Scottish Independence v. Further devolution, or just convoluted lies?

[ponch]

Who let Gerry Adams in?

 

[ColtDan]

Fuck Westminster.

Indeed

 

[gannetsarewe]

Thanks for telling me a lot of things I already knew, but the fact remains that despite the disparity of the tribes which inhabited ancient Britain and Ireland, there was more cultural common ground between the various ethnic / tribal groups than there were marked differences, language aside. In exactly the same fashion as today.



Shame you had to sign off with that attempt at an insult which, for the record, is wildly off the mark. Comically so, given my decidedly non-British ancestry.

Though if it keeps you warm at night (along with those warm and fuzzy dreams of Dál Riata) then more power to you.

Make whatever assumptions you like about this moment in time, what little is known about Britain and Ireland during the Roman occupation is from Roman sources and the annalists writing 500 years+ afterwards, but you knew that already the same as you know everything else, but what has Lentils in yogurt sauce to do with it?, but that would be your Indian sub continent ancestry, I mean ye would hardly let the Brits back in, would ye?

The price of the No vote winning has hardened up to 1.2 from 1.27 yesterday making it 83% probable that Scotland remains a colony.

 

[Sammy G]

but you knew that already the same as you know everything else,

Is there any need? I pointed out the fact that I'm aware of the history you spoke of, perhaps in a slightly shirty fashion, but your original post was pretty condescending. I've never professed to know 'everything', despite what you may infer from some of my posts.

but what has Lentils in yogurt sauce to do with it?, but that would be your Indian sub continent ancestry

Dal / daal? That actually made me chuckle. Though my Indian subcontinent ancestry is news to me.

 

[swedger77]

Shetland just happens to have a suspected oil field near it...

No suspect about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TN7nvWvPWro

8 billion barrels. 50 year life expected. Biggest oil field in Europe but these Westminster cunts want to keep this quiet. Fuckem.

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/140aa88c-3d16-11e4-a2ab-00144feabdc0.html#axzz3DgcEmtkX

Scotland would be fucking loaded, even just off the tax revenure cos that fucking retard Thatcher sold our oil and gas fields to oild companies instead of nationalising it. Fucking moron of the highest order. The UK could of had an oil fund like Norway if the shitty Tory government had though a little about the future instead of just plowing cash into London.

 

[gannetsarewe]

Is there any need? I pointed out the fact that I'm aware of the history you spoke of, perhaps in a slightly shirty fashion, but your original post was pretty condescending. I've never professed to know 'everything', despite what you may infer from some of my posts.



Dal / daal? That actually made me chuckle. Though my Indian subcontinent ancestry is news to me.

The similar cultural thing holds no water for me, look at the American Revolution which is better example than Ireland, where a mostly identical people rebelled against the Mother Country because they felt that polity no longer represented their interests, but before I go any further, I went to check a fact I see the Grauniad is there before me.
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/18/scotlands-referendum-american-revolution

I think the not sures and recently convinced will bottle it as in better the divil you know, so I have just backed 45.01 to 45 % for the yes vote.

 

[Vurtual]

^I'd read (from someone not particularly reliable) that some Soros figure (or soros, it was unclear) has underwritten the cost of the odds to favour no in some bookie - another type of push polling... (could be bollocks though - we'll see i suppose).

Come on scotland!

 

[mattnotrik]

^I'd read (from someone not particularly reliable) that some Soros figure (or soros, it was unclear) has underwritten the cost of the odds to favour no in some bookie - another type of push polling... (could be bollocks though - we'll see i suppose).

Come on scotland!

The No vote has been clear favourite for a while at odds 2/7 was being offered and 4/1 for the Yes, so they really do not fancy it at all.

What im on.

NSFW:

 

[Bluebell]

Gutted

 

[kingme]

Results say No to scottish independence

 

[BecomingJulie]

Better luck next time, Scotland .....

In the meantime, be sure to demand everything London promised you in return for bending over and taking it, plus a bit more.

 

[kingme]

Better luck next time, Scotland .....

In the meantime, be sure to demand everything London promised you in return for bending over and taking it, plus a bit more.

or else what?
ask for independence again?

 

[Ismene]

Maybe it was when the scots started getting worried about having to pay a bit more that they shit their potfull. Never try and come between a scotsman and his wallet.

Now lets fuck Andy Murray off from the Team Britain tennis squad.

