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The Big & Dandy ALD-52 Thread

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The prodrug thing is an interesting topic for me. I haven't tried ALD-52 yet, but I know that the 4-AcO-tryptamines convert to the 4-HO in the body, yet they are in some cases (and for some people) clearly distinguishable from their 4-HO counterparts. 4-HO-DMT and 4-AcO-DMT come to mind, for some they seem very similar, yet for others including me, they are very different in feeling and mental space, two entirely separate drugs. I am 100% confident I could differentiate them accurately in a blind test every time. My working theory (only a theory) is that some prodrugs are also able to pass the BBB, and produce their own effects, but your individual body chemistry determines how quickly you metabolize it into the other drug. It would not surprise me if ALD-52 is different to some noticeable degree than LSD, though it doesn't sound like they're going to be much different.

I think I will be taking 250ug of this on Friday or Saturday, going to a music festival with my friend's band and we're going to set up and jam late-night. We've been doing psychedelic jam sessions recently with great success, and I suspect this will be a good one for that, since LSD certainly is.
 
My 250ug trial seemed indistinguishable from my intense early acid trips. There were indeed moments where I'd kinda freak out and think there was a conspiracy going on around me, what have you. If it does indeed have its own effects different from LSD, it will take me many more trials to flush them out, and probably require them to be closer in timing so as I do not forget what one or the other feels like... really, I'm just satisfied that it feels exactly like LSD to me. LSD in my circle is very expensive these days and ALD-52 is not for me, so I'll probably pick up as much of it as I can and just be satisfied with it as my 'acid' for the rest of my life.
 
I really like ald-52 alot. It has a very positive, loving push to it it's never had any negative edge at all really. Some have said that it's almost opiate like which is true to some degree and something I can't achieve with lsd. The benefits of this one inperticular I think is its very small of body load as compared to lsd and most definitely ETH lad.
The only thing that not as good with ald-52 is the visuals are just a little less prominent. I mean they are fucking amazing at 250 but lsd has stronger visuals. And lsd is also kinda hard to to find in my circles as well and the people are sketchy sometimes so I'll take this as it really costs mabey a dollar more a a tab than if I got lsd. And I would not know the quality or dose either.
So to sum it up ald-52 is really really close. But in the end lsd is heaven and hell sometimes but ald-52 is melancholy and beautiful at the same time a little less intense but it hilarious, gentlez, gracefull, and still very very beautiful at the same time.
I have yet to scratch above 250 I will eventually if I find the need too. But 250 is a great dose and I imagine it could get very intense above 300 but still hold that gentle loving aspect. It's love on a tab.
Happy trails,
Nugz
 
The only anxiety I have ever suffered from LSD was on 1P, I really don't experience any discomfort from LSD-25 ever, it just feels like magic and sparkles to me, I've had a chance to try AL-LAD, ETH-LAD 1P-LSD and LSD-25 all pretty close together and they all have very different effects, 1P being the closest to LSD-25 but not nearly as promising.

The body high I feel on LSD-25 is so comfortable comparing to 1P for me, you just become one with all. The 1P was very speedy and "electric" body high like you were describing as some LSD, a lot of vaso.. It had me feeling really racy in my mind especially on the come down, honestly it made me feel like I was on meth, it mad me very uncomfortable in short. LSD-25 is so comfortable in my body though it's indescribable. Normal LSD-25 is so much different for me, clean smooth and no negative effects in my body I can pinpoint, the body high is so comfortable, all you feel is one with everything, nothing but laughing and magic, melting and becoming one with everything with cascading aztec and geometric patterns. You mention the duration of the awakeness post trip is reduced, that has caught my attention which is really the only downside I experience of LSD, a part I don't particularly enjoy too much just because of how long it lasts. We could relate 4-Aco-DMT to Psilocin, but really there's no where in Nature where we can find pure Psilocin, it's a very low percentage in most mushrooms, second to psilocybin; and that's why it's so much different. It's like taking a pure extract of Psilocin, it's its own drug.

I would assume ALD-52 does have it's differences just as 1P does but it's probably metabolic, and I won't know for sure until I get a chance to try it. :)
I think it helps if you have actually taken LSD-25 and are not relating these analogues to 1P-LSD, because it is not the same as the standard stuff. In my case, not nearly as good. If you haven't had the chance to experience LSD-25 for sure, don't relate experiences to 1P because it's not the same for some people.
 
