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Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine Mega Thread and FAQ v17.0 + v18.0

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Some people hallucinate off them (I seriously don't think that's common whatsoever)

For myself I get really shitty feeling the next day like I am not happy and it detracts from my energy the next day

It's weird and I'm not exactly sure how to put my experience with it into words.

I don't hallucinate (I can't visualize anything), but I do hear voices, and I am very anxious with restless limbs. This is only during withdrawal. If I take one or two or a few now while on bupe, it just seems to do nothing.

I also get the "hangover effect" and feel shitty the next day.

Does anyone know how long after taking suboxone I can get high on kratom? I shot 8 mgs of sub over the course of the last six days, the past 2 days only using very small amounts like .2 mgs. I want to go back on kratom because I realized I like it so much more than suboxone but it seems the sub is blocking it because I took a strong dose and only feel minor effects.

I don't know much about Kratom. I was under the impression that bupe didn't block it from others' posts here. Perhaps the bupe raised your tolerance? I know bupe keeps my tolerance around ~150 mg oxycodone, and has been reported to keep tolerance at ~100 mg oxycodone. Hopefully someone else comes along soon who can help more.
 
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You probably won't be able to get high off kratom for a while after using subs for 6 days straight. When I was using kratom, back in early 2000s, I would go on oxy binges where I only took 40-60mg per day for 4 days, and couldn't get high off kratom for about a week and a half afterwords. I believe it's because instead of withdrawing from the subs, your body is just using the kratom to avoid withdrawal. I find 3 days use of any opiate gets me WD'ing pretty hard. Just be lucky you just aren't getting high from kratom and arent withdrawing. There were times I went through crazy withdrawal, where kratom would kind of take away the chills, and the shits, but every other symptom still stayed there. Just keep using kratom as you normally would and within a week you should start getting effects again.
 
It never takes that long for me though, I go on heroin binges where I use heroin 3 or 4 days then switch back to kratom and I am always able to get high on kratom again 2-3 days later. Suboxone being a lot weaker than heroin, I figured it would be even less time. The last time I switched from sub to kratom, I got super high on the kratom after being in sub withdrawal for one day or so.
 
Finally off sub after 7 long years

It's been a while since I've been on bluelight for a few reasons, but this site has helped me tremendously through the years and I was more active in the early days of the first few sub mega threads. Just wanted to pop in for an update because I was stuck on sub for many years more than I needed to be, complacency and fear of withdrawals kept me captive for far too long.

Started on the stupid high dose of 16mg in 2007 after a modest dope/oxy habit and IV use was caught in infancy. Got on sub, tested limits the first year with high dose OC and dope once or twice, realized it wasn't worth the waste of money and continued with sub as directed. Did blow for 9 months til I got my last strike with my BF. 7 years on sub, 6 years clean of illicit substances. Had my first kid in 2012 and she escaped withdrawal, but my son didn't. He was kept for 2 weeks in NICU with scores borderline and I asked them to not medicate unless the scores were more consistently over the line because it didn't seem necessary.

About a year ago I realized I was living in a fog for so long on sub and never even realized it. I'm not here to preach either way, btw, I was content on it for several years and think certain people should continue to stay on indefinitely. I'm just not one of them. Whenever I told my doc of my intent to quit he would peer at me and say, "Huh, well you should probably wait til spring." and send me on my way with the usual 16mg/day Rx, leaving me to my own devices. My sweet spot was always 4-6mg/day but I couldn't seem to get any lower than that on my own. Early this year I told my doctor to give me my last Rx ever and I would taper with that on my own.

The hardest part was using the hi tech brand subutex for taper, because they are impossibly tiny and difficult to divide lower than 2mg since any less is basically dust. I handed it over to my boyfriend who kept it in his safe and doled out my daily dose for a few months. The last 2 months we just made sure that each crumb was equal to or smaller than the previous days crumb.

Comfort meds I had were clonidine .2mg X 120, valium 5mg x (? a shit load), ativan, and the doc threw in tramadol, up to 5 a day for 4-5 weeks. Other regular med is adderall, 80mgIR + 30mg XR (10 years of tolerance + 2 years of stupid high dose abuse = current 110mg daily dose. Don't go there, I already know. One battle at a time.)

