Safe psychedelics (in terms of physical health rather than mental)

[Okami]

I'm looking to expand my psychedelic use beyond my limited use of LSA, LSD, Shrooms, aMT and 2c-b (also salvia but never broken through). I would quite like to try more but it seems for most things the history of use is quite short and the possible side effects are pretty much unknown. Other 2c-x chemicals seem to have high incidents of hppd, so not too keen on doing much more 2c-b let alone the other ones (and aMT was probably not the best idea from a health point of view (although to be fair I seem fine c. DOx chemicals if I'm not mistaken are even more risky than 2cs? TMAs and NBOMEs again no one seems to know anything about. Are there no other psychedelics that have are known to have a safety profile similar to that of acid or shrooms?

N.B. I'd like to try mescaline but have can't get my hands on any D:

 

[cryptix420]

DMT, 4-substituted tryptamines.

 

[Transform]

LSA and aMT are arguably pretty dangerous in the short term. Mescaline too.

For someone who is worried about this, there's very little risk because they tend to be the people who research and measure their doses and moderate their use.

If you still need that extra safety margin though, tryptamines are the place to look as they are very physically benign and have a low incidence of HPPD.

 

[atara]

Before I start: please do not recommend specific drugs in this thread. "What should I take" threads are [still] not allowed, but discussing the relative safety of families of compounds is fine.

4-hydroxy tryptamines and 7-alkylated lysergamides are the ones we have the most confidence in, because they're very chemically similar to two drugs we already know to be very safe.

Are there no other psychedelics that have are known to have a safety profile similar to that of acid or shrooms?

The most honest answer I can give is no, simply because the way we know acid and mushrooms to be pretty safe is that a whole damn lot of people have taken them for a very long time without serious problems and there aren't many other popular things with a history like that. There is good epidemiological evidence that the long-term effects of mescaline are nothing to worry about, and in fact we know the most about mescaline because we can easily study Native Americans who have been taking it weekly for decades and -- spoiler -- they are all doing fine.

The only exception is salvia, which has been studied extensively and seems to be about as safe as green tea.

tryptamines [...] have a low incidence of HPPD.

Not in my experience. Granted, I never really minded HPPD.

 

[Delsyd]

4 ho/aco tryptamines, particularly 4 aco DMT and 4 aco mipt

 

[thoughtsUnThought]

Many plants have been used as medicine for thousands of years...ayahuasca might be something appealing to you.
Plants obviously have a long history of use, but not all are safe of course. I feel safe working with plants in moderation though, I share your weariness of the unknown potential of rcs op. Just stay away from anticholinergics and you can probably gauge your own physical reaction accordingly as long as you start slow with most other plants which are known psychedelics.

 

[Okami]

4-aco tryptamines has been mentioned more than once but erowid claims that their research chemicals that should be treated with caution. Is that purely because they haven't been around long?

I do intend on trying dmt, but seeing as what I've heard it seems to take you the furthest away from your normal realms of perception I want to experience a wider array of chemicals to somewhat prepare myself. Also in terms of recreational use its not really the same as other things seeing as it only last 5-15 minutes.

How potentially dangerous are the 2c-x/DOx/NBOMEs/TMAs? There's very little information to be found

 

[toastmann]

2C-I,2C-B and perhaps 2C-C and 2C-E are all pretty safe. They aren't neurotoxic, they're fairly easy on the body (some exceptions though). Keep the doses normal and you should be fine.

The NBOMe's are concidered safe, but they haven't been researched that much so that a risky saying. If I have to believe the reports, they're pretty safe if you don't take high doses. They are pretty severe vasoconstrictors. So do not combine them.

Same goes for DOx. Dont know about DOx's neurotoxcity, but taking a DOx when you know it is a DOx isn't too risky. Most problems from DOx come frome people buying it as LSD, taking high doses then have to get their limbs cut of because of the severe vasoconstriction.

As for DMT, nothing can really prepare you, only give a hint.

