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Seratonin Syndrome Symptoms

BlackTom

Bluelighter
Joined
Aug 4, 2004
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40
Location
Houston, TX
Seratonin Syndrome is a possible occurance when you take something that replenishes seratonin (like 5htp) while using something that's draining it (ecstasy), right?

What are the symptoms of it? Has anyone one dealt with this before? Any feedback would be greatly appreciated, thanks.
 
It's possible to get it with 5-HTP and MDxx, though you're more likely to get it sith the SSRI/SSRI or SSRI/MAOI combo.

A quick search on google would have revealed:
http://members.aol.com/atracyphd/syndrome.htm
"The symptoms of the serotonin syndrome are: euphoria, drowsiness, sustained rapid eye movement, overreaction of the reflexes, rapid muscle contraction and relaxation in the ankle causing abnormal movements of the foot, clumsiness, restlessness, feeling drunk and dizzy, muscle contraction and relaxation in the jaw, sweating, intoxication, muscle twitching, rigidity, high body temperature, mental status changes were frequent (including confusion and hypomania - a "happy drunk" state), shivering, diarrhea, loss of consciousness and death. (The Serotonin Syndrome, AM J PSYCHIATRY, June 1991)
 
Can one say that MDMA experience is a very mild case of serotonin syndrome in itself?
 
It has some similarities, but the more serious problems seems to occur as the length of the syndrome increases... with MDMA you remain reasonably co-ordinated, whereas people with serotonin syndrome often report not being able to control their limbs properly. Often they'll report the experience as being thoroughly unpleasant.
 
^ very interesting... has there ever been cases where people have ENJOYED serotonin syndrome..?
 
Does anyone know if it happens when you are on the drug? or can it occur weeks later?
 
What are the side effects if any?
The most common side effects with 5-HTP were nausea, heartburn, and gastrointestinal problems (flatulence, feelings of fullness, and rumbling sensations). These side effects were rated as being very mild to mild. In contrast, most of the side effects experienced in the fluvoxamine group were of moderate to severe intensity.

Very high intakes of 5-HTP have caused muscle jerks in guinea pigs and both muscle jerks and diarrhoea in mice. Injected 5-HTP has also caused kidney damage in rats. To date, these problems have not been reported in humans. "Serotonin syndrome," a serious but uncommon condition caused by excessive amounts of serotonin, has not been reported to result from supplementation with 5-HTP; in theory it could be triggered by the supplement. However, the level of intake at which this toxic effect might potentially occur remains unknown.

What's this about serotonin syndrome?
Well its true that the levels of serotonin in your brain will probably be higher as a result of taking 5-HTP but not to the extreme of serotonin syndrome. This does not mean that it is not possible that it could happen but it is usually an interaction between monoamine oxidase inhibitors (MAOIs) and things like 5-HTP and MDMA.

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^^^
This is taken straight from the 5-HTP Faq. Serotonin Syndrome is caused by sustained high levels for a long period of time. It probably could be caused by taking too much for an extended period. But the amount would have to be alot higher than the recommended 1 per day. Say in the amount of 10 to 20. Not worth the risk of death IMO.
 
5-ht syndrome

i had a little mnemonic for this which may help

the signs of serotonin syndrome are .... RAD 5-HT

Rigidity
Agitation
Diaphoresis

5
-
Hyperthermia
Tachycardia

it works for me!

blinx
 
Raas said:
Does anyone know if it happens when you are on the drug? or can it occur weeks later?

It can only occur whilst the drugs are in your system, with the exception of MAO inhibitors which have a lingering effect for some 3 weeks after you stop taking them. MAOI/SSRI is the most serious combo, and is often fatal.

There are rare reports in the literature of single-drug serotonin syndrome... e.g. people starting on a course of prozac have been known to get it, though this is infrequent.
 
AznHangukBoi said:
^ very interesting... has there ever been cases where people have ENJOYED serotonin syndrome..?

