Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v3; 2010 - 2022

[bwanajzj]

^I agree PERIOD. Will always support the legalization of Cannabis, and would even go as far as to enforce much more medical research in that plant if I had the chance. So many people could benefit, and get a much better life. Food, clothes, smoke, new medicines from all the other cannabinoids that are left unexplored!

 

[SubDude]

False negatives and all of that crap is why I would never willingly go through with a drug test. They are so unreliable that it's more like playing roulette with a doctor, or your employer, etc. because of shit like that.

I would instruct your doctor to have him watch you take some, wait an hour or two, take another UA, and then still be a false negative. Then I would have him never take your UA again since a perpetual false negative isn't telling him jack shit.

Agreeing to continue giving UA's, while they are all false negatives, says to me "you can harass me every month and I'll just have to continue attempt to what you believe is bullshitting you around doctor, whereas I'm just telling you the truth and you cannot believe a drug test would be so faulty when it really is that way".

I think it's probably false negative because of the low .5mg I take?? Hopefully taking extra 1-2mg a couple of days before next appt will end the dilemma

Once again... the first problem is that I get it FREE thru the VA so it's their way or the highway. If I take the prescribed dose of 4mg in front of him... I'm pretty sure it would show up as it should. I just don't want to take that much... [definitely ongoing] But I guess that is an viable option.

I wonder how he will intepret that? From his perspective I take 4mg on my own and it doesn't show... but if I take it in front of him... it does. Damn I hate people having such power over me.... and I'm basically allowing it.

If they finally kick me out, for claiming I'm NOT taking it... I'll probably eventually go back to paying for MMT at a local private clinic... after I go thru my subs stock. This VA district sucks because 2 different VA's about 100 miles away [one east the other north] offer both subs and methadone. This one... it's subs or nothing.

IDK, If necessary I might just go ahead and see him weekly [his requirement]to get a lower prescribed dose... but then I don't know how low they will let you go and keep you in the program??? Not only do I want to stay in the VA program because of cost but thats where I get my healthcare and I have other health issues. if they treat or hospitalize me for something else... it could lead to some real problems... including my service connected disability rating getting reduced. Part of that is for PTSD, and non prescribed drug use will get that part off my rating knocked off. I could deal with the reduced income [about $900] But the percentage I'm at... also qualifies my 3 teen kids for free college tuition at our state universities.... and I'll loose my #1 priority status [out of 9] for healthcare services. Thats a hugh benefit too. It's govt bureaucracy at its finest.

It's seems to be a really complicated financial/healthcare catch 22.

 

[Pegasus]

Fuck relapse dudes and dudettes... Let's just stick it to the Bupe and eventually get out of this mess... I just had an itch today that made me make a stupid mistake and waste my money... Of course I'm making the most of it, and I wont beat myself up for it, but really, first time I relapsed, I wasn't sure if I was right about it being a waste of time and effort to use heroin again after going into ORT, but second time around, I'm pretty sure... let's get the fuck out of this dumb game of self-satisfaction/destruction and our tendency to escape from the real world... Really, we are just cowards when we use opiates to get through the day. I know this is a provocative contradiction, but aren't we cowards for using any drugs at all? I mean, we feel that we NEED to use a drug to be able to do something or be somewhere, and in reality, all we're doing is escaping the moment, and trying to seize something that we will never grasp... no more escape, we must face life [and death] as it is... eat, fuck, reproduce, survive, don't hide...

It is a back-and-forth game for all of us. I, personally, have been ready to get off opiates many times but give me a month clean and I'll get the biggest grin just thinking about opiates. Everyone has to work through their issues as they will be slightly different for everyone. For example, I don't take opiates to avoid life, I take them to experience life better. They are my mood enhancer. This benefit fades after awhile and I will quit to get my body as healthy as possible, then the cycle will restart as I have never resolved the underlying problem that makes me crave the drug.

I'm writing this just to mention the cyclical nature of addition. I'm sure you know of this... The way you describe addiction and addicts as cowardly is just a very common theme among people who relapse. Once you get clean and whatever problem resurfaces, it is all too easy to just admit to being a "coward" that needs drugs and to begin the addiction cycle yet again. Just look out for this...