 

[Okami]

2C-I,2C-B and perhaps 2C-C and 2C-E are all pretty safe. They aren't neurotoxic, they're fairly easy on the body (some exceptions though). Keep the doses normal and you should be fine.

The NBOMe's are concidered safe, but they haven't been researched that much so that a risky saying. If I have to believe the reports, they're pretty safe if you don't take high doses. They are pretty severe vasoconstrictors. So do not combine them.

Same goes for DOx. Dont know about DOx's neurotoxcity, but taking a DOx when you know it is a DOx isn't too risky. Most problems from DOx come frome people buying it as LSD, taking high doses then have to get their limbs cut of because of the severe vasoconstriction.

As for DMT, nothing can really prepare you, only give a hint.

2c-i, 2c-e both have a research chemical warning on their vaults on erowid whilst 2c-b, 2c-c and 2c-d do not. Anyone know why?

Can you link me to whatever sources about neurotoxicity you have with the 2c chemicals. How similar are they all to each other, I don't actually like 2c-b all that much, I find the body high in doses of 20mg and more quite unpleasant, it just seems like a bad alternative to acid to me (I do of course realise thats my own opinion)

 

[Transform]

Psychedelics aren't neurotoxic, pretty much by virtue of their action. You shouldn't worry about that.

Your risks here are acute physical harm, HPPD and psychotic breaks.

 

[Okami]

Psychedelics aren't neurotoxic, pretty much by virtue of their action. You shouldn't worry about that.

Your risks here are acute physical harm, HPPD and psychotic breaks.

Psychotic breaks are not something I'm worried about, not only is there no history in my family, I am by far the most emotionally stable person I know (I can of course only really say that for the 5 or 6 people I know well enough to judge of course). Everytime I've started to have a difficult experience whilst tripping I've managed to calm myself down pretty quickly and turn it positive again.

HPPD I am slightly worried about, I've definately started noticing visual noise pretty much all the time. A sort of television static over everything I see and if I stare I can make patterns on floors and paved concrete distort. I've heard that paticular 2c chemicals such as 2c-e have higher rates of HPPD, can't remember where I read that though.

As for acute physical harm, what do you mean? Hurting myself whilst tripping or like heart attacks?

 

[Crashing]

I think HPPD is when you your psyche is opened to a facet of reality that has always existed, but you never realized. Being able to stare at the floor and make patterns means you have enhanced your creative abilities, if anything. It could be psychologically unnerving but I don't think it's dangerous or anything to worry about. It's just minor changes in everyday perception brought on by seeing the world from a different angle. Memory probably plays a big role in this, also.

You aren't going to suffer any physical harm from most any psychedelic (at moderate doses), unless you literally harm yourself which would probably be classified as a psychotic break. If you plan to take ungodly dosages, I would stay away from more obscure, less studied psychedelics, and stay away from phenethylamines due to their stimulant properties. If you are looking to take catatonic dosages, i would stick with psilocybin mushrooms or LSD.

 

[Transform]

Acute harm refers to the short-term risk of overdose and damage through that. You've certainly picked an odd class of drugs to ask this question about - with moderation and care they are all incredibly safe.

 

[Okami]

I think HPPD is when you your psyche is opened to a facet of reality that has always existed, but you never realized. Being able to stare at the floor and make patterns means you have enhanced your creative abilities, if anything. It could be psychologically unnerving but I don't think it's dangerous or anything to worry about. It's just minor changes in everyday perception brought on by seeing the world from a different angle. Memory probably plays a big role in this, also.

You aren't going to suffer any physical harm from most any psychedelic (at moderate doses), unless you literally harm yourself which would probably be classified as a psychotic break. If you plan to take ungodly dosages, I would stay away from more obscure, less studied psychedelics, and stay away from phenethylamines due to their stimulant properties. If you are looking to take catatonic dosages, i would stick with psilocybin mushrooms or LSD.

