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Dissociatives The Big & Dandy Deschloroketamine Thread

roi

roi

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 2, 2013
Messages
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Deschloroketamine.png


2-(Methylamino)-2-phenylcyclohexanone

Not totally novel, but there was no dedicated thread for it and it seems to be around again. Quote from adder in 2011:

Well, 2-(methylamino)-2-phenylcyclohexanone actually existed (not sure if it's still an impurity in ketamine or not, or if it is/was sold as ketamine anywhere, I'm guessing the UK is the biggest "K market", but I think lazy asses preferred to start with plain benzonitrile) on black market and it's simply called deschloroketamine. It's more potent mass/mass compared to ketamine and effects are much more PCP-like, maybe not counting bodyload. It's not really so "wild" as tiletamine, I mean I'd rather describe it as a plain dull dissociative, definitely not psychedelic, not at all. Sure, it's possible to go "holing" but it's not the same after all.

So unfortunately, both 2-(methylamino)-2-phenylcyclohexanone and 2-(ethylamino)-2-phenylcyclohexanone wouldn't get much of attention in manner of longer time. That's my experience with lab grade deschloroketamine.
Click to expand...

edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deschloroketamine
 
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2-OxO-PCM, I see! This should be interesting. Desoxyket (2-Chloro-PCM) would be more interesting though...
 
wish i could get my hands on some of this, dissociatives are my favorite drug
 
adder said:
Well, 2-(methylamino)-2-phenylcyclohexanone actually existed (not sure if it's still an impurity in ketamine or not, or if it is/was sold as ketamine anywhere, I'm guessing the UK is the biggest "K market", but I think lazy asses preferred to start with plain benzonitrile) on black market and it's simply called deschloroketamine. It's more potent mass/mass compared to ketamine and effects are much more PCP-like, maybe not counting bodyload. It's not really so "wild" as tiletamine, I mean I'd rather describe it as a plain dull dissociative, definitely not psychedelic, not at all. Sure, it's possible to go "holing" but it's not the same after all..
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That actually sounds to me like a contender for whatever is being sold in the UK at the moment, and has been ever since the clamp-down in India. It sometimes gets called tiletamine, but given the occasional scarcity of this substance (regular droughts), the legality of tiletamine, and the fact it is claimed to be manufactured in China, I seriously doubt that.

Whatever it is, it is not psychedelic, is very dull, somewhat negative, and lacks the detailed CEV's induced by ketamine. It's also completely lacking any k-hole. You just kind of blackout for a while. People often call it blackout ket. Horrible stuff.

Either way, I'm certain we are being sold some kind of dissociative analogue. I don't believe it is just another isomer.
 
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Found on the interweb:
(A) = 2-ethylamino-2-phenylcyclohexanone
(B) = 2-methylamino-2-phenylcyclohexanone

in this patent: Patent FR2973M the activities of those compounds against PCP are claimed:


4+ = very good activity
3+ = good activity
2+ = weak activity
+-= thresold of effects


(A):

- on pigeons (birds) (dose mg/kg):

100: 4+ ; 50: 4+ ; 25: 4+ ; 12.5: 4+ ; 6.3: 3-4+ ; 3: 1+ ; 1.5: +-

- on apes (% relative on PCP):

potency: 60%
duration: 60%


(B):

- on pigeons (birds) (dose mg/kg):

100: 4+ ; 50: 4+ ; 25: 4+ ; 12.5: 2-3+ ; 6.3: 2+ ; 3: +-

- on apes (% relative on PCP):

potency: 30%
duration: 60%


Ketamine:

- on pigeons (birds) (dose mg/kg):

50: 4+ ; 25: 3+ ; 12.5: +-

- on apes (% relative on PCP):

potency: 20%
duration: 30%

[...]
The ethyl analog A should be active at 15-20mg i guess, and the more easily avaiable methyl analog B should be at twice this dosage, around 35 mg.
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There's a report on reddit.

**INTRO**

2-Methylamino-2-phenylcyclohexanone is a completely new RC that I had the good fortune of being one of the first to test it. AFAIK, this is the only trip/experience report currently published for this chemical.

It's also known as "New" Ket, but I wonder if you guys have any ideas out there for a different one.

