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The Big and Dandy 4-AcO-DMT thread - New incarnation

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With the light controversy about whether and at what point (ie how quickly) psilacetin is deacetylated to produce psilocin, and whether psilacetin might have some intrinsic activity, has anyone deacetylated the stuff manually (I mean, outside the body and prior to ingestion) and compared?

This might be a stupid question. I'm not too cognizant of the chemistry at work.


edit: Acetylesterase is in the saliva I believe. Someone should probably try spitting on the stuff and letting it mix a while, before dining. And then bless us with the anecdotal report!
 
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hmmm that is not a bad idea. don't know if it would work as i am pretty clueless about chemistry stuff but personally i like mushrooms a lot more than 4-aco-dmt (never tried pure psilocin) so its worth a shot
 
Me too... and FYI, pure psilocin is also different from mushrooms but it captures the intense connection to "god" (or whatever you want to call it). I prefer mushrooms altogether to both, but psilocin is damn good, better than 4-AcO-DMT (though much less gentle).
 
I'm interested to see what those of us with more chemistry knowledge say about this. Would putting a dose of 4-aco-dmt in a small container with saliva for a few hours and then putting that in something and drinking it make 4-ho-dmt? Maybe the experiential differences between the two mean that 4-aco isn't in the body long enough to be broken down before taking effect (since my understanding is that the chemicals in our bodies SHOULD break it down, but it seems like everyone agrees that the effects of 4-aco and 4-ho are very different). Now that I think of it, I had very different experiences taking 4-aco in a gelcap versus dissolving it in gatorade and drinking that slowly over an hour or so. The latter gave an experience more similar to my trips on mushrooms with a feeling of connection to the a kind of earthly divine spirit while taking it in a gelcap felt more alien and bizarre. This makes me think that taking it slowly gives the body more time to convert to 4-ho, while if you take it all at once you are getting more of the 4-aco experience. At the time I thought the difference was probably mainly due to it coming on slower and lasting longer when taken over an hour, but looking back the actual effects were quite different too.
 
I'm curious too. But I wanted to comment... actually, not everyone claims the effects are different. Some claim they're virtually identical. But MANY people report significant differences, including myself. This leads me to believe that different people's body chemistry breaks 4-AcO esters of tryptamines into their 4-HO counterparts at different rates, and that 4-AcO-DMT (or other tryptamine) is indeed active on its own. I believe it's likely that this is the reason for the wide range of effects for all of the 4-AcO tryptamines compared to their 4-HO counterparts. I would be willing to bet money that 4-AcO-DMT and others can cross the BBB, and that the fact (is it a fact or speculation? I'm actually not sure) that they convert into 4-HO-DMT or what have you is the reason that the effects range so greatly. Because although of course every trip is different even with the same substance and everything affects everyone differently, those of us who have used these chemicals many times begin to notice some solid consistencies, and I know in my case I am 100% sure that I could easily distinguish between 4-AcO-DMT and 4-HO-DMT in a double blind test. The entirety of the effects is different between them for me.

But yeah, if I could spit in a cup and soak my dose of 4-AcO-DMT in it to convert it to 4-HO-DMT, I'd be pretty ecstatic, because I prefer the latter for sure. :)
 
I found the experiences quite similar - I will have to take mushrooms again really soon just to be sure, but 14mg of 4-AcO-DMT felt alot like taking 30 dried Liberty Caps. It did however produce more nausea on the comeup, but that went away quite quickly...Also it did seem to me to be noticeably gentler than taking shrooms.

I have never taken a really good dose of mushrooms on a sunny day though, so will have to do so and compare the 2 qualitatively.

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=502202

There is my trip report for my experience 10 days ago...

Was talking to my old hippy head friend last night about the odd tolerance with this substance - there doesn't appear to be a very consistent one. Him and another friend both took it twice last week after I said it was really good - Pooh* took it the same day as I did, but in the evening after I had come down, then took it again 3 days later, and said it was still amazing.

Piglet* said that he took 2 14mg capsules on friday night, had a whale of a time, then took 1 capsule on saturday night - with the same effects, he said it was exactly the same, just as magical, and perfect in every way!
 
