Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine Mega Thread v. 19

[adder]

I don't get it how people differentiate between Subutex and Suboxone, and Zubsolv is still the same medication only better absorbed, supposedly. It's the same active compound - buprenorphine with or without naloxone which is harmless. Buprenorphine's affinity to MOP receptors is ~3x higher than that of naloxone (source), the dose ratio in Suboxone is 4:1 with a much lower s.l. BA for naloxone vs. buprenorphine (source). Also, naloxone's half-life is only up to 1h, so the minuscule quantity that gets into the circulation is mostly gone by the time buprenorphine really kicks in. Under no circumstances naloxone antagonistic properties should have an effect on buprenorphine effects, so saying that Subutex is a little stronger than Suboxone or that you'll get a stronger buzz off Subutex is untrue. There are many stories of people switching from Suboxone to Subutex and still feeling withdrawal despite being on the same dose, it's all due to autosuggestion.

The reason why opioid effects from buprenorphine diminish over time as you take more doses is because it builds up in your blood and occupies more and more receptors. That's what happens initially. The so-called "honey moon" phase has probably more to do with long-term tolerance (the change in effects may relate both to MOP and KOP receptors). That's why unless your tolerance is incredibly high, you never really need doses as high as 24-32mg. It's best to stabilize on the lowest dose possible, I guess you'll have a bigger chance that your buprenorphine doesn't stop working too soon.

 

[d1ahp]

I don't get it how people differentiate between Subutex and Suboxone, and Zubsolv is still the same medication only better absorbed, supposedly. It's merely the same active compound - buprenorphine with or without naloxone which is harmless. Buprenorphine's affinity to MOP receptors is ~3x higher than that of naloxone (source), the dose ratio in Suboxone is 4:1 with a much lower s.l. BA for naloxone vs. buprenorphine (source). Also, naloxone's half-life is only up to 1h, so the minuscule quantity that gets into the circulation is mostly gone by the time buprenorphine really kicks in. Under no circumstances naloxone antagonistic properties should have an effect on buprenorphine effects, so saying that Subutex is a little stronger than Suboxone or that you'll get a stronger buzz off Subutex is untrue. There are many stories of people switching from Suboxone to Subutex and still feeling withdrawal despite being on the same dose, it's all due to autosuggestion.

The reason why opioid effects from buprenorphine diminish over time as you take more doses is because it builds up in your blood and occupies more and more receptors. That's what happens initially. The so-called "honey moon" phase has probably more to do with long-term tolerance (the change in effects may relate both to MOP and KOP receptors). That's why unless your tolerance is incredibly high, you never really need doses as high as 24-32mg. It's best to stabilize on the lowest dose possible, I guess you'll have a bigger chance that your buprenorphine doesn't stop working too soon.

Because people are ignorant. I'm not saying that to insult anyone. They simply don't know.

There was a time when I thought that Subutex was superior to Suboxone because of its lack of Naloxone. That was until I learned that Buprenorphine's binding affinity is stronger than that of Naloxone.

Most doctors still believe that Subutex has more abuse potential because it doesn't have Naloxone. I'm sensitive to Naloxone and it gives me headaches, but I cannot convince a doctor to give me Subutex instead because hurr durr abuse potential.

Can you take a look at my question above your post?

 

[True.junkie]

After reading the first 15 pages of this thread this morning, I decided to shoot up a piece of my 8/2 sub film. I did a quarter of the film with 1/2 ml of water. This was going to be my first time taking suboxone. I did my last dose of BTH yesterday at about 8pm. It was noon when I did the sub dose. OMG. I thought I was going to die. Worst experience of my life. As the rush came, my whole body felt cold and tingly. I was the fool because I hadn't started any WD symptoms. But oh boy, I tell you I sure was WD badly after that dose.One mistake I wish I would have never tried. Any others experience something similar?

 

[Jabberwocky]

Any others experience something similar?

this happens often; many people will dose a bit too early and experience the WD's take over their body.

luckily, this does NOT happen to me. I can shoot dope at 8AM and eat a sub/bupe by 8PM and be fine. you just have to be careful when it comes to subs/bupe and learn the game a bit before you go ahead and take it a bit too far; kinda like you just did.

