Dissociatives The Big & Dandy Deschloroketamine Thread

[Mindtraveller87]

Tried this Friday and last saturday. It is really nice when taking orally. Tried 25mg and is a perfect dosage for mellow warm euphoric effects. Insufflated is definitely less interesting and also less comfortable considering the nasty drip. I find this a better mxe replacement than o-pce which is more of a stronger compound on its own with lingering effects (could still feel it next day), but also worthwhile. I don't know if it's possible to hole on dxe, but time will tell

 

[MSK]

Tried this Friday and last saturday. It is really nice when taking orally. Tried 25mg and is a perfect dosage for mellow warm euphoric effects. Insufflated is definitely less interesting and also less comfortable considering the nasty drip. I find this a better mxe replacement than o-pce which is more of a stronger compound on its own with lingering effects (could still feel it next day), but also worthwhile. I don't know if it's possible to hole on dxe, but time will tell

It's very possible, but it's a very amnesic experience and a lot of material is required, at least in my case.

 

[Haltia]

I conducted a more serious "experiment" with O-PCM, taking about 3 x ~35mg individual doses within three hours (on top of initial 35mg that I had taken some 6 hour before) and then smoking a joint.

It did take me to the same "dimension" that O-PCE takes me, but the long lasting tail was somewhat uncomfortable, and accompanied with disturbing imagery (I find deschloroketamine to be most visual of ACHs, bar MXE). Still I have a newfound respect for this compound, and I'm grateful for the lessons that it gave me last night.

 

[Haltia]

Well, I ended up having capital time over the weekend with this lovely, weird and perhaps misunderstood member of the wonderful ACH family.

To what should I liken this compound? I would say that she is a like having a slightly crazy female friend - not a romantic
relationship, but you're hanging out with a daring, intelligent and a bit mischievous lady. She's taking you to places, and it's her
who's behind the wheel, so don't you try to manipulate her by any means, otherwise she'll show your real place real quick.

She opens up a large space inside your mind, and fills it with ever-changing impressions. There's no stability here, you gotta
go with the flow and roll with waves. Give up the control. And she'll show her take on the common theme of ACHs, the world
outside concepts, words, language, ego, and shows how hopeless are our efforts of making sense of it all.

She directly inspired me to write this little ditty, as a memento:

there is a way of seeing things
that is crazy
and nobody will ever see it
unless they become crazy

and when you are crazy
you can see it all

But you talk and talk
to shut yourself up
and with all that talk
you shut yourself up

That is so crazy

THAT IS SO CRAZY

 

[Barkuti]

Hello!

Mmm, it seriously seems this compound is of the right class for me. My background is that of a fellow who more than a decade ago was getting Ketolar (racemic ketamine, 50mg/ml) vials from a pharmacist friend for personal use. Always used it à la John Cunningham Lilly, with an intra-muscular dosage range of 2 to 3.7mg/Kg.

So this compound is both longer lasting (increased half-life) and more powerful (lesser required dose). I've tl;dr'ed most of this (long and boring LoL!) thread. Excuse me please, as I only need to grab a good idea of the half-life multiplier, already got its relative potency seems ≈2x.

Cheers my researchers

 

[g0to]

Its not certain that it has got a longer half-life. Theres been no formal research done on it, so nothing is known about its metabolism.

I would presume that the lack of a 2-chloro moiety as compared to ketamine causes a different distribution in tissue, as well as perhaps a different binding profile(may be similar on some receptor subtypes, however may have additional receptors it fits into) I would have to look up the in-vivo metabolism of ketamine to look into how the unsubstituted phenyl compares to the 2-chlorophenyl.

 

[Barkuti]

While not being very expert in biomolecular design…

Everything has at least a cause and a purpose. The laboratories involved in Ketamine development, Parke & Davis (now Pfizer), knew they needed to provide a short acting anaesthetic without supressing the respiratory reflexes. It was designed as a field anaesthetic, allowing a single nurse or doctor to operate and suture a soldier without further assistance. Came to market in 1965 and soon turned out as a tremendous success. Maybe Parke & Davis toyed first with this version, to latter add that 2-chloro substitution in order to meet the fast sew up recovery requirement.
From a recreational perspective, this deschloro version can be preferable.
We'll see.

 

[g0to]

Yes indeed. For what its worth, i too am a ketaset connoisseur, i personally still prefer ketaset due to a shorter duration and more predictable, cleaner effects, however they are two very different beasts.

Just like ketamine, deschloroketamine has 3 different forms. S-deschloroketamine, S-deschloroketamine, and the racemic 1:1 S/R-deschloroketamine. So results may vary wildly depending on your source just like with ketamine.

 

[Barkuti]

Mmm…

Briefly read the last ≈3 pages of posts. What is this stuff lacking vs Ketamine? Maybe people tends to overdo it via multiple consecutive doses and then they complain of comedowns?
Also, what's up with the dosage? People is claiming really low doses. On top of this, read the deschloroketamine PsychonautWiki dosages and wtf, are those guys radical anorexics or what? 40+ and 50+mg heavy doses? C'mooon… 8)
Well, jokes apart, maybe the doses they propose are very conservative, harm reduction geared? Tried 3-FEA more or less recently and, well, the listed dosages for it there are pretty bland too.

