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Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine FAQ & Megathread v3; 2010 - 2022

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i experienced an awesome nod last night on suboxone...but i was also on etizolam, alcohol, gabapentin and 75mg DPH..

bupe can get me feeling pretty dopey IMO.. people should give it more credit


you cant compare bup to full-agonists. it's just not the same. bup's a weird one
 
^ Well since IV administration means a faster onset/absorption, wouldn't that also mean that the drug will be eliminated faster compared to other ROAs? The half-life can still be the same even though the body may eliminate the drugs at the same rate. IV bupe reaches peak plasma concentration is only 0.41 hours (according to the wiki page) which is a lot faster than with other ROAs, so its going to begin to be eliminated quicker since other ROAs will still be increasing in concentration while the bupe in an IV user will already have peaked and started breaking down.

Here is my analogy, which is in The Parable of the Good SuboxMan:

Two men are building fires with logs to keep warm. IV man puts all of his logs into a single pile, and lights them up all at once. Sublingual man starts off with a few logs, and has decided to add several logs every half hour throughout the night. IV man has a big fire rather quickly, keeping him very warm, but after an hour it has already peaked and is starting to burn out. Sublingual mans fire isn't as large, but is definitely keeping him adequately warm, and as each set of logs begins to burn out, he is still adding more to off-set them.

Sublingual mans fire burns throughout the night and into the morning, keeping him nice and warm. IV mans fire burnt out in the middle of the night, which made him get the chills, and have trouble sleeping (symbolic of ye withdrawals). IV man, in a cold sweat, turns to sublingual man to ask him his secret for being able to make his fire last longer and keep him warmer longer than him. Sublingual man replies "that which is not present, can not yet be destroyed" which in layman's terms meant that the logs that were yet to be added to the fire could not begin to burn up yet.

Sublingual man is more like transdermal patch man looking back at it, but I'm sure you are all wise enough to learn the lesson. Peace be with you.
 
Tommyboy said:
^ Well since IV administration means a faster onset/absorption, wouldn't that also mean that the drug will be eliminated faster compared to other ROAs? The half-life can still be the same even though the body may eliminate the drugs at the same rate. IV bupe reaches peak plasma concentration is only 0.41 hours (according to the wiki page) which is a lot faster than with other ROAs, so its going to begin to be eliminated quicker since other ROAs will still be increasing in concentration while the bupe in an IV user will already have peaked and started breaking down.

Here is my analogy, which is in The Parable of the Good SuboxMan:

Two men are building fires with logs to keep warm. IV man puts all of his logs into a single pile, and lights them up all at once. Sublingual man starts off with a few logs, and has decided to add several logs every half hour throughout the night. IV man has a big fire rather quickly, keeping him very warm, but after an hour it has already peaked and is starting to burn out. Sublingual mans fire isn't as large, but is definitely keeping him adequately warm, and as each set of logs begins to burn out, he is still adding more to off-set them.

Sublingual mans fire burns throughout the night and into the morning, keeping him nice and warm. IV mans fire burnt out in the middle of the night, which made him get the chills, and have trouble sleeping (symbolic of ye withdrawals). IV man, in a cold sweat, turns to sublingual man to ask him his secret for being able to make his fire last longer and keep him warmer longer than him. Sublingual man replies "that which is not present, can not yet be destroyed" which in layman's terms meant that the logs that were yet to be added to the fire could not begin to burn up yet.

Sublingual man is more like transdermal patch man looking back at it, but I'm sure you are all wise enough to learn the lesson. Peace be with you.
Click to expand...

It was a good analogy but I still dont quite get it considering you yourself said sublingual man was more like transdermal patch man.

It is true that "that which is not yet present cannot be destroyed" but if you take your bupe sublingual, it all gets absorbed over the course of about 20 minutes. But it lasts MUCH more than an extra 20 minutes. Why?

Its just like with shooting heroin vs snorting. When I snort some heroin, it kicks in very quickly. not as quickly as IV but its still very quick. Probably all of it has been absorbed iwthin about 10 minutes, maybe 15. ANd yet IV dope seem to wear off hours before sniffed dope. I feel like sniffed doped lasts 30 - 50% longer. why is this? I mean if we with your analogy, one would think that youd need to add the extra heroin over a period of hours to make it last 50% longer. But thats not the case.
 
Wouldn't this thread belong in the Mega Suboxone/Bupe thread. Lol?
I believe that sublingal has about 10-15% advantage, lasts 24 hours. I haven't snorted bupe, but Ive heard its nothing better than taking it subligually.
Lasts about 24 hours when you first start taking it. And about 16 hours when you get on maintenance.
 
burn out said:
It was a good analogy but I still dont quite get it considering you yourself said sublingual man was more like transdermal patch man.

It is true that "that which is not yet present cannot be destroyed" but if you take your bupe sublingual, it all gets absorbed over the course of about 20 minutes. But it lasts MUCH more than an extra 20 minutes. Why?

Its just like with shooting heroin vs snorting. When I snort some heroin, it kicks in very quickly. not as quickly as IV but its still very quick. Probably all of it has been absorbed iwthin about 10 minutes, maybe 15. ANd yet IV dope seem to wear off hours before sniffed dope. I feel like sniffed doped lasts 30 - 50% longer. why is this? I mean if we with your analogy, one would think that youd need to add the extra heroin over a period of hours to make it last 50% longer. But thats not the case.
Click to expand...