 

[woamotive]

True words! Know yourself! I wait 16 hours.

Transitioning aaagain from h to sub today. Like third time in a week. No, im really stoned.

Toodles.

 

[Daniella1989]

My boyfriend has been on zubusolv tab 5.7/1.4 for a week now he took suboxone tab 8mg a couple years age and used to crush up and put under his toungue said it gave him a heroin high does anyone know is the zubsolv will do the same he said snorting burns too much he's nervous to be on these threads so hes having me do it for him and I'm new to this so I'm not sure if I'm even at the right place

Thanks

 

[Jabberwocky]

My boyfriend has been on zubusolv tab 5.7/1.4 for a week now he took suboxone tab 8mg a couple years age and used to crush up and put under his toungue said it gave him a heroin high does anyone know is the zubsolv will do the same he said snorting burns too much he's nervous to be on these threads so hes having me do it for him and I'm new to this so I'm not sure if I'm even at the right place

Thanks

he's nervous to be on these boards/threads? why!? ha. does he think the cops will get him? or is this YOU asking the question but pretending its your so called "boyfriend"!?

either way, why doesnt he just try it and see what it feel like for him? if he's doing bupe or zub daily, then it wont be anything like a heroin high. if he's doing this for the first time in 2 years then yes, it will be like a heroin high.

 

[RTrain]

My boyfriend has been on zubusolv tab 5.7/1.4 for a week now he took suboxone tab 8mg a couple years age and used to crush up and put under his toungue said it gave him a heroin high does anyone know is the zubsolv will do the same he said snorting burns too much he's nervous to be on these threads so hes having me do it for him and I'm new to this so I'm not sure if I'm even at the right place

Thanks

They're are basically the same medications. Just the doses of the 2 active drugs in the medication is adjusted because the Zubsolv has hihger absorption rates, and might have some other benefits I can't think of right now, but they are pretty much the same exact drug.

You don't make it clear whether he is taking the Zubsolv to treat opiate addiction or to get high? Also you don't make it clear whether his past use of Suboxone was for recreation (getting high) or to treat opiate addiction.

And if he is just getting high off it, just watch out, combined with other downers and such it can be quite deadly, Narcan does not work on it, so better hope some good medics show up.

 

[Usa51]

Roxy habit last year or so with few breaks. Sometimes take 4 sometimes 10-12. TooK 6 mg sub yesterday. Didn't feel great didn't want to go higher. Took another 6 today too feel ok. Blah. Any questions or tips? Trying to do a quick taper thanks

 

[Crackajack]

Hey guys, I'm not sure if this is the right place to post this or not but I'm desperately needing some help and expertise about Bupe urine testing. I'm almost completely tapered off of Bupe after almost 9 months and have a pre-employment drug screen this coming Monday. I know that it will test for Bupe and a small amount of Bupe is the only thing that will be in my system. I haven't had a prescription for it in a little over two months so I cannot test positive for it as I have no legal reason to have it. I've looked into synthetic options (quick fix) but am not crazy about the expense and shipping costs for a rush if there's a less expensive, possibly more effective method of detox drink or other synthetic option that will definitely work for Bupe. I would really appreciate any help or advice you all can offer me. I've finally gotten my life back on track after a very tough time and am hoping I can beat this Bupe piss test and become gainfully employed. If there's another thread I need to check in please share. Thank you in advance.

 

[Jabberwocky]

what makes you think they will test for bupe? they told you that? its not gonna come up on a 5 panal test and if its for a job then I really doubt they would do anything more than that. in order to test for bupe you have to have a test specific for that; no job will be testing just to see if a potential employment has ever taken suboxone unless its some whacky fucking job.

 

[jeffitto]

Hello, I'm not sure if anyone can see this as I'm not what would be considered "computer savvy". I don't even remember how I got on this site, but it's somehow my homepage & I haven't logged out since I used my tablet last- a year or so ago. I have a very serious problem however.