In the early stages euphoria is reported... but as it progresses, whether you have fun depends, I guess, on whether you enjoy loss of consciousness, seizures and your internal organs breaking down :\
 
Excess in the brain i think.
I had this a few years ago now, i took two different types of anti depressants and in larger than normal doses and yea at first you could say it felt euphoric but it was far from enjoyable. I then needed to lay down and i couldnt stop shivering even with blankets on. I was like this for a couple hours before i decided id go out and lay in the lounge room so people could see me. The last thing i remember was some guy from down the road come in and asked me for a bong. As obvious as it was that i was in no state to be shouting cones so i used the last of my energy and told him to leave. Thats all i remember, After that my room mate realised something was wrong(yes took him a while, i couldnt stress enough that i was in bad shape) and he put me in the shower and ran cold water over me.
No respond so he called a friend and they took me to hospital. when i got to the hospital, they done heapsof shit to keep me alive and i woke up the next morning with tubes and shit hanging out of me everywhere. fucking freaky. And the firsth thing i had told to me by a nurse was "did you here what happened last night?" i looked at her confused as i should have. "america was bombed they are under attack". And that was some freaky shit to wake up to. Also a penis that nolonger existed.

But yea all in all a very bad experience and i highly discourage any one wanting to test their luck. And yes for the curious im rolling my ass off at the moment and thats why so much babble.
 
Is it me or are a lot of the symptoms associated with seratonin syndrome the same as normal side effects experienced while on MDMA?


"The symptoms of the serotonin syndrome are: euphoria, drowsiness, sustained rapid eye movement, overreaction of the reflexes, rapid muscle contraction and relaxation in the ankle causing abnormal movements of the foot, clumsiness, restlessness, feeling drunk and dizzy, muscle contraction and relaxation in the jaw, sweating, intoxication, muscle twitching, rigidity, high body temperature, mental status changes were frequent (including confusion and hypomania - a "happy drunk" state), shivering, diarrhea, loss of consciousness and death. (The Serotonin Syndrome, AM J PSYCHIATRY, June 1991)

I've experienced 95% of these symptoms while on MDMA, but I doubt I've ever had seratonin syndrome. How are you supposed to know if you have it or not?
 
The MDMA high is self-limiting -- due to serotonin depletion, the drug just stops working...

Serotonin syndrome usually manifests over a longer time period (not 3-4 hours). The longer it lasts, the worse it gets as your body becomes unable to deal with the hyperserotonergic state.

If you're just using MDMA you're unlikely to get it, unless you eat rediculous amounts of pills. If, on the other hand, you start mixing MDMA with other serotonergic drugs (DXM, SSRIs, MAOIs etc) you may find it arises.
 
VelocideX said:
The MDMA high is self-limiting -- due to serotonin depletion, the drug just stops working...

Serotonin syndrome usually manifests over a longer time period (not 3-4 hours). The longer it lasts, the worse it gets as your body becomes unable to deal with the hyperserotonergic state.


Ill go into a bit more detail now im a bit more with it.
yea for the first few hours i wasnt sure if i was meant to be on that kind of high. Like i said it was euphoric but very unpleasant. Kindof like when your drunk but really wish you werent because you are just feeling completely shit. I was shivering like a mad man, i felt cold on the inside and hot on the outside, couldnt get comfortable. Sweating real badly and frequent rushes of adrenalin.
By the time i lost track of things i was not in good shape, unconcious and spasming out of control. When they got me to hospital, some doctors thought they would treat me without knowing what id taken exactly and it was making me worse. I had 5 people holding me down and they took turns being thrown around the room every few seconds when i had rushes of adreniline. Luckily a smarter doctor entered the room and asked what i had taken exactly over the last few days and then put me on something which just calmed me down and put me out. when i woke in the morning i was gaging on a massive tube down my throat and tubes in my nose, my dick, the lot. Very fucked up experience. The feeling associated with seratonin syndrome is not at all like taking mdma. But i guess it could be in some way similar, there is a very fine line between pleasure and pain.
Though in my case i dont see it being the same at all, i was taking one A-D that blocked the break down of seratonin and one A-D that produced seratonin. So it looks as though it was caused due to excess seratonin supply in the brain, rather than excess being used by the brain and body.
If only i had the internet for a source of info back then.
 
Thanks VelocideX and Timbo, this is all useful information. While seratonin isn't something I'm too worried about it, I feel I should learn as much about it as I can in case I ever experience it or am trying to help someone else.
 
yea it is important. If only i knew what was happening earlier i prolly couldve got out of it a little easier. Now if i feel ven the slightest bit uneasy, i tell angela(my fiance) to look out for me. Even if i feel uneasy after taking 5htp i put angela on Tim watch. Its just too easy to think it will just go away when in actual fact it didnt in my case, it just got worse and worse as time goes on.
 
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