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Consumed 30mg of the fumarate on a full stomach.
The first two hours nothing happened. Then I felt the familiar tryptamine feeling, but it never manifested properly. I decided to snort ~10mg 5-meo-dmt. This felt wonderful.
After coming down from the 5-meo-dmt it seemed the 4-aco-dmt had settled in, but it just didnt feel right. I was tripping, but not at the level I would expect from 30mg. more like a treshhold, low dose. Very little visuals to speak of, some patterning, but mostly I just felt my vision was sort of mildly blurred out.
The bodyhigh was good, felt very relaxed throughout the experience.

Not at all what I expected from this chem. Im thinking my sample might be a bad synth or may have simply just degraded. it shows no signs of physical degradation, though? Maybe my body just dosent agree with this chem.
I'll try a similar dose soon, on an empty stomach this time, and see what happens.
 
It was probably the full stomach, every time I have tried to dose an RC on anything other than an empty gut it barely works if at all. Good luck with your next attempt!
 
4-AcO-DMT - 60mg oral


Onset Start: About 15mins

Peak Start: 1 hour - 1 hour & half

Duration: 7-8 hours and lingered


Effects in order:

- Extreme environment distortion, Strong open/closed eyed patterns and colors, No sense of time, Music seems distant and story like.

- Zombie like stage blanking out, Loss of ego, Laid out on couch and could barely move.

- Entered a different world (Near Death Experience), A dead person talking to me *He told me he was dead* and said person was walking around the room. This scared the shit out of me because I thought I was dead too.

- Face warping and morphing (Reptile looking at times), Things looping over & over, Backwards/weird pitch speech both on TV and me talking, Commercial people telling me their real inner emotions/intent (That was hilarious!)

- Constant flailing my arms & legs around near the end (Swimming motion)

- The last hour everything was playing back in reverse of what I described and also on the TV.


Summary: 8o 8o 8o
 
wow, that's a hell of a dose! i still haven't pushed this chemical beyond 18mg myself... i can't wait for summer to arrive :)
 
Just found a dose that I weighed out and dropped on my carpet, rolling somewhere else...a nice 14mg dose, which I'll make larger with all the rest still "stuck" to the baggie...then I'll weigh it, and report back! Should be about 20mg, see how that's different...Will wait til the weekend most likely though.
 
greenmeanies said:
wow, that's a hell of a dose! i still haven't pushed this chemical beyond 18mg myself... i can't wait for summer to arrive :)
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Yeah I wanted an over the top trip and I got one. I believe a mental exercise like this on occasion though is very beneficial.

It isn't something I recommend dosing normally at, 20-30mg seems to be a pretty solid trip for 4-AcO-DMT.
 
So Today i recieved my batch of 4aco dmt from my source
nice discreet little package everything i expected
tonight i will dose 30 mg and will post back with my results i cannot wait :D
 
Has anyone else had muscle spasms/constriction on this one.? I tried this for the second time at 16mg (first @ 12mg) orally. I'll write a full TR, but this was anything but gentle for me - I had nausea/GI discomfort throughout, and the most annoying thing was this feeling in my forearms like my muscles were constricting & tingling. Almost like I fell asleep on my arm wrong, but this muscle tension never went away. I wasn't freaking out or anything - one of the enjoyable aspects of psilacetin for me was the clear head that I had, but the side effects were just too much. Also, for me there was a lot of that raw tryptamine stimulation that isn't exactly comfortable.
Is it possible that I got in an overwhelmed headspace and released adrenaline, and that would be responsible for the side effects? I had such high hopes for this one, but after this last test, I may classify it next to 5-MEO-AMT: Too many side effects.
 
Boognish said:
Has anyone else had muscle spasms/constriction on this one.? I tried this for the second time at 16mg (first @ 12mg) orally. I'll write a full TR, but this was anything but gentle for me - I had nausea/GI discomfort throughout, and the most annoying thing was this feeling in my forearms like my muscles were constricting & tingling. Almost like I fell asleep on my arm wrong, but this muscle tension never went away. I wasn't freaking out or anything - one of the enjoyable aspects of psilacetin for me was the clear head that I had, but the side effects were just too much. Also, for me there was a lot of that raw tryptamine stimulation that isn't exactly comfortable.
Is it possible that I got in an overwhelmed headspace and released adrenaline, and that would be responsible for the side effects? I had such high hopes for this one, but after this last test, I may classify it next to 5-MEO-AMT: Too many side effects.
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4-AcO-DMT has the least if any negative side effects for me while 4-HO-MiPT had the most. You might be right though, you could be sensitive to it and it's making you tense up a lot. I think it's a natural reaction for humans to tense up under stress or pass out under extreme stress.
 
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