I don't mean to sound preachy as I obviously haven't completely resolved my own issue even; however, I am getting very experienced with addiction and certain patterns are definitely present. I hope you can avoid this particular one.

Good luck.

 

[Pegasus]

I think it's probably false negative because of the low .5mg I take?? Hopefully taking extra 1-2mg a couple of days before next appt will end the dilemma

Once again... the first problem is that I get it FREE thru the VA so it's their way or the highway. If I take the prescribed dose of 4mg in front of him... I'm pretty sure it would show up as it should. I just don't want to take that much... [definitely ongoing] But I guess that is an viable option.

I wonder how he will intepret that? From his perspective I take 4mg on my own and it doesn't show... but if I take it in front of him... it does. Damn I hate people having such power over me.... and I'm basically allowing it.

If they finally kick me out, for claiming I'm NOT taking it... I'll probably eventually go back to paying for MMT at a local private clinic... after I go thru my subs stock. This VA district sucks because 2 different VA's about 100 miles away [one east the other north] offer both subs and methadone. This one... it's subs or nothing.

IDK, If necessary I might just go ahead and see him weekly [his requirement]to get a lower prescribed dose... but then I don't know how low they will let you go and keep you in the program??? Not only do I want to stay in the VA program because of cost but thats where I get my healthcare and I have other health issues. if they treat or hospitalize me for something else... it could lead to some real problems... including my service connected disability rating getting reduced. Part of that is for PTSD, and non prescribed drug use will get that part off my rating knocked off. I could deal with the reduced income [about $900] But the percentage I'm at... also qualifies my 3 teen kids for free college tuition at our state universities.... and I'll loose my #1 priority status [out of 9] for healthcare services. Thats a hugh benefit too. It's govt bureaucracy at its finest.

It's seems to be a really complicated financial/healthcare catch 22.

Yeah, I would add a little bit to the dose to get it to show positive, and explain that you were having certain bad side effect(s) and read online that lowering the dose helps greatly with eliminating these side effects. Since the half-life is so long, you could have been at a lower dose for a few days and thinking that you were fine, but after a few days needed to increase the dose back up to get proper relief, and also because you began to fail the drug tests. As long as he isn't a complete ass, he shouldn't have a problem with you lowering your dose as an experiment on your own. If you didn't tell him for an extended period, he could be upset about not telling him as this would seem to be stockpiling, but the drug test was just failed and so your experiment would have just occurred. Since you're clean from other opiates, I don't think your doctor should be alarmed or suspicious of you.

Bupe is in fact a very strong drug and the fact that side effects were bothering you to the point of lowering your dose is absolutely not something that he has a right to object to. If he does, he is underestimating the power of bupe by quite a bit and you should point this out. No one has the right to make you take your medication more than is comfortable.

Good luck.

 

[caseface99]

False negatives and all of that crap is why I would never willingly go through with a drug test. They are so unreliable that it's more like playing roulette with a doctor, or your employer, etc. because of shit like that.

I would instruct your doctor to have him watch you take some, wait an hour or two, take another UA, and then still be a false negative. Then I would have him never take your UA again since a perpetual false negative isn't telling him jack shit.

Agreeing to continue giving UA's, while they are all false negatives, says to me "you can harass me every month and I'll just have to continue attempt to what you believe is bullshitting you around doctor, whereas I'm just telling you the truth and you cannot believe a drug test would be so faulty when it really is that way".



I don't know about all that. When I had IV fentanyl for severe pain, I barely felt high. They loaded me up full of it too so I could tell I was on it, it just wasn't "euphoric". To me, extreme pain makes opiates really boring because you're more concerned with not feeling pain than you are able to just sit back and enjoy the euphoria.

True that. I just had to take a drug test for a job a week or so ago, i wasn't expecting to get hired or drug tested on the spot but i passed a cheek swab an hour after smoking weed, after smoking every day for 2 weeks. I've also failed for pot over a month after smoking in the past...

