Addiction Subutex/Suboxone vs Methadone

[gymguy30]

what’s better in your opinion Subutex/suboxone or methadone for MAT? Also which are you prescribed and what dosage ? I’m prescribed 16mg Subutex a day and it’s working well unless I have a dream the night before about my doc or something.

 

[slightly_paranoid]

I am on 16mg Suboxone and it's working well for me too. I have chronic pain though and think that I might ask to switch to Methadone. I really don't think my Doctor will do it and if he does, he won't allow me to continue the benzo I take as needed for panic attacks. However, I am thinking that if Methadone is a full agonist, it might help the anxiety. Hopefully someone on Methadone can chime in. I also have a hard enough time being judged by the pharmacists because I am on multiple controlled substances.
I asked for name brand Suboxone as I find that it works MUCH BETTER than some of the generics I was getting before.
For those on Methadone and getting it from a Doctor (and not the clinic), how much of a pain in the butt is it to get your medication filled each month?

 

[maryanne77]

I have both pain and anxiety. One of the reasons I am on subs is most doctors will not let you have both kinds of meds anymore. I chose the pain meds . However I started having major panic attacks used an old benzo and then had a surprise urine screen and lost the pain meds too. My only option was suboxone or methadone. The suboxone had a bit of anxiety and depression relief but now I am freaked about it harming my teeth. I wouldn't give up the anxiety med if you are able to keep it now. Getting off them has to be extremely slow . Its a big mistake I made .

 

[slightly_paranoid]

I agree that doctors should not have you on a full agonist if you are on Methadone or Suboxone. I recently had to cold turkey Suboxone from 16mg to 0 in 2 days when my tooth pain flared up because I knew it would require a pain med. I advised my doctor that I had abstained from Suboxone and the benzo for 3 days and he called me in a weeks worth of pain meds that I took as directed until I had the procedure and root cause of pain removed. I've come too far now to screw up. I got back on Suboxone as soon as I was out of pain but do not want to that again. I was thinking on Methadone, and I have a pain flare up, they could temporarily up my Methadone or write a Rx for something for breakthrough pain since Methadone doesn't block all receptors like Suboxone does.

Thanks for letting me know your experience and advice! I will definitely take it into account when it comes time to decide. I don't think that Suboxone is harmful for the teeth per my experience. I have great reports from my dentist that tells me to keep doing what I'm doing. I've been on Suboxone for about 6 years total and can tell you it hasn't had a negative impact on my oral health. I do a good job of flossing and brushing everyday. The pain flare up I had was from cracking my tooth while grinding my teeth at night. I get check ups every 6 months. Interestingly enough, I read where Methadone can contribute to bad teeth. My 2 cents is that SOME addicts have poor oral hygeine, and that combined with something that can make it worse, can be a bad situation. But if you have good oral hygeine, I don't think you have anything to worry about.

Ok, so we have 1 person sharing moving from Suboxone to pain meds was a mistake for them. I would like to hear from more that have been on both Suboxone and/or Methadone and can tell me what you're on now and what you think about it? I currently don't require drug screening but honestly wouldn't mind it if I were given the best meds fro my conditions. Now that I am medicated, it is much easier to not screw my life up by self medicating with dope. I am NOT using the Suboxone or Methadone "as a backboard" so I can continue using with a safety net. If you are doing that, you will eventually get caught or get a new doctor who is not going to play that game.
I have it great right now. I have 2 GREAT doctors and 1 GREAT chriopractor and those are hard to come by. They're so good that I DO NOT want to move out of the city I am currently in. I am currently stable on all of my meds and would hate to fix something that ain't broke.

TL;DR
I want to switch from Subxone to Methadone for pain management, emotional stability, mood stability, and cravings. The Suboxone is great for withdrawal but think it lacks the emotional and mood stability properties of Methadone. Methadone is also indicated for use for the exact type of chronic back pain that I have and was born with. I think Methadone has been given a bad name and there are MANY successful people out there on this medication and would love to hear from all of you!

