Great, I can't afford to be so tired like I am today a lot. My kids are into everything & laying on the couch like I've been, that's not going to work. Anyway, yesterday I was full of energy. Weird, I'm wondering if the 6mg dose is just to high for me?? Maybe dropping earlier to 4mg may help with the daytime fatigue?
Tapering Suboxone taper journal & advice
- Thread starter kickin74
- Start date
Hey kickin74, I'd love to share this journey with you and support each other as we go along. I'm glad to see you've found some good books on this subject... I myself haven't actually read any books on drug addiction but it's good to hear of some good references in case I do decide to find some reading materials.
Your comment about sleep was interesting and I guess shows just how differently meds effect each person. For me, ever since I started taking the suboxone I started sleeping better than I had in a very long time. It's been wonderful to be able to sleep thru the night again, bc for me when I was on norco or oxy I would wake up several times a night - on a few occasions this was of course due to WD but most of the time it was not. I do take gabapentin and seroquel at night for sleep, but I've been on those meds for a very long time, and was taking them back when I was using, so the only change has been when the suboxone entered the picture for me. I hope you are able to get some good sleep very soon. Oh and btw I also take my sub dose twice a day - once in the morning and then again between 3-4pm.
Your comment about sleep was interesting and I guess shows just how differently meds effect each person. For me, ever since I started taking the suboxone I started sleeping better than I had in a very long time. It's been wonderful to be able to sleep thru the night again, bc for me when I was on norco or oxy I would wake up several times a night - on a few occasions this was of course due to WD but most of the time it was not. I do take gabapentin and seroquel at night for sleep, but I've been on those meds for a very long time, and was taking them back when I was using, so the only change has been when the suboxone entered the picture for me. I hope you are able to get some good sleep very soon. Oh and btw I also take my sub dose twice a day - once in the morning and then again between 3-4pm.
Hey 2dark2see! Hope you're doing well. I feel much better this afternoon & evening. I honestly just think I am tired, our youngest son gets up at night alot still & he's been wearing me out. Oh the joys of addiction & parenting lol. Ugh, it is awful but mentally I feel so much better right now.
So I've gone from 8mg for 4 days to 6mg at 2 days right now & then I'm jumping down to 4mg. I hope this works. ?
You should check out one of the books, I love to read, its a great escape .
TTYL!
So I've gone from 8mg for 4 days to 6mg at 2 days right now & then I'm jumping down to 4mg. I hope this works. ?
You should check out one of the books, I love to read, its a great escape .
TTYL!
Ok so today I was supposed to start the 4mg, I'm not even going to lie, I took 2mg in the am, around 4am & then 2mg about 1pm, & 1mg this evening. I was struggling. I hope this won't mess me up.
I feel like as long as I'm reducing it should be ok, at least better than going up. Any input?? Maybe every 4 days reduction is not long enough? I guess I will just listen to my body & how it feels?
I feel like as long as I'm reducing it should be ok, at least better than going up. Any input?? Maybe every 4 days reduction is not long enough? I guess I will just listen to my body & how it feels?
I can totally relate! I'm trying to taper right now too... trying to go from 3mg to 2mg and so far I've been successful today but yesterday was a different story.... if you go and scroll thru my thread (the one in this forum titled sub taper... scared but excited) you'll see some great feedback that people gave regarding this exact same thing. I found it helpful, I think/hope you will too.
And regardless of how today went, you're still sober and still working towards the goals you set for yourself!
And regardless of how today went, you're still sober and still working towards the goals you set for yourself!
I've jumped off 2mg and .25mg. Jumping @ 2mg was very low energy on top of moderate WD, it's going to be tough to be around anyone I imagine.
Getting down to and stable at .25mg took me several months (I'm a wuss), but the WD was not bad relatively speaking. I could be around people and go to work explaining I was just feeling under the weather.
However, I did have access to a lot of medications that really helped. Maybe you can tough it out with nothing, but a safety net can't hurt.
Me personally, I hate RLS the most because it adds to the problem of not sleeping. People talk about using gabapentin as an option to manage that.
Be motivated and patient. Good luck!
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
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^Good advice 
Another great and rarely heard of medication for RLS is ropinirole.
Another great and rarely heard of medication for RLS is ropinirole.
Gabapentin would be the ONLY thing that helped my RLS while in WD. I wish more people knew because that is one of the toughest things to deal with. RLS will drive a person mad!! I have unlimited amounts of gabapentin on hand.
Anyway I woke up this am & took 2mg. Trying to stick to 4mg total today & for the next few days. Slowly decreasing. I'm feeling ok right now. Just have a horrible headache through this whole process. Ugh.
Have a great day & thanks for the advice!
Anyway I woke up this am & took 2mg. Trying to stick to 4mg total today & for the next few days. Slowly decreasing. I'm feeling ok right now. Just have a horrible headache through this whole process. Ugh.
Have a great day & thanks for the advice!
simco
Bluelight Crew
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Hey, kickin74, it sounds like you're doing awesome. Just wanted to add my .02, and reiterate that if it's at all possible logistically, remember that you can take this slowly. Healing up after a long opioid addiction is a big project (not just the physical WD's, but also re-learning how to be OK emotionally without narcotics), and the temptation is strong to try to be done with it all as quickly as possible (this is certainly something I fall into).
