker each day as I needed it keeping confidential. She declined and the next day parents were told about my drug use and the strange fact I had been drinking 2 bottles of vodka a day. I told them I hide it well and have special mints. Hypocratic oath my arse. The alcohol worker was due to visit in 2 week, but I was doubting how much my kidneys were gonna take 50 grams of sodium a day!
I told the drug counsellor at the local drug clinic I was addicted to GHB. She gave me a funny look, then told me it is impossible, GHB is liquid ecstasy And that or any amphetamines are not addictive at all! I may be psychotically craving the stuff, but the best thing to do would be to go home, let the ecstasy wear off and get some sleep. I had not sleep for 2 days due to withdrawal!
I maintainded the terrible GHB regime for a few days trying desperately to taper. Many of you will know it can be protracted and distressing especially for those prone to panic attacks.
A few days later I stopped and got some diphenhydramine ,a sleep aid.. I knew I’d still be jittery but I might get drowsy at least. Also 2 bottles of wine to assist in GABA agonist withdrawals. I took twice the recommended dose of sleep aid, but not too many being educated in the dangers of anti-cholinergenics. Last thing I needed was ghb withdrawal and delirium! The choline thing will later prove to be crucial.
Last dose having tapered to 4 grams every 3 hours. 75mg of diphenhydramine and 3 glasses of wine. 2 hours nothing, 3 hours nothing. 4 then 5. I did’t know what happened but a bottle of wine and 150mg of diphenhydramine spaced out worked..
Here’s my best explanation, although I am no scientist. It has been suggested GHB binds to gaba and controls release of dopamine. This is a subject of some contention.
What is true of all reports is that GHB shows that each dose raises levels pf a neurotransmitter called acetylcholine Its mechanism , amongst others, is that it controls the contraction of muscle tissue (ring any bells?) and is also responsible for REM sleep (incidentally the sleep responsible for growth hprmone release.) It is also vital for memeory and learning (in itself connected to REM sleep)
I think by now you know what I am getting at. The rem sleep cycle is usually shorter, but with these massive levels of acetylcholine, they are long vivid and memorable. Ring any bells to users of GHB?These high levels of acetylcholine are being inhibited by GHBs affinity for the GABA centre. Take one dose, you are high but relaxed, as its affinity for GABA wears off you feel wired, rather like the stimulant effect of having had a cigarette. Nicotine IIRC correctly has its stimulant effect due to raised acetycholine (amongst other factors), and is also a potent pesticide because it prevents ther breakdown of acetylcholine. Nicotine too, can be highly addictive.
Now if you have been suppressing these levels of acetycholine for a while you are in big trouble. It always interested me that strictly speaking it was not like withdrawal from drugs like benzos and alcohol. It would build quicker too. There was something jittery about I the withdrawal, eyes watering stuffed nose ,twitching.
In conclusion my laymans belief then is that the withdrawal is both GABAdownregulation ( Although I can take massive amounts of benzos and booze for weeks and merely feel shakey). But also the raised levels of acetylcholine must play a part. Essentially raised levels of this neurotransmitter are used by many nerve agents and pesticides by preventing its breakdown.
Again someone correct my laymans neurochemistry. Just trying to find out why diphenhydramine shoul work.
Solution in absence of benzos is 1 unit alcohol an hour and 75mg diphenydramine every 4 hours until symptoms desist.
![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