I was diagnosed in 2002 with schizophrenia, & for the first 10 years I tried dozens of medications that not only didn't work but made me feel horrible & I covered those side effects with booze. In 2012 I couldn't go on that way & decided to take the road of slow suicide by becoming a heroine addict. I really did feel like this was the way I would go out. I actually had peace with it. I am a Christian & know I'm going to heaven. I've live a wonderful life, I've traveled a lot & experienced many of the worlds beautiful destinations. I couldn't make sense of my affliction & can't even describe or express the effects of it correctly. No medication or therapy worked or helped at all. Self medicating with heroine seemed to finally make me feel good, but I knew it was the road to the grave. For some reason in February this year the will to live came over me. My 1st move was to get off heroine, & I found a doctor who prescribed to me Suboxone (film). I'm posting this question because I'm at a loss for understanding. This Suboxone seems to be helping with my mental affliction. I'm not taking anything else. Nor am I drinking or using anything else. I'm attending regular Bible study & living/feeling the way I did in 2001. I read stories of people taking Suboxone who indicate intoxication. I haven't felt more sober in my life. My question is this: Is this a temporary affect? Is Suboxone a psychotic medication? Am I in for a major crash? Am I high & don't know it? Should I continue taking it?

 

[d1ahp]

Hello, I'm not sure if anyone can see this as I'm not what would be considered "computer savvy". I don't even remember how I got on this site, but it's somehow my homepage & I haven't logged out since I used my tablet last- a year or so ago. I have a very serious problem however.

I was diagnosed in 2002 with schizophrenia, & for the first 10 years I tried dozens of medications that not only didn't work but made me feel horrible & I covered those side effects with booze. In 2012 I couldn't go on that way & decided to take the road of slow suicide by becoming a heroine addict. I really did feel like this was the way I would go out. I actually had peace with it. I am a Christian & know I'm going to heaven. I've live a wonderful life, I've traveled a lot & experienced many of the worlds beautiful destinations. I couldn't make sense of my affliction & can't even describe or express the effects of it correctly. No medication or therapy worked or helped at all. Self medicating with heroine seemed to finally make me feel good, but I knew it was the road to the grave. For some reason in February this year the will to live came over me. My 1st move was to get off heroine, & I found a doctor who prescribed to me Suboxone (film). I'm posting this question because I'm at a loss for understanding. This Suboxone seems to be helping with my mental affliction. I'm not taking anything else. Nor am I drinking or using anything else. I'm attending regular Bible study & living/feeling the way I did in 2001. I read stories of people taking Suboxone who indicate intoxication. I haven't felt more sober in my life. My question is this: Is this a temporary affect? Is Suboxone a psychotic medication? Am I in for a major crash? Am I high & don't know it? Should I continue taking it?

Suboxone has been or is being studied for its anti-depressant effects, but it's not officially approved for the treatment of. It is not a psychotic medication. If you keep taking your Suboxone as prescribed you're not in for a crash, but the honeymoon phase may wear off. Though, a lot of people report feeling good with prolonged Suboxone use, unlike heroin, where you develop a tolerance and the magic wears off. If you were high, you'd know it. Should you continue taking it? Do the benefits of your Suboxone use outweigh the risks? If so, it's not a bad idea to keep using it. Suboxone is an opiate, just like heroin is, and sudden discontinuation will cause withdrawals. A slow, gradual taper is highly recommended if you want to discontinue its use.

 

[eteezy915]

I had typed up a real long detailed question but it got lost when my browser timed out n logged me out, causing me to lose it all so here's the basic question: I have compounded bupe only troches, the stamp sized gummies, and was on my 3rd day back on them after a little binge and finally feeling good again. So like the genius I am I went and scored some dope :'(. Did a shot that would and normally nod me out but felt nothing, as expected but was just in that mood where I gotta shoot.
Anyway my actual question; if you do H and it's completely blocked what happens to it? Does it just "float around" in your system slowly binding to receptors as the bupe wears off or does it leave the body faster bc it had nowhere to bind?
Thanks all,
ET(eezy) Phonehome

 

[True.junkie]

Time to bring this thread back from the dead..

