Stoned driving is uncharted territory

slimvictor

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Experts say they don't know what level of marijuana impairs a driver, but statistics show that fatal crashes involving drugged drivers have jumped. Law enforcement puts much of the blame on the growth of medical marijuana use.



By Ralph Vartabedian, Los Angeles Times
July 2, 2011, 3:46 p.m.


It was his green tongue that helped give away Jimmy Candido Flores when police arrived at the fatal accident scene near Chico.

Flores had run off the road and killed a jogger, Carrie Jean Holliman, a 56-year-old Chico elementary school teacher. California Highway Patrol officers thought he might be impaired and conducted a sobriety examination. Flores' tongue had a green coat typical of heavy marijuana users and a later test showed he had pot, as well as other drugs, in his blood.

After pleading guilty to manslaughter, Flores, a medical marijuana user, was sentenced in February to 10 years and 8 months in prison.

Holliman's death and others like it across the nation hint at what experts say is an unrecognized crisis: stoned drivers.


cont at
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-pot-drivers-20110703,0,3288424.story
 
i think you have more wrong with you than just smokin a bit of bud if your FUCKING TONGUE IS GREEN
 
I reckon he had some "legal highs" because they always send you a free hemp lolly :D
 
Yeah what other drugs? And the green tongue thing is ridiculous.

But i think stoned driving has been pretty well charted by hundreds of thousands of people, at least. Experts don't know? Do a study, pretty sure some have been done already...

Law enforcement puts much of the blame on the growth of medical marijuana use.

Do they have any evidence for that? Didn't think so.
 
I've driven stoned everyday for the last 9 months. The two wrecks I've been in, I wasn't stoned. When I smoke, I become better at driving. This sounds dumb but I have horrible ADD and have had it (diagnosed, I'm not just bsing) and when I drive, I try to do a million things at once. But when I smoke then drive, I'm like fucking my phone, iPod, etc.
 
Green tongue & other drugs in his system..

We'll go ahead and blame the pot.
 
But when I smoke then drive, I'm like fucking my phone, iPod, etc.

That doesn't sound too safe, and a bit weird! :p

I guess prescription marijuana users are quite likely to also be on other prescription meds, that might impair driving. But isn't it legal to drive while on benzos, the info leaflets they come with just say not to drive or operate heavy machinery if you feel drowsy... So why can't they do the same with pot? If you're too messed up on anything to pass the sobriety test then you have no business driving, but otherwise the presence of THC or other drugs in your system doesn't mean you're not capable of driving safely.

It all sounds like they're just looking for a reason for bashing medical marijuana.
 
I've driven stoned everyday for the last 9 months. The two wrecks I've been in, I wasn't stoned. When I smoke, I become better at driving. This sounds dumb but I have horrible ADD and have had it (diagnosed, I'm not just bsing) and when I drive, I try to do a million things at once. But when I smoke then drive, I'm like fucking my phone, iPod, etc.

I agree this isn't a good thing to be doing. Whether high or not, you shouldn't be driving while messing with electronics in your car. I try to hold things up to my line of sight so I'm still looking at the road, when I do need to mess with an electronic of some sort while driving.

I've probably driven stoned almost everyday of the last 7 years, nevermind 9 months. Oddly enough, the only accidents/ticket I have ever gotten were on the rare event I wasn't driving while high. BUT I still don't recommend anyone do it...I don't make that decision when I have unknowing passengers in the car, and there are times where I even think I should wait a little bit before driving.


Smoking pot + driving doesn't make anyone "better drivers," I think it's an excuse people use so that they can smoke and drive. I've had friends claim they drive way better when they're drunk, and we all know how that goes.

I'm still pissy they somehow blame pot in this article and don't even mention the other drugs in the guy's system.
 
Now that I'm thinking about it, I'd bet he was drinking green syrup. Probably nodded off and ran off the road.

EDIT:

NVM, this is totally just cop bullshit. See number-dude's post below.
 