 

[muvolution]

case, good to see you back and congrats on the job.

I had an interview today and was apprehensive about them wanting a test, but I'm pretty sure the dude interviewing me was stoned.

Oh, right, this is the suboxone megathread. My ? for the day:

My last script was for the film strips, my first was for the tablets and it has lasted me 4x as long as it was supposed to, so now I'm finally going to fill the film strips because I still do need to take less than .25 or so if I get bad cravings (better than going out and scoring).

My question for those of you who have used these is how do they keep?
I'm probably going to have these for like a year or two at least considering I go through them so slowly - do they have the same problems as Lysterine strips where it turns into one huge gummy mass? Are they individually wrapped? (That seems like a waste to me) Do they dissolve well in your mouth or stick to your teeth like lysterine strips do?

 

[nonug]

Hey guys. I have decided that it is time for me to get a script of Suboxone and try to get off of opiates all together. My main concern is the price of the visits and medication refills. Would anyone be interested in letting me know the average price of these expenses (PM or response in this thread)? I am insured (Aetna) and live in San Francisco. If anyone has any suggestions as far as doctors go in the area, it would certainly be appreciated.

Thanks in advance guys.

 

[muvolution]

You can ask Aetna if they cover Suboxone (which they most likely do) and on what tier of coverage is it - i.e. 1st, 2nd or 3rd (for me, it's $10, 25 and 50) with Suboxone being at the top tier.
There are now $75 coupons that you can get for the films which, for me, covers 100% of my co-pay. I think most sub doctors now have these promotional materials.

There are also low-income programs for patients. But since you have insurance, I doubt you would qualify.

 

[Rebubula]

Hello everyone, I just wanted to express myself here because this is my favorite website for these issues, I feel comfortable here with you all.
This thread http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=527048&page=5
has really helped me in my mission to stop Suboxone.
I have been on 1-2mg a day for almost a year, I have been DREADING withdrawal for months, the internet scared the hell outta me in thinking that Sub was difficult to get off, even worse than oxy etc....So I have been delaying the inevitable for months. I tried once last summer but I was at 2mg and I had a full blown anxiety attack 3 times and felt like absolute hell, so I went back on.
(((I don't feel like I need the maintenance anymore, I got hooked on subs last year after a brief stint with Opana (holy hell) and before that I was clean for a year.)))) I support those who use it for maintenance though, and dont condone its use at all. I can see how it saves many.
The Suboxone feeling has been really hurting my body, personally. It messes with my thyroid and energy levels and weight and mood. I have been soooo ready to get off of it, even at 1 mg the side effects have been really bothering me. Every time Ive tried to drop to .5 mg though, I would start to feel withdrawal and get tired etc....I always thought, gee if this is yucky imagine what jumping off would feel like! Terrible! So I delayed it.....and kept on. On party weekends I would go up to 2mg and feel worse overall. The Sub cloud was really starting to wear on me.
Recently I decided it was time. I tapered to .5mg from 1mg. I felt crappy for a couple of days but nothing unbearable! Buzzy creepy crawly anxiety at night, some insomnia and super lethargic, but nothing like detoxing from 40 mg a day of hydro. The tireds came in spurts, whereas hydro they were never ending. A little depresed but not bad. I adjusted to .5mg and felt SOOOOO MUCH BETTER!!!! WOW WHAT A DIFFERENCE. Stayed there at .5 for a week.

The difference between 1mg and .5mg, I cannot stress this enough, is HUGE.
Now I am on .25 mg and I am going to stay here for a couple of weeks. I FEEL AMAZING.
Yeah I have a little tummy upset, I have been waking up at 5am, but that actually feels great because being even on 1mg of Sub I would sleep like a ROCK and it was impossible to wake up before 9am, so I am really enjoying the morning now. Things are starting to feel "normal" like I dont have an opiate blanket over my face!