Cheers everyone

 

[g0to]

Overdoing it yes, with the tailend effects building up and clouding the high itself upon redosing. In this sense, due to its compulsive nature it is somewhat similar to dopaminergic stimulants like amphetamines. However the similarities end there, this is a very very spiritual compound, almost mystical, just like ketamine but it moreso reminds me of MXE in some ways (methoxetamine, 3-MeO-2'-oxo-PCE, its 2-methoxyl N-ethylated counterpart)

Since its a new untested compound and many trying it tend to order online and perhaps their first experiences with dissociatives (on the sites its sold its listed alongside both rc stimulants and black market drugs), the recommended dosages tend to stray more on the conservative side so that those with no experience have perhaps a better chance of not having an overwhelming experience.

In my experience, for the more old-school type of users, its okay to eyeball this compound (small lines). Keep in mind though that it comes from some vendors as a highly compact rock form, with in some cases a small rock being over 1g. A small sorta chunky line turns into a huge one if crushed over and over until its no longer crackling upon pressing upon it with a card or what-have-you.

I would not recommend this one for IV or IM, not only is it completely unknown territory but it also could have vendor specific issues like way too acidic etc.

Good news is, it can be smoked. Its way harder to hole on this compound then ket, but the plus side with this one imo is that the most euphoric of its effects occur *after* the peak, that is, when youre lucid enough to function in reality. Strong strong afterglow with this one- to the point that it can trigger mania in some (be careful mixing with alcohol and amphetamines- it spoils the experience)

 

[Barkuti]

No problems…

I believe these issues can also be experienced with ketamine, though due to the short duration of the desired effects a lot of re-administration is required. I never went after a third shot and this happened only very rarely. Re-administration was weird and challenging with all that hole-in and hole-out (LoL!). Had a few falls from bed, honestly.
By the way, did you know John C. Lilly mastered ketamine readministration to the point of doing 50mg doses 20 times a day each hour (rested 4 hours) for two weeks? Ended up in the hospital. And heck, he later did it again but without the resting periods. 8(

I'll go via rectal, best route imho. Even street speed works like a dream that way. No more messing with my sinuses, although I can do a (finely 8) pulverized) line or two to please the guests.

Cheers

 

[g0to]

Yes indeedy! Yep, John Lilly definitely did alot.
I wonder if him or any of his contemporaries did any research on analogs like deschloroketamine? After all, he did work for the company that developed ket! There must be research out there somewhere, perhaps under lock and key at the forgotten bottom of some cabinet. I wish these companies had an incentive for full disclosure. This is one of those 'lost in the books' compounds.. i think its quality!

Plugging sounds like a good idea with this compound! Let us know how it goes

 

[Barkuti]

LoL!

Had a couple of John C. Lilly's books (now lost), “The Scientist: A Metaphysical Autobiography” being one of them. I read it enough to grasp he did tried “a new drug” from his sources, but he went on a bike ride in his first test and he crashed badly. Aaaah my reckless, daring John…

Cheers

 

[vortech]

The outcome of Hoffman's first LSD ride compared to the outcome of Lily's first K-hole ride illustrate's the very different effects and applications of each drug.

 

[Xorkoth]

Haha, yeah they sure do.

 

[Haltia]

Actually, if memory serves, Lillys bike ride was his last "K test". He had been injecting insane amounts and ended up in hospital badly bruised.

 

[Barkuti]

Actually, if memory serves, Lillys bike ride was his last "K test". He had been injecting insane amounts and ended up in hospital badly bruised.

That's sort of right, Haltia. It was not his last “vitamin K test”, though. If I do recall correctly, he related about a new “K style” substance. Of course, it could have been Tiletamine or God knows what, as there's no explicit mention about it in the book. Crashed on vitamin T…
Not trying to be rude, vortech, yet that Hoffman/Lilly bike ride simile is quite nonsensical.

Nearly all of my hundreds of K trips have been holes, most of them Network of Creation and up. People doing bumps and going out on this? Poor foolish n00bs…

 

[psy997]

I don't see how the simile is nonsensical, I find it quite fitting, but thanks for the correction Barkuti. For some reason I had it in my mind it was PCP or a PCP analogue, from somewhere.

 

[g0to]

Its nonsensical because its taking the best and worst of lsd/k user stereotypes and then comparing them. Like as if every person who has ingested lsd is some enlightened selfless individual. Plenty of trashy people have done stupid shit on lsd. Hell even many extremely intelligent people have taken too much. It lends a bad name associated to the substance that isnt necessarily true (with k as well)

 

[vortech]

I was referring more to how LSD is less likely to seriously effect balance and coordination than a hole-sized K dose. But I agree, after the historical correction the story isn't so fitting. Someone who does a lot of K would likely fare much better on a bike, but I also agree it is a waste of that precious time in which the rabbit hole opens up enough to explore the other side.