Stimulant RC researchers, join forces with me on this...?

[MDPVagrant]

Generally the faster acting the drug, the more compulsive/addictive it is. That's why things like cocaine & nicotine are such hard things to stop using once they have their claws in you. Intermediate acting ones like methylphenidate through desoxy to amineptine are easy enough to contol any desire to redose and really long acting ones like certain antidepressants have next to no craving.

I think both faster-acting and shorter-lasting tend to contribute, as continual re-dosing is strongly reinforcing. If it comes on in a "rush" and wears off quickly (ala crack) it's probably going to be highly addictive.

If they sat down to design a drug with a crippling psychological component they'd be hard pressed to surpass that of cocaine

I messed with cocaine on & off during the 90s, and hit more than a few treatment centers simply because I didn't know how else to deal with running out of money forcing me to kick. It does get to a point where you live for the drug, and if money is gone or whatever you've lost the one thing you gave a damn about (high suicide risk IMO).

P.S. looks like I've managed to shed both you mentioned (nicotine and cocaine)... good riddance. Both crap drugs in more ways than one.

 

[Dondante]

Probably occupying your time with something other than researching and reading about dopamine would be worthwhile.

Just my two cents...peace...

He has a very good point here. MDPVagrant, I don't know how much of your "research" is stimulant fueled, but it seems like a good portion. Don't try to justify stimulant abuse by telling yourself that it is to further your understanding of reward systems. By all means, personal education is a fine hobby, but if you require stimulants to keep up this research then are you really using the stims for the research, or the other way around??

You do have a ridiculous number of posts on the topic of stims ... may I ask what else in your life gets you as excited as posting about stimulants? You should take a second and think what it is that you are trying to accomplish. I'm not trying to be an ass ... I actually do want you to think about this.

 

[Dondante]

And welcome to BL, Thanatopium. That's was an excellent post. I read in your intro that psychopharmacology is your field. Great to have you!

 

[kidamnesiac]

Because the use of large doses of DARI's that are potent and fast acting is a relatively recent habit in man's history. There is no reason why an organism would have evolved defensive mechanism against something that has never been a threat in the history of human kind. No selection process has favored the individual who sports slightly greater resistance, no selective pressure has been in action long enough to kill off those less able to deal.

Oh, contraire',

Dopamine has little to do with satisfaction. It has everything to do with "want" or "need". There is a common misperception of dopamine as the "feel good" neurotransmitter. Rather, it is the "I want it now" NT.

Ever walk past a female and say "I want it now". I must do this three times a day where I live. This highly sensitive and overdeveloped system has helped those who give their dopaminergenic urges breed, breed, breed. Monkey's do it like, 30 times a day? They have sex during meals!
It is also responsible for those who seek power and dominance, especially physically (as most social, and even unsocial critters do) to seek out the adrenaline rush of power, giving them again more breeding opportunity.
For most of our history, this behaviour was offset by the many overly driven types who would meet their demise by wanting too much of some reward (food, sex, etc). As we get better at keeping people alive, this type of behavior is able to propagate into the general population more and more and entire bulletin boards and communities become littered with the product of people who just couldn't manage to do themselves off.

 

[kidamnesiac]

and yea, dondante has a point

 

[Dondante]

MDPVagrant, first of all, thanks for responding with an honest answer.

Do I really have to spell out why I have such a deep personal interest in this subject? I thought maybe people would be perceptive enough to pick up on it, but here it is in all its blatant obviousness:

If I don't figure out how to get my use under control, I am going to die.

Is that clear enough for you? And learning how these drugs work could very possibly provide some meaningful answers and avenues to pursue in terms of figuring this out. It's at least worth a try. I've tried literally everything else. EVERYTHING. There is nothing left to try, no treatment center left in the area, no 12-step program I haven't yet choked on, no "willpower" orgy I haven't participated in, no spiritual enlightment I haven't pursued 'til I dropped, no antidepressant that made me feel so good that I lost interest.

This pattern has been progressive now for 28 years. Twenty-Eight Years. Get the picture? RC's came along just in time to save me from a life of crime, which I'm very grateful for. But they haven't stopped the progression of this thing. Either I get things sorted or my next stop is a drawer in the morgue. I don't know when that could be and refuse to speculate, as number only serve to stir up drama, shock, awe, pity, ad nauseum.

Help, or get lost. I have no patience for anything else.