 

[Trying123]

20 year heroin addict here. I was on Methadone for about 15yrs. It destroyed my teeth, let me continue to use when I wanted, even at a 200mg dose. The clinics didn't care because they made money. Just a total waste of time, and I have no teeth left. I found a great Dr who helped me get on Subuex. Or staright Buprenorphine. This has helped me the most. Was at 16mg/day, im down to 12mg. Actually 8, because I only take a half pill when I work long days, and my body needs it. I had all my bottom teeth pulled at once, without coming off my bupe. Honestly, it wasn't that bad. I remember having my wisdom teeth pulled, getting the good drugs, and shooting heroin at the same time. That was hell. Coming off subutex for a few days isnt gonna do much. Then, if your putting oxygen, or Tylenol 3,4 back in you, your taking a hige risk on relapsing. Our brains work in a strange way. We can be sober for 20 hears, and the tiniest bit of our favorite drug can trigger full withdrawal, or full addiction again. I have to have all my top teeth pulled soon. Im scared as hell. But, I will refuse any type of opiate. My rehab Dr told me he could get me up to the max dose of bupe again, because its a partial agnostic. But, I don't wanna do that either. I've decided, nothing in this world can be worse then my addiction was. I'm not going back there, even if I'm in pain. Pain hurts. But you can learn to minimize it with your thoughts. You gotta practice having a strong mind. Dedication. Tell yourself its not that bad. Find ways to distract yourself. I'm not saying it's easy, or takes away pain. But. It does help. Beats putting an opiate in me again. Just be careful. The tiniest bit of opiate can throw you backwards in a second. We went thru heavy duty WD for 5,10 days minimum. We can ride out some pain for a while. Sucks, but we can, if we try. I Wish you the best. Stay safe n sober.

 

[rplate81]

I agree that doctors should not have you on a full agonist if you are on Methadone or Suboxone. I recently had to cold turkey Suboxone from 16mg to 0 in 2 days when my tooth pain flared up because I knew it would require a pain med. I advised my doctor that I had abstained from Suboxone and the benzo for 3 days and he called me in a weeks worth of pain meds that I took as directed until I had the procedure and root cause of pain removed. I've come too far now to screw up. I got back on Suboxone as soon as I was out of pain but do not want to that again. I was thinking on Methadone, and I have a pain flare up, they could temporarily up my Methadone or write a Rx for something for breakthrough pain since Methadone doesn't block all receptors like Suboxone does.

Thanks for letting me know your experience and advice! I will definitely take it into account when it comes time to decide. I don't think that Suboxone is harmful for the teeth per my experience. I have great reports from my dentist that tells me to keep doing what I'm doing. I've been on Suboxone for about 6 years total and can tell you it hasn't had a negative impact on my oral health. I do a good job of flossing and brushing everyday. The pain flare up I had was from cracking my tooth while grinding my teeth at night. I get check ups every 6 months. Interestingly enough, I read where Methadone can contribute to bad teeth. My 2 cents is that SOME addicts have poor oral hygeine, and that combined with something that can make it worse, can be a bad situation. But if you have good oral hygeine, I don't think you have anything to worry about.

Ok, so we have 1 person sharing moving from Suboxone to pain meds was a mistake for them. I would like to hear from more that have been on both Suboxone and/or Methadone and can tell me what you're on now and what you think about it? I currently don't require drug screening but honestly wouldn't mind it if I were given the best meds fro my conditions. Now that I am medicated, it is much easier to not screw my life up by self medicating with dope. I am NOT using the Suboxone or Methadone "as a backboard" so I can continue using with a safety net. If you are doing that, you will eventually get caught or get a new doctor who is not going to play that game.
I have it great right now. I have 2 GREAT doctors and 1 GREAT chriopractor and those are hard to come by. They're so good that I DO NOT want to move out of the city I am currently in. I am currently stable on all of my meds and would hate to fix something that ain't broke.