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Actually I was able to experience synthetic pure 4-HO-DMT several times around the same time that 4-AcO-DMT first became available which is the reason I was able to make the comparison... the two differ greatly in effects. Obviously mushrooms are a different thing than either of the two pure compounds, because they contain other tryptamines as well, albeit primarily 4-PO-DMT (psilocybin, which for all we know could be an independently active prodrug of 4-HO-DMT as well) and 4-HO-DMT (psilocin).
 
eclipse3130 said:
The only anxiety I have ever suffered from LSD was on 1P, I really don't experience any discomfort from LSD-25 ever, it just feels like magic and sparkles to me, I've had a chance to try AL-LAD, ETH-LAD 1P-LSD and LSD-25 all pretty close together and they all have very different effects, 1P being the closest to LSD-25 but not nearly as promising.

The body high I feel on LSD-25 is so comfortable comparing to 1P for me, you just become one with all. The 1P was very speedy and "electric" body high like you were describing as some LSD, a lot of vaso.. It had me feeling really racy in my mind especially on the come down, honestly it made me feel like I was on meth, it mad me very uncomfortable in short. LSD-25 is so comfortable in my body though it's indescribable. Normal LSD-25 is so much different for me, clean smooth and no negative effects in my body I can pinpoint, the body high is so comfortable, all you feel is one with everything, nothing but laughing and magic, melting and becoming one with everything with cascading aztec and geometric patterns. You mention the duration of the awakeness post trip is reduced, that has caught my attention which is really the only downside I experience of LSD, a part I don't particularly enjoy too much just because of how long it lasts. We could relate 4-Aco-DMT to Psilocin, but really there's no where in Nature where we can find pure Psilocin, it's a very low percentage in most mushrooms, second to psilocybin; and that's why it's so much different. It's like taking a pure extract of Psilocin, it's its own drug.

I would assume ALD-52 does have it's differences just as 1P does but it's probably metabolic, and I won't know for sure until I get a chance to try it. :)
I think it helps if you have actually taken LSD-25 and are not relating these analogues to 1P-LSD, because it is not the same as the standard stuff. In my case, not nearly as good. If you haven't had the chance to experience LSD-25 for sure, don't relate experiences to 1P because it's not the same for some people.
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I found 1P coming very close to LSD25 as well. The main difference for me, and the only thing that i realy don't like about it is the come-up. The first two hours after ingestion Always feel like i drank too much coffee or something. Speedy indeed. But that feeling gradually subsides and about two and a half hours after ingestion it's more or less gone, and it feels very simmilar to LSD-25 fro me.
 
Has anyone got experience with kratom and lysergamides? Was thinking of trying this gem again today but have taken my daily dose of kratom already.

The last and first time i tried this i wasnt using kratom at the time but I added some MDMA and alcohol to the mix so my memory of it is somewhat poor. I do remember how it felt different than LSD as I was in a pretty wild setting at the time which i dont think i could have handled as easy if it had been LSD-25 never mind with a high dose of MD in the mix and i do have years of experience with both LSD and MDMA.

Lots of other people tried it at the party with reports ranging from slightly underwhelming on 1 tab to "too much head frying and pretty deep" for 2 people on one tab who are used to LSD in such settings. Although one of the 2 who didn't enjoy it was epileptic and had forgotten to take his epilim and was also taking speed which probably added to his anxiety and racing thoughts.
 
I always found kratom to not dull the effects of psychedelic much, quite a bit less than true opiates. I was addicted to kratom for 7+ years and I took it almost every time I tripped.
 
Thanks Xorkoth, thats reassuring. Tidying the house then going in at 187.5ug (1.5 tabs) =D

have some ket I might add in if i feel the need. Its always great with acid so im guessing the same with ALD.
 
Yeah I'd assume (without having tried it yet, but having some experience with 1p-LSD) that anything that goes well with LSD will go well with ALD-52. They seem like they're mostly the same drug, with perhaps different facets being emphasized.