It's advertised as a Ketamine replacement. It's **much** cheaper, I found it to be (as advertised) about 2x more potent than K, and lasting about twice as long.

**EXPERIENCE REPORT**

After conducting an allergy test at around 8pm, and not noticing anything out of the ordinary, I decided to get going on prepping some syringes for IM injection.

The "New" Ket came in crystal clear shards, just like K should look. I was able to dissolve two 1ml shots of 63mg and 128 mg respectively. The crystals dissolved instantly - no heat and almost no stirring required.

I got my ice pack ready, which I like to use with a blindfold- set up my play list, and laid on my back on my bed.

My 2x 1ml syringes were ready for use (along with my alcohol prep pads.

**11:50pm**: First injection of 63mg into left thigh

T+0:10 -Felt trademark dissociation. Motor skills were slighly impaired and there was a delay between my thoughts and actions.

*T+0:15 -Music sounds great on this chemical and seems to shape the hole a lot.*

T+0:20 - Felt somewhere in between K and MXE at this point. Smooth and sedating like K, but warm like MXE.

T+0:25 - IM'd the second dose of 128mg

T+0:35 -Wow, evthjsfd

*T-1:20 Peaking. I slid around looking at all these giant ice pods late belonged to the Old Gods. The images were pretty detailed, and the colors were very industrial and blur.*

*My writing became totally illegible and I think I forgot about the paper entirely.*

**NOTES**

* I made the mistake of taking this unkown substance while on two antidepressants, Mirtazapine and Cymbalta.
* I believe "New" Ket to be very serotonergic, hence the warm euphoria and the lingering discomfort I felt after my experience. Stay away from other serotonin reuptake inhibitors.
* I'm excited for this to be more widely available within the next year, great, cheap, K alternative.
* Sorry it took so long to write this report for an experience I had about 2 weeks ago
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My report of this one after a week with it. I believe it has potential, but the batch going around under the name 'New ket' feels like a cheap synth with room for improvement, like it feels potentially more toxic than it could be if it was higher quality. One person had a really bad trip on it and was messed up for a couple days physically/mentally. Other lab rats had pleasant times when taking smaller doses, but also remarked about it being harder on the body than something like high quality MXE. Experienced symptoms such as gastrointestinal discomfort, and 'didn't feel like myself the next day'. Again I suspect it is not the chemical to blame but this specific synth.
 
I've talked to a couple of old heads from the 1970s, and according to them, PCP (the prototypical bare benzene ring cyclohexylalkylaminophenyl dissociative drug) had such a bad hangover that after doing it, that they would for days afterwards--every time--profess to never touch it again, a promise made and then broken perpetually while PCP was still widely available on the US' black drug market instead just being available in the ghettoes of DC, for example. Jamshyd, an older bluelighter who apparently never posts anymore but who had access to lab made dissociatives such as PCP and PCE for a while, equated taking PCP with feeling poisoned for a week or so after the fact. Plus, the active dose is something like 3 to 5 mg. Just think how either (1) impure "wet" must be to need such drastically higher dosages for full effect or (2) how "wet" is often simply formaldehyde just as "molly" is often (m)ethylone, or is at best PCP dissolved in formaldehyde which is then used to lace marijuana joints with. Perhaps substituted phenyl dissociatives are to be preferred to bare phenyl ones? What about the unsubstituted phenidines? Are they also rough on the mind/body, and how do they compare to MXE, as far as quality of overall experience goes? The only dissociatives other than DXM, which I hate because of its taste, that I've any experience with are ketamine and MXE (methoxetamine), both of which make me psychotic but in the case of MXE also causes ++++ events to happen for at least a week or so after doing it. Unfortunately, my last order placed for MXE seems to have fallen victim to a fraudulent clearnet vendor, whose name I will gladly share with you if you PM me and ask for it.
 
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tbh that report sounds like how I experience S-ketamine. I think I could see how psychedelic content can seem missing when you are dissociated... that is always exciting though also possibly schizo esp when dopaminergic action is involved it seems.
Still, does not sound like a hollow lame dissociation.

would try!!