What is anybody's help going to do for you? Let me make this clear ... it will do NOTHING. There is absolutely no way that helping you understand dopamine/ reward systems is going to have any role in you become abstinent.

I think this is a very interesting topic ... BUT you must understand that NONE of this is going to be of any help to you. None at all! I'm not at all hinting that you're hopeless, but this is definitely not the way to go about figuring out an escape from addiction.

There are other routes. I promise you have not tried everything. Seriously, will somebody back me up here? Is there anybody that thinks that this "research" will help MDPVagrant in his battle with addiction. Anybody??? Again, I'm not trying to be a dick. I'm really concerned for you.

Spinoza's philosophy has much in common with Stoicism in as much as both philosophies sought to fulfil a therapeutic role by instructing people how to attain happiness (or eudaimonia, for the Stoics). However, Spinoza differed sharply from the Stoics in one important respect: he utterly rejected their contention that reason could defeat emotion. On the contrary, he contended, an emotion can only be displaced or overcome by a stronger emotion. For him, the crucial distinction was between active and passive emotions, the former being those that are rationally understood and the latter those that are not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinoza

I think the only way to solve your stimulant addiction is to find something else to which you can attach an even stronger emotion/drive. Of course, this is enormously difficult, but you have shown yourself over and over than reason is simply not enough to overcome addictive behavior.

Your brain has established an incredibly strong link between drugs and euphoria ... you can't just reverse this. Again, I'm not saying you're hopeless. I'm just saying that quitting is going to be a life long battle. I recommend looking into Ibogaine therapy; it seems to be quite effective in treating opiate addiction. I don't see why it couldn't help in your case. Otherwise, it's going to take a very high degree of self honesty. You know your killing yourself, so stop! Help in the form of a psychiatrist is likely important as well. Samadhi was trying to help you out, but you brushed him off. Maybe his way is not for you, but he was correct in that you are going about this all wrong.

In all seriousness, this thread is not going to help you. Get that part straight. I have no idea what your rationale is in figuring that education, particularly neuropharmacology, will help you get your use under control.

 

[Sandbag]

^While I think the research could lead to possible stimulant cessation aids; I am also rather skeptical that the knowledge alone will be of use. Simply enough, the addiction that wins out over food, sleep, sex, and life; will most likely also be victorious over any new information. I researched meth night and day for months (by no means at the academic level you are undergoing currently) thinking it would aid me when the time to quit would come. Instead it only made me hate myself more and ergo use more when relapse occured because I felt because of the knowledge I had aquired I should've been able to quit.

I do hope this turns out differently for you. I'm guessing you have plans for the research beyond the paperwork. Stimulants being my favorite substances I definately admire the work you're trying to do here MDPV; regrettably I am not much more useful than a test-subject since I am a college sophmore currently. My major is psych though and previously had been chem. eng so I will eagly stay tuned to this thread. I am very excited to see whatever you may uncover. Best of luck and godspeed....lord knows I'm also headed to the coroner's if something doesn't change. Sooner or later my over-worked heart is just going to say, "fuck this" and 86 me.

 

[Swerlz]

We can only pray that you guys dont kick the bucket before the battles over

 

[ziddy]

This is the trick to abstinence: You _must_ realize that you will be happier if you do not stimulants than you will be if you do use them. You must always believe this (not just say it, but actually believe it), despite how you subjectively feel at any given time. In the long run, you will be better off. The problem is that with such a sensitive DA system, you are compelled to seek stimulants to an extent that most people (myself included) are not capable of comprehending. Therefore, I have little hope that this advice will be of any use to you - it's just a shot in the dark. As far as research goes:

http://www.aapsj.org/view.asp?art=aapsj070361

k Opioids as Potential Treatments for Stimulant Dependence

That may prove very useful for you: Both selective and nonselective κ opioids have been shown to attenuate stimulant self-administration in a variety of animal models. Thus, it would stand to reason that careful administration of salvinorin A (found in salvia divinorum) may aid you in your goals.

 

[MDPVagrant]

This is the trick to abstinence: You _must_ realize that you will be happier if you do not stimulants than you will be if you do use them.

What you say I know to be true intellectually, but it's impossible for such a realization to actually sink in without significant time away from the substance. Which of course is the main problem... one can't or won't do that. Dim memories do not suffice. IMO this method may be unviable.

You must always believe this (not just say it, but actually believe it), despite how you subjectively feel at any given time. In the long run, you will be better off. The problem is that with such a sensitive DA system, you are compelled to seek stimulants to an extent that most people (myself included) are not capable of comprehending.

