Tapering Suboxone taper journal & advice

[JoeJunky]

Thanks, I may have to check that out.

So today I'm at 4mg. I am having a hard time sticking to taking my sub in 2 doses, I've occasionally split my doses into 3. Is that a set back? I guess I stiLL keep thinking I need something throughout the day, old habits.....ugh

Anyway starting tomorriw I'm going to stick to taking it in 2 doses.

I have an appointment this week to get 28 more. Crazy doc thinks I'm taking it twice a day. They are clueless.

Anyway, hope everyone is having a great day. I am, just been so tired ever since starting the subs.

I've always thought setting a specific mg was a mistake, just take the minimum to get you through the day. I might take .5mg four times one day and 3/2 times the next day, you get the idea. Some days you don't taper because you're too busy and some days you're not busy and don't need the energy so a smaller dose is not as noticeable, setting you up for the future and getting your body adjusted. That was my mindset while tapering.

2dark2see said what is true for me, I can be critical of suboxone but it definitely helped me get my mind off harder opiates and out of my needle fixation. I never successfully kicked H, but my mindset wasn't in the right place for that. I remember leaving the methadone clinic and the counselor said, "you will be back" ...they were right.

 

[kickin74]

Wow, at least they were encouraging to you lol. Ugh.

I agree about it allowing us to get in a better way of thinking. I legit obsessed over oxy. I would flip out when I started to get low, which was a week after it was filled. Every freaking month I would go through that crap. I'm so glad that for 10 days now it's not been an issue. I was mentally exhausted.

Yea I'm just trying to take less and less as I go. That's all I can do right now.

Thanks for the comment.

 

[Enough999]

I have a question about my sub taper. I'm stable at 3 mg Xanax right now and have a psychiatrist appointment tomorrow. I'm hoping he can help with tapering office of this. As for the opiates, I can't play around with them. I did a classic quick taper using subs, 4 mg day 1, 3 day 2, 2 for 2 days, 1.5 for a day, 1 for 2 days, .75 for a day, .5 for 1 day, then insufllated around .3 yesterday and today. Should I be in the clear? I didn't feel bad when I woke up. Should I feel any opiate withdrawals tomorrow? I have work tomorrow and about 2 mgs left but if I'm in the clear I'm flushing it. What do you guys think?

 

[kickin74]

Enough, subs have a very long half life so even like 5-7 days later you can get hit with WDS. I'm no expert but since you did a rapid taper you may feel some, but it may not be too bad.

Someone who knows more will come along & give you better info. What were you taking before the subs??

 

[Jabberwocky]

kick - how long have you been taking buprenorphine now in total? Generally feelings of fatigue are very common the first 2 to 3 weeks on it. If this continues past that point, you should be considering lowing whatever dose you're taking. And if that doesn't help with the fatigue, considering looking into getting tested to see if you suffer from depression or some other mood disorder.

I have a question about my sub taper. I'm stable at 3 mg Xanax right now and have a psychiatrist appointment tomorrow. I'm hoping he can help with tapering office of this. As for the opiates, I can't play around with them. I did a classic quick taper using subs, 4 mg day 1, 3 day 2, 2 for 2 days, 1.5 for a day, 1 for 2 days, .75 for a day, .5 for 1 day, then insufllated around .3 yesterday and today. Should I be in the clear? I didn't feel bad when I woke up. Should I feel any opiate withdrawals tomorrow? I have work tomorrow and about 2 mgs left but if I'm in the clear I'm flushing it. What do you guys think?

You should be fine, you'll certainly be through the worst of it (or very likely will be). You'll probably experience a bit more withdrawal for a couple days to, although much less intensely, a week or so more.

If you just got off the buprenorphine, or will likely soon, why are you trying to get off the alprazolam? I mean, you could start a very slow taper for that if you want, but it generally makes things hard tapering of one med right after the other.

I strongly suggest beginning to discuss your desire to get off alprazolam with him or her, but waiting for at least a month without taking any opioids, ideally waiting until the 90 day mark, before making more changes to what you're putting into your body.

Push HARD for your doctor to put you on a more appropriate benzo for tapering. Ideally he will prescribed diazepam vis a vis the Ashton Manual, but clonazepam would also be much better than simply tapering off alprazolam by simply lower the dosage of alprazolam you're taking. It is like trying to taper off heroin simply by reducing your dose of heroin - both substances are too short acting to lend themselves to effective taper protocols.