My last dose was on August 8th, approx .5-.75mg. The first week was largely mental, waiting for the bomb to drop and feeling sorry for myself. Second week I realized it wasn't as bad as I thought, maybe. 3rd week, meh, dysphoric and blah but ok.

Week 4, few days before I had tapered off the tramadol for good, I was hit like a ton of bricks one evening. In the backyard playing with my kids, and out of nowhere I was rendered completely useless. Any trace of energy was sapped from my body, and that night was the first of restless legs and arms like I've never experienced before. For the next 10 days I was totally miserable, taking loads of valium, clon, flexeril, vodka, etc at night to try to knock myself out but nothing could overpower the maggots under my skin. The only thing that provided temporary relief was while I lay in a steaming hot bath. Even then I had ice cold bones. I don't want to see our utility bill because I think I averaged 4-5 hot as possible baths every night for 10 days straight.

Depleted, defeated, burnt out, and at the point where too many people go back on sub or relapse otherwise, I saw my doc and got gabapentin. I don't know if it's coincidence or the meds because I only take 100mg gaba during the day which is nothing, and 200mg at night which is still nothing, and I've been sleeping like a baby for the past week (with <5mg valium & .1 clonidine).

I finally feel like I am inching closer to "the other side" of this and seeing the light. Piper, take your payment and fuck off.

I'm not naive and know PAWS has plenty of time to kick my ass but I am just proud to have finally taken this leap. Yeah, 2-3 weeks were pretty nasty and felt like an eternity, but it passed. I'm excited to live life with feelings again, the good, bad, and ugly, I'll take it compared to the steady "meh" I felt on sub (I thought I was just really really good at dealing with everything...wrong).

I just wanted to share my experience and that I am finally off and not looking back. I'm very grateful for Bluelight, it's been an indispensable resource for me many times. Now that I'm far out from my days of using, partying, crashing, and maintaining, I don't post much anymore, but will fade back into lurkdom and keep moving forward.

Much love to BL and all of the mods especially, you're amazing! Captain, you're a huge influence and help more people than you'll ever know. Mr Scag, tricomb, cane2theleft, tommyboy, genericmind, ebola, hammilton... and anyone else selflessly spreading truth & harm reduction. <3
 
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Took more kratom today and still only got threshold effects. Is this still the sub blocking it or did the sub somehow raise my tolerance? Is it possible that low doses of sub could raise my kratom tolerance more than a heroin binge, because I am normally able to feel kratom (not fully of course) on day 2 following a heroin binge.
 
Yeah, depending how much h you were doing, it's totally possible. Sub is actually very strong, even though it usually won't get someone with a tolerance "high". Honestly, even with my tolerance at 4+ buns a day or 400+ mg oxy just to stay well, 12-16 mg sub had me high the first 10 or so times I took it (irregularly, not maintenance, just when I could get it here or there).

@ellua - I just started paying attention to the bupe thread when I got on bupe 6 or 8 months ago. Since then I've read all 18 versions, so I remember you quite well. I want you to know that your posts (along with all the other old-schoolers) have helped/influenced me greatly. I remember many of your well-thought-out posts to help others. As a result of reading all the old threads and asking for help on this current version, I started at 16 mg in January but tapered to 4-6 mg in March and have been under 2 mg a day for the majority of the time since June or so. I still think it's too soon to think about getting off, but the low dose is good for me right now without keeping me so far in the "bupe fog".
 
