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Opioids Suboxone Stopped Working for Me...

O

Oppyandme

Bluelighter
Joined
Oct 30, 2009
Messages
169
Location
Brooklyn, NYC
I have been meaning to pose this question for a while. I want to know if this is just me, or others experienced this also. Suboxone does not alleviate my w/d symptoms really anymore. Let me give you all a little background information.

I was taking 30-40mg of oxycodone (orally) daily for around 9 months. I got some subs and decided to quit. I waited till I was in w/d and dosed the subs and felt amazing. Like actually high. used it for around a month and relapsed. This time I started snorting my roxi's, OC's. My usage grew to around 60-80mg daily. I was mainly using over a few hours at nighttime. Moving ahead, I went back on subs, they still worked but I stopped getting high off of them. Now they just made me feel normal and not dopesick. I kept going back and forth for a while, oxy-subs-oxy-subs etc.

Then I started using Opana (oxymorphone). I went on a few month bender, snorting 20mg a day in the beginning, escalating to upwards of 120mg a day. Now I was using from the moment I woke up to the moment I fell asleep. No more of this getting high only at night bullshit. If I couldnt get Opana it would take around 300-500mg of oxycodone to get me high all day.

At this point I made the choice I wanted to get back on subs because I couldn't live life like that anymore. Now keep in mind I had went from full agonists to bupe over and over again before this and I started noticing it wasnt working as well as it used to. So I went from 120mg Opana daily for a long time to subs, and to be concise, it didnt work. I was extremely dopesick after dosing upwards of 8mg of subs (thats a lot for me, never use that much). Basically 75% of my w/d symptoms persisted for 2-3 days even on the subs until I finally leveled off and felt normal again.

Now that was maybe 3 months ago. I have done the same thing a few times and bupe just does not fucking work for me anymore and it really upsets me.

Has anyone experienced this? Is it from using something as potent as oxymorphone? Is it from how much I was using? Is it from abusing the partial-agonists by switching back and forth to full agonists too many times?

Right now I am trying to taper down with oxycodone as much as possible, probably to around 90mg a day before I try to jump back on subs again. I am praying to God the suboxone will work because I cant be dopesick at my job.

If anyone has some answers, personal experience or can relate, I would appreciate some feedback. T

Thanks all,
Oppy
 
Nothing in the mega-thread applies?

How much are you dosing on subs? (oh 8 mg)

You can take up 16 mg before you start wasting it "for reals." Annnnd, it can take until the third day of regular dosing to feel normal. This all sounds like normal bupe action to me.
 
I know this is an old thread, but figured I would post anyway as I feel this topic is one that needs to be discussed more.

I too am experiencing the same thing. Went back and forth from vicodin to subs and each time found the subs working less and less. No longer was feeling good on them and it was taking me more and more to get relief. Also when I did go back to the vicodin I could start right back off at my last dosage amount but tolerance rapidly increased. The last relapse I ended up on heroin (an old friend/demon of mine I have not been acquainted with in years). At first it took very little for me to catch a good rush, but quickly ( a matter of weeks) I found myself with quite a habit!! About a gram a day. I tried to get back on the subs, took 4 and felt awful. Functional yes, but still achy, cold sweats, goose flesh and a bit of that lovely churning stomach.

My theory is that the bouncing back to the subs causes your tolerance to skyrocket, that coupled with the ceiling effect on the subs and you are basically S.O.L ! I am right now working on weening myself down on the heroin then going to back to the vicodins and ween down on those as much as possible before again trying to get on the subs. Hopefully this will work, if not I have no clue what I am going to do. I've heard people who get like this usually end up on methadone maintenance, and I have ALWAYS avoided methadone.I very strongly do not believe in it.

Oppyandme, this is an old post, I wonder if you are still around the forum and if so can you tell me if your weening down process worked for you? It sure would be nice to know there is light at the end of this dark tunnel!!!
 
My friend who has extensive oxymorphone use has assured me that everyone they know says the same thing, that Suboxone stops working once you start abusing oxymorphone.

I have no personal experience with oxymorphone and can't comment on this topic based on personal experience, but it's not unheard of by any means.
 
i have never heard of this. does anyone have any actual information ,not saying your lying Captain, just an interesting topic and i would like to see some facts. i have abused plenty of oxymorphone in my day and currently on suboxone and it works fine.
 
I have experienced this.