It does depend on the substance. Some are mildly compelling, others are downright insane. It's funny too, as this appears unpredictable... only a couple factors are known to influence compulsive addiction (rapidity of onset, shortness of duration), but IMO those two don't even begin to tell the story.

I recently 'researched' a stimulant substance known as diphenyl prolinol (i.e. the 'test subject' used it recreationally, and ended up binging for ~48 hours).

This substance is an DNRI (Dopamine and Norepinephrine Reuptake Inhibitor). Note that only one test subject was used, so this could have happened due to some unusual combination of factors, but it happened twice, with quite a lot of time between them.

The substance is fairly weak, does not scale upward much effects-wise, and when administered orally is often compared to "a cup or two of coffee" (followed by a rapid loss of interest on the part of the person using it). One of the mildest stimulants around, short of caffeine... apparently.

However, administering upper mid to high doses via one of the faster methods of admin (e.g. rectal, IM, IV) and attempting to maintain desirable recreational effects through repeated re-dosing results in the most virulent, aggressive binge behavior I've ever seen. It's shocking, and frankly terrifying. Although actual behavior doesn't proceed like this, the end goal of the process seems clear: Get as much into the body as fast as possible, as often as possible and for as long as possible, regardless of consequences, rationality, sanity or anything else. IMO this may be one of the most addictive (in the short-term sense) stimulants in existence, when used in a certain way. Loss of control is the most awesome aspect... the substance has an iron grip that cannot be resisted through any kind of planning or willpower I'm aware of. It's simply impossible to stop. It also appears to be hard on the body at recreational doses (most likely renal and hepatic load) and around 48 hours the user begins to feel ill (luckily, that's about when one gram of the stuff runs out, a commonly acquired amount). When supply is gone, the drug has worn off and the user reaches baseline normal, all cravings and desire to use the substance vanish without a trace and do not return! It's really bizarre.

Yet it feels like a few cups of coffee when you take it once by mouth, at a reasonable dosage. COFFEE, that is. And people REALLY believe this subject of binging, compulsion and loss-of-control is well-understood? Well documented, mapped out, nowhere else to go with it. LOL!

IMO the field of addiction is desperately lacking in creative thinking and open-mindedness. Not to mention, it's influenced to a major extent by certain powers that be -- the pharmaceutical industry, political pressure to demonize certain drugs, 12-Step ideology, etc.

http://www.aapsj.org/view.asp?art=aapsj070361

k Opioids as Potential Treatments for Stimulant Dependence

That may prove very useful for you: Both selective and nonselective κ opioids have been shown to attenuate stimulant self-administration in a variety of animal models. Thus, it would stand to reason that careful administration of salvinorin A (found in salvia divinorum) may aid you in your goals.

Thanks, I appreciate the link! Will check it out.

 

[MDPVagrant]

Stirrings of an idea (1 of 2)

I've got stirring, in the nether regions of my brain, the beginnings of an idea.

First off, I think the best approach to this is going to be from a purely psychological angle, guided by whatever we happen to learn about dopamine and its effects on the brain, as well as personal experience in knowing how a binging addict thinks about and views things. There's no way we're going to conduct any scientific research here -- this is a message board, not a laboratory. So I think a psychological approach is really the only viable method of attack.

Here's the idea that's starting to form (along with some sample wording presumed attractive to a person binging on stimulants). Note this is very loosely formulated, based on brainstorming and is nowhere near coherent yet. Sorry about the switches in 1st/2nd/3rd person context, it will be cleared up:

The user will be introduced to a "Control Program" (better-sounding names gratefully accepted) offered as a way for them to gain more control over compulsive binging, should they wish to do so. The user may quit the program at any time they desire, may ignore the guidelines, decide not to participate, and otherwise do exactly as they please. That's their business, not ours. This program is simply offered as a tool, a way to put THEM in the driver's seat instead of the drug. Then the user puts the drug in the passenger seat next to them, and can party on or get some sleep, whichever and whenever THEY feel like it.

This program is specially tailored for recreational use, and our goal is to help get obstacles out of the way so substance use is MORE fun. Less tiredness. Better effects from the substance, because the user will have more stored-up energy. Less negativity and mood swings, more euphoria. Less getting down on oneself, more feeling high as hell instead of low & shitty. This program is here for one purpose only: to GET THOSE IRRITATING, BOTHERSOME AND ANNOYING THINGS OUT OF THE USER'S WAY so they can enjoy themselves more. That's what it's all about, right?