TL;DR
I want to switch from Subxone to Methadone for pain management, emotional stability, mood stability, and cravings. The Suboxone is great for withdrawal but think it lacks the emotional and mood stability properties of Methadone. Methadone is also indicated for use for the exact type of chronic back pain that I have and was born with. I think Methadone has been given a bad name and there are MANY successful people out there on this medication and would love to hear from all of you!

I take it that the pain medication that your doctor gave you to take was opioid?? If they were, how long after your last dose of the meds did you take your suboxone??
Just curious because if you took Subs too soon then you would be having precipitated withdrawals.

 

[CfZrx]

So many things to reply to here! I agree that suboxone does not impact oral health beyond it being an opioid that causes dry mouth. I take 12 mg most days and it kicks ass for pain! If I had to choose between methadone and monthly pee tests or suboxone and once a year pee tests, I would go with Subs! Bupe was created as a painkiller after all! I think mixing sub w/ THC and CBD is a great feeling!

By the way, I just had major surgery and was given zero pan meds. I was scared, but after 1 toughnight, I was doing ok! It is nice to not depend on these weasel docs for pain relief!!!

 

[maryanne77]

20 year heroin addict here. I was on Methadone for about 15yrs. It destroyed my teeth, let me continue to use when I wanted, even at a 200mg dose. The clinics didn't care because they made money. Just a total waste of time, and I have no teeth left. I found a great Dr who helped me get on Subuex. Or staright Buprenorphine. This has helped me the most. Was at 16mg/day, im down to 12mg. Actually 8, because I only take a half pill when I work long days, and my body needs it. I had all my bottom teeth pulled at once, without coming off my bupe. Honestly, it wasn't that bad. I remember having my wisdom teeth pulled, getting the good drugs, and shooting heroin at the same time. That was hell. Coming off subutex for a few days isnt gonna do much. Then, if your putting oxygen, or Tylenol 3,4 back in you, your taking a hige risk on relapsing. Our brains work in a strange way. We can be sober for 20 hears, and the tiniest bit of our favorite drug can trigger full withdrawal, or full addiction again. I have to have all my top teeth pulled soon. Im scared as hell. But, I will refuse any type of opiate. My rehab Dr told me he could get me up to the max dose of bupe again, because its a partial agnostic. But, I don't wanna do that either. I've decided, nothing in this world can be worse then my addiction was. I'm not going back there, even if I'm in pain. Pain hurts. But you can learn to minimize it with your thoughts. You gotta practice having a strong mind. Dedication. Tell yourself its not that bad. Find ways to distract yourself. I'm not saying it's easy, or takes away pain. But. It does help. Beats putting an opiate in me again. Just be careful. The tiniest bit of opiate can throw you backwards in a second. We went thru heavy duty WD for 5,10 days minimum. We can ride out some pain for a while. Sucks, but we can, if we try. I Wish you the best. Stay safe n sober.

Why does everyone seem to say nothing above 4mg works for pain ? Anything above that just gets you more addicted to the subs and near impossible to come off if you ever need a full agonist. I watched a friend of mine who was on subs for years die a very painful death in hospice . Nothing was working .

Also not everyone on subs these days is on them for addiction. There are many chronic pain patients, that are not addicts that like to walk instead of lie in bed forced on this stuff. New doctors are being taught anyone needing pain meds regularly is a drug addict.

 

[gonzo93270]

I suffer chronic pain due to being in multiple car crashes, being hit by a car and I have arthritis, herniated discs and arthritis. I was clean off heroin and ORTs but relapsed with opiates in January, started with oxycodone and by the end I was smoking around 1.75 of "heroin"(one batch was definitely just nitazene, had a green colour it) a day- they've put me on 16mg buprenorphine sublingual daily but I dont want to be on it for long but I also need to have my pain controlled and I feel less analgesia at 16mg buprenorphine then I felt at 8. For me, buprenorphine does little to help my pain. Snorting the 400mcg SL tabs give me a great high but I more or less feel nothing if I snort my bupe, its weird,

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Just wanted to point out that methadone isn't intrinsically harmful to your teeth.