Well I got frustrated from not being able to get high on kratom especially because I suffer from an illness this weekend, 102.8 fever (at its height, gone now) runny nose, sore throat, aches and pain and so I really wanted a pain reliever. I got frustrated with my kratom not working so I went out and bought some heroin. I just shot up, felt the initial rush as per usual when I do heroin on suboxone and then my high is gone now 5 minutes later which is typically what happens when I do suboxone on heroin. How is this possible? All I took was one 8 mg sub over the course of a whole week and the past 2 days all I took was about .2 mg IV (which is stronger but also greatly reduces the half life) and my last sub dose was aproximately 36 hours ago. How can it be that it is still blocking me heroin? I have taken 4 mg of sub at night and got wasted on heroin the following evening, not even 24 hrs later. Why am I being blocked 36 hours after a miniscule dose? I deeply regret ever purchasing that sub. I used to be a MAJOR suboxone fan, liking it as much as heroin. It used to give me the most joyful, energetic, long lasting buzz that just made me smile. I was longing for some sub all summer long, even tried to talk one of my co-workers who had health insurance to go to a sub doc and get suboxone for me. Man am I glad I didn't go through with that, this recent time the sub just made me feel what I call "sub groggy", I found it greatly inferior to both kratom and heroin and now on tops of not liking the effects, I can't even get high on my drugs of choice! I just drank the last of my wine hoping that would help me feel the heroin a bit more but it wasn't much. I wish I had some vodka or something but I don't feel like driving to the liquor store, being sick and all.
 
Thanks to everyone's suggestions I think I can maintain my abstinence from Methadone by taking around 4mgs of Suboxone a day. I have cut up the 8mg tabs and I take a 1/4 tablet twice a day. I don't "feel" anything, but they sure do keep me from jonesing for Methadone.

I will also see how well I do on 1/4 tablet a day. It may be all in my head, the addict talking to me, telling me I need more.
I haven't felt an opiate high in a long time. I miss it, but not enough to chase it right now.
Thanks again for all your help and wisdom.
 
@ellua - I just started paying attention to the bupe thread when I got on bupe 6 or 8 months ago. Since then I've read all 18 versions, so I remember you quite well. I want you to know that your posts (along with all the ot her old-schoolers) have helped/influenced me greatly. I remember many of your well-thought-out posts to help others. As a result of reading all the old threads and asking for help on this current version, I started at 16 mg in January but tapered to 4-6 mg in March and have been under 2 mg a day for the majority of the time since June or so. I still think it's too soon to think about getting off, but the low dose is good for me right now without keeping me so far in the "bupe fog".

Wow, you read all 18!! You'll do just fine then. Stay on however long is right for you. I wasn't ready to get off until a couple years out, but by then it was simply easier to not change. A point came where I realized if I didn't make a conscious decision to quit soon I may as well stay on for life.

I am just glad we don't have to suffer withdrawal for an equal length of time that we used and abused, you know? 5 weeks of yucky is a drop in the bucket of a penance for the years I said "fuck you!" to my brain and body. Even another so many months of waves of yuck is better than keeping myself stuck, for me anyway. Got it done before my kids really understand what I'm going through and that was most important to me.
 
Hey guys I am here looking for any help maybe one of you can give me. I have not been able to find ANY information on this but I was in another suboxone forum and a poster named genamcc posted a link to a site that claims to be able to prevent and stop suboxone withdrawal and every other opiate withdrawal without meds and that this is information that has been suppressed by the pharma industry for over 37 years so they could sell methadone. Said the Australian government ordered the discovery to be hidden away and that one official stated "If This gets out to the public it has the potential to close half the rehabs in the country"c Stated that a whistleblower has come out and revealed the suppressed information in an ebook titled "No More Opiate Withdrawal". I am not posting any links to this because i don't know if I can and I also don't want to post any links to a garbage scam artist trying to prey on opiate users. Has this person posted anything about this in this forum? I think I have to call BS on this one because if that were true wouldn't we have all heard something about it? Wouldnt that be important enough to make front page news or tV news? I would think so! They posted one link and long post but the mods quickly erased it and I assume banned the person because I could no longer message her (I believe).

I messaged her(I think its a her) and she said she can back up everything she said an has all the papers and research to prove it. Wouldn't the suboxone and or methadone companies put a hit out on somebody that was making accusations like that which could eliminate the need for their meds? I don't have $49.99 to see if she is right and if she is really trying to help people then why is she charging people for this info? That looks suspicious right there. I cant find any negative posts or scam results but would like to know if anyone has heard of this or even tried it and if it really dose what it claims. I am on 24 mg of suboxone and have been for 5 years and want to quit because I am starting to have side effects and severe sleep problems. I just started sniffing them mixed with hydroxizine and taking gabapenton along with the mix. I know that was a BIG MISTAKE because I love it and feel like Im on dope again legally but I am going to have to get down to like 4mg or something so im not so worried all the time. Im also reading about gabapenton withdrawals to if anyone has any stories on that.