 

[THE_REAL_OBLIVION]

Alright, due to the fact I am where I am due to an untenable pain situation, I preferred methadone to suboxone, the only issue, which is a big one, methadone has thrown my testosterone levels have gone down the gutter and I gained 110 pounds in 11 months so I had to switch to suboxone, which is kinda okay for pain, but gives other kinds of pains which unfortunately not even a prescription to relpax and fiorinal (without codeine, unfortunately, I long for the days codeine did anything to me, I was one of the people who would be awesomely happy with a script of Empracets (30/300) or a 10mg oxycontin, chewed, but still. I was on some pain treatment that was abruptly stopped by a retiring jaw specialist, who had me on Codeine Contins 200mgx2 every 12 hours + an Oxycodan 5mg/375mg (generic percodan, percodan itself doesnt even exist here in canada anymore) as needed (usually one or two a day). So the obvious happened when I found a pharms dealer who had of course much stronger stuff, Hydromorph Contins 18mg and 30mg, Oxycontins 40mg, Supeudol (generic OxyIR) 20mg for ridiculously low prices.

So while the ORT clinic acknowledges my pain issues, they got all the IRM's and x-rays that prove my condition, I had to stop methadone, was put on a shot of Delatestryl once a week SC until it got back to normal, that combined with the fact bupe a partial agonist is proven to reduce testosterone much less than comparable large doses of full agonists (i never had issues with T with any other full agonist other than Methadone, the only opioid with a sides effect list longer than my 2 arms). I'm tapering the suboxone pills, slowly, i was at 12mg, now at 10, but sometimes take less, sometimes more, it really depends on how i feel, but 2 months now at 10mg and I still have a full 8mg pill by the time I reach monday, the day before I renew my script and take in my 6 takehome doses.

I understand the full ramifications of switching from bupe to methadone, it was painless in my case, went from 49mg methadone ( I was already since a while taking 2-3mg less a month since a while), to 44 for 2 weeks, 39 for 2 weeks, then I went without methadone for 48 hours as I am a fast metabolizer (I had a script for tagamet 600mg then for ulcers, not actually fooled my doc into giving it to me, tagamet is now rx only in canada since a long time and doses of 200mg and over are to heal those ulcers away, and it worked, and it also made the methadone hit hard as fuck, but by the end of the day I could feel it go away and I'd need a little sip from a takehome to make things alright). Anyway, since my T levels are fine, I followed my doctor's procedure which is to stop the SC injections of Delatestryl for a month and have blood tests done again and see where I am with only suboxone and how it affects those T levels. If everything is normal, I'll be switching back to methadone, temporarily, as they acknowledge my pain problem and been told I truly belong in the department next door in the hospital (the Pain Clinic, which share a lot of the same docs with the ORT clinic).

Now the tl;dr,, I know all about switching from methadone to bupe, how does it work the other way, from bupe to methadone? I've only been told I'd have to be inpatient a few days, when I switched to bupe, I was in the inpatient area, but only for 4 hours in my own room, to see how my induction reacted, 2 days in a row, first was given 2mg then 2 hours later another 2mg and everything was fine, the next day i was given 4mg, twice and all was fine, I left with a 10mg script. Also is it worth it? I'm promised generic oxycontin 60mg and some lyrica for my insanely painful TMJ disorder/nerve damage in that area too when I quit bupe. But this is taking a long ass time, getting used from 12 to 10mg took me a month and a half, next step is 8mg, next appointment is in early january, so I got a lot of time to think about my course of action.

Wait there is already another suboxone thread v.19...this one seems superfluous, as the other one's first post is a very large FAQ.

 

[WhiteCat9Lives]

Hi guys, i have a question

I`ve been readingthis forum since 2007, its got tons of good info and it helped me a lot in past years. This is my first post, here we go

Im on Buprenorphine for 3 weeks now on 2mg a day, snorting (bad i know, will stop asap). Today i had urge and i bought 1g of dope. I took my bupe at 12am and started smoking at 7pm. I have 0.2 left. The dope here is pretty shitty in the last few years, and i dont feel especially high (probably because of bupe, will never do this shit again) The last time i smoked dope was 1 month ago. So i fucked up pretty bad i know. I dont know how to handle this so i wont go in to PW`s. 3 weeks ago when i went from meth to bupe i was waiting 48h but i guess it was not enuf because i went into PW. It was like hell. The worse part lasted 2 hours but after that i cold not sleep whole night and have been in WD for almost two days (it was getting better with hours of course). So how should i get myself out of this mess? I will wait at least 24 hours and the start of WD. So how should i start taking 0.5 and see what happens, or should i take 2mg? Has anyone here been in similar situation? If so please help me. I hope you understand me because English is not my first language. If i posted in the wrong section im sorry. I thought its not cool to open new thread because of this.