And I got SOOO tired of the hot/colds while on Sub......My adjustment to .5 I did go thru some chills, and I only took 1 clondine that week and it did the job, but I only needed one so far. Now I am on day 3 of .25. and I only get a little bit tired in the afternoons! I have been drinking the energy shots, LOVING those things......I havent needed a xanax yet, I have had small little tiny panic attacks but thats because I smoke lots of pot in the eves and sometimes that'll provoke em. The pot kills back pain though.

Like "JamesBrown" said in that thread I linked up, I am going to stay at .25 for a couple of weeks to hopefully avoid PAWS and significant withdrawal. I am not gloating, I just see so many negative stories on line about this process and I am shocked to feel so good right now. SHOCKED. I am so excited but I don't wanna rush it!! Long Slow Wean is the way to go......
I also have been jogging 1.5 miles a day and taking tons of suppliments like Kelp Iodine, B complex and L Tyrosine, E and C. Good quality vits. And a little Immodium even tho I dont have the runs at all, it helps fill that weird empty pit feeling in my tummy that I get when I lack opiates.

Another thing: A side effect of Subs for me has been, for months, numbing of the hands when I sleep. This has lifted SIGNIFICANTLY since I went to .5mg!! I just realized I havent had that issue in a week.

Hope this gives a little hope out there. I am still not off completely, but will let you know how that goes in a couple of weeks. For some reason, I am just not scared anymore. I just feel so much better without a lot of that drug in my body. I think I had a sensitivity to it because at larger doses like 2mg, I would itch like crazy.

Good luck and blessings!

 

[lmc422]

Ok I have a question. I have read that you can take your first dose of suboxone about 12-16 hours after your last dose of your DOC. as long as your in w/d's. So heres my question: I am going to take my last dose of morphine ER tonight at around 9pm I will be in w/d when I wake up bc my dose is low now. I was IVing the IR's but havent in 4 days and only have the ER's left. Im starting back on my suboxone tomorow, hopefully, at some point in the day. I was wondering how long I really have to wait to take the first dose of suboxone? I know I should wait as long as possible but whats the shortest amount of time you should wait? I dont want to be in w/d that long. we all know it sucks. I just want to stay safe and avoid the precipitated w/d. Is 12 hours long enough or should I wait longer? and what dose should I start off with? usually I take 4mg in a case like this. Is that too high? should I do maybe 1-2mg to stay on the safe side bc I can dose again if needed a little later.
any advice would be great. I did alot of reading I just need some clearification. I think i did so much reading that now its all just scrambled in my brain.
Thank you to anyone who can help me out. its much apreciated!

 

[SubDude]

^It's mostly an individual thing. I'm on .5mg BMT and can wake up ready to dose and instead wait till about noon and do @ 80mg oxy and another 40-60mg thru out the day with the last small dose about 5-6pm and enjoy the day and sleep fine. Then I wake the next morn and do my .5mg subs and am ok..... maybe a little irritable later on but no real wd's. By the next morn subs dose, I feel like I never took the oxys. So it's mostly the individual, dose, and overall health... Both physical mental. I have a low tolerance to oxys because I don't use them often and am on low subs dose. So I don't need much oxy to get a buzz or subs to maintain.

I don't IV or use ER... and dose subs sublingual.

 

[cire113]

i switched to Sub today tapered down from 400mg iv oxy to 180 oral... waited 12 hours and took sub this morning.. So far today to not be in withdrawal ive taken 20mgs of sub total... usually 4mg every few hrs...

From my experience in a few days i will be down to 4mg or less a day

 

[imaROBOT]

The less is more logic really work with suboxone?

SWIM been on it for a year.. Honestly on and off at times, but always had 8mg once a day. That's what every doc has always gave me. Tried abusing it before, but never got anything out of it so I just stuck with the 8mg once a day.

Would it be better to try and cut it down to.. 4mg.. 2mg?

I know you're supposed to eventually lower your dosage, until you finally get off it without any withdraw. I'm just wondering, since SWIM has been on it for so long now do you think I should do this and eventually get down to 4mg or 2mg.

