☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy Scale / Balance Thread - Part 2.000±

[Blue Druid]

Thanks for the ebay tip Transform, sadly I missed out on that one though.

As I've recently come to the conclusion that I need a more accurate set of scales than cheap noname Chinese scales I've decided to invest in a serious set of mg scales and I wanted to ask some advice, both on specific makes & on general issues:

1) Is there any way to tell from the specifications of a scale how well it'll work, how accurate, how much drift, etc or is my only method of assessing quality going to be personal recommendations & reviews?

2) I'd assume that as scales are very precise carefully calibrated tools they can be easily damaged or thrown off in their measurements. If this is the case it suggests that it'd be risky to have a scale shipped a long distance in the post, like from USA to UK as it'd be more likely to get bashed about & become less precise. Is my thinking right on this & should I be looking for a domestic scale rather than ordering from overseas?

3) What's the chances of a precise mg scale being thrown off by normal domestic postal delivery?

4) Is there generally much benefit in getting a calibration certificate for the scales?

5) Is there a general list of particular scale/balance manufacturers or makes/models with indications as to which are good & bad? I've been reading the thread but it's a long thread.

6) I've seen some references to the proximity of mobile phones causing problems with scales. Is this for real, & if so what's happening there & will wi-fi or bluetooth in the house upset the scales?

I've been trawling the net for different accurate & reliable mg scales that're affordable (~£200) but at present I don't know how to tell the good from tha bad other than general appearance & price, which isn't going to be the best method. If someone can give me some pointers on the above points It'd help to narrow things down, I'll probably post a few links/specs up for comments later on too.

Thanks, & apologies if these questions have been answered already further up the thread.

 

[Predecessor]

The Gemini has never let this Gemini down

 

[crOOk]

This is the Mettler B5, manufactured in 1947, which I bought 9 years ago for 30 EUR off ebay. I paid another 80 EUR in gas to go pick it up and in retrospect it was the best I could have ever gotten for that money.

Precision is 30ug, so it isn't very hard to measure out 200 hundred micrograms, should the situation ever call for it. :D

I also love how the whole thing is completely mechanical, except for the light bulb in the back. Whatever breaks can be fixed without any training. One day, I will marry her.

 

[Zehst]

This is the Mettler B5, manufactured in 1947, which I bought 9 years ago for 30 EUR off ebay. I paid another 80 EUR in gas to go pick it up and in retrospect it was the best I could have ever gotten for that money.

Precision is 30ug, so it isn't very hard to measure out 200 hundred micrograms, should the situation ever call for it. :D

I also love how the whole thing is completely mechanical, except for the light bulb in the back. Whatever breaks can be fixed without any training. One day, I will marry her.

That looks amazing man!

 

[Transform]

As I've recently come to the conclusion that I need a more accurate set of scales than cheap noname Chinese scales I've decided to invest in a serious set of mg scales and I wanted to ask some advice, both on specific makes & on general issues:

IMHO, if you're going to upgrade, seek 0.1mg precision

1) Is there any way to tell from the specifications of a scale how well it'll work, how accurate, how much drift, etc or is my only method of assessing quality going to be personal recommendations & reviews?

Depends on the manufacturer. A big brand will have technical specifications which you can look at.

2) I'd assume that as scales are very precise carefully calibrated tools they can be easily damaged or thrown off in their measurements. If this is the case it suggests that it'd be risky to have a scale shipped a long distance in the post, like from USA to UK as it'd be more likely to get bashed about & become less precise. Is my thinking right on this & should I be looking for a domestic scale rather than ordering from overseas?

That's correct. I would avoid shipping internationally unless you are buying new. (In which case the manufacturer should have good packaging.) Modern (smaller and lighter) balances have less inertia and would be less susceptible to shipping damage.

3) What's the chances of a precise mg scale being thrown off by normal domestic postal delivery?

Who knows. I sent a balance by courier once and it looked like it had somehow come out of the box and fallen from a fair height. It was not repairable.

4) Is there generally much benefit in getting a calibration certificate for the scales?

I must confess I've never bothered. Cheap mg ones are not reliable enough and 0.1mg precision has meant that it's probably not necessary for measuring 10mg+. Additionally, it's very expensive.

