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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards

Replacing alcohol with drugs

Okay guys, I've tried MDMA and Xanax. Totally hated xanax. Whoever said I was an upper guy was absolutely right. I loved MDMA. Even the day after the afterglow was amazing, I just went out and talked to random people and had great conversations.

Now, since GHB is a downer what are the chances I'm not gonna like that either? I don't like the sleepy and lazy feeling. I'm aiming for the opposite. MDMA's trip was..well too good. I was planning on talking to girls etc, but I had the time of my life sitting down and not doing anything. I just wanted to close my eyes and smile. I took a pretty heavy dose and even saw hallucinations. I could close my eyes, imagine and see whatever I wanted. I may have even experienced telepathy with my mate, or I could be imagining it. Anyway, fucking would have been out of the question on that stuff. There was times I forgot the first part of my sentence while trying to come up with the second.

GHB still interests me due to the benefits. But will it make me sleepy like Xanax?

Next in line:
- Methylone - if you know, can I take it often without messing my brain up like it would with MDMA due to seratonin?
- GHB
- 2C family
 
Hmm.... I've always read - and experienced with GHB that once you have your 'dose limit' established, it doesn't change. That is how is has been for me, and never needing to increase dosage like other drugs. I've been searching for a source on this though can't find anything... grrr... :X
 
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GHB is (broadly speaking, it's complicated) a downer, but in the same way alcohol is one - at the right dose it can make you feel chatty and sociable. However, too high a dose and you will be very sedated, and may well pass out. GHB is physically addictive - make sure you only use it sporadically, definitely not overnight to help you sleep (you may sleep well initially after G but you tend to wake up after 4 hours ish when plasma concentration falls and it's excitatory properties take over). Withdrawal can be very unpleasant and even potentially dangerous, in line with other GABAergic drugs such as alcohol and benzos. Have you had a read of the thread I linked you to in my earlier post?

MDMA tends to seem wonderful to everyone at first - the good sides predominate, and come-downs are often negligible. Hallucinations aren't uncommon :) Unfortunately this golden period doesn't last, and repeated users tend to find the good effects diminish and the negative effects increase. We don't cover MDMA really in BDD, so hop over to Ecstasy Discussion if you want to talk about this further - you'll see lots of talk about the importance of spacing your doses out and not overdoing it.

Methylone is serotonergic and you should treat it as MDMA - not something to take too often.

If you want to find out more about psychedelic drugs such as the 2C-x family then Psychedelic Drugs is the forum to do it in - we don't cover psychedelics in BDD.

I can understand wanting to take drugs to make you more sociable if you aren't using alcohol, but I would reiterate what has been said in the thread - using drugs as a prop isn't a good plan, and you need to be careful it doesn't become too much of a habit. Regular use of most recreational drugs has some kind of drawback and it's really important that you are honest with yourself about any negative effects of your use.
 
effie I agree that taking 'too much' can and will lead to OD (sadly have experienced it first hand, although had good friends that I had taught how to deal with it so it was really a case of being KO'd for hrs). What I was trying to say is that I have heard and experienced that the same dose seems to do the same thing - and I wish I had the source to where it is semi-medically proven. I haven't had the pleasure of tasting GHB in a long time, though when I was using it a lot, it would always be the same amount that would do the trick.

Unfort. for me, I lost my doser bottle so took too much too soon and learnt my lesson fast - to the point of saying to one of my friends "shit, I'm going to drop soon, please go get the others!". A big wakeup call for me, and we all make mistakes.

I think it's really important that regardless of the drug you are taking, that you are with people that are aware of what you've taken - and how to react in a situation. Remember that it's better to call Emergency Services than to risk a friends' life. I'm glad I've never been in that position, though I wouldn't hesitate if things seemed out of control.

~pharm_friendly~
 
effie said:
GHB is (broadly speaking, it's complicated) a downer, but in the same way alcohol is one - at the right dose it can make you feel chatty and sociable. However, too high a dose and you will be very sedated, and may well pass out. GHB is physically addictive - make sure you only use it sporadically, definitely not overnight to help you sleep (you may sleep well initially after G but you tend to wake up after 4 hours ish when plasma concentration falls and it's excitatory properties take over). Withdrawal can be very unpleasant and even potentially dangerous, in line with other GABAergic drugs such as alcohol and benzos. Have you had a read of the thread I linked you to in my earlier post?