Here's what we won't ask the user to do. Ever. Never. We party too, and we aren't idiots!

* You will not be asked to stop using the substance, stop binging, use less or less often, stop binging, binge for shorter periods, "get ahold of yourself," "just use willpower!" "You know you can stop" -- none of that bulls**t. There is not a single, solitary "no" or "do not" in this program. The whole purpose is to put the "yes" back in your partying. We'll remind you of stuff, that's all... the program uses a timer, just so you don't get so lost in partying you forget this tool's sitting right in front of you you can use to get even more "yes"'s, whenever you want. Go ahead and ignore the timer if you like, but try it at least once, OK? In other words, if it beeps, look & see what it says. If it sounds cool, do it.

If you ever feel some kind of control you don't want, let this stuff go away and be out of control again! None of this stuff is gonna go away... if you ever want this tool again sometime, it'll be there, immediately ready to pick up and use. It's an optional way to party that we've designed to be more fun, give you more choices and keep you feeling in tiptop shape while you party.

Listen: It is always up to YOU how long you party, and how much you use. We won't tell you any of that. But think for a minute. Do you ever feel it's more up to the drug than you? That IT decides how long you party, so you're still up 72 hours later ready to drop on the floor? WE KNOW THAT. Listen again: It is always up to YOU how long you party, and how much you use. It's your party, your choice. We aren't taking over from the drug and telling you what to do, we're going to show you how to NOT HAVE THE DRUG take over and NOT HAVE US take over either. We don't want your life, we got our own. What we want to do is this: Take it back from the drug, toss it to you and get the f*ck out of your way. Get it? Use our tool, and you get to do what you want. NOT WHAT THE DRUG WANTS. That's what we're about, and that's all we're about.

 

[MDPVagrant]

Stirrings of Idea (2 of 2)

-- This program will proceed in several phases. I have already come up with some ideas for the first phase.

As computers are pretty much ubiquitous these days, the user will be running a computer program that will take care of timing related matters (reminders), as time is often lost for forgotten during a binge. This program will possibly provide some entertainment as well.

I'm a fair Visual Basic programmer, and I intend to write the computer program used for this. User will have to have Windows tho. Not sure what to do about Macs and such.

Goals for Phase 1 -- the introduction of STRUCTURE. *S-T-R-U-C-T-U-R-E* while partying. The first step back toward control.

If the user already does this stuff, they'll be invited to continue to Phase 2.

(1) Continually reassure the user that we intend to clear obstacles, not introduce them.

(2) Get the user to try showering/bathing every 24 hours, if they tended to neglect it during stimulant use. "Your eyes keep burning. Salt gets in them. You feel bad about yourself. You don't smell so hot after 3 days. Your clothes look like crap. You look in the mirror and there's grease all over your face. You just feel f*cking dirty, scuzzy. THIS STUFF F*CKS UP YOUR HIGH. "THREE MINUTES in the shower and you will never be bothered again by these hassles. Feel free to dose while in the shower! But it will only take a couple minutes." etc.

(3) Suggest food items (very carefully chosen); work out a schedule where the user will eat at least twice per day (daytime hours), up to four times/day. They will be invited to force themselves to eat, because 15 minutes after they do, the high will improve greatly. Specially suggested food items will minimize this "forcing" to almost nil.

(4) The user will be offered a suggestion to lie down in bed and rest for a minimum of 30 minutes every evening (normal sleep time) and a maximum of 60 minutes, depending on what they decide feels best. Invite will be given to try both & see which feels better. No sleep requested here, and the interruption in use will be emphasized as minimal. "If you rest at least 30 minutes, this improves the high even more, and may even allow larger doses without feeling worn out so often!" Less tiredness, better high. Once again, we are offering the user exactly what they want.

Emphasis on improving the party, always and forever, my dears. Because ultimately, that's what we want to do. Never forget this. Our goal is to knock down roadblocks. KNOCK THEM DOWN. We are not making rules, we are taking them away. The drug made the rules, and that's precisely the problem. We want to give control back to the user, SO THEY CAN DECIDE what it is they want instead of the drug forcing the matter.

We will never, ever, EVER offer something alternative to depend on as AA/NA does. That program has less than a 2% success rate. The user doesn't want it either. They just want the increasingly annoying aspects of the drug (inability to stop, dosing too much, running out too soon, being too tired, etc) to stop getting in the way of their fun. So do we.