This is my first post and I am a greeny but I really just signed up to hopefully find out some info on this because if it were legit it would be a real life saver but if it is some scum bucket scam artist then maybe one of you or a viewer may have some background on her, it, or even what this so called amazing secret is. It says on the site its not imodium ad which was my first guess. Thanks Bluelighters and my name is Dallan.
 
Believe me...if there were an easy way off sub a bluelighter would have discovered that shit long ago.

If its not a box full of Imodium, a medically induced coma, or iboga- the only other thing it could possibly be is a frontal lobotomy.

The only way out is through, period. The more time you waste looking for a magical cure is that much more time lost in the fog instead of moving forward.
 
The easy way off of subs is with opiates..... duh.. everyone knows that. It just sucks cuz it creates a relapsing environment
 
So I have visited the site for years, never registered 'til now. I only registered to give my quick experiences with Suboxone, and coming off of it.

So I started on perc, hydrocodone and eventually oxy's when I was 16-18. Someone gave me some methadone one day and I LOVED it. SO...I went to the Mdone clinic. I stayed on it for 5+years starting around 80 mg and eventually getting down to maybe 15. Thats when I switched to suboxone. I was basically told that it is a miracle drug and not addictive (lol).

3 years later now I have tapered from 10mg to .2 mg (or as close as I could get, I had 2mg tabs and had to break them into 16 pieces or more. So I took some PTO from work, got mentally prepared and got my supplements (amino acids, vitamins/minerals, clonodine, and...Kratom) So I had 9 days off of work and REALLY wanted to be feeling 80%+ before going back to work. The following is my experience with getting off Suboxone. I made mistakes I think, but hopefully it helps someone else get off the Sub as I have found some, but not many specific day by day experiences. All drugs and supplements were legally purchased BTW.

Day 1: Woke up in mild WD, as I had taken just .1mg the day before and one in the AM. With the 30-37 hr half life I know I had some BUPE in my system still, but obviously my receptors were under-stimulated. Symptoms included RLS, lack of sleep, low energy and shaky hands, all mild except the lack of sleep. That morning I took 2 grams of Kratom and felt immediately better. In fact I felt more stimulation than I ever had from SUB. Even Euphoria. I knew this was bad right away.....took 2 more grams that night.

Day 2: No sleep, same mild symptoms as before. Again I took 2 grams of Kratom, this day 3 times. I had the thought (or justification) that Kratom was prob less difficult to get off, so get the sub out of my system and come off the Kratom in a few days.

Day 3: Slept ok, maybe the extra kratom dose the night before, maybe the Unisom and Clonodine helped :) Woke up feeling fine, good even. Went ahead and took same amount of kratom as the day before. Felt amazing. it would last 2-3 hrs, then I'd feel mediocre, and take some more.

Day 4: Slept ok, same thing as the night before. All of these days I had taken my supplements, Clonodine just the last 2 nights. I woke up feeling like crap. slightly more WD symtoms than the 1st 2 days. But no energy and I had stuff to do. I came to the conclusion that the kratom was gonna be tough to get off and I was just delaying the inevitable. So, I throw out the rest of my kratom, get some of my left over SUB (my dumb brain will justify anything) and take .15 mg in the am and >.1mg pm. I told myself this was it!! I will use the sub to ease off, and I thought that my receptors would kind of get confused because of the chemical changes and that they wouldnt be addicted to any one thing at this point (I knew this was BS, but I couldnt concede that I wasted the 1st 4 days. Felt OK all day.

Day 5: I was feeling ok, slept ok. Worked out really hard this day, which REALLY REALLY REALLY helps!!! By 5 pm I felt bad again. Went for a quick jog again, but really felt it coming on. My wife suprised me with dinner at the in laws house that night...so I took a tiny, tiny bit of sub (.02 mg or so) Didnt help. Kind of happy it didnt I was being stupid.

Day 6: finally went and threw out every opiod that I had. Even the dogs pain meds from last year which was tramadol. Felt weak, tired, but no real WD otherwise.