ALL opiates/opioids can cause reduced saliva production (xerostomia) which accelerates tooth decay.

Just be sure to clean your teeth, attend dental appointments and drink plenty of water.

Unfortunately, the nature of addiction means that these simple precautions are often overlooked.

 

[4DQSAR]

@F.U.B.A.R. - drug myths are amazing, they can withstand any given weight of evidence.

One idiot loudly complained that generic methadone wasn't methadone. Why, because they truly believed Martindale still held some sort of patent so generics simply could be 'the real thing'.

Meanwhile - guy is smoking a gram of brown a day BUT due to repeated non-complience, they were knocked down to 30mg/day. Gee Wizz, wonder why he still rattled! You do your best, you get them the 95mg they claim to need only to discover that the juice was being sold for smack. So for the sake of others, first supervised consumption and when even that wasn't complied with, 30mg/day.

Street methadone is really dangerous. It could be ANYTHING - I'm sure you know the good old 'Aquadone' trick.

You served yout time so I reckon you know your stuff.

Chippers 'why am I rattling but can't stay awake?'

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

@F.U.B.A.R. - drug myths are amazing, they can withstand any given weight of evidence.

One idiot loudly complained that generic methadone wasn't methadone. Why, because they truly believed Martindale still held some sort of patent so generics simply could be 'the real thing'.

Meanwhile - guy is smoking a gram of brown a day BUT due to repeated non-complience, they were knocked down to 30mg/day. Gee Wizz, wonder why he still rattled! You do your best, you get them the 95mg they claim to need only to discover that the juice was being sold for smack. So for the sake of others, first supervised consumption and when even that wasn't complied with, 30mg/day.

Street methadone is really dangerous. It could be ANYTHING - I'm sure you know the good old 'Aquadone' trick.

You served yout time so I reckon you know your stuff.

Chippers 'why am I rattling but can't stay awake?'

Aquadone? Ive not heard that specific term, but im guessing it's when users on take homes water it down then sell it on?

Another more disgusting practice is when addicts on supervised consumption pretend to swallow it but keep it in their cheeks only to spit it out into another bottle outside the pharmacy and sell it on for smack.

NEVER buy someone else's juice...

 

[4DQSAR]

Ah, OK, must be a Manchester thing. Aquadone is methadone cut with Night Nurse.

I can recall wandering around the town and wondering why I saw so many empty bottles of mouthwash. Then it clicked - they contain alcohol and Picadilly had a 24 hour branch of Boots so street drinkers would rock up at 3AM and buy many,many bottles. It got so silly that they had to add a sign limiting sales to 2 per customer.

What next?

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

Ah, OK, must be a Manchester thing. Aquadone is methadone cut with Night Nurse.

I can recall wandering around the town and wondering why I saw so many empty bottles of mouthwash. Then it clicked - they contain alcohol and Picadilly had a 24 hour branch of Boots so street drinkers would rock up at 3AM and buy many,many bottles. It got so silly that they had to add a sign limiting sales to 2 per customer.

What next?

Cut with Night Nurse? Still, it's better than water I suppose. Shouldn't it be called 'Nightadone?'

 

[4DQSAR]

@F.U.B.A.R. - I have NO IDEA where that nickname came from. But just look at Nightnurse. Same colour, same viscocity. So maybe if you have 100mL, you swig 30mL, top it up and sell it for £10...

But equally, if you need 80mL, Nightnurse will still mix.

The spitting it out thing is even worse in prisons. People spit it directly into someone else's mouth. Yuk. Yet we still cannot fathom why so many disases we thought extict are back (baby)! TB for example. People sneeze when they rattle - sneeze in a confined, badly ventilated space.

I told you, when we did an anonymous MDT in HMP Durham, 50% of them tested positive for buprenorphine. Easy to see why. A single 8mg tablet is worth £40. How many of them can you shove up your bum when you get a recall?