 

[kickin74]

Toothpastedog it's 11 days today.

 

[JoeJunky]

Wow, at least they were encouraging to you lol. Ugh.

I agree about it allowing us to get in a better way of thinking. I legit obsessed over oxy. I would flip out when I started to get low, which was a week after it was filled. Every freaking month I would go through that crap. I'm so glad that for 10 days now it's not been an issue. I was mentally exhausted.

Yea I'm just trying to take less and less as I go. That's all I can do right now.

Thanks for the comment.

I don't blame my counselor, I was a punk. Methadone didn't work for me, I couldn't get in the right mindset in that environment especially trying to taper.

I got tired of chasing dope everyday and the suboxone made it tough to go back to that world. I did try, but doing dope and suboxone is frustrating, you're waiting to WD and hoping the first hit gets you high which is also expensive.

I eventually stopped obsessing about getting heroin and began trying to figure out how to get off suboxone that just makes me "normal."

 

[kickin74]

I had a time where I bounced back & forth between subs & oxy. That's a rollercoaster ride that sucks.

Like you said, WDs & then waiting to get your pills or drug to work after subs was awful.

One thing I'm LOVING right now is the peace in my head of NOT obsessing over where I'm going to get more pills. Gosh, my poor family. I planned everything around my pills. I couldn't do anything when I was out. Only time I got anything done was when I had my script, which of course didn't last long.

I went to the store the other day, did some shopping & wasn't worried about how I would feel being out. It is very different learning to live without that crutch again. It takes time to adjust.

I do have a question that I can't seem to figure out looking through threads here.

So, am I over the oxy WDs right now? If I am, what would happen if I didn't take anymore subs? Would I have WDs from subs being on them for only 11 days? I can't seem to understand that part of this.

Thanks

 

[Enough999]

You should be fine, you'll certainly be through the worst of it (or very likely will be). You'll probably experience a bit more withdrawal for a couple days to, although much less intensely, a week or so more.

If you just got off the buprenorphine, or will likely soon, why are you trying to get off the alprazolam? I mean, you could start a very slow taper for that if you want, but it generally makes things hard tapering of one med right after the other.

I strongly suggest beginning to discuss your desire to get off alprazolam with him or her, but waiting for at least a month without taking any opioids, ideally waiting until the 90 day mark, before making more changes to what you're putting into your body.

Push HARD for your doctor to put you on a more appropriate benzo for tapering. Ideally he will prescribed diazepam vis a vis the Ashton Manual, but clonazepam would also be much better than simply tapering off alprazolam by simply lower the dosage of alprazolam you're taking. It is like trying to taper off heroin simply by reducing your dose of heroin - both substances are too short acting to lend themselves to effective taper protocols.

I've been tapering for months now, just haven't been able to find a doctor accepting new patients until now, and can't get time off work or the money to go inpatient. I'm just going in for my intake appointment and I'm bringing my Xanax script with me. I'm going to say that my tolerance has built but I Donny want ah increase, I want help getting off.

 

[kickin74]

Day 12 for me on subs. Took 2mg at 6am & again, I fell asleep until 11. I can't take this tiredness. I have to be able to be up with the kids.

I've been thinking about this & when I take my afternoon dose I seem to get energy from it, I get moving around & am fine so I usually stay up late at night. Maybe that's why I'm SO tired in the am after I dose. But I've always been a night owl, so I'm just really feeling unstable right now with this tiredness.

Any suggestions?

 

[JoeJunky]

Day 12 for me on subs. Took 2mg at 6am & again, I fell asleep until 11. I can't take this tiredness. I have to be able to be up with the kids.

I've been thinking about this & when I take my afternoon dose I seem to get energy from it, I get moving around & am fine so I usually stay up late at night. Maybe that's why I'm SO tired in the am after I dose. But I've always been a night owl, so I'm just really feeling unstable right now with this tiredness.

Any suggestions?

Yeah, I would pinch off pieces of a strip in the AM and after lunch for the energy boost to get me through the workday. For nighttime my doctor gave me trazodone, but if I took too little during the day I would have to pinch off another really small piece to help me go to sleep.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Toothpastedog it's 11 days today.

Congrats! So you're still under two weeks on buprenorphine, which makes the side effects your experiencing very normal. I tended to get tired from my first dose and energy from the second when starting. Your body will start to adjust to the medication's side effects between the 2-4 week mark, so if you can just put up with this a bit longer you're super golden.