Have a nice day beautiful souls

 

[Jabberwocky]

how long do you typically stay on Suboxone for!? I know whatever works, works.. and you should probably stick w/ it, but I am wondering how some/most of you go about coming up w/ that number (how long you stay on Suboxone).

as of now, its only been 4-5 months and I've been doing great; SOBER IN MY EYES (Suboxone and Gabapentin)! but to others, I a far from sober, and I've made threads like this before and know its totally ON ME and ONLY ME but Id like to see what it feels like to be actually "sober".

last time on Suboxone, and actually TRIED TO STAY SOBER, I started off at 24MG in a psych ward and dropped to 16MG after a week/day I left the place. I stayed at 16MG for a month or two and dropped to 12, then 8, then 6, then 4 and on the 9th month I was at 2MG. it was at the 2MG mark I started to get a bit antsy and I just so happen to run into a "friend" on the street and BOOM, I was up and running again.. dope, dope, dope.. and guess what, more dope! so yea, life took a tumble and I went on the craziest 2-3yr run of my life! B-A-N-A-N-A-S!

now its been 4-5 months and all have been good. I started off at 16MG for about 4 months and then dropped it right to 8MG since my dick was NOT WORKING on 16MG! I was NOT getting hard when needed and never was horny enough for the girl; shes a beautiful girl, so I should have been horny/hard at the drop of a dime, but I wasnt. I knew anytime I took 8MG I would be solid as a ROCK, so I just dropped right to 8MG and felt NO DIFFERENCE! I actually feel better on 8MG than I did on 16MG! I am also hard as a rock, when needed, and can squirtttttttttttttttttttt that cum everywhere and anywhere, baby! ha.

so yea, now I am at 8MG and thinking of making the move to 6MG.. just cuz I KNOW I CAN! so why not, right? and as they say, less is MORE w/ Suboone; although I think that is total BS since I've been doing it many years, many times, but only two times have I actually did it and TRIED TO STAY SOBER! many times I'd just use it to buy an extra day till I get $$ or if I was on vaca and did not want to take the risk of bringing real drugs w/ me.

starting to notice I am writing and writing and its kinda bout NOTHING good. I guess what I am asking is.. what I originally said! SHOULD I, or COULD I, get off Suboxone and how long do you typically stay on before even attempting to settle down a bit!? I see a "private Dr." AKA - a drug dealer, who I pay for each visit, and then he writes a script. he is a good dude but he scripts based on what i have to say and, of course, I always take the 2 16MG/day so I have extra and never have to worry; even tho I am at 1 8MG/day and would NEVER tell him that since I am paying the same amount regardless, so why get less!? ha. I KNOW I am not the only one who would do this; when I was on my old script, years back, and had my insurance covering it, I actually had my Dr. KNOW what I was taking and he would drop the dosage down over the months but I always tried to stay 2-4MG ahead of the game. I'd never do that now since I pay top dollar and I want EVERYTHING I CAN GET; including my 30 100MG Seroquel monthly.

anyway, tell me your experience and how quick you got off!? if so, how much dope/opiates were you doing prior? how long did you use for? what did you do w/ Suboxone before making the switch? (used prior but ended up relapsing; only used on days when you could not afford your drug, etc). what else do you take w/ your Suboxone? when/how/where/

 

[StealYourFace]

Ive been using subs as a stop gap for long time now. Use it for a week then go back to my doc...

Well suboxone usually makes be feel kinda blah which is why I always go back. This time tho I got bunivile ... Wow! I feel fantastic on about 2mg. Easy adminstration and I dont have the yuky blahs and headache I usually have on subs. Any other feel that way? I will easily make one last 4 or 5 days.

 

[sober.for.now]

I was on 8mg subutex for 8yrs and made the choice to quick taper for 5 days and just made the jump.............and holy shit was that hard but i made it out of the physical but this dark cloud is eating me alive. not sure what to do about it other than staying active but im not sure if thats enough. any thoughts?