I guess I'm just putting it out there that if it feels like the dose of subs that you're on is too low, there's no shame in increasing.
I guess I'm just putting it out there that if it feels like the dose of subs that you're on is too low, there's no shame in increasing.
No problem, toothpastedog has enough good advice that I'm just sharing what I went through and hope that it helps. But it seems like you know what to expect.
I remember they tried to switch me from suboxone to zubsolv and that gave me bad headaches. I just found it strange because it was suppose to be the same dosage of bupe. My doctor didn't know what to make of it and put me back on suboxone. The only time I remember bupe giving me headaches, other WD symptoms made me increase my dose.
Another thing that helped me was setting a date to jump off months in advance, in some weird way you look forward to WD and stay motivated with your taper. I have two weeks of vacation a year and dammit I wasn't going to slip and wait another year to jump.
I don't know if you have the option of sending your kids to summer camp or their grandparents or wherever to give you some space.
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I'm a stay at home mom who homeschools our kids, I have NO time off lol. However, jumping off eventually it will be from a really low dose, according to the taper, so WD shouldn't be too bad right??
I will say my obsession over needing pills, wanting to be high, and just feeling the comfort of having them seem to be the hardest thing. So with that said, being on a longer taper, maybe 2-3 months, that should help me get into a healthier pattern of living without my pills. That's a big goal for me. Obsessing over these pills has driven me mad at times. I think if I can get that under control, I may be ok. I mean I would dream about these pills. Ugh
Thanks again, I love getting the advice. It gives me hope!!
I will say my obsession over needing pills, wanting to be high, and just feeling the comfort of having them seem to be the hardest thing. So with that said, being on a longer taper, maybe 2-3 months, that should help me get into a healthier pattern of living without my pills. That's a big goal for me. Obsessing over these pills has driven me mad at times. I think if I can get that under control, I may be ok. I mean I would dream about these pills. Ugh
Thanks again, I love getting the advice. It gives me hope!!
simco
Bluelight Crew
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Dreaming about your DOC is par for the course...totally normal and to be expected, though certainly not fun. Yes, for many of us, the psychological part of recovery is as hard as the physical part (and much longer lasting). Getting off an opioid addiction is really serious business; I always try to give the process its due deference and aim to keep myself as well guarded and supported as possible.
So it's not terrible if it would take me a couple months on the subs? I keep reading that a few months is too long & it will be harder at that point to get off of them. I pretty much read it would've been easier to get off the oxy instead!? Ugh it scares me.....
I had that same fear when I would read people saying it'd be easier to have just gone thru oxy WD than get on suboxone. That's why I was so hesitant at first and why I had planned on only using subs for a few days to help with the oxy WD.
But here's the difference for me.... sure, I guess I could have gone cold turkey from oxy and just suffered thru the WD and then after a week or so been feeling physically better. However, I KNOW that I would not remained sober as long as I have without the help of the suboxone. I mean hell there were plenty of days early on even with the suboxone that I wanted to run back to my dealer... and the only thing that stopped me was knowing I had the sub in my system and the oxy would have been worthless bc I wouldn't feel the high.
So just that alone makes the suboxone well worth it for me. It's only been a little over a month for me but I know I owe my sobriety to suboxone. And from what I'm learning and experiencing, when a person does a proper taper off suboxone it's not that painful. I've read horror stories just like you, and many of them have been from people who stopped taking subs at 4mg or even much higher, so of course they're going to be hating life at that point.
So for me, just knowing how I wouldn't have made it past that first week or two without the subs is worth it. Not to mention this whole time I've been on the subs I've been able to establish new routines and patterns in life without having to deal with the strong urges to use. I wouldn't have had that if I wasn't on the suboxone. As I'm sure you've read, everyone has a different experience.... but it's so important that we set that aside and focus on how our own experience with this med has been.
But here's the difference for me.... sure, I guess I could have gone cold turkey from oxy and just suffered thru the WD and then after a week or so been feeling physically better. However, I KNOW that I would not remained sober as long as I have without the help of the suboxone. I mean hell there were plenty of days early on even with the suboxone that I wanted to run back to my dealer... and the only thing that stopped me was knowing I had the sub in my system and the oxy would have been worthless bc I wouldn't feel the high.
So just that alone makes the suboxone well worth it for me. It's only been a little over a month for me but I know I owe my sobriety to suboxone. And from what I'm learning and experiencing, when a person does a proper taper off suboxone it's not that painful. I've read horror stories just like you, and many of them have been from people who stopped taking subs at 4mg or even much higher, so of course they're going to be hating life at that point.
So for me, just knowing how I wouldn't have made it past that first week or two without the subs is worth it. Not to mention this whole time I've been on the subs I've been able to establish new routines and patterns in life without having to deal with the strong urges to use. I wouldn't have had that if I wasn't on the suboxone. As I'm sure you've read, everyone has a different experience.... but it's so important that we set that aside and focus on how our own experience with this med has been.