Day 12 for me on subs. Took 2mg at 6am & again, I fell asleep until 11. I can't take this tiredness. I have to be able to be up with the kids.

I've been thinking about this & when I take my afternoon dose I seem to get energy from it, I get moving around & am fine so I usually stay up late at night. Maybe that's why I'm SO tired in the am after I dose. But I've always been a night owl, so I'm just really feeling unstable right now with this tiredness.

Any suggestions?

Try waiting to take your dose later in the day, like after 4pm. If you need to take 0.5mg in the morning or whenever and then the rest at or after 4pm (but since it's keeping you up, which isn't unusual, try only taking 0.5-1mg in the afternoon, and not after 4pm).

OR

Try splitting your dose up. 1mg at 11am and 1mg at 4pm.

OR

Lower your dose and take it at noon. You can always redose a bit later if necessary (but don't redose more than 0.5mg given your issues not sleeping with it - again you can always take more if necessary).

 

[kickin74]

I took my am dose with a caffeine pill, started to get tired BUT I put my ear buds in, cranked up the music & been going ever since!

I think I may be depressed to. I'm not going to lie, I miss my pills. But when I think of what they've done to my life, it only makes me more determined to keep going.

One good thing is my afternoon dose I was actually able to only take half. So that's 3mg today. I've been on 4mg. I only hope that it's not too much of a jump to where I get to feeling bad again.

Overall, today has been better. So far so good. We shall see.

Thanks everyone for the advice.

 

[kickin74]

I can't seem to get it consistently under 4mg. I'm so upset about it. I thought I'd be moving along quicker then this.

I'm afraid I'm going to be addicted to subs now.

I'm also still very tired when I dose in the am. The afternoon dose is fine though. It's crazy.

Any advice??

Thanks!

 

[Jabberwocky]

How long have you been taking buprenorphine in total now? And how long have you been at 4mg?

 

[2dark2see]

Hey it's good to "see" you here again, I was wondering how you were doing. I'm sorry you're still not feeling that great with things.

I'm just curious about your taper - when you say you can't seem to stay under 4 mg, how much are you trying to drop to? Are you trying to go from 4mg to 3mg? Maybe you'll need to taper in smaller doses at this point... like going down to 3.5mg a day or even 3.75mg a day. And TPD brings up a good question regarding how long you've been at this dose - maybe your body is still adjusting from your last taper that brought you to 4mg...

 

[kickin74]

I started on the 1st, so 24 days now.

Started at 8mg, dropped to 6mg 4 days later, then 4mg about 5 days later & been struggling at 4mg.

I'm up all night long with RLS the past few nights, but I'm stiLL very tired during the am after my dose. I don't get "moving" until the afternoon dose.

Maybe 3.5mg would be good to try...

If I were to stop all subs & wait for WD to kick in, would that be better to try & restart this or is it normal to still be adjusting?

Thanks!!

 

[Jabberwocky]

It isn't exactly abnormal to take a few weeks, up to a month, to stabilize on something like buprenorphine (particularly with a longer standing history of prior opioid use). Do you have any other health issues that could be contributing to this? The kind of side effects you're having a kind of extreme for this stuff, not at all outside the realm of normal, but not exactly stereotypical of the medication either.

The best bet is to just keep plugging away with what you're doing, slowly taping off week by week, day by day. Has your symptoms been like when you go from 4mg to 3mg? And have you tried spacing your doses out or taking them later in the day?

If you want to try you can always skip days dosing until you get down below 2mg, that will speed up the process for you - it may even lesson some of the medications side effects. Just be very aware of how it affects your cravings, and if you need to end up taking your dose on an off day, do so! It is better than ending up using again, this is for sure.

 

[kickin74]

No I'm otherwise healthy. I abused oxy for about 7 years.... not sure if that matters but this weekend I wasn't as tired, but this week it hit me again. However, I will say that it probably has a lot to do with me not sleeping through the night. I feel like a newborn, up & down all night long since I've started subs. I guess that its taking a toll on me & could be why I'm getting so tired in the am.

I'm going to chart my sleep & see if it's a pattern as to why I'm so tired. This past weekend my hubby let me sleep in & so I wasn't as tired.

Do you think the WDs would be bad if I decided to stop & start again?? I may do that just so I can get to a lower dose. So once I feel WDs I would start the sub again the same way right? Thanks!

 

[kickin74]

Oh and yes I do space my doses. When I start to drop doses i get RLS bad & anxiety. Just really agitated.