The peak plasma concentration for bupe occurs in less than a half hour. The peak plasma concentrations for sublingual bupe occur an average of 200 minutes after administration, and the bodies uptake of the drug occurs for 5 hours (source). So the percent of the drug that is still being absorbed at hour 5 has yet to be exposed to decay. It's definitely not all absorbed in 10-15 minutes just because you feel it kicking in. Even with IV administration it isn't completely absorbed for 20 minutes or so. The analogy was referring to the administration and absorption of the drug, so if part of the drug is still being absorbed at hour 5, that part cannot begin to be destroyed until after that.
 
I'm going to merge this into the Megathread. It's an interesting discussion, but there's nothing unique enough to seperate it. There will be a link OP, for your thread that will redirect you and other users to the Megathread.
 
^Yeah, it's really only possible to equate bupe with other full agonists to a point, and where that point is depends on the individual, as there is no known "set" cieling dosage.

But you can still compare bupe through different ROA, you just got to do a little math. For instance, oral morphine has a BA of about 30%, whereas buprenorphine has an oral BA of 10%. So basically 3mg (.3 absorbed)of oral suboxone is equal to about 30mg (1mg absorbed) of oral morphine.
 
^bupe is supposed to take about 2 hours to fully take effect... thats SL of course tho...
 
The only way to decrease the time it takes bupe to kick in is (assuming you're using it sublingually) to use ethanol/alcohol to help it absorb into your mucus membrain (I just wash my mouth out with listerine before putting the strip under my tongue). I haven't noticed any difference in time it takes to get high between bupe and bupe+naloxone. Potentiators don't seem to make it kick in faster either, although they do make the high more intense/enjoyable/longer lasting.

Other than using ethanol to aid in absorption, your only other choices to get it kicking in faster is to switch your ROA from sublingual to intranasal or rectal.

Yea, with sublingual aided with ethenal it take about 15-30min to become noticeable and then peaks around 1.5-2hrs. Snorting it take significantly less time to become noticable than sublingual (at 15-45min peaking at 1-1.5hrs), where as rectal is close to IM and IV highest of all.
 
What I'm curious about is if anyone has noticed a difference in onset of action time between Suboxone Iv and Bupe IV. (subutex,buprenex,etc).
I know that the bupe has a higher affinity than narcan , and narcan has low sublingual BA.However, If taken IV the chemical still reaches the brain. I was curious if it might affect onset . I've never tried bupe by itself so I don't know.
 
IME it seem to make a noticeable yet somewhat small difference. Like when I have injected suboxone I had had issues with headaches I didn't have when I injected subutex. The naloxone almost has to have some sort of effect, although it wouldn't surprise me if it was small to negligible.
 
toothpastedog said:
The only way to decrease the time it takes bupe to kick in is (assuming you're using it sublingually) to use ethanol/alcohol to help it absorb into your mucus membrain (I just wash my mouth out with listerine before putting the strip under my tongue). I haven't noticed any difference in time it takes to get high between bupe and bupe+naloxone. Potentiators don't seem to make it kick in faster either, although they do make the high more intense/enjoyable/longer lasting.

Other than using ethanol to aid in absorption, your only other choices to get it kicking in faster is to switch your ROA from sublingual to intranasal or rectal.

Yea, with sublingual aided with ethenal it take about 15-30min to become noticeable and then peaks around 1.5-2hrs. Snorting it take significantly less time to become noticable than sublingual (at 15-45min peaking at 1-1.5hrs), where as rectal is close to IM and IV highest of all.
Click to expand...

The article that I linked in my last post here said sublingual administation of the first dose took an average of 200 minutes to reach peak plasma concentration. I find 2 hours to be about the time it takes to peak in me personally, but I'm sure that the difference in amounts in quite neglible between 120 minutes and 200 minutes, so it's not really noticable.
 
i've taken probably around .5mg of suboxone for the pst 3 days so a total of 1.5mg.... its been 18 hours since my last dose of around id say .1-.2 mg of suboxone and i want to get high off some blues and boy. do you guys think ill be able to get off even though i took my sub less then 24hours??? i havent taken subs in like 4 weeks before tuesday so its not like i was on it for lomng....

i guess it doesnt matter because i already took 50mg dph and 600mg tagamet about 30 mins ago so i hope i will get high in 30 mins
 
laCster said:
i've taken probably around .5mg of suboxone for the pst 3 days so a total of 1.5mg.... its been 18 hours since my last dose of around id say .1-.2 mg of suboxone and i want to get high off some blues and boy. do you guys think ill be able to get off even though i took my sub less then 24hours??? i havent taken subs in like 4 weeks before tuesday so its not like i was on it for lomng....

i guess it doesnt matter because i already took 50mg dph and 600mg tagamet about 30 mins ago so i hope i will get high in 30 mins
Click to expand...

You should feel at least 90 % of blues and boy.
 
Using Subs or Bup temporarily

Could someone explain to me how to use subs or bup? I want to avoid withdrawals, but also still get pain relief. How long does it take to get out of your system on average? I take 120mg oxycodone a day or around 100mg of morphine a day. This could get to be a lengthy conversation, so pm's are fine. I have an appointment with a pain clinic on coming up in a few weeks, and I have to take in my current scripts, and I'll assume they'll do a count. I take more than prescribed and if I don't find something else to take in the mean time, I'm not going to have what I'm supposed to have. Going through Wd's right now is not an option either.
 
Your first question has been answered a million times on this website, I suggest you checkout the suboxone megathread.

The key with buprenorphine is knowing that less is more. It's incredibly potent and is active in microgram doses, so I suggest you start there. Try to use the least amount possible. Start with 200 micrograms (0.2mg)

Also, you don't want to precipitate withdrawals by using bupre too recently after a full agonist like oxycodone and morphine, you're going to want to wait at least 24 hours, sometimes a little more if you take time released meds.
 
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