We are here to give them precisely what they desire, because what they desire is to be the master, and the drug the servant again like it was in the beginning. That is the aim of this program.

---------------------------

You guys getting the psychological gist of this thing? I'm going to print this out and work on it.

I want to ask STIMULANT USERS SPECIFICALLY what they think of my approach here. There is not going to be a single rule, roadblock, requirement, condition, demand, not even a request or guideline. Everything here will be an OFFR or TOOL intended to put control squarely in the user's hands (provided they WANT it, which is their choice)... if they do, they can decide to keep it or throw it away, whatever they want.

*** We do not want to take over for the drug. That is the worst possible approach, and is utterly useless ***

We want to grab what the drug's got (i.e. control over the user), drop it in the user's lap, and vanish before we are noticed.

P.S. as far as myself & my issues? Greatly looking forward to testing this whole thing once it's been developed. If it works, it will work for me as well.

 

[Adrenochrome]

Only ingest stimulants, NEVER intranasal, and NEVER intravenous, and NEVER vaporizing, not sublingual either, transdermal is fine

 

[MDPVagrant]

Only ingest stimulants, NEVER intranasal, and NEVER intravenous, and NEVER vaporizing, not sublingual either, transdermal is fine

What are you referring to, Adrenochrome... is this a suggestion? If so, the focus of something like this can't be on rules. People who binge and lose control make their own rules all the time, then they break them without a second thought. That approach won't work.

If we say "do this, don't do that, NEVER do this" are we any better than the drug? That's exactly what it's doing. "Take more, use a larger dose this time. Don't sleep. Binge on me forever." etc.

The problem is that the drug itself starts making more and more of the rules, and it enforces them with an iron hand. The user has no choice but to obey.

There can be only one approach -- take control away from the drug and give it back to the user. However that can be done. It is then entirely up to the user what to do with that control.

This approach is looking more & more viable to me, the more I think about it. The devil is in the details, of course, but I feel inspiration beginning to creep around the edges of my thoughts. Maybe there is some kind of 'higher energy' that inspires us when it's truly needed.

 

[MDPVagrant]

Notes on approach...

The approach I have in mind (almost miraculous, pardon the word, how rapidly it has clarified itself and how deeply it makes sense to me) is different than anything I'm currently aware of. It's going to require a new way of thinking, and unlearning old ways of thinking.

The old methods don't work. Everyone knows that. Treatment centers don't work. NA has a 1% to 2% success rate. It's time to toss them and their failed philosophy into the fire and watch it all burn.

NA has NOTHING to offer a drug addict but the same thing their drug did (powerlessness, helplessness and some external force (HP)motivating/controlling their lives), minus the high. This approach is worthless. Eventually the "recovering" addict will figure out NA is like an addictive drug that doesn't get them high, and they'll go back to the one that does (wouldn't you?).

Consider the following, and the philosophy attached to it:

We don't want the user to quit. That's their decision. We don't want them to stop binging. We want to return the choice to them whether or not to do it. We don't want them to cut down, or use less often. We want to give them the ability to choose that if they want to, because the drug has taken that choice away.

Set up one single roadblock, and we've lost our audience. Someone binging on stims has too many roadblocks already. Think about that last line. How can we help then? KNOCK THEIR ROADBLOCKS DOWN, or enable them to do it. That's it.


Key points so far:

(1) No "don'ts" "no's" "mustn'ts" "can't's" etc. No rules at all, in the sense of rules being necessary to follow if one wants to regain control of their substance use. The drug already makes the rules. Do they want *US* doing it on top of the drug??

(2) The focus of the program is to PERMIT. To ALLOW. To FACILITATE. To EMPOWER. The user has lost control. Our goal is to return it to them. THEY decide. We help them to do that, then get out of the way. If they choose to give control back to the drug, at least it was their choice.

(3) What the user wants most is to be able to party without all these hassles. That's exactly what we want for them. We're going to "enable" them to keep using (if they want to). "Enable". Think about that word. The current treatment system has destroyed its meaning, and taken what little control the user had left once the drug had squeezed them dry.

(4) Our primary goal is to ENABLE the user to do precisely what they want, including binge if that's their choice. We are not going to interfere with their using, we're going to interfere with the drug's interference in their decision-making.

ENABLE is a positive word. It's very similar to EMPOWER.