I've decided I'm going to take my 250ug tomorrow at the first night of the festival. Likely there will be more LSD which I will take if I feel that I'd like to go higher. Very excited. :) I feel like I'm about to eat a unicorn. =D
 
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Xorkoth said:
Yeah I'd assume 9without having tried it yet, but having some experience with 1p-LSD) that anything that goes well with LSD will go well with ALD-52. They seem like they're mostly the same drug, with perhaps different facets being emphasized.

I've decided I'm going to take my 250ug tomorrow at the first night of the festival. Likely there will be more LSD which I will take if I feel that I'd like to go higher. Very excited. :) I feel like I'm about to eat a unicorn. =D
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I opted out of the bigger dose and stuck with 1 tab (125ug). Had a biggest smile plastered across my face for the first 5 hours along with a clean lysergic glow of euphoria very very similar to LSD. It felt similar to 1p-LSD but maybe smoother in ways but that could be down to me having higher hopes for this rather than 1p because of all the hype?

I was underhelmed at this dose with hardly any visuals. On the same dose of LSD I can get a a lot more visuals and a deeper spiritual feel but thats not to say ald isnt able to do the same at a higher dose. I just feel its more gentle nature makes it seem slightly less potent than LSD

Also done lots of K from around 4 hours in but due to a huge tolerance and a very blocked nose I didnt get anywhere particularly interesting.

Next time I will definitely go in at 250ug which I would be more apprehensive about with actual LSD.
 
Tried 125ug for the first time yesterday, actually got my assed handed to me for a few hours. Got into insane thought loops, thinking all my actions and everything happening around me was predetermined and impossible to change. Maybe I'm more sensitive to lysergamides? Or you guys are more hard headed than me but I found 125ug about as visual as 32mg 2C-E. I only seem to get these thought loops on ALD-52, 1P, and LSD, but only when I dose at home. If I'm doing shit and exploring I don't get this but, being in my home with my fiance I get very deep in my own head and have a hard time relaxing. Had a rough go at relaxing and being able to let go yesterday. Had a lot of confusion too, more than I expected, I think I was simply taken off guard and tried to fight it. Had an existential issue with my drug use and wanted to be done tripping halfway through. Fiance was fine throughout and had a blast though, and was able to keep in a relatively good headspace. Still had some amazing moments and the insanely euphoric sex we so much enjoy when tripping.

Can't wait to try again and redeem myself. This weird anxiety I've only gotten on 125ug ALD-52 and 200mcg 1P, I still think from being taken off guard. Otherwise, I've keep my head really well on 100+ other trips on 20 some other psychedelics(yes, trying to stay tough in front of my other drug users :/). Suffice to say, I was humbled yesterday
 
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I actually haven't found ALD-52 to have any anxiety but I remember watching one person (I think I mentioned this way back in the fourm) who had to lay down because they had a toxic (anxious) feeling for the come up. They felt better afterwards but after another trip they fell in love with ALD-52. The people around me all seem to have the preference of ALD-52 over LSD-25.

It seems to be dependent on mind state for visuals for me. The setting seems to be a factor but I stay euphoric unlike LSD which can become very depressing (I actually haven't felt depressed from LSD in like 2 years so make what you want of that). I have gotten thought loops when I did the 5 tabs over the day, so you aren't alone.
 
Ive read quite a lot about ALD 52 ad ETH LAD seperately but I can't find anything in regards to these as a combination, has anyone ever tried these as a combo?
 
justme6263 said:
Ive read quite a lot about ALD 52 ad ETH LAD seperately but I can't find anything in regards to these as a combination, has anyone ever tried these as a combo?
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Someone did, I think it might have been in the ETH-LAD B&D thread. He said it's a great combo.
 
Xorkoth said:
Actually I was able to experience synthetic pure 4-HO-DMT several times around the same time that 4-AcO-DMT first became available which is the reason I was able to make the comparison... the two differ greatly in effects. Obviously mushrooms are a different thing than either of the two pure compounds, because they contain other tryptamines as well, albeit primarily 4-PO-DMT (psilocybin, which for all we know could be an independently active prodrug of 4-HO-DMT as well) and 4-HO-DMT (psilocin).
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I agree that ALD-52 and ACO DMT have activity by themselves, before ever reaching any enzymes or metabolic process; this is proven through IV injections, I also agree they are prodrugs and convert fully to their non ester counterparts in the body at some point. It doesn't take away from the fact that effects are altered in most individuals, this is proven with synthetic 4 HO DMT and 4 ACO DMT.