Yeah I figured that much already. I dont have too much experience with phenethylamines, but I don't much care for 2c-b the body load really detracts from it and I just don't feel comfortable in my own body, kind or restless but hard to move at the same time. All heroic doses are definately going to be limited to lsd, shrooms (if i can actually get my hands on any of the god damn pesky things) an dmt if it isn't already intense enough.

Acute harm refers to the short-term risk of overdose and damage through that. You've certainly picked an odd class of drugs to ask this question about - with moderation and care they are all incredibly safe.

Better to be safe than sorry. More than worrying for myself, I'm worried for my parents and slightly less for myfriends sake, no parent deserves they're son/daughter to have something irrevesibly bad happen to them, if I get brain damage and go mental, I won't be the only one sufffering, they will too since they'll have to look after me. If I was just risking my own happiness I'd probably be fine with trying heroin, but I'm not, I'm risking theirs as well.

 

[bluedolphin]

There is not sufficient evidence to conclude that 2c-x drugs cause HPPD more than other psychedelics.

People who were taking 2c-x drugs and complained of HPPD most likely had access to many doses (when 2c-x was cheap and easily available) and took it frequently. People who take mushrooms frequently also sometimes complain of HPPD. In most cases HPPD-like symptoms will disappear when the user stops tripping frequently.

In terms of safety 4-aco-DMT is widely regarded as both one of the most enjoyable and safest synthetic psychedelic. DMT obviously is very safe. 4-ho-/4-aco-MiPT also seem very safe. Mescaline is very safe although you can not take 10x a normal dose and expect to always come out fine; there is an upper dosage limit which you should know about.

You said you have already taken AMT and 2C-B. I would consider both of those "moderately safe", as in, somewhere in the middle. As in, overdoses can be very uncomfortable and possibly require hospitalization. Something like LSD, by contrast, is almost physically impossible for all practical purposes to physically overdose on. An overdose of mushrooms will cause you to black out. Who knows you could have a seizure on an overdose of any serotonergic psychedelic.

LSA is pretty safe but causes some cramping and vasoconstriction. But it's also hard to really overdose on or kill yourself with.

DOC is something that I would personally consider as marginally safer than AMT. It's certainly easier on my body, and I can tolerate a wider range of doses and still be comfortable and enjoy myself. DOI, as evidenced by several of my friends many years ago, can be taken in pretty high doses apparently safely, but it will be a long, rough ride.

The nBOME's are the ones I would caution against. They are not "considered safe". Not by me, anyway. But as you know there are plenty of unsafe drugs which people take all the time and usually have no problems with. Also, based on my one high dose experience with 25i-nBOME, I do not think this drug has anything to offer in comparison with superior and safer PEAs and Tryptamines.

As for TMA-series most people would agree these are not worth taking if you have access to better psychedelics.

 

[Crashing]

Better to be safe than sorry. More than worrying for myself, I'm worried for my parents and slightly less for myfriends sake, no parent deserves they're son/daughter to have something irrevesibly bad happen to them, if I get brain damage and go mental, I won't be the only one sufffering, they will too since they'll have to look after me. If I was just risking my own happiness I'd probably be fine with trying heroin, but I'm not, I'm risking theirs as well.

Yeah, you would definitely be erasing happiness from your available emotional palette with Heroin, as i'm sure any user or ex-user would agree.

 

[Thorns Have Roses]

Hey, y'all were asked not to discuss specific drugs and couldn't keep to that. No what should I take threads allowed, closed. (and Atara gave a great answer).

Best research individual drugs based off of what you've learned here, and then make your decision about what to move onto, if anything.

Better to be safe than sorry. More than worrying for myself, I'm worried for my parents and slightly less for myfriends sake, no parent deserves they're son/daughter to have something irrevesibly bad happen to them, if I get brain damage and go mental, I won't be the only one sufffering, they will too since they'll have to look after me. If I was just risking my own happiness I'd probably be fine with trying heroin, but I'm not, I'm risking theirs as well.

If you mind your HR principles, I think the mental aspect (the anxiety expressed above is a bit of a red flag) presents more risk than the physical aspect, but even then a negative experience would be the most salient worry.