5) Is there a general list of particular scale/balance manufacturers or makes/models with indications as to which are good & bad? I've been reading the thread but it's a long thread.

Ohaus, salter, A&D, certainly others too

6) I've seen some references to the proximity of mobile phones causing problems with scales. Is this for real, & if so what's happening there & will wi-fi or bluetooth in the house upset the scales?

Not something I've ever experienced or heard of personally.

I've been trawling the net for different accurate & reliable mg scales that're affordable (~£200) but at present I don't know how to tell the good from tha bad other than general appearance & price, which isn't going to be the best method. If someone can give me some pointers on the above points It'd help to narrow things down, I'll probably post a few links/specs up for comments later on too.

Reliable brands is about all there is to go on, though even little-known brands probably produce decent kit. As I've said before, I'd recommend biding your time and buying second hand.

 

[Blue Druid]

Thanks,
Ideally I'd get 0.1mg precision but it's matter of cost as they tend to be well outside my pricerange. Still take your point I'll keep my eyes open and see if I can spot any bargains 2nd hand.

 

[Blue Druid]

This is the Mettler B5, manufactured in 1947, which I bought 9 years ago for 30 EUR off ebay. I paid another 80 EUR in gas to go pick it up and in retrospect it was the best I could have ever gotten for that money.

Precision is 30ug, so it isn't very hard to measure out 200 hundred micrograms, should the situation ever call for it. :D

I also love how the whole thing is completely mechanical, except for the light bulb in the back. Whatever breaks can be fixed without any training. One day, I will marry her.

Looks good Crook,
How much is involved in repairing/maintaining and calibrating mechanical scales like that? and can you really get it as accurate as an electronic digital scale. I see a few of these on ebay so I'm curious as to whether their useability/user friendlieess & reliabiliy

 

[crOOk]

Looks good Crook,
How much is involved in repairing/maintaining and calibrating mechanical scales like that? and can you really get it as accurate as an electronic digital scale. I see a few of these on ebay so I'm curious as to whether their useability/user friendlieess & reliabiliy

Well, I used to keep it hidden from my parents and move it back and forth very very frequently (daily). Now I keep it in the cellar away from my daughter. So whenever I need it (which is pretty rare these days) I still have to move it around a lot. Despite this nothing has ever broken or required me to use tools for fixing it.

If anything goes wrong during the transport, you just have to remove the top lid and check if the weights are still hanging properly lol. If the light bulb ever breaks, I'm sure a replacement could be found.
So basically, nothing in there ever required serious maintenance at all. IF something broke one of these days, I'm pretty confident it could be fixed easily, since it's a very simple mechanical setup.

The only thing you gotta do before using it (unless you haven't moved it around since the last use) is adjust the height of it's 3 feet by turning them, so it is perfectly level before you start measuring (there's a water level integrated, you are not able to see it on the picture).

As for it's accuracy, I don't think it has lost any of it throughout the decades. I can still tare it to zero and measure out 100ug with +-30ug precision if I feel like it. For that you have to make sure it stands on firm ground though. If you move around too much during the measuring process, the scale won't be level anymore and that will change the reading. This is however not an issue if you plan to measure out 5mg.

I'd take a scale like this over today's digital trash (excuse me, owners and manufacturers of digital scales) that won't last through the next decade ANY DAY and would warmly recommend you to get one, too, if you have been considering it! The thing is a fucking gem, I love it. Price is around 200 bucks on ebay now.

EDIT: Btw 0.1mg precision means, your measured weight of 5mg could be anywhere between 4.9 and 5.1mg, right?

 

[Transform]

I'd take a scale like this over today's digital trash (excuse me, owners and manufacturers of digital scales) that won't last through the next decade ANY DAY and would warmly recommend you to get one, too, if you have been considering it! The thing is a fucking gem, I love it. Price is around 200 bucks on ebay now.

My 0.01 mg set was £400 and I've had two 0.1 mg sets between at £150 and £250.
Newer ones are £400-500 but weigh much less and are more compact.

EDIT: Btw 0.1 mg precision means, your measured weight of 5 mg could be anywhere between 4.9 and 5.1 mg, right?

Perhaps 0.1 mg readability would be a better way to phrase it. Your display would read 5.0 mg and the accuracy would probably be 0.05 mg, in which case your measurement would be 4.95 mg-5.05 mg

 

[crOOk]

My 0.01 mg set was £400

Ok well that's nice. Is it really that precise?