 

[BecomingJulie]

Yeah, fear of the unknown was basically what the NO campaign were pandering to. And even then, that only works on people who think they have anything to lose.

Still, 45-55 represents a bloody nose for London, however you look at it; and it shows just how annoyed people are with the present system. It's not at all unfeasible that a bit of drama somewhere beyond the influence of the Government propaganda machine might have swung a YES victory.

Let's hope the Weasels of Westminster deliver on the bribes they promised. All of Scotland will be watching -- especially those who switched to NO on tye basis of promised concessions -- and so will many others sick of being pushed around by, and playing a poor second fiddle to, London.

 

[Eveleivibe]

I'm just glad I don't have to vote. That would have been a lot of pressure as I don't understand the true extent of it n lets face it we're dealing with people's lives here. It's bound to affect people whatever happens , both on a national n individual basis.

Evey

 

[Sammy G]

Yeah, fear of the unknown was basically what the NO campaign were pandering to. And even then, that only works on people who think they have anything to lose.

Maybe so (at least for sections of the 'no' campaign), but to a certain extent factions within the yes campaign quite cynically pandered to the more jingoistic and militant strains of nationalism. To try and characterise this as a battle between the noble, long-suffering inhabitants of Scotland, hankering for freedom from the Sassenach yoke, and the Big Bad Wolf of Westminster, with its propaganda machine, is to insult and patronise the 55% of Scottish people who voted no.

I hope the government does deliver on its promises, though I'm as doubtful as anybody else. I just firmly believe that a strong contingent of 'yes' voters were motivated more by nationalistic sentiment than they were by politics. Which is fair enough, but actual political dissent it most certainly ain't.

 

[Chatative]

I'd also like to add that although the No campaign may have pandered to the unknowns, they were only there because of the incompetence of the Yes campaign. That doesn't instil confidence that these issues would be satisfactorily settled had we become independent. It wasn't unknowns as much as lack of trust for me...

I personally would have at least considered a Yes vote had they dealt with the logistics more than the jingoistic side of things in their 'propaganda'. I just found it hard to take them seriously.

And for obvious reasons, the poll is closed. It seems we have somewhat of a "I am Spartacus" situation with regards to Spade. :D

 

[ColtDan]

Really thought it was gonna end up being a yes result, there's been speculation over wether its been tampered with. Wouldn't surprise me if it had been

 

[Sammy G]

The speculation points the finger at both sides, though. The Dundee fire alarm farce was pretty fishy, as was the attempt to use a picture from before the votes were counted to imply that yes votes were being counted as no. Incidentally, Dundee voted yes.

That said, I wouldn't be surprised at vote-rigging from either side.

 

[Vurtual]

Damn Shame. Sorry for scotland and the rest of us - missed a very rare chance to introduce some change into a baroque establishment which we've come to accept is what a democracy should look like, for lack of a better example. The elite better be convincing with the baubles they throw or they may find out how many of those nos really voted for the union, rather than taking the offered powers at face value. I hope that the little people who campaigned (on any side) keep it going and make some inroads into the next election.

I can believe the vote was genuine (and respect anyone's democratic views), but i think it was unfair when considering the massive media bias (one paper against a hundred) and the combined weight of so many centres of power (turns out even that 'off-the-cuff' remark from queenie was stage managed (who'd have thunk it)) - not to suggest that no voters are any more susceptible to media propaganda than anyone else, but we know from the price of advertising/marketing/PR: that shit works in an appreciable percentage. It seems to have been totally forgotten, but there were supposed to be election 'purdah' laws in effect meaning you can't introduce new policies in the media a couple of weeks before the election (after postal votes start) - the british state facilitated by its media arm completely ignored this with their back of a fag packet 'vows' and week-long doom tirade.

Can't resist a conspiracy though (especially a self-justifying one): There's this video showing some dodgy shenanigans (the one with the piles of yes votes on a no table has already been debunked above, but the other two are still fishy). I don't think it feasible to directly rig it in the counts though as they're pretty tightly observed by both sides and the numbers make it difficult. The postal votes are another question though - they were mixed in with the other votes before the count - easier to switch piles of them...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LbJif7vISQg&app=desktop

I'll accept the result - i still think it was a big step forward just being able to bring social democratic and even socialist ideas into the debate without being (completely) shouted down by neoliberalist news management like they have been since the 80s. This gives me hope that the neoliberal control of the political debate is starting to unravel a bit (optimist at heart)