MDMA tends to seem wonderful to everyone at first - the good sides predominate, and come-downs are often negligible. Hallucinations aren't uncommon :) Unfortunately this golden period doesn't last, and repeated users tend to find the good effects diminish and the negative effects increase. We don't cover MDMA really in BDD, so hop over to Ecstasy Discussion if you want to talk about this further - you'll see lots of talk about the importance of spacing your doses out and not overdoing it.

Methylone is serotonergic and you should treat it as MDMA - not something to take too often.

If you want to find out more about psychedelic drugs such as the 2C-x family then Psychedelic Drugs is the forum to do it in - we don't cover psychedelics in BDD.

I can understand wanting to take drugs to make you more sociable if you aren't using alcohol, but I would reiterate what has been said in the thread - using drugs as a prop isn't a good plan, and you need to be careful it doesn't become too much of a habit. Regular use of most recreational drugs has some kind of drawback and it's really important that you are honest with yourself about any negative effects of your use.
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Yes, I read the links. I'll give GHB a go, although the chance of overdosing scares me, especially since I'm that kind of person who usually goes "all in" with everything. I've got to discipline myself...

I was hoping for a different answer regarding Methylone. It seemed like the perfect thing. I read some erowid reports of people using it daily without building tolerance or getting any issues.

To be totally honest, the feelings and experiences from the drugs I've used recently have been many times better than any human relationship I've had. The social side is starting to become a secondary interest.
 
Be safe! It's more fun :-)

cuntball said:
Yes, I read the links. I'll give GHB a go, although the chance of overdosing scares me, especially since I'm that kind of person who usually goes "all in" with everything. I've got to discipline myself...
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That's what used to get me into trouble all the time.... going "all in" as you say. I didn't see the point of doing anything unless you were going to 'do it hard or go home' mentality. That didn't always work out the best for me, that's for sure :\ And with GHB/GBL or anything similar - it's so true to what I always disbelieved.... there's SUCH a fine line between getting high, and OD'ing and nodding out in some alley-way or wherever.

If I can offer any advice if you are going to touch it, make sure you're with friends you trust, that know what you've taken - and at least one person sober or drinking incase something goes to shit. And the #1 rule, do not mix with alcohol!

Take care and be safe :)

~pharm_friendly~
 
It almost never ends well hehe. I've learned many times and I still keep doing it, I don't know why. I took a heavy acid dose the first time as well and had a cool trip, but it had its bad moments. I couldn't control it at all and it kicked my ass. At some point I gave up and was ready to die. It broke me in half...multiple times. From some odd reason I don't regret it at all, I learned a lot from it. Getting a bit off topic. ..
 
If you try to replace drugs instead of booze you will still encounter blackouts, sweating, insomnia, etc...In a way its better to drink beer than constantley trying to "Score" either way your kinda screwed unless you can walk the line and not stray from the path. Maybe just smoke Pot.
 
I just read your question, didnt feel like scrolling through 20 posts. If you wanna quit do it dont substitute. I go back in forth between alcohol and opiates, I will kick one stay with the other. I've been told the reason partially why is alcohol and opiates affect the same receptors in the brain. so its common for this to happen to an alcoholic or an opiate addict. They satisfy the cravings for the other. If not drinking hardcore everyday of the week I'd just quit while its easy, trust me on that. I dont condone opiate use either. Heroin ruined my life.
 
screw the other drugs man, ghb is bad! xanax is ok till you mix it with alcohol, wich there is a high chance, you being a drinker an all, lsd is loads of fun but you dont wanna be a pumpkin head and never come back.
 
Lord - I am not an alcoholic. I despise alcohol. But it gets me where I wanna be.. I'm looking for a less destructive substance to get into that state. GHB seems ideal.
 
if you're gonna replace alcohol with drugs do your self a favor and switch to weed it's quite safer than other drugs it's still very bad for you just not on the same scale
 
Totally happens. Whenever I get any periods of time off of the H.. I start consuming large quantities of Wild Turkey.. :\

Believe it or not, as far as the tole on my body and organs... the H was healthier for me.
 