 

[Blue Druid]

CrOOk, if you don't mind I've a few questions.
I like the idea of a low-tech repairable but accurate microgram scale but most of what I see on ebay is spares or repair with no guarantee of its working state or repairability so I'm trying to get a better idea to judge these on.
Does yours have an electrical cable in the back & if so is the bulb the only electrical component? I've seen a few on ebay that were discontinued in the 70s or 80s so I'm concerned they'll have more of an electrical reliance.

How does the last image in this listing compare to yours
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/270524792895?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

With your model to what extent can you vary the readout display, I note there's only one digit after the decimal point.

Are there any mechanical parts of your scale which are easily removeable, unclippable or detachable, which I'd expect would probably be the most likely to go missing in any model on ebay

Any other parts that might be prone to damage?

Thanks

 

[Transform]

Ok well that's nice. Is it really that precise?

It's a proper mettler balance, so if I have it on a stable surface and let it warm up then I've no reason to doubt it.

BlueDruid - With all due respect to CrOOk - I've had nothing but good experiences with my digital balances and paid about the same as what you're proposing to spend on what appears to be an antique to me. With ordinary good care there is no need for maintenance.

 

[Blue Druid]

Just considering options Transform, I'm not planning to rush into buying something that pricey, digital or mechanical, without making sure it's suitable.

 

[MagickalKat777]

My scale says it weighs up to 20g in 0.001g (1mg)
It weighs g, oz, ct, ozt, dwt, and gn. I've been using dwt for 1mg and so far the caps look pretty accurate. Is dwt the right mode for 1mg?

You should be using g for grams, not dwt which is pennyweight. 1 pennyweight = 1.55517384 grams so your calculations are all off quite a bit if you're using the .001 dwt readout. 1mg would read out on that scale as 0.0006 which isn't an option so really you would be at 0.0012 which would be 2mg. In other words, by using dwt, you're WAY off.

Also, those types of scales are not suitable for measuring 1mg. I would trust them to be +/- 2mg at the most and only at and beyond 10mg or more.

 

[crOOk]

BlueDruid - With all due respect to CrOOk - I've had nothing but good experiences with my digital balances and paid about the same as what you're proposing to spend on what appears to be an antique to me. With ordinary good care there is no need for maintenance.

You're probably right, I've jsut got a thing for old stuff. Btw I only paid 30 EUR, not 400. :D

 

[Transform]

My budget balance has packed up already after a few months. I went to weigh something and noticed that the weighing boat seemed much lighter than normal. When I weighed a 10 mg item on them it registered as 5mg! Could have been a close call.
I will not get this style of balance again; they need twice as many batteries (not clear if they last longer as a result though) and generally seem to not be made as well. For the extra £2 I will be returning to other style of budget balance for my portable set.

Style 1 (broken)

Style 2:

plmar: I would recommend getting the second balance I've listed here. It weighs down to 0.001mg and costs £9.50

 

[Bob Loblaw]

^I also had the second one. It worked great for me until it got stolen. I'm thinking about ordering a new one soon though.

 

[Transform]

For £10 I really think more people should have them.They obviously don't compare to a 0.1mg balance but for the money they are indispensable.

 

[Xorkoth]

Style 1 (broken)

Style 2:

plmar: I would recommend getting the second balance I've listed here. It weighs down to 0.001mg and costs £9.50

Agreed. I have the 2nd scale listed and it's indeed very cheap ($19.99 in US dollars I got it for, on Amazon). It works fine for the price, the first few mgs don't usually read BUT what I do is I put the tray on and don't tare it, it reads 2.5 grams roughly (it reads 2.050 grams). Then I can weigh out even 1mg increments because every mg is being read up there. I still like to measure several times and make sure it usually reads to the desired weight, because it varies slightly, it's not perfect. It's very good for liquid measurement because even if it's off by 1 or 2 mg, it will make virtually no difference when spread over make doses.

 

[Blue Druid]

I had style 1 & it got increasingly inaccurate the longer I had it, with technical faults appearing too (tare broken, on off iffy). I recently got type 2 & it's accurate for now but I don't expect it to last.