Buprenorphine has a cieling effect, and therefore it's opioid agonist activity caps off at a dose equivalent to around 30-40 mg of methadone. For most people, even with very large habits, this is enough to alleviate withdrawals. However, if you're using a high dosage of a super potent opioid like oxymorphone, than buprenorphine may not be able to completely ward off withdrawal.
 
oh alright. i understand. its not that it stops working when you start abusing oxymorphone, it just stops working at a high enough dose of any opiate. got it.
 
Captain.Heroin said:
My friend who has extensive oxymorphone use has assured me that everyone they know says the same thing, that Suboxone stops working once you start abusing oxymorphone.

I have no personal experience with oxymorphone and can't comment on this topic based on personal experience, but it's not unheard of by any means.
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I do not know if you all consider taking suboxone (nalaxone+buphenorephine) the same as butrans (buphenorephin transdermal microdose patch). I used to snort 1 40 opana er a day over a few doses with 1 30 mg roxi oral and/or snorted about give or take half a pill. After quitting for about 2-3 months with one "relapse" of 1 40 mg opana over a few days. When I got on the butrans there was a noticeable effect although it was not really a strong high as it was a 5 mcg/h transdermal patch. It had effect for sure though and I was able to enjoy my weed again and not feel like I needed to smoke every 4-6 hours due to serious specific back pains.

Just get your tolerance down. Try weening off with a codine formulation is my recommendation. If they are used responsibly IMO they are the best to get off, but not as much for pain. I find it is less sedating and just about not sedating at all, but a bit stimulating in lower doses.

There was also a recent article I read that said that taking nalaxone with an opiate helps decrees the build of addiction or something, but I am to lazy to find the link to the article I found on shroomery. Maybe thats why suboxone is best to get off opiates with and not necessarily bupe. I wonder what would happen if they made an oxy/hydrocodone or codine and nalaxone formulation for weening off. Ah well hope this helps.
 
bayhead415 said:
I do not know if you all consider taking suboxone (nalaxone+buphenorephine) the same as butrans (buphenorephin transdermal microdose patch).
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Transdermal buprenorphine has a really poor bioavailability, and from what I have gathered about the patches, they are very low in terms of dosage.

I consider buprenorphine + naloxone to be equivalent to buprenorphine for myself; I have tried Suboxone and Subutex, and both have identical effects at an equal dosage for myself.
 
Captain.Heroin said:
My friend who has extensive oxymorphone use has assured me that everyone they know says the same thing, that Suboxone stops working once you start abusing oxymorphone.

I have no personal experience with oxymorphone and can't comment on this topic based on personal experience, but it's not unheard of by any means.
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I abused TONS of oxymorphone, and suboxone was the ONLY THING that saved me from horrible, deadly painful, withdrawals. Although you're right in the sense that suboxone has never gotten me high since my opana days.

As Znegative says, oxym is so powerful that the suboxone doesn't get rid of 100%, but it DOES alleviate like 95%+ of withdrawals if you find the right dose (not too high, not too low, goldilocks style).

Suboxone does work even after abusing said opioid, just probably not in the way most addicts want it to (ie makes you NORMAL, not high in the slightest).

Even when i went to detox and I was averaging a couple HUNDRED MG OF OPANA DAILY, easily 4-5 40mg opanas a day average, depending on $, suboxone still saved me. I started at 10mg at detox and that was enough. Suboxone is powerful stuff, even way more powerful than opana. Opana definitely still 'ruined' opiates for me by comparison, but i'll tell you this much:

I would've never made it through those oxymorphone withdrawals WITHOUT suboxone. I've kicked a lot of times w/o suboxone or methadone: ive kicked morphine without either, i've kicked oxy without either, i've kicked codeine and hydrocodone and heroin. I've done a lot of kicks and even though they are the closest thing to hell on earth, i've been able to do it with OTC meds and walks and hot, hot, showers constantly.

But those opana withdrawals? Only time I was never able to make it 'to the finish line' of the withdrawals. Never have i experienced such PHYSICAL PAIN from withdrawals (sure its been bad, but never felt like someone was slamming a sledgehammer into my spine and jointmens constantly), nor GI disturbances, nor hot/cold flashes and sweats, nor the mental aspect been so horrible. Not to mention they last longer than almost all other opiates, and the 'worst' day is, like methadone, right in the middle. Opana W/D IMO compare to nothing else

But even with all of that, and several yellows every day being my average before i went to detox? Suboxone at the right dosing in the right setting with doctors was able to get me through it. I would've NEVER been able to get through that w/o suboxone. SO! Bupe still works after crazy power opioids like oxymorphone, just definitely will not get you high, nor get you feeling anything but NOT SICK!