Last edited:
lol

Criminal Defense Lawyers Challenge "Green Tongue" Phenomenon in Drug DUI Cases

In the last ten years, police in Washington State have paid a lot more attention to the problem of drugged drivers. A rookie cop can detect a driver who has drunk too much alcohol, but it takes a little training and experience to determine if a driver has been using controlled substances such as cocaine, methamphetamine, marijuana or prescription pills. After completing certain training, an officer can become a Drug Recognition Expert or “DRE”. We have many such DRE’s here in Washington, especially in Spokane. The problem is that people are catching on that the so-called drug recognition “experts” really are basing their opinions on many things we do not really recognize as science. Take for example, the green tongue phenomenon. The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration warns of the following characteristics of a marijuana DUI: “… characteristic indicators may include odor of marijuana in car or on subject’s breath, marijuana debris in mouth, green coating of tongue, bloodshot eyes, body and eyelid tremors, relaxed inhibitions, incomplete thought process, and poor performance on field sobriety tests.” Criminal defense lawyers are not the only ones questioning the validity of this “green tongue” thing. The Washington Court of Appeals also questioned whether a green tongue establishes probable cause for anything. The court agreed with the defense lawyer that no probable cause existed, explaining:
Trooper Lane contends that a green tongue is indicative of recent marijuana use. Even assuming he is correct, the absence of any other indicators of recent marijuana usage, combined with the many innocuous ways to get a green tongue, indicate a lack of reasonable suspicion. Although we assume the officer’s assertion to be true for purposes of this opinion, we are nevertheless skeptical as to its accuracy. We find no case stating that recent marijuana usage leads to a green tongue. The only case we could find that remotely supports such a proposition is State v. Baity, 140 Wn.2d 1, 991 P.2d 1151 (2000), wherein the opinion’s fact section mentions that the defendant, who had admitted to recent marijuana usage, also had a green tongue. Beyond this observation, however, the court never analyzes whether the green tongue and the recent marijuana usage are linked. And the officer who made the observation does not assert a connection between the two.

http://www.grahamlawyerblog.com/201...ge-green-tongue-phenomenon-in-drug-dui-cases/
 
Yeah, this is just some bullshit they teach cops to get probably cause. No basis in reality. If a cop told me that he suspected I was high because my tongue is green I'd tell him that HE must be high as shit to believe something crazy like that.

Found this paper on the topic.

Our volunteers smoked and toked a gram of expensive exclusive ganja, and proceeded to play frisbee during their breaks under the watchful eyes of our cameras . Not only did their tongues not turn green, they all seemed to have acted normally. So, by the end of our experiment, we all assumed that this lame excuse for probable cause and arrest was an anomaly, existing only in the backward hinterlands of inbred America.

He goes on to talk about how this misconception has become more and more popular amongst the drug recognition "experts" in police forces, and suggests we respond by all sticking our tongues out at cops every time we see one to reassure them that we aren't high.
 
Found this paper on the topic.



He goes on to talk about how this misconception has become more and more popular amongst the drug recognition "experts" in police forces, and suggests we respond by all sticking our tongues out at cops every time we see one to reassure them that we aren't high.

who's the author? That's a great read.
 
So they seriously believe the green tongue thing, it's not just some kind of metaphor or something? What if you have a blue tongue, what does that mean? Red? Jesus, fucking morons.
 
That doesn't sound too safe, and a bit weird! :p

I guess prescription marijuana users are quite likely to also be on other prescription meds, that might impair driving. But isn't it legal to drive while on benzos, the info leaflets they come with just say not to drive or operate heavy machinery if you feel drowsy... So why can't they do the same with pot? If you're too messed up on anything to pass the sobriety test then you have no business driving, but otherwise the presence of THC or other drugs in your system doesn't mean you're not capable of driving safely.

It all sounds like they're just looking for a reason for bashing medical marijuana.

I'm not sure about the rest of the US, but here's how it is in Texas in regards to driving on benzos and other meds. DWI is driving while intoxicated. The definition of intoxicated in Texas is (taken from http://blog.austindefense.com/2005/...ion-of-intoxication-for-dwi-texas-penal-code/ )

(2) "Intoxicated" means:
(A) not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body; or
(B) having an alcohol concentration of 0.08 or more.


So it's up to the officer's opinion. When I took a drug class, the teacher said one of the people in a past class was arrested for admitting to taking 2 benadryl. Several people in my class had only had one or two drinks 4-5 hours before driving, but since they admitted that fact to the cop and refused field tests, the cop decided they were intoxicated, and it was his word against their word.

The teacher told of someone else who had gotten arrested for taking a legal prescription. The cop searched them and found a legal bottle of hydrocodone. The person said they had taken one hydrocodone 12 hours earlier in the day, but no more because they didn't feel like they needed it, and they got arrested.

In Texas, cops will generally ask if you've had any alcohol or drugs in any traffic stop, and when you say no they'll often say "not even a little?" or "none at all?" and the reason they do that is to try and get you to admit to anything. If you admit to having consumed any substances, the cop can decide if you were intoxicated or not. Same applies to benzos and even OTC drugs that get you high (benadryl, DXM, etc.).
 
Texas said:
(2) "Intoxicated" means:
(A) not having the normal use of mental or physical faculties by reason of the introduction of alcohol, a controlled substance, a drug, a dangerous drug, a combination of two or more of those substances, or any other substance into the body

but someone who is prescribed a benzo for anxiety or an opiate for pain already does not have the normal use of their mental or physical faculties; the medicine helps them reach normalcy.
 
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