@Dresden: yeah PCP was in the early days of clinical research already noted to cause anxiety / (di)stress / malaise on I think primates and humans upon coming down, I have gotten that occasionally from 3-MeO-PCP when I got more sensitive to it / took it more often... and a little bit from 3-MeO-PCE as well, plus MXE did that. As for feeling poisoned for a week... well PCP like compounds have a big tendency to stick around in your body for a long time, so that can be felt semi-latently while your brain's glutamatergic grid (and more) is resetting to get your cognition only again decently. That is not always a fantastic thing to experience at all, even if DRI / SRI type activity can lend anti-depressant action that makes stuff feel very alright however scrambled. Be careful with dissos, there is multiple action, and unforeseen consequences imo.
I really dislike DXM at higher doses cause of hypertension or at least feeling that way (pressure in head etc), feverish stuff... but otoh it seems to have a pleasant SRI profile compared to the messed up dopaminergic action seen in a lot of other dissociatives.
There are so many components to a good dissociative, I think pure NMDA antagonism is not the answer, but making it really dopaminergic isn't either. MXE was keenly designed, I would very much like someone to use their smarts to solve this equation. Possibly they have already and prefer not to get it banned cause its so friggin good. But what good is the genie in the bottle?

Meh this is getting complicated.. I would like to have gone dissociating right now, but not sure if that is the same as distantiating from the topic :P
 
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Many vendors have a blanket "nothing possibly controlled to USA" restriction on shipping to prevent the untoward possibility of customs seizing the package and then ending up either liable to re-ship more, or enduring bad word going around about their shipping, legitimacy, association with LEO, etc.

Once more I must caution, until I find someone who has done the hard work to verify what they are consuming is deschloro-K (ideally, independent third party GC or LC-MS, but a TLC plate stained with Mecke/Marquis, melt point, NMR, anything really apart from a "bioassay of faith") I would take any information about this compound with a grain of salt.

The last round of "ketamine analogues" were reported to be utter trash, I wonder if it's because they were actually crappy compounds, or was it the case that people were using it as a vehicle to sell excess crap from their inventories a la NRG-3?

Needless to say if I can ever get my greasy hands on it I will give some objective tidbits, and do the analysis myself...
 
I found the Kd (Dissociation Constant) values for Deschloro Ketamine [1](2-OxO-PCM):

Image 1:
fppeIPF.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/fppeIPF.jpg?1 (Deschloro-ketamine is labelled with Carbon-11)

± Deschloro-ketamine:
Kd for NMDA PCP site: 1200 nM [1]

And here you can compering it with ketamine:
S-ketamine (Kd - NMDA pcp site): (840 ± 320 nM) [2]
R-ketamine (Kd - NMDA pcp site): (1500 ± 530 nM) [2]


-----------------------------------------------
Kd values for ketamine and Descloro-ketamine is not from the same article. This maybe does not provide a fair comparison. but give an approximate value.
 
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Dresden said:
Just think how either (1) impure "wet" must be to need such drastically higher dosages for full effect or (2) how "wet" is often simply formaldehyde just as "molly" is often (m)ethylone, or is at best PCP dissolved in formaldehyde which is then used to lace marijuana joints with.
Click to expand...

Except formaldehyde has no dissociative properties.
 
Hey, this is hypherism. The one who posted that trip report on reddit for Deschloroketamine. I do feel like I left out a lot of information or that maybe I wrote it incorrectly. So, if you guys have any questions or anything feel free to ask here or even PM me!

Overall, I really liked the chem. It's the most ketamine-like of any analogue that's come out. I obviously have more experience with it than just that singular experience but for whatever reason I chose that one -I think because I had actual physical notes on.
 
Few reports so far and they seem somewhat conflicting. Anyone else tried this who can add to the shared experiences?

vortech said:
My report of this one after a week with it. I believe it has potential, but the batch going around under the name 'New ket' feels like a cheap synth with room for improvement, like it feels potentially more toxic than it could be if it was higher quality. One person had a really bad trip on it and was messed up for a couple days physically/mentally. Other lab rats had pleasant times when taking smaller doses, but also remarked about it being harder on the body than something like high quality MXE. Experienced symptoms such as gastrointestinal discomfort, and 'didn't feel like myself the next day'. Again I suspect it is not the chemical to blame but this specific synth.
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If there are impurities, do you have any ideas about what they might be? Or if they could be removed by the average person at home? I know some chemicals can be rinsed with the right solvent to increase purity pretty effectively (e.g. cocaine with acetone).
 
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