SWIM has been on a bad H addiction for awhile now and can't seem to kick it. Don't get me wrong, suboxone is great, it's magical actually. SWIM will be clean for a month or two, then get right back into it, and before you know it, it's out of control again. I know a lot of it has to do with needing to want to be clean, suboxone can't just do it for you. It's a lot easier said then done, though.

Also I always noticed whenever SWIM fprgets a dose in the morning and doesn't take it for awhile, besides opiate withdraw of course, swim always has low back pain. SWIM's back has always been like that, swim used to drink a lot to help with it in the past before using H. Don't know if that's why swim goes back to using or not, but probably has something to do with it. Obviously I can't go to any doctor for help. One look the file and get nothing more than ibuprofen...

Honestly, SWIM isn't looking to get a high. I'm just looking for some way to actually fell good without any pain.

Anyway I'm rambling now. Just another guy looking for advice, other methods, whatever will help.

 

[amapola]

Hi imaROBOT,

At Bluelight we don't use SWIM and in fact it isn't allowed so please edit your post accordingly.

I'm not exactly sure what you are asking but many people plan on staying on bupe for extended periods of time. If you you feel like you want to get off of it then by all means start tapering down as best you can. You mention back pain however and if the sub helps with that it might be preferable to alternative meds like oxy or hydro which you might find yourself abusing and it seems you do want to get clean.

 

[SubDude]

Saw my subs doc yesterday and he had a beautiful woman being added to staff sitting in on session... which I think helped me. He officially cut my dose down to 2mg [without having to come in more often] which I'd been trying to get him to do for a long time. And he said my urines are still showing no subs [ 3mos in a row now] which he didn't make a big deal about. He hired her to help with caseload and I'm hoping he switches me over to her as my subs dr

 

[cire113]

Ok ive been off oxy for 42 hrs... Bee taking sub..

I took 4 mgs of sub a few hrs ago.. I was a stupid addict and shot 50mgs of oxy nothing much happened barely a rush...

Since sub is already in my system I can take sub in a few hrs and I won't go into precipitated Wds right? The 42 hrs I was off oxy I prob took atleast 30+mgs of sub:.. There is a shitload of sub in my system.... I barely feel any different

Such a dumb idea I'm so stupid... I think I just had to use a needle

 

[Pegasus]

Saw my subs doc yesterday and he had a beautiful woman being added to staff sitting in on session... which I think helped me. He officially cut my dose down to 2mg [without having to come in more often] which I'd been trying to get him to do for a long time. And he said my urines are still showing no subs [ 3mos in a row now] which he didn't make a big deal about. He hired her to help with caseload and I'm hoping he switches me over to her as my subs dr

Great to hear it worked out well! Actually, it sounds like it worked out unbelievably!

 

[DeLee]

The less is more logic really work with suboxone?

Some swear by it others don't.
I certainly don't, if I take smaller doses like 1-4-8mg I get cravings for opioids. If i take higher doses my cravings are not as bad.
Now im on 8mg 3x per day so 24mg/day and while it works most of the days I still do crave but its not nearly as bad as on 4-8mg.

That is the "main purpose" of Buprenorphine treatment.

Buprenorphine also acts like a "mood stablilizer" and on that subject I can lower my dose somewhat but it does not work on 4-8mg. That low of a dose just gets me fiending for heroin.

 

[muvolution]

SubDude, that sounds awesome, congratulations.

on another note, I took a little suboxone the other day because I was having bad cravings and actually got a little buzz, so I went SWIMming (one of my favorite activities when I have a buzz.)
So, there is a place for swimming with subs, just not on bluelight.

 

[DeLee]

The less is more logic really work with suboxone?

Some swear by it others don't.
I certainly don't, if I take smaller doses like 1-4-8mg I get cravings for opioids. If i take higher doses my cravings are not as bad.
Now im on 8mg 3x per day so 24mg/day and while it works most of the days I still do crave but its not nearly as bad as on 4-8mg.

That is the "main purpose" of Buprenorphine treatment.

Buprenorphine also acts like a "mood stablilizer" and on that subject I can lower my dose somewhat but it does not work on 4-8mg. That low of a dose just gets me fiending for heroin.

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