Day 7: Slept well, took Clonodine as needed, worked out. Really excited that I might be getting over it without real "pain" Worked out in the early afternoon, stayed busy, ate healthy. Really tired, no motivation, but fine.

Day 8: Is today. I fell fine. tired, low energy...but it is amazing how little WD I felt. Sleeping good, taking clonodine as needed mostly at night. Really not bad.

Overall I would say that if you can get your SUB dose below .5 MG for a couple weeks (which isnt that hard) DO it!!!!! Ive been on some kind of opiod dose for 10 years until jsut a few days ago and its not that bad at all!! Sub is brutal from 1 mg+ to jump off, but get it as low as possible, mentally and supplemen (ally?) prepare and you will be FINE!!!! And work out!!! at least take a walk. The only bad time was sitting at home feeling bad for my self. Good luck everyone!! hope this helps. and stay away from other sources of opiods they seemed to just delay what was gonna come. Peace
 
The easy way off of subs is with opiates..... duh.. everyone knows that. It just sucks cuz it creates a relapsing environment

The easy way to get off opiates is to take opiates?? Haha I think that's how people got to the position they are in by taking opiates to avoid withdrawal but you can only run for so long.
 
Suboxone withdrawal miracle

Hi. Okay so I'm kind of new here so don't dog me if I say something or post in the wrong place. Anyway. Long story short I've been on suboxone around 8 months. I've done well with the exception of a slip or two. Well where I'm from the street suboxone well ran dry, forcing me to detox. When I look for suggestions everyone usually tapers and jumps from a lower dose. I'm jumping at around 4mg. I got some neurotin. Actually the generic for it. But anyway it's my fourth (almost 5th) day with no subs. I woke up this morning and regretfully skipped my first two classes at the university. I kind of scared myself thinking about the impending doom heading my way. I popped 2100 mg of neurotin and life is bearable. Not easy. But I can function and get out the bed. My head feels slightly in the clouds and my legs can't seem to catch up with my body. I'm slightly tired but able to do things for which I am so grateful. Figured id share. Thanks :)
 
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The easy way to get off opiates is to take opiates?? Haha I think that's how people got to the position they are in by taking opiates to avoid withdrawal but you can only run for so long.

It is technically possible to shorten withdrawal by replacing sub with something with a shorter half life and tapering down. HOWEVER, are you f$*%ing kidding me? Give me any short acting opiate and I will relapse until it's gone. We're addicts here, generally speaking.

There are instances in which it can be done for sure, but for most, a little warmth from the fire and we're right back in the flames.


On another note, I'm still doing well on 1-2 mg SL a day. I may go back to nasal admin soon to conserve sub, but even with a nasal spray bottle, my nose was getting irritated. Any ideas as to why? Just too much abuse? I've been snorting oxys, h, coke, bupe, and anything else I can reasonably snort (nothing containing APAP or microcrystalline cellulose) for five yrs or so.
 
On another note, I'm still doing well on 1-2 mg SL a day. I may go back to nasal admin soon to conserve sub, but even with a nasal spray bottle, my nose was getting irritated. Any ideas as to why? Just too much abuse? I've been snorting oxys, h, coke, bupe, and anything else I can reasonably snort (nothing containing APAP or microcrystalline cellulose) for five yrs or so.

Hmm strange that after putting stuff up your nose for 5 years it suddenly gives way to irritation. Probably need to build up more resistence by upping the frequency.

Aren't you glad I'm back? :)
 
I wasnt going to touch the SAO theory for easing wds as theres truly nothing new by this point in the megas, but I was scripted up to 200mg tramadol for the first month and didnt give it a second thought. After all, its "just" tramadol.

Turns out it was like using paper plates to hold back the force of water from the hoover dam. Acute symptoms hit me when by my estimation 95% of people are done with the physical stuff- week 4. Taking more tram didnt touch it and then I was out, possibly compounding the issue.

"But if it had been a real SAO and you did it for 90 days...."

If there's proof of this please ante up, cause my addiction doctor asks "So what do you want from me?" at each appointment. Seriously. I fill in the blank. And if I squandered the recent visit by turning down a magical cure and shooting too low, well fuck.
 
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