2dark2see Everything you said is exactly how I feel. No way would I be 9 days with no oxy, even first few days on the subs I've wanted to get some, but like you said, it wouldn't work anyway!
It is allowing me to learn how to be without it on the daily basis. I could've never done it without subs so far.
I'm hopeful for us!! We can do it. I'm just taking it day to day.
Thanks for the comment!!
It is allowing me to learn how to be without it on the daily basis. I could've never done it without subs so far.
I'm hopeful for us!! We can do it. I'm just taking it day to day.
Thanks for the comment!!
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
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- Nov 3, 1999
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- 84,998
Keep taking it day to day, try not to get caught up in the future. You'll deal with each step in the process, its successes and its challenges, as you experience each one. Worrying about what is to come and how you'll deal won't change how you handle them when you are actually forced to confront how you're going to deal with them as they happen. Worry now, while completely normal given the ways we are conditioned to think in our culture, will just make worrying easier in the future.
As a favorite teacher of mine likes to say,
Perhaps you can continue focusing on make the most of your time with where you are at in this process today? Like, taking 800mg of ibuprofen, eating a bit of feed, and drinking 8FL oz of water for that headache of yours?
BTW, the less you can ruminate over whether you're doing this properly, or whether you will be doing it properly in the future, the better! And the more time you'll have to focus you energy (as we only have so much to spare, for ourselves or our loved ones) on spending quality time with your loved ones and learning how to become kinder and gentler with yourself. Not to mention focusing on the fact of the matter in this case - that you're doing really, REALLY fucking well!!!
As a favorite teacher of mine likes to say,
Debrah Eden Tull said:
Perhaps you can continue focusing on make the most of your time with where you are at in this process today? Like, taking 800mg of ibuprofen, eating a bit of feed, and drinking 8FL oz of water for that headache of yours?
BTW, the less you can ruminate over whether you're doing this properly, or whether you will be doing it properly in the future, the better! And the more time you'll have to focus you energy (as we only have so much to spare, for ourselves or our loved ones) on spending quality time with your loved ones and learning how to become kinder and gentler with yourself. Not to mention focusing on the fact of the matter in this case - that you're doing really, REALLY fucking well!!!
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
- Joined
- Nov 3, 1999
- Messages
- 84,998
Totally. I'd like nothing to be able to hang out behind your ears and just chill until a difficult emotion or negative thought enters your mindscape and KICK THE LIVING SHIT OUT OF THE BASTARD.
At you least, and this is the beauty of it all, you can train your mind to do that for yourself. It takes time and work, but anyone can do it with relative ease (it just takes more time for some than others, but I tend to notice those with the most pervasive negative thinkers often catch on far quicker than average folks).
A guy named George Haas (mettagroup.org) does a morning meditation program six morning a week on teaching you to do exactly that though - kick the shit out of the negative thoughts (not really) and nip them in the bud before they turn into something more by replacing them with a positive replacement thought (often contrary to the negative though, though it can be whatever works for you). They last about 30min and are recorded so if you can't make it for the actual call in you can listen any time. If you are free around 7:45-8:15am PST, you can call in live to the meditation and get individual feedback on anything you want to ask. I am pretty sure you still can to a trial run with the first month free if you want to try it out.
/endmindfulnessplug
At you least, and this is the beauty of it all, you can train your mind to do that for yourself. It takes time and work, but anyone can do it with relative ease (it just takes more time for some than others, but I tend to notice those with the most pervasive negative thinkers often catch on far quicker than average folks).
A guy named George Haas (mettagroup.org) does a morning meditation program six morning a week on teaching you to do exactly that though - kick the shit out of the negative thoughts (not really) and nip them in the bud before they turn into something more by replacing them with a positive replacement thought (often contrary to the negative though, though it can be whatever works for you). They last about 30min and are recorded so if you can't make it for the actual call in you can listen any time. If you are free around 7:45-8:15am PST, you can call in live to the meditation and get individual feedback on anything you want to ask. I am pretty sure you still can to a trial run with the first month free if you want to try it out.
/endmindfulnessplug
Thanks, I may have to check that out.
So today I'm at 4mg. I am having a hard time sticking to taking my sub in 2 doses, I've occasionally split my doses into 3. Is that a set back? I guess I stiLL keep thinking I need something throughout the day, old habits.....ugh
Anyway starting tomorriw I'm going to stick to taking it in 2 doses.
I have an appointment this week to get 28 more. Crazy doc thinks I'm taking it twice a day. They are clueless.
Anyway, hope everyone is having a great day. I am, just been so tired ever since starting the subs.
So today I'm at 4mg. I am having a hard time sticking to taking my sub in 2 doses, I've occasionally split my doses into 3. Is that a set back? I guess I stiLL keep thinking I need something throughout the day, old habits.....ugh
Anyway starting tomorriw I'm going to stick to taking it in 2 doses.
I have an appointment this week to get 28 more. Crazy doc thinks I'm taking it twice a day. They are clueless.
Anyway, hope everyone is having a great day. I am, just been so tired ever since starting the subs.