Just gotta get the dose right IMO (and add other meds such as advil, clonodine, etc. Only one I added was IBUPROFEN but I'm sure clonodine in conjuncture with suboxone would be awesome for a rough kick). Again just from my own personal experiences, and observations, from my countless kicks and time in detox observing other people.
 
I have been having a similar problem with subs!! I was on suboxone for 5 years or so and I took maybe 8mg daily for average for first 3 years then 16 mg daily for the fourth.. Then around year 5 I had to up the dose to 24-32 mg daily and it was fine other than the side effects from the naloxone. I had my doc switch me to subutex 2 years ago and a lot of the side effects went away but over the last year and a half or so bupe just stopped working. I have really strong cravings, I'm depressed all the time and my dose used to make me feel content and I wouldn't think about opiates at all but now it doesn't work at all!!! I researched this medication extensively and I feel like it ran its course on my body and no longer can give me any positive effect because of the ceiling effect and my tolerance developed way over that amount during my 8 years on Buprenorphine. My only thought has been trying to switch to methadone as I can't take the void that subs no leave. Methadone being a full opiate I believe that my brain might be more receptive to it and not shut it out and leave me in a state of longing like I am now. Anyone have similar experience ? I feel like I'm a lab rat for Buprenorphine and the last year I felt like I have been going nuts trying to figure out why it stopped working and why I'm constantly longing even right after my dose. Do any doctors or clinics dispense methadone like they do subs? Or are they all everyday dose things? I can't take that going to a clinic everyday...
 
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i have been on subs for 3 years now and always felt great i thought i was the only one nt feeling the high anymore for past 2 months ive been puzzled i am not w/d ing but dnt have interest or energy. has anyone found a fix for this problem yet? replies would be greatly appreciated
 
anabolic1979 said:
I have been having a similar problem with subs!! I was on suboxone for 5 years or so and I took maybe 8mg daily for average for first 3 years then 16 mg daily for the fourth.. Then around year 5 I had to up the dose to 24-32 mg daily and it was fine other than the side effects from the naloxone. I had my doc switch me to subutex 2 years ago and a lot of the side effects went away but over the last year and a half or so bupe just stopped working. I have really strong cravings, I'm depressed all the time and my dose used to make me feel content and I wouldn't think about opiates at all but now it doesn't work at all!!! I researched this medication extensively and I feel like it ran its course on my body and no longer can give me any positive effect because of the ceiling effect and my tolerance developed way over that amount during my 8 years on Buprenorphine. My only thought has been trying to switch to methadone as I can't take the void that subs no leave. Methadone being a full opiate I believe that my brain might be more receptive to it and not shut it out and leave me in a state of longing like I am now. Anyone have similar experience ? I feel like I'm a lab rat for Buprenorphine and the last year I felt like I have been going nuts trying to figure out why it stopped working and why I'm constantly longing even right after my dose. Do any doctors or clinics dispense methadone like they do subs? Or are they all everyday dose things? I can't take that going to a clinic everyday...
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im having exact same problem going nuts trying to fig it out and i dont do any other drugs anymore juat sub have u found n e answers or fixes to this?
 
No phine you bloody well won't as you've already been told in the 2 threads you've made already.
 
^it is a spectacularly far-spread myth that doing other opiates AFTER taking suboxone will throw you into withdrawal. Naloxone present or not, all that will happen is that you will now high. Now reverse that order, and we're talking extreme (precipitated) withdrawals
 
Crazyeighths said:
^it is a spectacularly far-spread myth that doing other opiates AFTER taking suboxone will throw you into withdrawal. Naloxone present or not, all that will happen is that you will now high. Now reverse that order, and we're talking extreme (precipitated) withdrawals[
Click to expand...

Correct. Using an opiate with suboxone already in your system will just prevent you from getting high because of the blocking factor. (It's the bupe that blocks, not the naloxone). However, if you do the opposite... and use suboxone with opiates in your system, you will be thrown into PW's (provided you are psychically dependent on opiates)
 
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