I agree with the tramadol statement. I recently found this stuff and thinking it might be one of my favorites. I usually take 100-150 mgs and have a blast. I have tried A LOT of shit: Weed, coke, shrooms, 2C's, LSD, MDMA <3, MDA, oxy, crack ew, meth/amphs, hydrocodone, ketamine, and a host of benzos/other pharms (gabapentin most recently) and I am far more partial to ecstasy and the uppers in that list( but I will never do meth ever again ). Tramadol, though a downer, gives me a serious rush especially when it's kicking in. I kept going to a mirror to see if my pupils were dilating haha they weren't, of course. Very similar to the beginning rush of ecstasy but just not as euphoric. It has the carefree properties of benzos without the tired feeling. I really like the mixture of speediness and the lowering of inhibitions. I, too, am socially awkward at times, even though I go out a fair amount, and am always feeling anxious. I am not on any meds and have never been to a shrink but I am pretty sure I have some sort of social anxiety. Good luck to ya and be very very careful! Especially if you try tramadol because high doses can give you a seizure!
 
Kratom is fairly harmless, as long as you don't take it everyday and get fucking hooked like I did. It has some stimulating effects, some sedative effects, is legal, and is only a problem if you take it too often. And it's nowhere near the kind of life destroyer the shit you're talking about is.
 
podsnomo said:
Kratom is fairly harmless, as long as you don't take it everyday and get fucking hooked like I did. It has some stimulating effects, some sedative effects, is legal, and is only a problem if you take it too often. And it's nowhere near the kind of life destroyer the shit you're talking about is.
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Agreed, especially lower doses of Kratom, like 4-6g powdered Premium Commercial Indo, have great stimulating effects along with good anxiety relief, only in higher doses the sedating side becomes more pronounced. It's addictive though, not as bad as real opiates, but the risk is there. It also tastes absolutely horrible, gel caps are very useful here. The upside is that once you have developed a bit of tolerance, the stimulation gets stronger and the sedation lessens.

Another possibility is low dose DXM (i.e. 30-60mg). It provides a nice mood lift and also lessens anxiety, but has its own drawbacks. For example, it's not really known if long term daily use leads to permanent brain damage, there are no long term studies afaik. However, if you stick to low doses you should be OK, provided you don't dose daily.

If still legal in your country, MXE is also great, providing a warm and fluffy euphoria. Same goes for other dissociatives like ketamine, just dose carefully - a full dissociation trip is not very good for going out, still great fun if you're not in public though.

In terms of harm reduction however, being sober is the best option. The more you expose yourself to social situations without drugs, the faster your anxiety will fade, practice is the best teacher for this. You could also consider a therapy to learn to cope better without the aid of substances.

Hope this helps, alcohol is truly a shitty drug.
 
I'm surpised nobody has mentioned phenibut. It can be found online at places that sell supplements. Don't let that fool you though, if used too often it can be quite addictive. Lots of people find that it is a great social drug (I have heard it described as "GHB light") One important thing to be aware of is that it can take up to 4 hours to feel the effects but they last for about 12 hours. For me it gives a slight stimulating effect & makes me chatty but relaxed without really feeling intoxicated.

Unfourtunately it seems to vary widely in effects and dosage from person to person. For some people it dosen't work at all, others get sedative effects & others get stimulant effects. Be careful not to over do it though, the withdrawl is pretty bad & overdosing can result in horrible nausea "the spins" lasting 12+ hours. -oar
 
In case anyone missed Effie's post earlier in this thread, we really should try to stick to discussing the drugs the OP mentioned and their associated risks/relative benefits etc, and not start throwing out random suggestions of drugs to take. Especially drugs that can create a serious physical dependence like opioids (I notice more than one person recommending the OP try Tramadol, for example).

Please remember that Basic Drug Discussion is a harm reduction form, we are not here to help people get high and don't allow posts promoting or glorifying drug use.

Thanks :)
 
Most recreational drugs come with the same kind of problems you're likely experiencing with alcohol, including the hangover thing.

If hangovers are what's bothering you about booze, MDMA is really not the substitute you want to use AT ALL. The E hangover can be just as bad as the booze hangover, and it typically lasts WAY longer.

Still, there's one advantage that pretty much ANY pill has over booze, and that's that it won't fuck up your liver or make you gain weight. This is a very real advantage, and perhaps worth looking into benzos as a substitute.
 
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