Which causes that activity by itself before conversion is based on individual factors, but I do believe these acelayted versions enter the BBB before fully converting metabolically and having effects of its own which can alter the experience, this can be proven firsthand and blindly.

An easy way to find out would be to add citric acid to solution or lemon juice with 4-ACO-DMT and see if it breaks down into 4-HO-DMT you would know after consuming as effects would be altered.

Thought i'd touch on 1P-LSD as well regarding prodrug theories..

As for the propionyl group of 1P I believe the trip is more so factored with enyzmes in the stomache/liver this would prove true to some people having profoundly altered(durations) or weaker effects to its counterpart. In my subjective experience it peaks much quicker and fades quicker, comparing to LSD25, this could be due to it being deep in the body before the propionyl chain ever metabolizes..
1P is also active in its own right, assuming with 1P the 38% potency correlation to that of LSD in mice either is proof to metabolic action or IV injection, with its own individual activity.

1P being a prodrug of LSD was confirmed as LSD was detected in human serum via liquid chromotography readings.. It seems to be prodrugs(ester counterparts of original mother compound - which metabolize into mother compound in the body) have proven to have their own acitivity, through individual subjective experience, LC-MS testing and via IV injections.


 
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eclipse3130 said:
ALD-52 is not orange sunshine, that was merely an ineffective attempt to get off on the charges. Orange Sunshine was 300 mics of 98% pure LSD crystal. Sand has since gone on record saying this, and Scully as well I believe. Owsley said so as well, though he wasn't involved in the manufacture of that batch. Yet this damn myth lives on...
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Nicholas Sand, Tim Scully, and Owsley Stanley all said this? Your comment is the first place I heard those claims. Could I have the source of those quotes mentioned in the above comment?

Uncertainty about the composition of Orange Sunshine does exist. I have researched Orange Sunshine and my understanding is the best evidence in existence is the legal case.

My research indicated in the legal prosecution the defendants were prosecuted as if ALD-52 was the chemical involved in the trial.

Wikipedia said:
It is possible ALD-52 was the active chemical in the Orange Sunshine variety of LSD that was widely available in California through 1968 and 1969. The Sonoma County underground chemistry lab of Tim Scully and Nicholas Sand was Orange Sunshine's source. It was shut down by the police, and Scully was arrested and prosecuted. This resulted in the first drug analogue trial, where Scully claimed that he and his partners did nothing illegal, because they were producing ALD-52, which was not an illicit drug. However, as the prosecution claimed, there were problems with such a rationale—ALD-52 readily undergoes hydrolysis to LSD, and secondly, the synthesis of ALD-52 required LSD. (The second point was based on the methods available in the scientific literature at the time). Scully was convicted and served time in prison.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ALD-52



Shuglin also mentions Orange Sunshine was possibly ALD-52 in TiHKAL. This is the quoted text here:

TiHKAL said:
ALD-52. 1-Acetyl-N,N-diethyllysergamide. This material has been explored in the 50-175 microgram range and there are a number of human trials reported, with varying conclusions. One found that there was less visual distortion than with LSD and it seems to produce less anxiety and was somewhat less potent than LSD. Another report claimed it was more effective in increasing blood pressure. Yet another could not tell them apart. ALD-52 just may have been the drug that was sold as "Orange Sunshine" during the "Summer of Love" in the late '60's. Or "Orange Sunshine" may have been, really, LSD. This was the focus of a fascinating trial where two defendants were accused of distributing LSD, whereas they claimed that it was ALD-52 which was not an illegal drug. The prosecution claimed that as it hydrolyses readily to LSD, for all intents and purposes it was LSD, and anyway, you had to go through the illegal LSD to get to ALD-52 by any of the known chemical syntheses. The defendants were found guilty. And yet, I do not know who has actually measured the speed or ease of that reaction. If ALD-52 hydrolyses so easily to LSD, and the body is indeed a hydrolytic instrument, then these two drugs should be absolutely equivalent in every particular, This is the ergot equivalent of the psilocybin to psilocin argument, except this is an acetamide rather than a phosphate ester.
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https://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/tihkal/tihkal26.shtml
 
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