(5) We want exactly what the drug user wants for themselves. What's that? Freedom of choice. The drug has taken it away. Our goal is to give it back. That is the extent of our interference.

"Q: How can you let them decide? They're using themselves to death!" It seems so. The reason is that the drug is in control. Our only goal is to take that away from the drug and give it back to them. They are then free to continue to use themselves to death all they want, IF they want... the point being IT WOULD BE WHAT THEY WANT and not the addiction forcing them. But I really tend to doubt many people would choose that, wouldn't you?

If someone had just one or two questions/comments, feel free to drop me a PM... might be better than using a whole post for it. If you think this whole thing is BS and worthless, PM might be the best place for that too (I'm cool with discussing it), unless you're asking everyone.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Finding replacements is key. What do you do with your time if not snorting chems? Oftentimes just engaging yourself (myself) in something healthy helps with avoiding use.

I like your general idea, that it shouldn't be a 'No Campaign' which you insightfully recognize is really futile for most people that are abusing stimulants.

Can you outline the general objectives of this project? For instance, its unclear to me right now if you want to do this to HELP people primarily OR to understand the cognitive processes of addictions primarily.

This is a big project and its awesome that you're doing it! Of course, talking to addiction counselors/psychologists will help direct you (they would probably be more than willing to set up phone meetings with you if you made your intent clear).

 

[MDPVagrant]

Seeking opinions on this approach in the "Healthy Living" forum... this should be... interesting...

 

[MDPVagrant]

Finding replacements is key. What do you do with your time if not snorting chems? Oftentimes just engaging yourself (myself) in something healthy helps with avoiding use.

I'm on a different philosophical tack: What's key is that I'm able to choose, and ATM I don't feel like I am. I'm tired of stabbing in the dark with this and that random suggestion. If I can, I'm going to develop a system to return control completely to the substance user. Then they can do whatever they want. That includes me... if it's effective, it should work for anyone.

Can you outline the general objectives of this project? For instance, its unclear to me right now if you want to do this to HELP people primarily OR to understand the cognitive processes of addictions primarily.

It has one single objective: To take control away from the drug and give it back to the user. Fini.

I've changed to a "help people" tack, yes. Help people do one thing. Get their freedom of choice back.

This is a big project and its awesome that you're doing it! Of course, talking to addiction counselors/psychologists will help direct you (they would probably be more than willing to set up phone meetings with you if you made your intent clear).

Thanks... I'm actually amazed how this has come to me... I'm an Agnostic, but it's weird... I posted that one honest post about myself yesterday, and not too long after this whole concept drops into my head out of the blue. It's like COMPLETE already, at least the philosophy. The practical application is gonna take some work.

If you read it more carefully, you'll have to change what you said above. This is almost a diametric opposite to the current approach of addiction counselors, NA, CA, etc. If it works, it will enable a drug user to keep using as long as they want. IF they want. Except it'll be by choice, not by the drug. The addiction counselor loses their job & goes on welfare.

I don't know if it'll work, of course. Philosophy's easy, the devil is in the details. If there's such a thing as inspiration (listen to Beethoven's 9th, Oh yeah there is) and I'm lucky (blessed?) enough to be struck, then it will work. If not, maybe someone could take it and build on it someday.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Yes, inspiration exists! I live surrounded by a few amazing artists that are currently in a frenzy of creation and explosion of new thought and idea.

I actually see a lot happening around me that is a signal that this type of thing is definitely 'in the air' right now. Its time to push these new ideas into fruition!

I recognize that you're taking an a-traditional approach to addiction. I still think it would help you in the process of implementing your idea into action to talk to some professionals in the field (you might be surprised how open minded some of them are to new ideas).

Anyways, good luck!

 

[Adrenochrome]

Yes, inspiration exists! I live surrounded by a few amazing artists that are currently in a frenzy of creation and explosion of new thought and idea.

I actually see a lot happening around me that is a signal that this type of thing is definitely 'in the air' right now. Its time to push these new ideas into fruition!

I recognize that you're taking an a-traditional approach to addiction. I still think it would help you in the process of implementing your idea into action to talk to some professionals in the field (you might be surprised how open minded some of them are to new ideas).

Anyways, good luck!

The people you told him to talk to aren't necessarily professionals, yes they are the traditional approach to addiction, but they are not as professional as the MEDICAL approach to addiction.

But I always think medical is better than traditional, I just find traditionals to be too antiintellectual for a intellectually based person like myself.